Couples geting the shaft on duty roulette

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

If a full pre-made goes into duty roulette doesn't that defeat the purpose that duty roulette is there for? Which won't happen if everyone goes in with full parties and still reap the reward off doing so. Two people pre-mades I can understand, but full party? Defeats the whole purpose.

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Doesn't defeat the WHOLE purpose...It's a ROULETTE. It's RANDOM. You still get the RANDOM Dungeon.

I use the Duty Roulette to get away from these 'couples' who queue together. They are either both bad, and vehemently defend each other when you try to tell them to perform better (even when put nicely); or one of them is terrible, and the competent one spends the entire time typing to the party about how new their friend/lover is. I can deal with new players, and teach them the ropes. I cannot, however, teach a couple who refuse to take any criticism, and resort to a flame war over using advice.

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Originally Posted by Rex

Doesn't defeat the WHOLE purpose...It's a ROULETTE. It's RANDOM. You still get the RANDOM Dungeon.

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Well, it kinda does. It's 'random' because it puts you where you're needed. It's not for the sake of being random.

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

If a full pre-made goes into duty roulette doesn't that defeat the purpose that duty roulette is there for? Which won't happen if everyone goes in with full parties and still reap the reward off doing so. Two people pre-mades I can understand, but full party? Defeats the whole purpose.

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No, it wouldn't.

Sure some people will form pre-mades but then you have players that want to queue together and fill in other slots with randoms, I find myself playing with 1-2 others and we're always missing one or two people.. for example;

When I was leveling my BLM I did so with a tank friend, we always queued and got 2 random players.. if we were able to Roulette the entire time, our exp per dungeon would have been less grindy and more enjoyable, spamming Halatali 10 times is pretty boring man ;)

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Originally Posted by Rekujen

No, it wouldn't.

Sure some people will form pre-mades but then you have players that want to queue together and fill in other slots with randoms, I find myself playing with 1-2 others and we're always missing one or two people.. for example;

When I was leveling my BLM I did so with a tank friend, we always queued and got 2 random players.. if we were able to Roulette the entire time, our exp per dungeon would have been less grindy and more enjoyable, spamming Halatali 10 times is pretty boring man ;)

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You didn't read the line of text you quoted then. As I said "Two people pre-mades I can understand, but full party? Defeats the whole purpose.". Even three people is more acceptable than full party. My main disagreement is if they allow full party ques to still get the myth bonus.

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Originally Posted by Cligue

Ok i give up trying to explain how when i am in a party the duty roulette option is not clickable

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Cligue, leave Ispano alone, don't even consider him. He's got a Dictionary sticked between his buttcheeks and don't listen to concepts or arguments outside perfect grammar.
If you write a message in a Numerical Binary string, you have more chance to have a senseful dialogue with him.

That said, you and OP are right on all the line. Plus, DEVS themselves told everyone they INTENDED for Duty Roulette to be unlimited to groups.
So everything the Friends-hater Team over there says, is biased and self-conceived.

What I can say, for my experience, is that feeling the injustice in this decision along with the insane prices of housing, I stopped DF, I stopped playing and more important I stopped paying till something change.

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Originally Posted by Cligue

Ok i give up trying to explain how when i am in a party the duty roulette option is not clickable (aka locked out, or some might say... Prevented from using this feature when in a party O.O). But, you are telling me you would rather take a bunch of friends and run 1 lvl 20 dungeon 3 times? I don't know about you but that is what i call boring.

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Again, nothing is being taken away from you. SE is not saying "You can still run dungeons as you have, but now you get less Tomes/Loot/Whatever" That would be a punishment for running with friends. No, you'd take your friends and run the dungeon you want the rewards from, since more than likely, you and your friends can do it far quicker than a random group in DF.

The idea is that when you're in a full premade, the option was never available to you in the first place, so it cannot be taken away. The option was GIVEN to solo players. There's quite a difference between the two concepts.

