Problem: The Mentor requirements cater to players who have no business being Mentors.

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Originally Posted by Ahki

I like the mentor system because it lets me know who the douchebags are. I haven't met a nice person yet with a crown next to their name. Thank you, SE.

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That sounds like discrimination if you really think that way.

People have problems with the mentor system? That's a shock. I haven't seen any countless salty rant threads to that effect at all!

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Originally Posted by Nav_Fae

That sounds like discrimination if you really think that way.

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I'm sorry to say, while I know many friends with the mentor tag, I also just as many people with notorious histories that have it too. Very few people seem to have the mentor tag that are just "casual" about dealing with people.

It's definitely the "hardcore" dealing with people tag. Whether you bring nothing but misery or kindness to the table, you absolutely bring a lot of whatever it is.

That was my experience. It's what I think. I don't discriminate people because of the tag however. As I said, many of them are people who I am friends with. Probably because they have that mentioned kindness. But it's the tag of "angels" and "demons" to be sure. Not that you can't be a little of both and still have the tag...aren't we all?

I "mentor" people and guide runs all the time.

Need no fizzy crown for that.

Can't get it anyway. 1K dungeons my ass.

This thread again?

If someone is childish enough to want to be a Mentor simply for the crown, good for them, they're immature. Chances of a new player personally asking them for help are next to nothing anyway when there's more Mentors running around than new players.

If you get a Mentor speed running in the Mentor roulette, kick them like you would any other player and move on. Report them if you must. Not to mention it's not really the Mentors fault if the new player doesn't speak up and ask for help. A lot of the time I've asked if anyone is new or needs help and they've simply ignored me or have even been pretty condescending in the way they tell me that they were playing their alt.

I agree the requirement system is bad, but you don't need to be a Mentor to help people.

I tend to be the one who explains mechanics and whatnot, doing the job the "mentor" is supposed to do. I rarely ever come across "mentors" who actually assist with giving instruction and most leave after one wipe when helping newbies.

It's a completely worthless title anyway and I call it a "shitter magnet".

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Originally Posted by Nav_Fae

That sounds like discrimination if you really think that way.

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How cute!


/10char

Why are people bullying the OP? Is it because the truth hurts? All I'm seeing in this thread is people with bad reading comprehension and lashing out at him (probably lolmentors themselves) people saying they keep the crown on just to stay in the mentor chat (Cool Kids Club) and just straight up admitting that when a novice asks them for help they don't have to oblige to it.

Thanks for admitting to being the problem guys.
Also, OP you're better off complaining on reddit or an image board, this place is a hug box when it comes to criticism and there's like a 5% chance of devs reading posts here on the NA side of things.

Sounds like an open faced lie. Way to turn a discussion into a rant about your personal opinions. Also the OP invited the crtisism with his generalized rambling about how all mentors are scum, as though mentors aren't simply players with more game experience than others.

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Originally Posted by Cherie

It's definitely the "hardcore" dealing with people tag. Whether you bring nothing but misery or kindness to the table, you absolutely bring a lot of whatever it is.

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Acknowledging you said in your experience, but still untrue. I'm a more 'casual' Mentor. I'm not one of the people who speed run and have the status just for the crown but I don't obsessively help people either or shower them with kindness. If someone asks for help, I'll give them help. If I ask someone if they need help and they don't want or need it, that's fine too. Most people I know who are Mentors are the same way. It probably varies server to server.

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Originally Posted by FinaSel

In fact, I have never once been in a dungeon where I saw a mentor give a single piece of useful, kind advice to another player.

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Even before the Mentor thing, I would, especially as a tank and saw bonus, would stop just outside the boss room to give simple explanations. I have no keyboard, so the typing is moderately slow. However, you get people who feel that if they engage, it'll trigger me to act, in which it does. Sadly, the new person mess up a mechanic then he becomes an idiot.

