Is it necessary to advertise "LGBTQ+ friendly"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

Your attitude is the one I expect from people who feel the need to design themselves as ''LGBTQ+ friendly'' and it is the reason why some people want to avoid those kinds of groups.

---

Then they should avoid those groups, that's the whole point, so people can find an FC that aligns with their interests.

Non-LGBT+ people not understanding, but trying to dictate, how LGBT+ people should exist: The Thread

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Talk to me when you've been bullied, harassed, ostracized by family, treated like crap, and actively beaten up irl for being something other than straight. This stuff still happens to this day to people, so having the indicator that the space is friendly for the LGBTQ+ people is important. Acceptance is the main thing people want here, and there's a hell of a lot of people who won't accept LGBTQ+ people in this day and age.

---

I think most people don't actually care what your sexual orientation is while playing a video game tbh, and that is why this topic is so obnoxious.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

I think most people don't actually care what your sexual orientation is while playing a video game tbh, and that is why this topic is so obnoxious.

---

Most people probably don't. Some people do. LGBTQ+ gamers want to game too without having to constantly explain or defend their lifestyles to others.

Always find it annoying when I see a guild advertise being LGBTQ/Furry friendly. Because it doesn't really matter. You shouldnt need a overly safespace.
I am not . This the same thing when this guild are advertised in ESO no cares who you sleep with just learn your class and have fun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Talk to me when you've been bullied, harassed, ostracized by family, treated like crap, and actively beaten up irl for being something other than straight. This stuff still happens to this day to people, so having the indicator that the space is friendly for the LGBTQ+ people is important. Acceptance is the main thing people want here, and there's a hell of a lot of people who won't accept LGBTQ+ people in this day and age.

---

Relevance? Just because some have suffered more than me in some case don't make their issues more real or impactful than others. The mainstream media accepted the LGBTQ+ movement and it viewed as a bad thing to be homophobic. Creating a safe space just creates another gap between those who are LGBTQ+ and those who ain't. IMO doing those kinds of thing just contribute to the problem you're trying to solve instead of helping against it. If you keep this toxic passive-aggressive of yours, maybe you ain't a victim.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashliet

Always find it annoying when I see a guild advertise being LGBTQ/Furry friendly. Because it doesn't really matter. You shouldnt need a overly safespace.
I am not . This the same thing when this guild are advertised in ESO no cares who you sleep with just learn your class and have fun.

---

Why is it annoying to you? Apply the same logic to yourself "No one cares" so stop caring?

"You shouldnt need a overly safespace." <-- That would certainly be nice wouldn't it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Why is it annoying to you? Apply the same logic to yourself "No one cares" so stop caring?

"You shouldnt need a overly safespace." <-- That would certainly be nice wouldn't it.

---

Again it doesn't matter who you sleept with so why advertise it. If you want it to be seen as normal or accepted then advertiseing it friendly in a space like FF14 when no one really cares your sexual orientation is annoying.
There are few instances where advertising LBGTQ friendly is required like at a church. There are churches where i live that are and aren't friendly.
This game isn't a church. This game isn't saying if your gay don't play it. Why this keeps coming up is baffling.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

Relevance? Just because some have suffered more than me in some case don't make their issues more real or impactful than others. The mainstream media accepted the LGBTQ+ movement and it viewed as a bad thing to be homophobic. Creating a safe space just creates another gap between those who are LGBTQ+ and those who ain't. IMO doing those kinds of thing just contribute to the problem you're trying to solve instead of helping against it. If you keep this toxic passive-aggressive of yours, maybe you ain't a victim.

---

The only response that can be given.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

Relevance? Just because some have suffered more than me in some case don't make their issues more real or impactful than others. The mainstream media accepted the LGBTQ+ movement and it viewed as a bad thing to be homophobic. Creating a safe space just creates another gap between those who are LGBTQ+ and those who ain't. IMO doing those kinds of thing just contribute to the problem you're trying to solve instead of helping against it. If you keep this toxic passive-aggressive of yours, maybe you ain't a victim.

---

Straight people are not being excluded from these groups? They are not making an LGBTQ+ EXCLUSIVE community, they are making one that is open to all while noting specifically that LGBTQ+ lifestyles will be welcome. Why do people keep assuming its exclusionary of cis/hetero people?

If it bothers you or you think it's for attention. You're probably the kind of person that group doesn't want to play with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashliet

Again it doesn't matter who you sleept with so why advertise it. If you want it to be seen as normal or accepted then advertiseing it friendly in a space like FF14 when no one really cares your sexual orientation is annoying.
There are few instances where advertising LBGTQ friendly is required like at a church. There are churches where i live that are and aren't friendly.
This game isn't a church. This game isn't saying if your gay don't play it. Why this keeps coming up is baffling.

