Hamlet defense feedback from a top 20 provisioner: Critical problems and solutions

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no, the drops are split(from the chest)

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How would you know? You never see an undistributed list of drops. You just see so and so's loot list now contains <blah>.

The DoW/DoM items come from the chest (Assumption Police: this may be a MASSIVE assumption, but not really). The chest drops are split among the parties loot list and can be given to another member via loot list. The DoH/DoL items are from the captain for being a top20 provisioner. These items go straight into your inventory (like Ifrit).

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Originally Posted by Sigmakan

The DoW/DoM items come from the chest (Assumption Police: this may be a MASSIVE assumption, but not really). The chest drops are split among the parties loot list and can be given to another member via loot list. The DoH/DoL items are from the captain for being a top20 provisioner. These items go straight into your inventory (like Ifrit).

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its already been confirmed drops from chest are the combat armors

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

its already been confirmed drops from chest are the combat armors

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Haha I know, I was making a joke . . . I failed.

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The chest drops are split among the parties loot list and can be given to another member via loot list.

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Again, I have yet to see any evidence that the loot is one pool that's immediately divvied up at random. I think each person's loot list is populated seperately.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Again, I have yet to see any evidence that the loot is one pool that's immediately divvied up at random. I think each person's loot list is populated seperately.

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proof = people who have actualy gotten drops from the chests who have told us thats how it works

you need to read back through some of these threads and see that


if a chest has to be touched by everyone(ifrit, moogle) then its seperate drops
if 1 person opens it, and its opened for everyone, thats a group pool

And the captain rewards are per person, you only get if you talk to the captain after the battle ends. (Exclusive to top 20 provisioners) --completely independant of the chest.

It is even missable, if you let the 5 minute timer run down after completing a hamlet defense, before talking to the captain.

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Originally Posted by Sigmakan

For the Hamlet Defense on Friday night (did ~15 runs), got 2 Top20 drops, and 1 Chest drop. Its the first chest drop Ive seen out of the 25+ runs Ive done.

Would like to see the chest drops go from 1% to 5%. Not sure what to do about provisioner drops, making the provisioner participate 10-20 hamlet runs to get their return on investment seems a bit extreme.

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Hi Signakan,

Congrats! :)

The drop rate sounds pretty low still. I wonder how any players outside the Top 20 would feel trying Hamlet Defense with the current drop rates?

I just fear it'll become a "Need a Top 20 or forget it"-type mentality soon with the current balance.

Even if SE hoped that, say, "Level 5" would have much better drop rates, if they keep Level 1 and 2 at the current rates, how many people would even bother to try it going forward?

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Originally Posted by Kiara

Hi Signakan,

Congrats! :)

The drop rate sounds pretty low still. I wonder how any players outside the Top 20 would feel trying Hamlet Defense with the current drop rates?

I just fear it'll become a "Need a Top 20 or forget it"-type mentality soon with the current balance.

Even if SE hoped that, say, "Level 5" would have much better drop rates, if they keep Level 1 and 2 at the current rates, how many people would even bother to try it going forward?

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players in my shell dont mind at all, we got about 20-30 people who will go just for the sake of going cuz they enjoy it, and if we get a drop thatl be awesome too but its not the end all


but alot dont want to touch it cuz they dont like the drops, but these same people will do 500 ifrits for a chance at a specific drop they want...

Hi All,

Thanks to Reinheart, it looks like the Dev Team *might* be looking into a Point System for Hamlet Defense. {Yes, please.}

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Originally Posted by Reinheart

こんばんは。
Good Evening,

皆さんより、多くフィードバックを頂いている、
From below two which we received the most feedback on

• ランキング内でも上位と下位で差をつけて欲しい
  Have a difference between higher/lower rank in the ranking (person who's in rank 1 is treated differently than the person who's in rank 20)
• 納品ポイントに応じて、何かしらメリットを設けてほしい
  Want some kind of merit to be placed for supply points.

上記2点について、現在開発チームで対応の検討を進めています。
対応内容などの詳細については、決まり次第あらためてお伝えします。
For above two the dev team is currently looking into it.
Will let you know the details once it is confirmed.

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But as Signakan posted, I don't agree with them developing *even more* difference / loot pools(?) between Rank 1 and Rank 20.

That *isn't* the problem: It's the horrible difference between making the Top 20 and *not* making it (the majority of the server), and how there's no incentive to even try Hamlet Defense unless you make it in the Top 20.

