RMTs are starting to bother me...

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Originally Posted by Bebekurenai

If you were afk and not moving or blinking or turbocrafting, then you shouldn't, since you shouldn't have gotten that tell to start with. If you did though, then yes, you should scroll back, but it might be too late anyways, so nah, don't bother.

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I cannot go AFK ? I cannot go take a shit if i feel like it ? or watch a stream while i play, and just sit there in somewhere doing nothing ? Because i can be banned for "RMT" ? Really ? lol

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Originally Posted by XxOstiaxX

I cannot go AFK ? I cannot go take a shit if i feel like it ? or watch a stream while i play, and just sit there in somewhere doing nothing ? Because i can be banned for "RMT" ? Really ? lol

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Still missing the point, please read what I said: Are you running around while afk? Are you mining while afk? Do you do that all day?

I never said you can't go afk, I will explain again so you can understand me:

AFK & any constant action & all day => miss tell => banhammer
AFK & standing still => miss tell => sorry mr. GM, I was afk => np, keep on and happy hunting

Clear now?

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Originally Posted by XxOstiaxX

If i go afk and miss a tell or w/e from a GM, why should i have to scroll back or whatever to make sure no GM has messaged me ? Why should i do their job for them ? And they should not be banning people left and right w/o absolute proof of wrongdoings anyways, the community is dwindling as it is, start banning innocent people left and right, and guess who wont be recomending this game....

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This reminds me of FFXI's long history.

People complained and complained about RMT, especially many endgame players. People complained about how there wasn't a need for investigations and that RMT/exploiters/etc. were obvious of course. But then Salvage came along, and people were caught red-handed duplicating stuff in Salvage, and they all cried about how it was ever so unfair.

I'm going to laugh my heart out if something similar happens in FFXIV too. The snake is going to come back and bite people on their ass when they go around talking about investigations not being needed.

that post, just lol.

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

While it might seem to many of you that we are not combating RMT related activity at camps like Cedarwood and other places, please rest assured that the operations and STF teams are proactively looking into this and performing thorough investigations. And to give you more insight of their investigations, we banned 700 accounts last week, but as you know they keep coming back.

In addition to ongoing STF efforts, we will be setting up countermeasures system wise as we head towards version 2.0. If you happen to notice any suspicious activity in your adventuring, please take a moment and help us out by making an STF report by going here: http://support.na.square-enix.com/co...hp?id=902&la=1

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You made me laugh. I can log in the game right now and see them. And ill see the same ones in next week.

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Originally Posted by XxOstiaxX

I cannot go AFK ? I cannot go take a shit if i feel like it ? or watch a stream while i play, and just sit there in somewhere doing nothing ? Because i can be banned for "RMT" ? Really ? lol

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Stop using that bot.

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Originally Posted by Deathmask

You made me laugh. I can log in the game right now and see them. And ill see the same ones in next week.

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Quite ironically I don't see the groups anymore at Cedarwood. Some were there this morning, but now they are all gone. I have that one Mithra's name written down, did a search and I couldn't find her on the game. There is also a Japanese RMT at Cedarwood and she's not there anymore.

As I mentioned earlier, I believe that they are farming the one Faction Leve to obtain leather from all of the sheep/ram/ewe from the Leve. Not only that but also the gil.

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

While it might seem to many of you that we are not combating RMT related activity at camps like Cedarwood and other places, please rest assured that the operations and STF teams are proactively looking into this and performing thorough investigations. And to give you more insight of their investigations, we banned 700 accounts last week, but as you know they keep coming back.

In addition to ongoing STF efforts, we will be setting up countermeasures system wise as we head towards version 2.0. If you happen to notice any suspicious activity in your adventuring, please take a moment and help us out by making an STF report by going here: http://support.na.square-enix.com/co...hp?id=902&la=1

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Can you ask the devs if they plan to add an STF form into 2.0? It seems like it would be a lot easier for players to help combat RMT by filing these reports if it were possible to send these, like a GM call, without needing to log/tab out and track down the form which is kind of buried at the moment.