Also, Taekrys. I've listened to the arguments. Grammar or proper word choice aside, it's still flawed form your side. Even if they DO add the ability to queue as a group, there's a few things people are still assuming. We don't know if they will allow full parties or not, they just said a party. They also didn't say if the rewards would be the same for a party of 2 or more or not. Which could very well be the case depending on the original reason for the roulette. What if every person after the first reduces the reward? To something much smaller if they do allow a full party? What would you say then?

In any case, the system as it is now does help people get through lower level content and story modes. Low Level and Story modes I almost always have at least one person who is new to the place when I do them. It has helped queue times for many for these places. And allowing more with the same reward will just defeat all that.

As someone that plays as a couple, I don't like the roulette system. However, I see why it is the way it is. It allows a need to be filled (with the roulette player) and grants them a bonus for doing it with all strangers.

When it comes to the myth tome bonus, it seems faster to just get friends together and zerg through something like Haukke Manor twice than it is to bang my head against the wall with 3 strangers and try to explain how to do some of these HM dungeons.

But, when it comes to the exp bonus, nothing beats DR. I can't do two instances with my wife and get exp faster than the daily exp bonus from DR. However, neither of us has had any problem with completing these dungeons with strangers. To be fair, most of the low-level dungeons are pretty straight forward and we've only run into a few players that had to be carried.

SE has done enough right with this game that I can overlook the duty roulette issue when it comes to playing as a couple.

Greetings,

Sorry to bump this thread, but I have additional information regarding the feature that will allow players to use pre-made parties in the duty roulette. The development team is currently working on this and they plan to address this in patch 2.3.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

Sorry to bump this thread, but I have additional information regarding the feature that will allow players to use pre-made parties in the duty roulette. The development team is currently working on this and they plan to address this in patch 2.3.

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Looking forward to FC runs!

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Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

Sorry to bump this thread, but I have additional information regarding the feature that will allow players to use pre-made parties in the duty roulette. The development team is currently working on this and they plan to address this in patch 2.3.

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Sorry, but this is too late for a LOT of us out there here that play with our significant other or friends. 2.3 is too far off. If it cant be here for 2.2 fine its 14 days away and we understand that it probably will take more time than that, but it needs to be sooner than the normal "3 months" away that 2.3 will be. Sorry but I can not deal with another 3.5 months of being forced to do things without my better half.

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Originally Posted by niwaar

Sorry, but this is too late for a LOT of us out there here that play with our significant other or friends. 2.3 is too far off. If it cant be here for 2.2 fine its 14 days away and we understand that it probably will take more time than that, but it needs to be sooner than the normal "3 months" away that 2.3 will be. Sorry but I can not deal with another 3.5 months of choosing out of my own free will to do this single, insignificant thing that is not required to enjoy all the other content in the game without my better half.

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Fixed this for ya ^-^

Well it is rather silly to make our dailies be totally with strangers. In an mmo. Of all godamn things.

I support this idea. I think sooner than 2.3 too please. Big QoL issue here imo.

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Originally Posted by niwaar

Sorry, but this is too late for a LOT of us out there here that play with our significant other or friends. 2.3 is too far off. If it cant be here for 2.2 fine its 14 days away and we understand that it probably will take more time than that, but it needs to be sooner than the normal "3 months" away that 2.3 will be. Sorry but I can not deal with another 3.5 months of being forced to do things without my better half.

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Who is forcing you to do anything? You can run any dungeon you want with your partner. You're just upset that you don't get the bonus for grouping with randoms. I'm actually really peeved they are going to change this. Do people really not understand a risk/reward system? The greater the risk (grouping with randoms) the greater the reward should be (bonus stuff). Grouping with your friends/family lowers your risk, why should you get the same reward?

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Who is forcing you to do anything? You can run any dungeon you want with your partner. You're just upset that you don't get the bonus for grouping with randoms. I'm actually really peeved they are going to change this. Do people really not understand a risk/reward system? The greater the risk (grouping with randoms) the greater the reward should be (bonus stuff). Grouping with your friends/family lowers your risk, why should you get the same reward?