Here's to hoping we get some real, meaningful changes for the better, because I really enjoy Hamlet Defense (from an idea point of view). :)

Its a tricky balance. There needs to be some sort of motivation for people to donate, but if its too big of a reward it makes Hamlet feel worthless for those outside the Top20. I have no suggestions for a quick fix to this, because I think the overall system is flawed. It does help that the loot lists for Captain and Chest are independent, but not many realize this.

If there were leaderboards for DoH/DoL/DoM/DoW for the Hamlet battle phase and some additional award was given to them, this would help provide motivation to participate in Hamlet.

Also, if ever there was a time for a tokenized reward system, Hamlet was it.

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Originally Posted by Sigmakan

Also, if ever there was a time for a tokenized reward system, Hamlet was it.

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I agree with this 100%. Especially for the Seals. I mean, you can still have something take time to acquire and have a token system. RNG is getting highly annoying right now to the point where it's starting to look embarrassing as a developer. Don't they have any room in their minds to generate a more innovative way to gain really rare gear without leaving it up to chance?

RNG for someone who has a lot of time in their schedules to play will possibly see more rewards. However, there is the chance that they won't and draw the short straw more times than not. This leaves the possibility of someone who doesn't put as much time into these seals to get lucky and gain them easily. Now.... that is not the part that infuriates me. There is nothing wrong with rewarding anyone for completing content whether it be their first time or their 100th clear. However, there is a point where you need long term end game-ish content where it clearly separates the men from the boys.

It's sort of just left up to who has those winning numbers. That is an old idea. Last I checked, people gained success in the amount of work they put in. Not winning the lottery.

The Problem has nothing to do with the Donation system. The problem is that SE made this 8 player party only content. Everyone and their mother would be donating if they thought they had even a remote chance of having a party to do Hamlet defense when it actually came time to fight. But they don't. Expecting people to have 8 man parties ready and waiting is quite literally the worst possible design for this content.

If people new for sure they were going to be able to participate, they wouldn't mind Doing the donation period. They should have set this up like 7th Umbral Era content or Behest. Anyone can sign up, and the parties are made after the event begins.

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Originally Posted by Kiara

Hi All,

Thanks to Reinheart, it looks like the Dev Team *might* be looking into a Point System for Hamlet Defense. {Yes, please.}

[/COLOR]

But as Signakan posted, I don't agree with them developing *even more* difference / loot pools(?) between Rank 1 and Rank 20.

That *isn't* the problem: It's the horrible difference between making the Top 20 and *not* making it (the majority of the server), and how there's no incentive to even try Hamlet Defense unless you make it in the Top 20.

Here's to hoping we get some real, meaningful changes for the better, because I really enjoy Hamlet Defense (from an idea point of view). :)

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actualy i think you no longer understand the problem

its been proven how to get drops and drop rate increases out of the chest


the top 20 and the chest drops have NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER

the top 20 get a unique set of drops as compared to the group when opening the chest(based ons core)

so people not in the top 20 have plenty of incewntive to go, since they can still get those chest drops. half the drops that can come from the top 20, people not in it wont want anyway(especialy the non gather/crafty types who cant use any of them)

as more players figure out how tro boost scores, you are seeing less complaint about this, time to pay attention and get with the times

To make people do more supply,
It should become something like this :

-If you supply over 100k point, then you get extra bronze chest every win in battle phase.
-If you supply over 300k point, then you get extra silver chest, every win in battle phase.
-If you be in top-20, then regardless of point, you get extra gold chest every win in battle phase.


So even if you don't become top-20, you can still get extra reward more than those who contribute 0 supply, as long as you reach 100k, 300k mark.

Hello,

I think (especially in light of Thevedis' summary), the real concerns can (and perhaps should be) focused on two really tough problems:

-- If you donate enough to be 21st you get nothing. Which means if more than 20 people donate, all but 20 of them will be very sad.

-- If you donate enough to be in top 20, you STILL need to win battle in order to get an item. Very sad if you manage to donate a lot but suddenly can not show up to battle or find people to win battles with you.

I think it would be great if those could be solved. That would perhaps increase incentive for more people to donate.


Ironically, I think there may be more incentive to not donate than to donate. If you do not donate, you still can get an item from a chest. You could literally just randomly show up for one battle and win something. This is not the case for someone who donates.

(However I still think making Grade 5 dark matter the most lucrative drop I've seen go to anyone after 20 battles is just mean.... At least.. make it 8 pieces of DM ?)