Red Mage Changes

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Originally Posted by Jkap_Goat

Yeah it's a shame really. It really holds jobs back and yes it's a DPS but nevertheless, it's a HYBRID.

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No, it isn't in FFXV. It isn't even a proper caster/melee hybrid as it was advertised.

The only thing holding back this job is the mentality that it somehow needs more support to salvage more and more terrible situations.

It's a dps. It needs to do more damage. It has more potential support than any other job, anything more and it's just excessive.

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Originally Posted by Jkap_Goat

Yeah it's a shame really. It really holds jobs back and yes it's a DPS but nevertheless, it's a HYBRID.

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this is not FF11 where one job can fill multiple roles
like ninjas being a tank or Blu and Rdm being jack of all trades
ff14 is built around the Three roles
just because samurai and monk have defense buffs means that they can tank
just because RDM and PLD have a heal spell means they can be a healer

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Originally Posted by Zyneste

in 5.0 we might see a support healing spell or two but if we do they need to have either:

No effect on a RDM's personal DPS or as situationally effective as Vercure for Dualcast proc without a target.

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I agree, any more healing utility must not impact their dps.
Just give them their version of Mantra as a Vermedica as an ability (so weavable) would probably do the trick.

Even if it had something like 50% of Indomability potency once a minute that would be quite something. Especially if SE continue with mechanic requiring everyone to be at 100%


As a side note, why so much focus on RDM AoE capability?
I mean, unless they add-in an AoE phase os12-secondpart where you need to AoE for so long that you could generate 2 moulinet rotation, compared to their single target issue, it seems a bit trivial. Or perhaps people were talking about some sort of expert-roulette meta , dunno if it's a thing, maybe.

To me, the fact that their single target dps buff aren't significant enough is the main issue.
I was really hoping for more, like 320 or 330 for Thunder/Aero and an Embolden buff too, like 15-20% (to make it not so utterly trash) or perhaps the same with a reduced CD / affecting all type of dmg.

I can't see RDM getting any more support White Magic. Like they definitely won't get a AoE Cure. Maybe a Veresuna, if anything, but RDM historically could never remove every ailment, only a few. So perhaps they will get a Vercleanse which will allow them to remove only the debuffs that medicine can remove (Poison, Paralyze, Blind, Silence).

As for heavy hitting spells, RDM probably won't unless its a finisher. Their damage comes from melee combos and finishers, not the in-between spells. Black Mage is meant to be the heavy spell slinger. Maybe RDM will get a trait that allows Verflare to proc Verholy and Verholy to proc Verflare (kinda like how 4.0 DRG could proc their other 4th finisher after landing the first 4th finisher with the Lance Mastery trait). 1200 potency in 2 GCDs would be pretty crazy.

I would not want more cure abilities thank you, just because many healers cannot play their job does not mean we need to sacrifice Red Mage as a dps and turn it into more of a healer...
Status removals like mentioned by Johny ^ is not a bad idea but that is so niche, how often does one have to use that anyhow? Granted i have never raided as a healer so dunno.
Besides they do have to be very careful should they add more healing abilities, because things must be balanced (even though casters never are)
Knowing how SE is the very much wanted job Dancer will probably be a dps with such things (healing and buffs, etc..)

Also to keep in mind: Red Mages, lore-wise are dabblers of Black and White Magic. Not necessarily "healing magic", just "White Magic", which encompasses a lot of Aero/Stone/Water spells. Vercure is technically Verwater (it has a blue aura), and Fleche is technically Verblizzard (it makes a patch of ice under the target's hitbox when it lands). So it's not like RDM HAS to get more heals. Maybe they'll get Haste or Stoneskin as a single-target oGCD. Actually, Temper would be cool (spell from FF1 that enhanced melee damage, and in FFXI allowed them to double/triple their auto attacks). They could implement that as a buff that enhances their melee combo further or something or makes them crit (like life surge).

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Originally Posted by MoroMurasaki

No, it isn't in FFXV. It isn't even a proper caster/melee hybrid as it was advertised.

The only thing holding back this job is the mentality that it somehow needs more support to salvage more and more terrible situations.

It's a dps. It needs to do more damage. It has more potential support than any other job, anything more and it's just excessive.

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It's a hybrid, do you know what a RDM is? WHM+BLM = RDM. I feel like if they really wanted a true DPS they should of never added a Hybrid job from the final fantasy series the game where it's know for it's uses in pure white and black magic, stuck Trinity system where it can't not be it's true self, it would be better if they added a support role but the Trinity system holds it back.

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Originally Posted by Duskane

this is not FF11 where one job can fill multiple roles
like ninjas being a tank or Blu and Rdm being jack of all trades
ff14 is built around the Three roles
just because samurai and monk have defense buffs means that they can tank
just because RDM and PLD have a heal spell means they can be a healer

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That's why as a new player to FFXI, I'm enjoying it more than FFXIV, don't get me wrong I love FFXIV and I want to see it thrive, but I'm enjoying the roles like DNC, a hybrid melee healer. To me FFXI RDM is better than FFXIV and will greatly representative how a RDM should be.

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Originally Posted by Jkap_Goat

It's a hybrid, do you know what a RDM is? WHM+BLM = RDM. I feel like if they really wanted a true DPS they should of never added a Hybrid job from the final fantasy series the game where it's know for it's uses in pure white and black magic, stuck Trinity system where it can't not be it's true self, it would be better if they added a support role but the Trinity system holds it back.

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It literally isn't that. You're shoving your opinions off on RDM. Stop It.

It's a dps. The icon is red. There isn't a debate to be had here. NIN worked as a tank in FFXI but that doesn't mean it has to be a tank in this game. MNK functions as a tanky healer in FFXII IZJS, still a dps in FFXIV.

Lore, function and classification can differ from game to game.

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Originally Posted by MoroMurasaki

It literally isn't that. You're shoving your opinions off on RDM. Stop It.

It's a dps. The icon is red. There isn't a debate to be had here. NIN worked as a tank in FFXI but that doesn't mean it has to be a tank in this game. MNK functions as a tanky healer in FFXII IZJS, still a dps in FFXIV.

Lore, function and classification can differ from game to game.

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Sorry but this is a fourm and I'm clearly in my right to express my opinion. If you don't like it you can , you know ignore me or you can express your opinion too.