There were very few RMT on Gungir, but now that the server is open again I am seeing them all over the place. For right now, what I do when I see RMT is target each one and use /tell <t> <t> so that I can copy paste their names into a form, but it's still kind of cumbersome to use the website form.

In game STF reports? I love the idea.

Having a form is pointless. Right click on a player => Report to the STF. /done

Nothing else should be done on my end. Reporting someone should automatically gather all necessary data SE will need to investigate.

Name/World/Time/Date/Location etc. Having to write anything in a box is fail from the start because it will mean workload for SE, whatever we type will have to be translated into JP (unless STF are English speakers which I doubt). Anything French and German players types as well (which is even worse...)

No text is needed. At worse, just add a small category in a context menu.

Report to STF > [3rd party tool usage / Absentee Play / Advertisement spam (chat) / Other]. Also the consumer shouldn't do the work, I pay to play, not to write a wall-o-text to report a cheater. The easier the process is for the consumer, the more report SE will receive, the easier will be their job as well. (Investigating players who have 100's of reports will often yield positive results...)

Also if players have to type anything there is a high risk for mistakes. (typing names like "dsfqsdfkj dhzzbn" times 10 is really annoying.)

You guys do realize XI's STF hurt a lot of legitimate players and SE's customer support is so fail that it's fairly impossible to ever get a decision by them rectified.

You're basically asking for full cavity searches on every passenger in a post 9/11 airport.

SE's job to improve their STF on XIV as well, but that's another problem...

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Originally Posted by Antipika

Having a form is pointless. Right click on a player => Report to the STF. /done

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it can't be that easy. otherwise in more competitive situations, like trying to claim a world NM (Ifrit for example?) one LS might report an entire other LS and tie up resources with no context. if you have to fill out a form, there are key details needed. it helps prevent people who are reporting just to grief another player.

if it was this easy, they'd need to add something in to 'punish' people who just report willy-nilly.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

Nothing else should be done on my end. Reporting someone should automatically gather all necessary data SE will need to investigate.

Name/World/Time/Date/Location etc. Having to write anything in a box is fail from the start because it will mean workload for SE, whatever we type will have to be translated into JP (unless STF are English speakers which I doubt). Anything French and German players types as well (which is even worse...)

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To a degree this can be done. but you've obviously never been on the receiving end of one of these forms. a lot of this is stuff you're already going to know, so it's not a whole lot of extra work. i mean really how many people don't know what sever they are on, what time zone they are in, where they were when it happened, etc. etc.

the more details present the easier it is on the people actually doing something. the more work you make someone do, the less likely it is to be a false alarm.

also, the goal should be to make it so people can't do the behavior. this will help protect the innocent players who are just playing at a lower level due to repetition/grinding.

by giving exact details, the task force can this say 'ahhh, i can see in the log exactly where this is now. i can now tie the data to actions because it is clearly spelled out what they were doing and i dont' have to guess.'

now that i know what it looks like they were doing, and what the data says they were doing, i can give a proposal to the devs to implement to make this more difficult.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

No text is needed. At worse, just add a small category in a context menu.

Report to STF > [3rd party tool usage / Absentee Play / Advertisement spam (chat) / Other]. Also the consumer shouldn't do the work, I pay to play, not to write a wall-o-text to report a cheater. The easier the process is for the consumer, the more report SE will receive, the easier will be their job as well. (Investigating players who have 100's of reports will often yield positive results...)

Also if players have to type anything there is a high risk for mistakes. (typing names like "dsfqsdfkj dhzzbn" times 10 is really annoying.)

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If you're not paying to report people. don't. it's that simple. you're not obligated to report anyone. if you want to, it's all on you. you volunteer to help track these people down. no-one is forcing you.

and again, if it's too easy to report, then it's possible people will just report one person over and over to get them banned. (see above for world NM). 100s of reports don't really mean anything.

that risk isn't as high as you might think. if you're really concerned about it, you better make sure you get it right. otherwise you've just wasted your own time

After 3 days of no RMTs at Cedarwood, they are back this morning. However, there is no leader to their group doing the Levequests; so they are just standing there doing nothing...