---

Because people do obviously seem to care lol? If no one cared there wouldn't be an issue in the first place. This thread wouldn't exist. Besides, how do you know no one cares? What gives you the authority to speak for everyone? Plenty of posts here give examples of LGBTQ+ members experiences where people did seem to care.

I see people have taken the bait and already at eachothers throats. :3

Look at this, one person says it doesn't matter, and you all will not let up on how it does matter and people do care. This is why no one can take you all seriously, you just don't know when to stfu and move on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Straight people are not being excluded from these groups? They are not making an LGBTQ+ EXCLUSIVE community, they are making one that is open to all while noting specifically that LGBTQ+ lifestyles will be welcome. Why do people keep assuming its exclusionary of cis/hetero people?

---

No, but as soon as I give my 2 cents about safe space (And not against LGBTQ+ people mind you) I'm being told that I'm straight so I haven't suffered like them and that my opinion doesn't count. So yea, I will take a wild guess and say they ain't that much straight friendly if they assume I am as soon as I disagree slightly with them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

Look at this, one person says it doesn't matter, and you all will not let up on how it does matter and people do care. This is why no one can take you all seriously, you just don't know when to stfu and move on.

---

Hey we all wish it didn't matter, I think everyone here could agree on that. But the fact is it does matter to some people, and pretending it doesn't, doesn't make the issue go away.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The only response that can be given.

---

Glad you prove my point even more by being even more passive-aggressive

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Hey we all wish it didn't matter, I think everyone here could agree on that. But the fact is it does matter to some people, and pretending it doesn't, doesn't make the issue go away.

---

The thing Is being homophobic is viewed as a bad thing and I'm pretty sure that even in a non LGBTQ+ friendly GC, anyone who show any kinds of direspectfull behavior will get reported and probably removed from said GC. So Why do we need safe spaces in an era where bullies ain't the norm and ain't tolerated?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

Look at this, one person says it doesn't matter, and you all will not let up on how it does matter and people do care. This is why no one can take you all seriously, you just don't know when to stfu and move on.

---

This, exactly this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

The thing Is being homophobic is viewed as a bad thing and I'm pretty sure that even in a non LGBTQ+ friendly GC, anyone who show any kinds of direspectfull behavior will get reported and probably removed from said GC. So Why do we need safe spaces in an era where bullies ain't the norm and ain't tolerated?

---

and this

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

The thing Is being homophobic is viewed as a bad thing and I'm pretty sure that even in a non LGBTQ+ friendly GC, anyone who show any kinds of direspectfull behavior will get reported and probably removed from said GC. So Why do we need safe spaces in an era where bullies ain't the norm and ain't tolerated?

---

Bullies aren't the norm and aren't tolerated? Have you paid attention to politics at all recently in the past 6 years?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

The thing Is being homophobic is viewed as a bad thing and I'm pretty sure that even in a non LGBTQ+ friendly GC, anyone who show any kinds of direspectfull behavior will get reported and probably removed from said GC. So Why do we need safe spaces in an era where bullies ain't the norm and ain't tolerated?

---

Because people don't want to be bullied in the first place. Just because you can report someone doesn't mean someone wants to subject themselves to having to go through the bullying and then subsequent reporting of said bullying then subsequent fallout from filing a report against another FC member. And there is no guarantee they will be removed from the FC either.

Its like saying hey you can walk through this alley known for pickpocketing but don't worry you can just call the police if anything happens. Or you can take this alley where you are less likely to be pickpocketed in the first place. Which alley would you choose?

It's a filter. If you're the kind of person who would get bent out of shape by a "LGBTQ+ friendly" FC, then you wouldn't be a good fit for that FC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Bullies aren't the norm and aren't tolerated? Have you paid attention to politics at all recently in the past 6 years?

---

Maybe worldview is different in the victim mentality bubble you seem to live in, But LGBTQ+ people are accepted in most parts of the world, and homophobes are considered as bigots or old men/women who can't let go of the old mentality they had from 50-ish years ago. There are certain parts of the world (Mostly China and Russia) That still have the horrible anti-LBTQ+ politic and it is not like these 2 countries are viewed as ''good guys'' by the rest of the world.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Because people don't want to be bullied in the first place. Just because you can report someone doesn't mean someone wants to subject themselves to having to go through the bullying and then subsequent reporting of said bullying then subsequent fallout from filing a report against another FC member. And there is no guarantee they will be removed from the FC either.

