MONK is to confusing / annoying of a class now

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

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What am I even reading...

I wish there was like a '' Monk certificate '' you needed to be able to post about MNK on the forums.



Did you boost?
Maybe that's why you were overwhelmed.

MNK is probably the easiest melee currently imo.

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This is how I feel about smn right now. Like you need to put so many hours into a class before you start complaining

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

To help with the opener issue and fix Anatman, they could make Anatman give you a Phantom Rush use ( both Nadi ).
Keep it 60s but make it an ogcd that unlocks it immediately.
Honestly it could even be a gcd it'd still be worth it.

But make Anatman a 60s insta Phantom Rush.

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What even is this? There is no "opener issue" unless you are balanced around getting 3 Blitzes into the opener. We probably aren't. And even if we were, we need only tune us that fraction of a fraction of a percent higher rather than gutting over the whole existing Blitz system. You do not need to get every huge skill into the opener. You can already get PR right into RoF2 two of three RoFs thereafter with the double-Solar opener or into RoF3 and two of three RoFs thereafter with a Solar/Lunar.

PR does not have to be in the opener any more than, say, Ifrit would need to fall within the opening flurry of raid (de)buffs. Don't needlessly muddy a mechanic (Blitz) that has no issue outside of sheer slightly too little frequency (where that infrequency is an issue more for gameplay and the sense of having an integral class mechanic more so than RoF-sync).

Do not add a 3rd charge to Blitz. Do not add a "grants a free, extra Blitz" skill. Just reduce PB's cooldown to 30s. That is it.

There's clunk elsewhere and we need our positionals back, but do not gut or muddy Blitz.

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Originally Posted by Sora_Oathkeeper

Why do people want 6SS to go? You guys know that it's a decent disengage tool for scenarios that last more than 4s right? Sure, it can have a bit of overlap with Chakra which need to be weighed against the situation but generally 6SS is fine for what it is - a disengage tool/phase finisher/kill blow. It's not even close to as bad as the old TK was in 3.0-4.1. It's like one aspect of the job that actually requires a bit of foresight for an encounter and some of you want to get rid of it??

New MNK feels fine, it just needs positionals back on Opo-opo form attacks. The flow feels fine though once you get used to it. I'm enjoying it a lot. Can't wait to see how it feels in a raid.

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I just want SSS to become a roll-over skill instead (i.e., an oGCD that adds a further [single] GCD's time to your existing time until GCD refresh). It'd make it feel a bit less choiceful/deliberate (and provide less reward for knowing precisely when a downtime mechanic is about to occur), but it'd feel tons more fluid that way and applicable. (Naturally, it'd have to be tuned down, of course, for its reduced uptime cost.)

Personally, I'd love to see MNK get positionals back on all skills but also embed a leniency mechanic. For instance, have every third successful positional generate a stack of Fluid Form, causing your next would-be missed positional to instead count as a hit. Maximum of 3 stacks. Voila, you are rewarded for getting every positional but ultimately need only to get 2 in 3, and you're immune to random boss-spins.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

What even is this? There is no "opener issue" unless you are balanced around getting 3 Blitzes into the opener. We probably aren't. And even if we were, we need only tune us that fraction of a fraction of a percent higher rather than gutting over the whole existing Blitz system. You do not need to get every huge skill into the opener. You can already get PR right into RoF2 two of three RoFs thereafter with the double-Solar opener or into RoF3 and two of three RoFs thereafter with a Solar/Lunar.

PR does not have to be in the opener any more than, say, Ifrit would need to fall within the opening flurry of raid (de)buffs. Don't needlessly muddy a mechanic (Blitz) that has no issue outside of sheer slightly too little frequency (where that infrequency is an issue more for gameplay and the sense of having an integral class mechanic more so than RoF-sync).

Do not add a 3rd charge to Blitz. Do not add a "grants a free, extra Blitz" skill. Just reduce PB's cooldown to 30s. That is it.

There's clunk elsewhere and we need our positionals back, but do not gut or muddy Blitz.

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I definitely think that there is an issue that we can't fit our big hitter into the opening.
I am aware that Yoshida said that MNK isn't designed to frontload its damage like that but I disagree and that's how most work all that's really happening is that MNK is being gimped while others aren't.