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THIS.

Also, who's to say people who run the DF roulette in groups will be eligible for the SAME reward? What if groups in the roulette only get half the reward?

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Originally Posted by niwaar

Sorry, but this is too late for a LOT of us out there here that play with our significant other or friends. 2.3 is too far off. If it cant be here for 2.2 fine its 14 days away and we understand that it probably will take more time than that, but it needs to be sooner than the normal "3 months" away that 2.3 will be. Sorry but I can not deal with another 3.5 months of being forced to do things without my better half.

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They aren't forcing you to do things without your friends, you are choosing to. The whole purpose of duty roulette was to get solo players through the queue faster, other games have this same feature and make you queue solo. On average if you queue with friends you can do much faster organized runs that finish in half or one third of the time it takes then if you would of gone with random pug. Now you do get less points pre run but that is made up in being able to finish faster due to having more organization then playing then with randoms.

For example if I do WP with my FC we finish in 10 min, we can do 3 runs for 90 myth. Now then if I go with randoms it takes like 30 min because people can't speed run and most of the time do not have good gear and for that one run i got 30+40 for roulette bonus. So in the end I made less points.

2.3 seriously? Also this isn't about couples only. The daily roulette could be an opportunity to do something with your friends once a day. It's morpg after all. Yes sure we can just do a normal dungeon run with our friends and not get the bonus.

The point is, people want to play together and by implementing the duty roulette SE -practially- has taken away the opportunity to play together with your friends on a regular basis. The fact is, these days people only do one highlv dungeon a day max (highlv roulette). There is little to no reason to do any more than that. Nobody or very few are willing to gimp their myth income by not doing the roulette and playing with your buddies instead.

The roulette could be the exact opposite: an opportunity to do stuff together at least once a day. I'm tired of playing alone and with strangers.

The roulettes are met to push you in with random people that are forced to play by themselves. It is a complete optional route to take and isnt forced upon you to do, its recommended to do to help you out but you are completely fine with not touching it at all. My first class i hardly touched the roulette and was playing with friends, only touched it near the end when my friends hit 50 before me becuase i had important things to do in RL

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Originally Posted by Kayumi

2.3 seriously? Also this isn't about couples only. The daily roulette could be an opportunity to do something with your friends once a day. It's morpg after all. Yes sure we can just do a normal dungeon run with our friends and not get the bonus.

The point is, people want to play together and by implementing the duty roulette SE -practially- has taken away the opportunity to play together with your friends on a regular basis. The fact is, these days people only do one highlv dungeon a day max (highlv roulette). There is little to no reason to do any more than that. Nobody or very few are willing to gimp their myth income by not doing the roulette and playing with your buddies instead.

The roulette could be the exact opposite: an opportunity to do stuff together at least once a day. I'm tired of playing alone and with strangers.

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The above posters had already just discussed your point. SE didn't take away anything from you. Everything in the game was already there for you to do with your friends. The only thing they did was ADD a feature called duty roulette which allowed solo players to use to help other players progress. The only thing that is taking away from your experience with friends are each other.

I'm not sure what sickens me more. How many instances there are of this game excluding group play with friends or the number of people ready to jump to Square-Enix's defense over such poor planning.

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Originally Posted by Cigaran

I'm not sure what sickens me more. How many instances there are of this game excluding group play with friends or the number of people ready to jump to Square-Enix's defense over such poor planning.

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Not jumping to Square-Enix defense, we are saying how the feature is suppose to work. It is suppose to force you to play with randoms and you get rewards for doing so if you complete it. The roulette just makes you play by yourself so you can get thrown into a group that is a party of 3. It also helps groups that are not a full party for said dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Cigaran

I'm not sure what sickens me more. How many instances there are of this game excluding group play with friends or the number of people ready to jump to Square-Enix's defense over such poor planning.

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Can you please list the number of instances that exclude group play with friends?

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Originally Posted by LordSliver

Not jumping to Square-Enix defense, we are saying how the feature is suppose to work. It is suppose to force you to play with randoms and you get rewards for doing so if you complete it.

