I’m not sitting through the cutscenes, I’m doing something else while they auto-play. I’m genuinely happy for it to be this way because it’s the setup I would have wanted when I first experienced this part of the game. (Although I do agree that the ideal option would be the ability to skip scenes when nobody is new to the dungeon, I suspect it might be more hardwired and unable to do that. They still auto-scroll if you rewatch them at the inn now.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
I’m honestly not even thinking about the reward and whether the dungeon is relatively “worth it”. I just want to help new players.
...
*goes off to get white dye for paladin armour*
Please Reconsider MSQ Changes
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02-04-2018, 02:07 AMIscah
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02-04-2018, 02:14 AMAmetrine
First, you can exploit editing a post to bypass the limits.
But, no, roulettes were never meant for facilitating speedruns.
Very early on the 2.0's life, before implenting DF and the Roulette dailies, running the level 50 dungeons was the only method to earn the earliest versions of tomestones. Ampador Keep and Wonderer's Palace, as well. (Darklight Gear, specifically.) Since we had 3 dungeons to play that rewarded tomestones, players spammed them, and the speedrun meta was born.
Essentially, these dungeons were designed before the idea of repeating content like we do now was the norm. The intermingled cutscenes was just a method to tell a story through some active group content.
WE are the ones at fault for forcing ourselves to run this stuff over and over again in the rush to gear up as fast as possible.
SB dungeons having more aggressive, harder hitting mobs and gates is another """bad""" (I can't airquote this hard enough) decision to try to force our collective asses to relax and slow down, too. -
02-04-2018, 02:20 AMUsho
And that's great Iscah, good for you for wanting to help out newbies. However, others who feel the same way I do don't want to waste an hour of our time in a roulette which used to take 15 mins or less to finish.
I don't mind helping newbies either...but I also value my time and don't like that by doing msq roulette now, you are forced to rewatch the same cutscenes over and over again Everyday.
This isn't a single player game, it's a MMO. Yoshi-Fail made the final 2 msq arr dungeons have a single player mode feel and that's fine...in a non MMO game....but this is a MMO meaning you are playing with other people. -
02-04-2018, 02:21 AMUsho
Continued....
Why do you think they didn't continue this single player mentality for HW and SB? Cause, they realized (kinda late) that NO ONE WANTS TO HAVE TO DEAL THE SAME CUTSCENE IDEAL AS ARR. I understand their intent but they could have made it better. This not only will screw over new players (queue time wise) but it also vets who used msq roulette as another source of leveling and poetic grinding.
The consensus of the people i play with and some of the newbies i chat with in Novice Network in game agree with me. -
02-04-2018, 02:21 AMVstarstruckYou get double to triple your exp gain spaming sirensong sea, even if your using exp II buff from your fc , but exp buff III exists. The impact of rest exp , fc bffs and food is also much greater for sirensong sea, so if you have access to them, or using the squad manuals, you get far greater gains doing sirensong sea spam. I question 25 mins as well, minimum seems to be 35, someone that did a precise timing clocked 42 earlier in the thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by XiXiQ
Since we are talking absolute best, 1 run of sirensong sea gives you about double exp you gained in that MSQ roulette and to top things off can be done in 10-12 mins. with healer being almost instant queue to anything, you would got 4 fold the exp doing 2 runs of sirensong sea. For most, you can fit 2.5 runs of sirensong sea in the span of one MSQ roulette.
MSQ roulette is not worth doing in this state it is in. -
02-04-2018, 02:29 AMUsho
@Ametrine: Sorry...can't hear you from back in 2013. This is 2018 now. 5 years have passed since this game was "re-released". Times have changed sir and or ma'am. The roulettes nowadays are a great source for speedrunning for exp, gear and tomes, especially since se doesn't put major cutscenes in the middle of dungeons anymore. Also note the sentence whenever you enter a instance and or roulette with someone new:
"Bonus experience points and rewards will be given for swift completion."
or something along those lines. So yeah roulettes and dungeons reward players for swift completion of the instance.
So I stand by my statement: MSQ roulette is not worth it now but if you wanna waste time on a non-skippable cutscene infested dungeon for meh rewards be my guest. -
02-04-2018, 02:34 AMAmetrineAgain, these were designed for 2.0 without the intention of us repeating these dungeons every day, let alone multiple times a day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
In fact, they specifically got their own roulette with seperate rewards for those willing to take newer players through the story heavy dungeons, only for us to collectively force players to skip everything.
THESE AREN'T MADE FOR SPEEDRUNNING.
NO DUNGEON IS.
What's likely going to happen now is players will use it in their early 50's, and mentors will see this frequently pop.
The giant EXP boost may not be enough post 60, but neither are most ARR leveling dungeons.
I was worried, but it's much better in practice. Don't force yourself into content you hate. -
02-04-2018, 02:37 AMUsho
Guess you didn't read my earlier post so I say this again:
Also note the sentence whenever you enter a instance and or roulette with someone new:
"Bonus experience points and rewards will be given for swift completion."
or something along those lines. So yeah roulettes and dungeons reward players for swift completion of the instance.
You can white knight all you want Ame but the majority of ppl don't like this change. And no I'm not forcing myself to do this. I just feel sorry for the newbies who will have to wait longer to get ARR done now and the vets like me, who enjoyed this roulette for the quick 15 mins runs of those dungeons.
SE made yet another bad decision regarding ARR related content. But if you support their badness then go ahead but I don't support bad decision making.
Anyway, I'm not gonna debate with you Ame since you clearly are a white knight. GG -
02-04-2018, 02:41 AMVstarstruckoptimal exp gain even before this change was PotD 50-59, then the great gubqal library at 59 to 60 if the person was a tank or healer, because of queue times, a DPS is better off going to 60 in PotD. The only odd level range out is 60 to 61, and with 2 tribes now, one can just bridge that there and maybe pop in trial and exp roulette. Doing all 3 of those things across 2 or 3 days gives 61, then you can at level dungon spam. That is how you gain exp in this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ametrine
For people that know this, more so now, will not be doing MSQ roulette making queue times longer for those that really need it. It is too close to patch release to really see it now though, but dps are already feeling the longer queue times for it, used to be much shorter for dps. tanks and healer times are not really effected by it, least for now. -
02-04-2018, 02:55 AMAmetrineYou haven't read my earlier posts regarding this MSQ change either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
SE is putting the emphasis on storytelling. The rewards haven't been good enough for LONG time as Poetics stop being worth the grind the moment you grow past the last expansion's gear. I might run this thing with a few friends when they hit that point.
I'm just confused at people feeling the need to ask for more more more to run this increasingly more time consuming dungeons verses running content you enjoy and do reward you at the point you are on level or gear progression.
I wouldn't consider that white knighting, just wondering why players torture themselves so.