In game reporting? Are you people insane? In FFXI I regularly saw people camping NMs whom accuse people I *knew* we're legit players as RMT. So now you want to give people like that, who would do nearly anything to underscore their competition just to get the claim a loaded gun? It'll be anarchy!

In no language on earth is dfsk gslll a name. They are just gil farmers who slammed their hands on the keyboard to make a name. SE just needs to scan the servers and ban all names like this. Then atleast the gilfarmers have to pretend, and maybe make real names. Cmon guys, at least try and lie to us

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Originally Posted by Ingolf

I doubt RMT would use stolen credit cards. It's a legitimate business. Using stolen credit cards would just get them in trouble seeing as the profit they make has to be claimed. Most of them are just people like you and me trying to make a few extra bucks.

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In legal terms, there is no such thing as a "legitimate RMT" business that sells gil from FFXIV accounts because selling gil, accounts, leveling services etc for real money is against the legal parameters set in the user agreement that you agree to when buying the game and playing it or even opening an SE account.

Even if the RMT company has their own legal credit cards and pays for accounts with those cards, there is not a legal way to operate a company that sells any part of the in-game content in exchange for real money. I don't mean the legal kind of selling like buying the game from Gamestop or Steam, I am specifically talking about unlicensed distributors.

Tonight while crafting for about 2 hours straight my only entertainment was the RMT train going to the adventurer guild to get more leves. The train kept taking off right as I was finishing a craft so I would miss my chance to jump on this RMT train, this made me very sad and I can only imagine what adventures I missed out on. :(

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OtuSCp3t72...ar_Express.png

Saw a line of them with their leader in Uldah. Fufufu Hahaha. So obvious with 7+ lallafels on follow with you. Gutsy move to show his face in town.

I assumed they were just passionate RPers. Afterall, Limsa's leader is named something like Mwrlb Ajktf, and Limsa is all about gangs of people doing illegal activities.

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Originally Posted by BlueMage

I assumed they were just passionate RPers. Afterall, Limsa's leader is named something like Mwrlb Ajktf, and Limsa is all about gangs of people doing illegal activities.

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That's ADMIRAL Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn to you, peasant.

Also yes. Nuke the RMTs. They make Cedarwood and eyesore.

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Originally Posted by MStowastiqVahlshdeh

In legal terms, there is no such thing as a "legitimate RMT" business that sells gil from FFXIV accounts because selling gil, accounts, leveling services etc for real money is against the legal parameters set in the user agreement that you agree to when buying the game and playing it or even opening an SE account.

Even if the RMT company has their own legal credit cards and pays for accounts with those cards, there is not a legal way to operate a company that sells any part of the in-game content in exchange for real money. I don't mean the legal kind of selling like buying the game from Gamestop or Steam, I am specifically talking about unlicensed distributors.

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If it really we're illegal, then why doesn't SE actually take people involved in RMT to court or have them arrested? After all, according to you they have broken the law. I'm sure someone's gonna throw the "but they operate outside the countries where the law is enforceable" which is just a way of saying the software license has no weight in those countries. Regardless it's just a contract, and it's pretty clear that what is said in the Software License Agreement has little influence since it's basically not possible to enforce. There simply is no way to tell if someone is violating the agreement or not without violating their privacy (by that I mean spying on them).

BTW, just to clarify the licence agreement says you don't own your account or characters, and may not sell, rent, or reproduce them or any virtual assets. You agree they have no "monetary" value. And you agree to not use any of SE's services for commercial purposes. What is does NOT say is that I can not "give" my account, character or virtual assets away. And should I find $200 your bank account the next day it's clearly "unrelated" (or so you could claim).

So SE is able to only one thing. Try to ban accounts that they find are being devoted to RMT activities. But RMT aren't phased by bans. They'll have a new account within a matter of hours. And RMT are clever. If you try to cut off one source of their revenue they will just find another. And in the end, the players not RMT are impacted the most.

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Originally Posted by Kerwin

Saw a line of them with their leader in Uldah. Fufufu Hahaha. So obvious with 7+ lallafels on follow with you. Gutsy move to show his face in town.