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Except you're wrong.

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Originally Posted by Camate

The development team actually had the idea to allow players to queue up for the Duty Roulette as a party since the planning stages of this feature

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I also play with my SO, it would be nice to be able to get the bonus together but it's solo so we just don't do it. We do some dungeons, alot of 8 man treasure maps and make the cap mostly by Wednesday. This thread is crazy though, you should be more careful about what you post. As someone mentioned, its easy for people to just respond in any old fashion due to the fact fists can't transfer through monitors. You should expect people to be less than civil when replying. There is some sort of e-cookie people think they will obtain by being witty and rude.

With some of the replies in this thread, its no surprise that people don't want to play with randoms and would rather go with people they know. I suppose the name for it is even more perfect, even though it's referring to the dungeons. Roulette.

I think selfishly I am all for the system making it so you can build a full party and roulette as friends. So that part is not hard for me. But the issue of why roulette was created in the first place is not quite the same. Originally it was designed so that a person needing a party in a low level dungeon could queue that dungeon and then the roulette system would build them a party. I know they could queue before or build one via pf or shout. It's just for some it wasn't quite that easy and that is why I believe they came up with this system. To go to a "I can build a party of 4 friends and roulette random content" is not quite supportive of this feature or idea originally created. I do like the change just don't think it will help as much as it once did once implemented. Something to consider for sure.

Why limit the discussion to just partner? it can be irl friend, in-game friend, anything!

Everyday we wanna do all the roulettes, which is like 90-120 minutes excluding queue times? For some people that's all the time they have to play, so why not create a system where 2 people can queue for roulette? At least that way, there is still the chance you get put with newbies who need help and guidance, which if I have it right, is the reason roulette is even there. Lets face it, most dungeons with total strangers aren't exactly social paradise except those few times you meet really nice people. " are you on my server? no? aww xc".

Really, why argue against this? Don't care? fine. But to argue against this is idiotic. Even more so now that its actually been confirmed.

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Originally Posted by Kayumi

2.3 seriously? Also this isn't about couples only. The daily roulette could be an opportunity to do something with your friends once a day. It's morpg after all. Yes sure we can just do a normal dungeon run with our friends and not get the bonus.

The point is, people want to play together and by implementing the duty roulette SE -practially- has taken away the opportunity to play together with your friends on a regular basis. The fact is, these days people only do one highlv dungeon a day max (highlv roulette). There is little to no reason to do any more than that. Nobody or very few are willing to gimp their myth income by not doing the roulette and playing with your buddies instead.

The roulette could be the exact opposite: an opportunity to do stuff together at least once a day. I'm tired of playing alone and with strangers.

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Actually it is an MMORPG. Massive multiplayer, not you and a couple buddies multiplayer. There is literally nothing being taken away from you. Your friends can still play on a regular basis, can still play any dungeon. Are you really saying that because you dont get a few extra tome bonus, you don't want to play with your friends anymore? It will be funny if SE implements smaller bonuses for each party member you sign up with, just so we can see the same people coming on here pouting because they are getting enough "reward" for playing a game. Then we will get to hear these stories about everything they are taking away from you and how wronged you have been.

The argument that couples/groups can't use the roulette function of duty roulette (random dungeons/instances) makes sense, being upset that you don't get the same rewards is just whining. Best part of roulette for me is not knowing what you are going to get, not OMG EASY TOME SPEED RUN

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Originally Posted by KupoNuts

Looking forward to FC runs!

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Terrible idea, it will make queues ever worse. Seems SE want to kill off non-FC content altogether.

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Originally Posted by CYoung187

Actually it is an MMORPG. Massive multiplayer, not you and a couple buddies multiplayer. There is literally nothing being taken away from you. Your friends can still play on a regular basis, can still play any dungeon. Are you really saying that because you dont get a few extra tome bonus, you don't want to play with your friends anymore?

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Totally agree.