After a while, I just stopped trying, because if I'm on healer, dps, or tank, others will pull regardless of where I'm standing. Just yesterday, I typed, "Wait!". As I was typing, the tank still pulled after like 3 seconds. When I mentioned that I was trying to explain something, he said that it's not our fault that the newb is a newb. The tank had a crown.

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Originally Posted by Jim_Berry

Even before the Mentor thing, I would, especially as a tank and saw bonus, would stop just outside the boss room to give simple explanations. ... When I mentioned that I was trying to explain something, he said that it's not our fault that the newb is a newb. The tank had a crown.

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I wish I were in parties with more people like yourself. I don't mind if the run takes a little longer because someone is trying to explain something. I think it's better to make sure everyone knows the mechanics if there is a newcomer than to rush in and have a wipe.

I always read about the battle strategy online before attempting it in the game. But I also always say "This is my first time here" when it is. And only ONE time did anyone actually stop before the boss to explain something.

Fortunately I always prepare before running in, so things usually go smoothly.

But of all people, it should be mentors who take time to make sure a player knows what they are doing. If they don't like doing that, then why be a mentor? Isn't that what mentors are supposed to do?

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Originally Posted by Jatoi

How cute!

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I love your sig.

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Originally Posted by RyuSaarva

You seriously have not noticed that even if you play well as a dps you wil not get a recommendation, maybe for good glamour but thats it, healers and tanks get automatic recommendation as a thanks for letting dps in the dungeon though.

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Most of my 1700+ commis I've gotten by playing bard. I'm always amazed when I leave a duty with a commi. Then I wonder what I'm doing? Maybe someone notices I DPS well, maybe someone notices I sing songs when needed, maybe someone appreciates I say hi when I enter, maybe someone appreciates I try to explain things if someone is struggling with things, maybe I stand up for the person that is being bullied, maybe that I do mechanics correct(so many people fail at this).

I tend to commi by order of preference: no one > person that amused me the most > person that did good

So no not hard to get commis.

Only those who have done A8s should be mentors. /sarcasm

The most noticeable improvement they did I to current mentor system, even if only to one part of it, was to make the participation to the Novice Network an opt-in for every mentor. After that, what I've noticed, all the mentors in that network at least in my server are the sort that's in the right place to help people. Those who just wear the grown but don't want the network.. I just don't count as mentors, even if few of them might have good intentions.

I honestly wish that SE is taking the mentor-system out of the game until it is fixed. Which means it has to be more useful than this.

I have to admit that I am also wearing a crown, but ever since this system got implemented I am actually busier to teach ‘mentors’ than actual newbies.
First of all, I do not know what the chat looks like right now since I turned the mentor-chat off fairly early because it was more used as a chat between mentors. And it was a brag-feast on my server for a while… So no clue if that has gotten better, in the very end.

Secondly, most people with a crown automatically think they are great.
Has anyone of you ever tried to tell a mentor how their main-class is played correctly? Because I had to.
Starts with mentors dying to every simple mechanic to actual Lv60 Darkknights who don’t even have provoke and think they will do just fine in Lv60-content.

I am honestly trying not to tell people how they should play their classes unless it’s a newbie – but whenever I see a mentor doing a bad job I just interfere.
And, from my experience, mentors usually don’t even accept advices because they think they already perform well enough.
No, instead they start flaming you for giving them actual advices how to make their life easier.
I am not even saying that I do know anything, but since I am a progress-raider I do know how to play my classes properly.
I am currently progressing through A8S, and I am generally raiding and playing ever since First Coil – so let’s just say I have some great experience in this game in general since I am an veteran player.

I have no idea how to fix; but by now I am just so extremely tired seeing Mentors floating all roulettes but having no actual clue how to play their classes/this game.
At this point I might also take my crown off because I do not want to part of this group anymore.
I simply cannot see 98% of all mentors to actually be helpful to any new player.
Urgh, and I just came out of a DF-group where other mentors pulled the boss without giving me the chance to explain it to the new person who never did it before.
The reason why I became a Mentor in the first place is because I actually do love to help new players, at least when my time can afford it.
I mean, even before this system came out I also offered people to ask me for any tanking advices.
But this system is right now nothing but a joke.

