Ranged DPS role is about to be excluded from all content

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Originally Posted by Marc-Vigar

Is there any job unable to complete the hardest content due failed DPS checks? No.

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With 7 99% players a job with 0 dps would be able to complete hardest content.

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Originally Posted by ValkyrieL

Not to be a a## but you are 100% exaggerating, range can NEVER be replaced many mechanics demand that role of range class or you wipe lol.

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Triple melee + BLM, what fight is going to be impossible with this?

R.I.P. dancer

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Originally Posted by Akiudo

this is so far from the truth one has to wonder if its intentional misinformation sorry but savage data for the last two weeks (all bosses, savage, raid dps) puts a 50% monk (so blue, not green) at 12.599 dps whereas a purple blackmage (exactly 75% percentile) sits at 12.986 , a purple blackmage is contributing nearly 400 dps more (rightfully obviously) to the raid than a BLUE monk, not green, blue so no, blm does not have to be purple to beat a green monk."

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You accuse me of lying then produce the same figures I did and confirm what I said.

The top end of green on a MNK = bottom end of purple on BLM (and stupidly ahead of the rest) and that's nuts.

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Originally Posted by ValkyrieL

Not to be a a## but you are 100% exaggerating, range can NEVER be replaced many mechanics demand that role of range class or you wipe lol.

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2 BLM

/10char

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Originally Posted by plasmacutter

You accuse me of lying then produce the same figures I did and confirm what I said.

The top end of green on a MNK = bottom end of purple on BLM (and stupidly ahead of the rest) and that's nuts.

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you said "purple is necessary to beat out green" green does not imply 49,99% and "purple" doesn't mean 75.00% (theres also still the around 370 dps these hypothetical blm in this scenario has on the monk), if you want to go that route than a blm at around 63% is the point where it would "beat out" the green monk as it would pass him by like 1 dps, so "middle of the pack blue compared to "absolute top of green" thats a lot different than "purple to beat green"

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Originally Posted by Akiudo

you said "purple is necessary to beat out green" green does not imply 49,99% and "purple" doesn't mean 75.00% (theres also still the around 370 dps these hypothetical blm in this scenario has on the monk), if you want to go that route than a blm at around 63% is the point where it would "beat out" the green monk as it would pass him by like 1 dps, so "middle of the pack blue compared to "absolute top of green" thats a lot different than "purple to beat green"

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Quibble all you want, it doesn't change the fact a half-sleeping monk which has mobility and group buffs easily beats an alert BLM that is rooted to the spot and loses ~10k damage every time they take a step.

Let me guess: MNK main?

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Originally Posted by Marc-Vigar

Is there any job unable to complete the hardest content due failed DPS checks? No. Therefore it's just a matter of community perception. Same thing happens in other games like WoW where if you don't play X job you aren't invited into groups despite being perfectly capable of clearing the content. Elitism is what kills the jobs, not a 2k DPS difference.

There was an exceptional case which was NIN, being melee with it's utility gutted and being bottom DPS, but they already buffed it so now it's time to see how those buffs affect the rankings.

I'm also a big defensor of Easy job = low damage and Hard job = high damage, despite the controversy when measuring difficulty.

Of course there are others that need fixes, DNC needs a slight damage buff and SMN needs a complete rework beacause this oGCD spam is maddening.

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It's nmot elitism. It's people choosing the path of least resistance. Same reason why no one wants 70 raids for roulette instead of 50 etc Whatever makes things easier people will always gravitate towards.

A repeat argument in this thread is that:

Ranged are unaffected by mechanics.
meaning
Melee/Casters are affected by mechanics.
meaning
It's easier for average ranged players to get higher dps during these times.
meaning
It's harder for average melee/caster players to get higher dps during these times.
meaning
Average ranged players are doing relatively higher dps than average melee/caster, and this should be considered for balancing.

This argument is extremely unfair. It's assuming that average ranged dps are performing perfectly at all times. They aren't. These players still have to perform their rotation correctly, and they are in average rankings because they don't. They make mistakes. They get distracted by mechanics. Getting distracted by mechanics is exactly the same reason that average percentile melee/casters don't maximize their uptime. The potential of a ranged job's rotation to remain unaffected by mechanics (instead of being paused for 1-2 GCDs or saving a mobility cooldown) is not the same thing as potential performance.

Arguments where ranged are framed in perfect scenarios and everyone else is given tons of leeway do not make good cases for balancing ranged tax. Ranged tax should be balanced around potential uptime, which it is currently very far from being.

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Originally Posted by Miralyth

A repeat argument in this thread is that:

Ranged are unaffected by mechanics.
meaning
Melee/Casters are affected by mechanics.
meaning
It's easier for average ranged players to get higher dps during these times.
meaning
It's harder for average melee/caster players to get higher dps during these times.
meaning
Average ranged players are doing relatively higher dps than average melee/caster, and this should be considered for balancing.

This argument is extremely unfair. It's assuming that average ranged dps are performing perfectly at all times. They aren't. These players still have to perform their rotation correctly, and they are in average rankings because they don't. They make mistakes. They get distracted by mechanics. Getting distracted by mechanics is exactly the same reason that average percentile melee/casters don't maximize their uptime. The potential of a ranged job's rotation to remain unaffected by mechanics (instead of being paused for 1-2 GCDs or saving a mobility cooldown) is not the same thing as potential performance.

Arguments where ranged are framed in perfect scenarios and everyone else is given tons of leeway do not make good cases for balancing ranged tax. Ranged tax should be balanced around potential uptime, which it is currently very far from being.

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This "ranged tax" makes sense in other franchises (WoW comes to mind - where blizz had always over-punished melee) , but Square is very, very good at pressuring ranged in this game.