Please, NEVER nerf RDM!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Emstidor

I think Magna has the right of it actually, RDM's melee skills are indeed physical damage but their potency is based on INT rather than STR, not unlike how NIN's melee skills scale of DEX instead of STR.

Which just makes this even more perplexing.

---

I think you can chalk this up to he has no idea what he's doing, I almost feel like this topic was a trap.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Emstidor

I think Magna has the right of it actually, RDM's melee skills are indeed physical damage but their potency is based on INT rather than STR, not unlike how NIN's melee skills scale of DEX instead of STR.

Which just makes this even more perplexing.

---

Even more, no RDM's enchanted melee skills are unaspected magic damage. There's no reason at all to consider investing in RDM's physical damage capabilities.

@magnanimousCynic

Your right they are, the STR is for auto attacks. In the split second between casting there is an opening to auto attack its not much i agree but even the smallest extra damage can sometimes make all the difference.

As for the other question, as of late i've had to step into a melee role as there aren't many reading up anymore and i do this to support the tank. it also places me near him in case i need to throw a support heal. as it stands without enhancements to my melee i can do around 1500-2300 compared to just around 2000-3000 (without critical) so it doesn't really make to much difference and i can do two things at once rather then just casting. Also if i relly more on Jolt, Scatter, and Impulse from that range my bar still goes up and i get an AOE around 1300-1500 (without critical) that makes the runs go much faster. On bosses i'll hang back and bombard them with my spells sure but leading up the melee is on par with most Monks and adds a second sword to the mix, then add in the AOE stuff and a lot of tanks have been very very thankful.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vorx

its not much i agree but even the smallest extra damage can sometimes make all the difference.

---

You'd get a much larger damage boost by melding literally any non-capped secondary stat instead of STR. Melding Crit/DH/SpS/Det would make ALL of your damaging abilities better, unlike STR which only buffs your <100 auto attacks.

No you just think it was, this was a serious plea to the devs. If anything i should of foreseen this, there's always elites who want to ruin every post and talk down to whoever they feel isn't up to their standards even though their standards mean jack crap!

Well, now that that's out of the way.

Nerf RDM? Yes please.

i didnt bother reading the entire thread, looked at the first couple of posts then page 17's response to melee damage is on par to monk and i lol'd

are you guys post whoring just to push your counter up? lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

Well, now that that's out of the way.

Nerf RDM? Yes please.

---

I hope they don't, as it stands the class and most things are on the right level in this expansion. Kinda rare for it to be as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ootarion

Having already played RDM myself, if they nerf its damage to a degree that puts it under BLM, Im not gonna play the class anymore. It is fine where it is, if BLM is suffering, then perhaps it is time to improve BLM itself, and not take a dump on another class.

---

You're also the person who created a thread crying about AST and threatening to quit that too, should it receive nerfs.

Apparently, SE better not ever nerf any OP job if they don't want to feel the wrath of you throwing a tantrum and quitting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

Well, now that that's out of the way.

Nerf RDM? Yes please.

---

And how the hell is this a solution to the underlying issues of smn and blm?
Red Mage can be kept as is not nerfed just because they messed up on the other jobs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ootarion

Having already played RDM myself, if they nerf its damage to a degree that puts it under BLM, Im not gonna play the class anymore. It is fine where it is, if BLM is suffering, then perhaps it is time to improve BLM itself, and not take a dump on another class.

---

While i agree about portion of what you said, blm should be more damage then Red (i mained blm for years up until just recently and main Red now). Red Mage does not get punished in mechanics like blm does, and when a older rotation does more damage on blm it shows how it is a bit broken

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

Well, now that that's out of the way.

Nerf RDM? Yes please.

---

Nah, no reason to nerf it.

The funny thing is, Still waiting on the proof that rdm is op. Not seen it yet.

They should nerf it and make it's dps rank same as a smn or blm and make its healing based off mind and not int.

Do not nerf RDM, boost full black magic casters DPS. As hinted at the live letter, it should be like that. :) Let's see tomorrow! I do hope so!!! :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

You're also the person who created a thread crying about AST and threatening to quit that too, should it receive nerfs.

Apparently, SE better not ever nerf any OP job if they don't want to feel the wrath of you throwing a tantrum and quitting.

---

Since I'm on mobile and cannot edit my post, I'll quote myself. The person I responded to is a level 55 RDM which makes this even more amusing.