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What? A full party in the most populated location in the game. I've never see those in Ul'dah. How utterly strange. Well strange to think that this would be a group of RMT.

The STF has limited resources. Please make sure you have more evidence than a name and a train before you report someone. The more reports they get, the larger the backlog will fill, and the more likely corners will start to be cut. And then you'll start to see something far worse than RMT. Legitimate players being banned.

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Originally Posted by Laraul

If it really we're illegal, then why doesn't SE actually take people involved in RMT to court or have them arrested? After all, according to you they have broken the law. I'm sure someone's gonna throw the "but they operate outside the countries where the law is enforceable" which is just a way of saying the software license has no weight in those countries. Regardless it's just a contract, and it's pretty clear that what is said in the Software License Agreement has little influence since it's basically not possible to enforce.

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A contract is still a contract, even if it is difficult to enforce. Even if the chinese government isn't helping SE catch these criminals, the fact remains that they broke a law. And actually, it's quite common for gil/gold/whatever sellers to use stolen credit cards to pay for accounts. Nearly every game I know of with a serious RMT problem has mentioned that as an issue in the past. They're also not above infecting computers to steal account information either, which is also a crime.

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Originally Posted by Laraul

If it really we're illegal, then why doesn't SE actually take people involved in RMT to court or have them arrested? After all, according to you they have broken the law. I'm sure someone's gonna throw the "but they operate outside the countries where the law is enforceable" which is just a way of saying the software license has no weight in those countries. Regardless it's just a contract, and it's pretty clear that what is said in the Software License Agreement has little influence since it's basically not possible to enforce. There simply is no way to tell if someone is violating the agreement or not without violating their privacy (by that I mean spying on them).

BTW, just to clarify the licence agreement says you don't own your account or characters, and may not sell, rent, or reproduce them or any virtual assets. You agree they have no "monetary" value. And you agree to not use any of SE's services for commercial purposes. What is does NOT say is that I can not "give" my account, character or virtual assets away. And should I find $200 your bank account the next day it's clearly "unrelated" (or so you could claim).

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I think you need to read their post again.

They said it's illegal -within the context of SE's EULA-. In other words, RMT is breaking SE's laws for their own game, and they take action accordingly. There are no state or federal laws against RMT companies buying or selling virtual goods for a MMORPG. SE determines the laws within their own game, and then they enforce them.

They don't need to go to court because it's something they handle themselves. Once they realized the damage RMT was doing to FFXI a few years back, SE implemented the RMT Task Force to deal wth them in-game. I understand they're doing the same, or are ramping up to do the same in XIV.

Incidentally, as I mentioned in a previous post in this thread, there is precedent that if SE (or any other developer) were to take a RMT company to court, they have a good chance of winning. Blizzard took a RMT company to court and were awarded the decision. So, now that that precedent has been set, if any other developer wanted to sue a RMT company, they'd have a better chance of winning.

Folks, it's very simple... So long as there are terms prohibiting RMT or its related activities in a game, it is not allowed. It is not "okay". It is not "perfectly legit". When you agree to the EULA, you are agreeing not to engage in RMT activity. If you do so anyway, you are doing so in violation of that EULA and it's SE's (or any developer) right to ban your account if you're caught. Period. End of discussion.

Your "opinion" or personal "moral beliefs" on the matter do not matter. How you "think" it should be does not matter. You do not set the rules. SE does.

If you're going to RMT, then that's what you're going to do, and you take the risks associated with it. Just own up to what you're doing and stop trying to spin and defend it as being "a-okay" when you know damn well it's not.

As for your statement about not knowing someone is violating the EULA or not without spying on them... Are you serious?

MMOs track everything you do. Every transaction. They can track when you teleport, how many mobs you fight, how many quests you do. Who you trade with, and what you're trading. And so on. They absolutely do know what you're doing in-game and can utilize internal tools to look for specific patterns of activity that are commonly associated with RMT, hacking, botting, etc. This is basically how the RMT Task Force was able to track down and deal with farmers and such in XI. It's how other developers do it in their games. Is it spying? No. It's not. It's the developer policing and monitoring their own game to make sure people aren't doing crap they're not supposed to be. They are not "violating" anyone's privacy.