Its like saying hey you can walk through this alley known for pickpocketing but don't worry you can just call the police if anything happens. Or you can take this alley where you are less likely to be pickpocketed in the first place. Which alley would you choose?

---

Except for your alley example don't work cause normal FC ain't reputed to bully LGBTQ+ friendly people. You can't avoid bullying in the first place, people will always be an ass for any kind of stupid reasons, but this a a video game where you can just blacklist people and go on with your life.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

Except your alley exemple don,t work cause normal FC ain't reputed to bully LGBTQ+ friendly people.

---

What is a "normal" FC? I am sure most FC's are filled with good people. But its an online game, people come from all over, different cultures, different belief systems, different societies. Sometimes there are people who fundamentally don't get along. The LGBTQ+ indicator on FC recruitment is just a tag to help avoid those differences. If an FC advertised "Pokemon Fans" welcome and you're not into Pokemon would it bother you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

What is a "normal" FC? I am sure most FC's are filled with good people. But its an online game, people come from all over, different cultures, different belief systems, different societies. Sometimes there are people who fundamentally don't get along. The LGBTQ+ indicator on FC recruitment is just a tag to help avoid those differences. If an FC advertised "Pokemon Fans" welcome and you're not into Pokemon would it bother you?

---

In this case, a Normal FC is one that don'T feel the need to put ''LGBTQ+ friendly'' tag

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Most people probably don't. Some people do. LGBTQ+ gamers want to game too without having to constantly explain or defend their lifestyles to others.

---

The victim mentality is strong in this one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

What is a "normal" FC? I am sure most FC's are filled with good people. But its an online game, people come from all over, different cultures, different belief systems, different societies. Sometimes there are people who fundamentally don't get along. The LGBTQ+ indicator on FC recruitment is just a tag to help avoid those differences. If an FC advertised "Pokemon Fans" welcome and you're not into Pokemon would it bother you?

---

A normal FC would be a FC that is focused on the game and the games content, not on civil rights movements.

I would never put a LGBTQ+ indicator on my FC cause I expect normal people to just act mature.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

I would never put a LGBTQ+ indicator on my FC cause I expect normal people to just act mature.

---

Unfortunately, you expect too much of people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Unfortunately, you expect too much of people.

---

You don't know me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

You don't know me.

---

I know enough having played this game since 2.0's beta that people will not act mature in many cases.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Bullies aren\\'t the norm and aren\\'t tolerated? Have you paid attention to politics at all recently in the past 6 years?

---

Oh Jesus cartwheeling Christ, here we go again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Seriously how does reporting the FC you're trying to join suddenly get you into an FC you're comfortable being in? How does reporting solve anything? The point is to avoid having to go through potential hassle and harassment in the first place. Would you even want to stay in a FC with other members who you had to report? Or would the other members even want you there after? Probably not. So back to square 1 looking for an FC that will just welcome you, if only there was some way to know before hand...

---

It doesn't, you report it and move on. Why would staying even be one of your options? Talk is cheap, just because they say they're LGBTQ+ doesn't offer a guarantee either, but thats a different discussion. My point remains. If its against ToS then you shouldn't have to be so cautious as you'll have power over any violators by being able to report them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Link941

It doesn't, you report it and move on. Why would staying even be one of your options? Talk is cheap, just because they say they're LGBTQ+ doesn't offer a guarantee either, but thats a different discussion. My point remains. If its against ToS then you shouldn't have to be so cautious as you'll have power over any violators by being able to report them.

---

And my point is having power to do something about it doesn't mean you want to be exposed to it in the first place. Obviously "LGBTQ+ friendly" doesn't guarantee you won't run into issues. You may even find more of certain type of issues. I have never reported anyone in game besides bots, how do I even benefit from it? I can ignore people perfectly well enough on my own without making them hate me more for it. I'm not looking for some sense of justice nor do I want to hurt anyone just because they don't share my viewpoints. Like you said i just move on, I am not trying to be nor do i want to have to police anyone. I don't want to deal with it period. Finding a place where its less likely to be an issue sounds good to me. Also informing people who get 'annoyed' at seeing LGBTQ+ related topics that they are probably going to see a lot of it in that FC also lets you know to avoid that FC, win win for everyone.