Something that I think should be changed for red mage is that if a proc expires mid cast, it doesn't interrupt your cast. It's really stupid

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

Something that I think should be changed for red mage is that if a proc expires mid cast, it doesn't interrupt your cast. It's really stupid

---

Oddly, I like that more than having to sit for that full cast timer to go through and then nothing happens.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vorx

As for the other question, as of late i've had to step into a melee role as there aren't many reading up anymore and i do this to support the tank. it also places me near him in case i need to throw a support heal. as it stands without enhancements to my melee i can do around 1500-2300 compared to just around 2000-3000 (without critical) so it doesn't really make to much difference and i can do two things at once rather then just casting. Also if i relly more on Jolt, Scatter, and Impulse from that range my bar still goes up and i get an AOE around 1300-1500 (without critical) that makes the runs go much faster. On bosses i'll hang back and bombard them with my spells sure but leading up the melee is on par with most Monks and adds a second sword to the mix, then add in the AOE stuff and a lot of tanks have been very very thankful.

---

Pffffffft!

There is absolutely no need for you to step into a melee role. You are classified as a caster. Under no circumstances should you even be putting yourself that close to any mob or boss unless you are at the melee portion of your RDM rotation. And even then, you should almost always start that once your black and white mana levels are at or close to 100. RDMs in this game excel at two things: black and white magic, and combining them. Not melee.

You are only doing yourself and (more importantly) your team a disservice by trying to "melee."

I have been following this thread for the first few days, and I have held my tongue, but no more. You, Vorx, are by far the worst red mage player I have seen post.

In what mind do you equate a Red Mage Non-buffed melee combo to a monk? A monk can do 4k+ dps in melee range. A red mage will never get that high. You seem to neglect the fact that monks get 30% damage from greased lightning, 5% from fists of fire, a blunt resistance down, extra from twin strikes, and more oGCD abilities. You will never be a monk.

Honestly, if I ever encountered you in a group I was in, I'd make sure you get kicked because I'm not about to carry someone. Melding strength into your gear because it increases auto attacks, pfffftt.

I don't pay your sub. I don't tell a player how to play when it affects themselves. But as soon as you go into a dungeon or a primal with something so obviously wrong, it isn't just your game anymore. You are single-handedly ruining the experience of other people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vorx

As for the other question, as of late i've had to step into a melee role as there aren't many reading up anymore and i do this to support the tank. it also places me near him in case i need to throw a support heal. as it stands without enhancements to my melee i can do around 1500-2300 compared to just around 2000-3000 (without critical) so it doesn't really make to much difference and i can do two things at once rather then just casting. Also if i relly more on Jolt, Scatter, and Impulse from that range my bar still goes up and i get an AOE around 1300-1500 (without critical) that makes the runs go much faster. On bosses i'll hang back and bombard them with my spells sure but leading up the melee is on par with most Monks and adds a second sword to the mix, then add in the AOE stuff and a lot of tanks have been very very thankful.

---

You need to learn how to play RDM.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LarcSekaya

I have been following this thread for the first few days, and I have held my tongue, but no more. You, Vorx, are by far the worst FFXIV player I have seen post.

---

Fix't.

/10char

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vorx

As for the other question, as of late i've had to step into a melee role as there aren't many reading up anymore and i do this to support the tank. it also places me near him in case i need to throw a support heal. as it stands without enhancements to my melee i can do around 1500-2300 compared to just around 2000-3000 (without critical) so it doesn't really make to much difference and i can do two things at once rather then just casting. Also if i relly more on Jolt, Scatter, and Impulse from that range my bar still goes up and i get an AOE around 1300-1500 (without critical) that makes the runs go much faster. On bosses i'll hang back and bombard them with my spells sure but leading up the melee is on par with most Monks and adds a second sword to the mix, then add in the AOE stuff and a lot of tanks have been very very thankful.

---

Okay. I'm sure you're joking now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Centershock

There is absolutely no need for you to step into a melee role. You are classified as a caster. Under no circumstances should you even be putting yourself that close to any mob or boss unless you are at the melee portion of your RDM rotation. And even then, you should almost always start that once your black and white mana levels are at or close to 100. RDMs in this game excel at two things: black and white magic, and combining them. Not melee.

You are only doing yourself and (more importantly) your team a disservice by trying to "melee."

---

Actually you should be standing in melee range unless you have a reason not to because extra auto attack damage. But melding STR to increase that is just stupid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

Actually you should be standing in melee range unless you have a reason not to because extra auto attack damage. But melding STR to increase that is just stupid.

---

Not to mention standing in close range allows you to be a more useful target for Dragoons and that Dragon Eye buff. You can also reserve your mobility skills for dodging boss aoes, allowing you to use the GCD that would otherwise be spent locked in a movement animation to cast more spells.

I dont get why people cry Nerf, instead they should ask for the others to be buffed. SMN got hit hard and never compensated for the loss, BLM get screwed over by movement and the recent fights count for more dodge then dps check so there a BLM gets screwed out of ley lines cause of aoes.