When you log into a MMO, you're in their house playing by their rules. Not the other way around.

Just don't do crap you're not supposed to be, play the game within its intended scope. Then you have absolutely nothing to worry about.

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Originally Posted by Laraul

What? A full party in the most populated location in the game. I've never see those in Ul'dah. How utterly strange. Well strange to think that this would be a group of RMT.

The STF has limited resources. Please make sure you have more evidence than a name and a train before you report someone. The more reports they get, the larger the backlog will fill, and the more likely corners will start to be cut. And then you'll start to see something far worse than RMT. Legitimate players being banned.

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You play on my server do you? So the line 7 of Lalafels with the name of "fgsd fssd" are legitimate? Then you know nothing and your self righteous attitude is ill-placed. Welcome to my b-list.

LOL i hope they make OPEN WORLD PVP- so we can fight rmts

YOSHI P SHOULD ADD what they did on everquest- LOOT ALL GIL from the player you kill--- Plus an item of your choice- Only pvp within 5 level range

UPDATE: I've noticed that the RMTs now have their Jobs and are now riding Chocobos as well. Plus this was hysterical: I saw some RMTs (they had the gibberish names), but they were LNC50 (and they were all lined up with each other). I also saw one BLM50, and that must've been the RMT bot leader.

Do they have AF?

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Originally Posted by Naraku_Diabolos

UPDATE: I've noticed that the RMTs now have their Jobs and are now riding Chocobos.

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Probably because SE is removing the Gobbue from being obtained anymore

RMT camping on you in Natalan? No problem!

I find them more entertaining than bothersome.

http://youtu.be/om0i3JgtQrA

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Originally Posted by Gukie

LOL i hope they make OPEN WORLD PVP- so we can fight rmts

YOSHI P SHOULD ADD what they did on everquest- LOOT ALL GIL from the player you kill--- Plus an item of your choice- Only pvp within 5 level range

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If anything make it where both parties have to agree, unless RMT proven then a GM could give you the ability to openly attack the RMT no matter where they were. The RMT would have no where to run, and no time to collect leve rewards.

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

While it might seem to many of you that we are not combating RMT related activity at camps like Cedarwood and other places, please rest assured that the operations and STF teams are proactively looking into this and performing thorough investigations. And to give you more insight of their investigations, we banned 700 accounts last week, but as you know they keep coming back.

In addition to ongoing STF efforts, we will be setting up countermeasures system wise as we head towards version 2.0. If you happen to notice any suspicious activity in your adventuring, please take a moment and help us out by making an STF report by going here: http://support.na.square-enix.com/co...hp?id=902&la=1

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Erozea is counting on you! This is a big help for SE, please help report what you see so they can handle the rmt faster!

I see them and I want to help report them... but can someone give me a guide on how to report them (step by step please)? -_-'

Hey guys I know. Instead of banning RMT, SE should change their characters to be attackable by other players!

If killed by a player, they would be permanently dead and they would drop their inventory as loot for the killing party.

It might not be as quick and fast as banning them instantly, but it would be hella fun!

The gilseller wouldn't even be notified about his character being attackable, so when trading someone who is going to buy gil, he would take a chance, cause if he was unlucky, the buyer could just attack him and steal his money.

way to much time spent caring about something that doesn't effect you

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9823/lolrmt.jpg

Cedarwood on Gungnir is pretty busy tonight :P

They even have their own linkshell, it's called "dfdsfdfsdf"

seems legit!

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Originally Posted by Resheph

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9823/lolrmt.jpg

Cedarwood on Gungnir is pretty busy tonight :P

They even have their own linkshell, it's called "dfdsfdfsdf"

seems legit!

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Only 1 of them has a linkshell.... probably a normal player

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Originally Posted by Churchill

way to much time spent caring about something that doesn't effect you

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Yes, because people artificially pumping money into the economy and illegally selling it to idiots who buy it doesn't effect you at all.

Oh wait it does; INFLATION!

http://www.gwcdn.com/albums/images/5...6528001427.jpg