How is it gutting or muddying anything with Anatman giving a free Phantom Rush?
I think you're overreacting a lot.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Do not add a 3rd charge to Blitz. Do not add a "grants a free, extra Blitz" skill. Just reduce PB's cooldown to 30s. That is it.

There's clunk elsewhere and we need our positionals back, but do not gut or muddy Blitz.

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Hmn... I partially agree with Shurrikhan... I have no idea about the idea to add a third charge to Perfect Balance, so I am neutral towards that debate, at the moment, but I agree with Shurrikhan's other points. I would love to, at the most, add diversity and variation to Blitz, but.. I would not change how it functions, and leave it as is, other than the CD reduction to 30 seconds, for Perfect Balance.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

There's clunk elsewhere and we need our positionals back, but do not gut or muddy Blitz.

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Blitz being a clunky, janky, turd on top of a now gutted monk is the biggest issue though. There are ways to fix it, but why adamantly defend the integrity of a mechanic that actively drags down the entire class like this?

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Originally Posted by Anahlise_Auhn_Giinslai

Hmn... I partially agree with Shurrikhan... I have no idea about the idea to add a third charge to Perfect Balance, so I am neutral towards that debate, at the moment, but I agree with Shurrikhan's other points. I would love to, at the most, add diversity and variation to Blitz, but.. I would not change how it functions, and leave it as is, other than the CD reduction to 30 seconds, for Perfect Balance.

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I never said to add a third charge to Perfect Balance.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

What even is this? There is no "opener issue" unless you are balanced around getting 3 Blitzes into the opener.

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I'm guilty of this, and one of my earlier suggestions in another thread was quick access to both Nadi to get TK/PR into the opening burst window. I'll point out that Mr. Happy had the exact same concern, and while I know he is not the end all be all raider, he does have influence over the community. I definitely wasn't thinking it's ok for MNK's strongest attack to not line up until well into the fight.

I agree that Blitz doesn't need to be gutted, and at least some positionals should return. However, I can't help but still continue to be at odds with PB. I've always had issues with it though, but none as much as now. The loss of positionals and clunk I can deal with, but PB being in a state I dislike even more than previous makes it really tough to put on my gloves. I just REALLY like this job, and when I resonate with a job like that, it's really tough to make me stop playing it despite setbacks. They'll fix this.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

I definitely think that there is an issue that we can't fit our big hitter into the opening.

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Why would it be an issue at all? Again, there is no more need for it to be in our opener than for SMN's Phoenix to have been in their opening 20 seconds.

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How is it gutting or muddying anything with Anatman giving a free Phantom Rush?

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PR then goes from "Correctly use your core mechanic twice to ready your big reward," to primarily "Press this no-damage button once per minute to get your big reward which you then do with a separate button."

Which sounds more like compelling gameplay?

You'd be replacing, in effect, Phantom Rush (gameplay-wise) with a GCD version of 5.x Dream Within a Dream into Assassinate (now for huge potency and partial AoE damage). Why? Why would you do that?

Monk doesn't need to be any easier. It doesn't need to have every possible iteration of its Blitz each occur within the first 20 seconds of a fight. The latter just makes us feel like we have longer lulls, less to look forward to macrorotationally; any relative potency impact it'd have would just be balanced out.

My confusion about the new Perfect Balance system is that it seems to fly in the face of the point of the ability. Perfect Balance removes the form requirements from abilities, which is cool. But the entire point of that before was to use a bunch of your highest damage abilities (Dragon Kick into Bootshine) without having to go through the full rotation to do them. Except now the Beast Chakra system seems to be suggesting that 2 out of 3 usages should use an ability from each form. Which means you pop Perfect Balance and then...use your rotation exactly like normal. Maybe you can skip two abilities (like being able to do Dragon Kick -> PB -> Bootshine -> raptor -> coeurl), but it still feels very weird for this cooldown to be saying "your next 3 abilities can be used regardless of form, but you should still cast them like you normally would, one from each form".

It also straight up baffles me that they left Anatman. That ability needs to be either completely removed or seriously reworked.