State of the Game: Personal Player Feedback and Stats on PvE Content [No Parsers Plz]

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Originally Posted by Remedi

But Their point is that the ppl that don't known they need to improve is most likely to be with a lack of willingness to do, their point is that if you want to improve or you want to know if you suck you'll most likely find the informations on your own instead of waiting for them to be handed to you.

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So, rather than take an admittedly small step towards trying to solve the problem, the accepted solution is to do nothing at all? Gotcha.

That is where my eagerness to try and make suggestions of positive steps for this game ends.

I dream of a system where players play only with players of comparable performance. Maybe after being surrounded by 7 other questionably skilled players some would wake up and actually bother improving. Or leave the game. Either suits me. But alas, it is just a dream.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

And another one completely misses the point. Yay =(

This is for those that don't realise that they need to improve.

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If we're talking about players improving, then the logic is already flawed. That's what I see being missed time and time again. This logic operates on the premise on not only a player actually wanting to improve, but also and more importantly when a ceiling is even placed on a skill level.

What I am getting at here is that ALL players should strive to improve, and it doesn't matter what content you run, or how good or bad you currently are. It shouldn't be a realization based off of some presented figures shown from a log. It should just be proper etiquette and courtesy to other players to always strive to be better than the player you were yesterday.

If the point is solely improving DPS, then that is not the impression I got from the OP. DPS is one of many factors related to player skill.

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Originally Posted by AxlStream

I dream of a system where players play only with players of comparable performance. Maybe after being surrounded by 7 other questionably skilled players some would wake up and actually bother improving. Or leave the game. Either suits me. But alas, it is just a dream.

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Now that was a legitimately controversial suggestion ;)

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Originally Posted by Gemina

It should just be proper etiquette and courtesy to other players to always strive to be better than the player you were yesterday.

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Agreed that would be a wonderful situation to strive for, however that's also idealistic to the point of naivety to expect that out of the masses.

My point isn't solely about DPS, granted that is a fair portion of it (given that combat effectively revolves around it for the majority of this game). As I stated in an earlier discussion in this thread, the idea of using healers and tanks cooldown and oGCD usage as another metric was one that appealed to me. That's not a DPS thing, that's just good form and play. Granted it's nigh impossible to accurately reflect that in a value without some form of flaw in there.

*edit*

I'll also add, lets keep in mind that no single solution is ever going to fix the skill disparity that exists within this game. It's going to take a combination of things to help ease down the gap, and I see this as one of several things that are required. Baby steps etc.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

So, rather than take an admittedly small step towards trying to solve the problem, the accepted solution is to do nothing at all? Gotcha.

That is where my eagerness to try and make suggestions of positive steps for this game ends.

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That's not what they are getting, they are saying that the approach is wrong because aside telling you that you failed a scoring without a context helps no1 if that person doesn't want to improve at all and ppl that want to improve are already doing it, so this approach doesn't really do much.

I think the best approach is idd making the mentor system not a meme and reinforcing it to be a real UI, with guides and stuff.
If SE inteded for Novice hall to be the ELI5 way of play the game and then the mentor network to be the continuation of that, by making veteran players being able to teach new players then They should make so that it's not just a chat and make it something really worth using from a new player.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

Agreed that would be a wonderful situation to strive for, however that's also idealistic to the point of naivety to expect that out of the masses.

My point isn't solely about DPS, granted that is a fair portion of it (given that combat effectively revolves around it for the majority of this game). As I stated in an earlier discussion in this thread, the idea of using healers and tanks cooldown and oGCD usage as another metric was one that appealed to me. That's not a DPS thing, that's just good form and play. Granted it's nigh impossible to accurately reflect that in a value without some form of flaw in there.

*edit*

I'll also add, lets keep in mind that no single solution is ever going to fix the skill disparity that exists within this game. It's going to take a combination of things to help ease down the gap, and I see this as one of several things that are required. Baby steps etc.

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Aye. It is idealistic. Even erroneous to have such an expectation. But the logic behind it isn't flawed because it only applies to players who already strive to get better. Skill ceilings do not exist because they acknowledge that there is always something that can be improved. Combat is also practical, which means spending time away from it, or from any particular job can lead to a deterioration of skill level. The good 'ol, "If you don't use it, you lose it." psychology.

If the intention from an in game parser is to give good players another tool to evaluate their own performance, I am totally on board with it. I'm afraid though, that the only thing that is going to reduce the skill disparity are the players themselves. It is unfortunate that it seems that the solution to the problem is the very same naïve and idealistic approach to content that cannot be expected from the entire playerbase. And there lies the conundrum.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

I'm afraid though, that the only thing that is going to reduce the skill disparity are the players themselves.

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Think of a new player as being dropped in the middle of a maze. There are clues as to the way out all around them but sadly the lights are off. If something basic were implemented like the suggested PPS model I would see that as giving that new player a flashlight. It isn't going to get them out of the maze, it isn't even going to give them a map. Some people might never even turn the flashlight on!

Some people will though, and with it they'll see the clues.

No one tool could ever magically impart skills or understanding, no one is suggesting a basic meter like this would do anything that drastic, but having a tool is better than walking through a maze emptyhanded. Right now with the way you can more or less play the game all the way to the level cap and never find out you're supposed to keep Straight Shot up on BRD I think anything is better than what we have now.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

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Totally off topic but I don't have another way to say it - thank you for being so awesome! I'm healing through Sigmascape now, working on God Kefka. Got a super late start. I also heal primarily with a SCH who likes to dps a lot. Your logs have been invaluable, I think they're even gonna help me figure out GK. So yeah, fangirl moment over, but thank you! <3