As a member of that community, I'm glad when FCs advertise it. It means 9 times out of 10 that said FC is going to be a hive of drama, high school-tier relationship infighting, gossip, and a whole maelstrom of stuff that doesn't interest me in the slightest, and I can keep looking for another FC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magikazam

The thing Is being homophobic is viewed as a bad thing and I'm pretty sure that even in a non LGBTQ+ friendly GC, anyone who show any kinds of direspectfull behavior will get reported and probably removed from said GC. So Why do we need safe spaces in an era where bullies ain't the norm and ain't tolerated?

---

Look less than a few pages back in these very forums and you’ll find massive threads filled with dozens of actively posting jerks being shamelessly and unhealthily obsessed with harassing transgender people by repeatedly misgendering them, inappropriately being fixated on what someone’s genitalia may be, spreading misinformation while ignoring basic developments in science, and tossing lots of other insults that have sometimes had to be removed by moderators; this isn’t even accounting for the numerous trolling threads or how many of these bigoted comments also have lots of likes. There also continue to be offensive comments toward other members of the LGBTQ+ community as well, with that example thread additionally including the ridiculous defending of harmful AIDS-related stereotypes, many blatant double standards, accusations of non-straight people who are uncomfortable with harassment as apparently being insecure with their own sexuality, and there’s even a still-visible and liked post where someone said it was a shame that certain individuals didn’t kill themselves.

So please don’t downplay the harassment against LGBTQ+ people (and defend the topic creator getting annoyed at some companies advertising they’re inclusive of LGBTQ+ people) based on the unfortunately wrong statement that such harassment is societally opposed as a whole; just on these slowly moderated forums alone, you really don’t need to look around much to find both homophobia and transphobia still happening.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashliet

Always find it annoying when I see a guild advertise being LGBTQ/Furry friendly. Because it doesn't really matter. You shouldnt need a overly safespace.
I am not . This the same thing when this guild are advertised in ESO no cares who you sleep with just learn your class and have fun.

---

If it apparently doesn’t matter, then why post this at all, and why do so many other people keep replying in agreement with the topic creator if said people apparently don’t care?

It clearly does seem to matter to you to some extent since you felt the need to share that you find it annoying when some free companies advertise that they’re inclusive of non-straight and transgender people.

It’s also kind of weird that you only mention sexual activity even though sexuality also includes romantic attraction, which tends to be brought up more in casual conversation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by angienessyo

Did the person that hit on you back off when you let them know you're straight? Because if so I'm not sure how they were being disrespectful unless they hit on you in a really not ToS friendly way. But if not, obviously that's not okay for them to continue and that'd be really out of line for them. I'm a lesbian and have gotten hit on by straight men many times playing this game. As long as the guys are cool and back off/don't start being creepy about it when I let them know I'm not into men, it's never been a big deal. (sadly they don't always back off or get really weird and want really personal details about my love life when I let them know)

---

Nooo!!! Thats the thing! I was in the wrong and all according to them even when I stated "im straight"
.......I decided to leave :S
At that point I didn't know i could say something but the main thing is they should respect also when I say back the F up and not label others as the "bad" ones

Yes and no.

While people don't have to be demeaning or harassing of people it is not the same as being friendly.

Separate but equal sounded like a good idea to some people at one point. But we all know how that worked out.

Proactively being supportive is way different then being neutral or not being a jerk. I hope those that advertise as this are actually meeting the expectation they set.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MellowMink

So please don’t downplay the harassment against LGBTQ+ people (and defend the topic creator getting annoyed at some companies advertising they’re inclusive of LGBTQ+ people) based on the unfortunately wrong statement that such harassment is societally opposed as a whole; just on these slowly moderated forums alone, you really don’t need to look around much to find both homophobia and transphobia still happening.

---

I can do whatever I want and defend whoever I want, you don't hold the moral ground. People like me are just tired of LGBTQ+ agenda-pushing safe space and victim mentality. That just creates more barriers between people. You don't solve problems by running away from them. From experience, LGBTQ+ friendly groups just create drama and turn into a cult that judges you based on your gender identity. Don't believe me? just look at my first post on this thread. Just said I didn't like said group attitude and the first thing I got replied with was that my opinion doesn't matter cause I'm Straight and I didn't get bullied. First off, he can't know that cause I never talked or mentioned it. So that means that he considers anyone who disagrees with him an aggressor and the aggressor HAS to be Straight. I also weird that with the tons of people ive meet, the only one who saw bully everywhere where the one who based their whole personality around their gender identity.

Also no, you live in a fantasy world if you think homophobe are considered the good guy. Just cause a small minority of people decide to be asshole dosen't mean that the whole world disregard or hate you.