I haven't read every post, but I think the mentor system is okay for now, could there be some improvements, maybe, but it seems to work as intended. Any issues people might be seeing now might be more server issues than anything else. On Siren after they made mentor participation optional, we only have like 20 mentor in the channel at a time, those are people who want to be there, and genuinely want to help the novices. But trust me there are plenty of people who have the crown and aren't in the channel, either because they haven't figured out how to come back in or they just want the crown icon, like who cares. The Siren Novice Network has been great since the participation change, the only isse we have is bots, bots EVERYWHERE, lol?

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Originally Posted by Rivaille

But this system is right now nothing but a joke.

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Tell me, what exactly do you expect this system to do?

Right now, the Mentor System has, as far as I can see, two purposes:

1) It identifies players that are potentially willing to help with guidance or assistance for new and veteran players.
2) It offers a method of universal communication between new and mentor players via the mentor network.

However, people like you who complain it's "Broken" are probably the biggest part of the problem. In and of itself, the Mentor system is fufilling both these purposes. Does it have an issue in that there might be some people who just want the crown? Sure. But there won't be a system that'll prevent that. Because in the end, even if they used a giant phallic shaped object, someone out there would still want it.

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Originally Posted by Rivaille

...snip...

I have no idea how to fix... Mentors....

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The best idea I've seen thus far was to get rid of the crown (seriously, an "M" like in XI would've sufficed) and any tangible rewards/achievements. Boom. The "status"-seekers and reward seekers are gone for the most part.

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Originally Posted by Cidel

The best idea I've seen thus far was to get rid of the crown (seriously, an "M" like in XI would've sufficed) and any tangible rewards/achievements. Boom. The "status"-seekers and reward seekers are gone for the most part.

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Many players threw the M on in FFXI as well just because it was "something different," "I like the symbol" or any of the more 'legitimate' of reasons that people try to state.

You have to come to accept that the symbol is not the problem, it is the expectation that is the issue. Instead of expecting people to all be amazing wonderful and perfect mentors, we should expect them to just be exactly what they are.

Fellow players.

And if we ask "Hey, can you tell me about X?" we can hope to get a response.
And we can expect that no matter how good we are, we can always expect improvement in and of ourselves.

Right now, Mentor's biggest issue is the player themselves. Not the system.

The problem that i have seen is majority of the players with mentor status are
a) unwilling to help new players and
b) not very good at all at their job to be offering advice in the first place
which is really the fault in the system as there should have been stronger requirements to become mentor


Myself i never went back as mentor as i was weeks with it and never once could i get into the darn network...
This in itself is a big issue is it not? I really wanted to help players but if cannot get on, what the heck. This was at launch mind you so hopefully it is better now.

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Originally Posted by Maero

The problem that i have seen is majority of the players with mentor status are
a) unwilling to help new players and
b) not very good at all at their job to be offering advice in the first place
which is really the fault in the system as there should have been stronger requirements to become mentor


Myself i never went back as mentor as i was weeks with it and never once could i get into the darn network...
This in itself is a big issue is it not? I really wanted to help players but if cannot get on, what the heck. This was at launch mind you so hopefully it is better now.

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They fixed the not being able to get into the network, last patch you have to manually opt into it now so everyone isn't automtically in it. Also there is a AFK timer that will kick you if you are AFK too long to free up space.

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Originally Posted by Maero

The problem that i have seen is majority of the players with mentor status are
a) unwilling to help new players and
b) not very good at all at their job to be offering advice in the first place
which is really the fault in the system as there should have been stronger requirements to become mentor

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Well honestly I think they made a typo with the Tormentor system.

Muh muh muh

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

Well honestly I think they made a typo with the Tormentor system.

Muh muh muh

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I must say that was clever. Magius has been stacking INT.

Ahh well at least that's fixed which is good, glad they noticed.
My other points from what i observed still hold true however, lol