Only reason RDM feels OP is cause it copes with movement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

Actually you should be standing in melee range unless you have a reason not to because extra auto attack damage. But melding STR to increase that is just stupid.

---

You realize auto attacking kills Dualcast, right?

Cant believe it took this long for people to finally take bigger shots at OP. Rdm is a caster, melee combo be damned you will never be a melee like the other classes. Your a DPS first and a Caster foremost. Maybe if all the "elites" you complained about in the DF vent kept telling you how to play Rdm they may have been right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lynde

You realize auto attacking kills Dualcast, right?

---

Elaborate, if you would, please.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lynde

You realize auto attacking kills Dualcast, right?

---

It doesn't.

I still stand by the opinion that RDM needs a significant DPS nerf. Or that they should have higher costs on their spells. Either of those would be fine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

It doesn't.

---

They changed it since the actual release then. The original tooltip said it did.

You guys realize that all the people saying "please don't nerf X" really just points to the fact that it probably is overpowered and deserves a nerf, right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

I still stand by the opinion that RDM needs a significant DPS nerf. Or that they should have higher costs on their spells. Either of those would be fine.

---

And the rest of us stand by the opinion that you know nothing about RDM and all your proposals would destroy the Job as a DPS job. Glad to see nothing has changed over the past few days here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fynlar

You guys realize that all the people saying "please don't nerf X" really just points to the fact that it probably is overpowered and deserves a nerf, right?

---

More that it points to the fact that if people whine hard enough, even if they're wrong, Square will cave in, and that the only way to prevent an unwanted change, is to voice a dissenting opinion.

Quote:

---

More that it points to the fact that if people whine hard enough, even if they're wrong, Square will cave in, and that the only way to prevent an unwanted change, is to voice a dissenting opinion.

---

Obviously nerfs are unwanted. The point is that if you feel like you have to beg for something not to be nerfed in the first place, it probably is too strong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fynlar

Obviously nerfs are unwanted. The point is that if you feel like you have to beg for something not to be nerfed in the first place, it probably is too strong.

---

Or that if people are begging for nerfs when they're not required, the only way to prevent them is to voice a dissenting opinion.

If 20 people say the lightbulb is broken and 100 people ignore them due to the fact it's shining just fine, do you think someone is going to try and, 'Fix,' the bulb if everyone else don't say a thing on the matter?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vexander

Or that if people are begging for nerfs when they're not required, the only way to prevent them is to voice a dissenting opinion.

---

I'm not a DPS main, but isn't more utility meant to equate to lower personal DPS? So theoretically RDM should be doing less than BLM/SMN. Which I'm assuming is not the case right now.

AST is in a similar position, and while nerfs aren't enjoyable, there needs to be a cut-off point at which jobs should not be able to exceed. If we keep buffing weaker jobs, then damage/healing output becomes insane, which then has implications on the content created. Which would then require them to retune their content when there was a much easier fix in the first place.

Edit: I think people would be a lot less scared of nerfs if SE could demonstrate they can actually do them properly. (SCH main here)

If you play an Ast, Sam, or a Rdm how do you not just spend the whole time going "whoo... yeah, I'm gon' get nerfed"

Have you never played an MMO before?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kabzy

I'm not a DPS main, but isn't more utility meant to equate to lower personal DPS? So theoretically RDM should be doing less than BLM/SMN. Which I'm assuming is not the case right now.

AST is in a similar position, and while nerfs aren't enjoyable, there needs to be a cut-off point at which jobs should not be able to exceed. If we keep buffing weaker jobs, then damage/healing output becomes insane, which then has implications on the content created. Which would then require them to retune their content when there was a much easier fix in the first place.

Edit: I think people would be a lot less scared of nerfs if SE could demonstrate they can actually do them properly. (SCH main here)

---

"More Utility," is subjective to the net benefit of said utility. Whereas Bard/Machinist provide a great variety of Utility through buffs that can restore resources and the likes, a RDM's main party utility is Embolden, which only affects physical damage for others. Vercure is not meant to be used as anything more than an emergency last resort and isn't strong enough to really do much. Verraise is strong utility but at the cost of significant and finite resources. If anything Vercure and Verraise exist less for the purpose of utility and more as a nod to the identity of the Job. A RDM shouldn't be using those skills in a group setting, a healer should. By discounting them due to this, their main utility is Embolden, which itself is not anywhere near as powerful as Balance or other DPS boosting utility. As far as self-DPS-Boosting skills go, its far behind Enochian which gives a flat out constant 10% DPS buff while active.

RDM's DPS is not leagues ahead of SMN/BLM. It's ahead, but not by much. It doesn't require nerfs, the other classes require buffs.