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Originally Posted by CYoung187

Are you really saying that because you dont get a few extra tome bonus, you don't want to play with your friends anymore?

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Way not to read what I said. I am talking from a practical viewpoint i.e. empiric. It's simply what I have observed. Before roulette people (read: friends, couples etc) used to run dungeons together much more frequently. That is: farming together. They had the goal of obtaining their philo/myth so they teamed up and had a good time.

These days however with the roulette it is far more efficient to just do the solo daily high-lv roulette. Even if you don't do any other content that gives myth, simply doing the daily highlv roulette will get you capped. And this is exactly what people do: daily roulette and be done with it. The days of teaming up with your buddies/FC mates etc to farm philo/myth are -practically- (read: in actuality) over. Again, empiric statement.

You can talk all you want about SE not taking anything away but you are ignoring how human psychology works, people tend to take the path of least resistance. Yes I do want to run dungeons with people I know and I take every opportunity to do so (mostly running lowlv dungeons) but with the way things are, and heres the central argument: there simply is little to no reason to do so and it's also less efficient.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

Sorry to bump this thread, but I have additional information regarding the feature that will allow players to use pre-made parties in the duty roulette. The development team is currently working on this and they plan to address this in patch 2.3.

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I just can't believe you're going through with this in light of the horrible queue times DPS already suffer, this will simply remove a huge number of potential tanks/healers from the DR system as they group up with their friends and still get the Tomes they're craving.

This is the only incentive those who consider an MMO means playing with a handful of 'friends' to leave their cosy little ghettos and play with the wider community, and you're removing it.

This is an asinine decision.

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Originally Posted by Kayumi

Way not to readwhat I said. I am talking from a practical viewpoint i.e. empiric. It's simply what I have observed. Before roulette people (read: friends, couples etc) used to run dungeons together much more frequently. That is: farming together. They had the goal of obtaining their philo/myth so they teamed up and had a good time.

These days however with the roulette it is far more efficient to just do the solo daily high-lv roulette. Even if you don't do any other content that gives myth, simply doing the daily highlv roulette will get you capped. And this is exactly what people do: daily roulette and be done with it. The days of teaming up with your buddies/FC mates etc to farm philo/myth are -practically- (read: in actuality) over. Again, empiric statement.

You can talk all you want about SE not taking anything away but you are ignoring how human psychology works, people tend to take the path of least resistance. Yes I do want to run dungeons with people I know and I take every opportunity to do so (mostly running lowlv dungeons) but with the way things are, and heres the central argument: there simply is little to no reason to do so and it's also less efficient.

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It's alreadybeen stated and proven that it is more efficient to run with your own group of friends than it is to roulette. WP has already been recorded as I think 8ish mins clear time. 8x3 = 24 mins. now 30 x 3 = 90 for myth tomes. You spent 24 minutes in WP with a group of friends to get what you would normally spend 30-60 mins in a roulette for IF you get Haukke HM or Copperbell HM. Now I will use Haukke HM as I've never speed ran copperbell. My fastest clear time with my group is 14-15 mins on Haukke HM for 50 myth. so around 30 mins for 100 myth which is more efficient than the 30-60/possible fail you will get with the roulette.

This isn't news. People in the thread have already stated that it's more efficient to run with a premade than it is the roulette. The only reason the bonus is there is because you run the risk of failing with random people. You can do the same thing as the roulette if you wish to, que for AK, WP, Haukke Hard, Copperbell Hard, Pharos, whatever you feel like and get the amount of myth that you would in a duty roulette. You will still obtain it faster with a premade.

With that said, you now want what's already easy to begin with to be even easier? You want the bonus rewards for whats already easy obtainable to you? Just because you and your friends refuse to play together, doesn't make it the fault of the roulette.

Anyways come 2.2, I doubt this will matter. The bonus rewards people go for are primarily myth tomes and with 2.2, it goes uncapped. I haven't read anything about them changing the rewards to the new tomes but who knows. I hope they do lower the rewards for premades on roulette though or else we'd probably end up back to square 1 with solo que's back to they're original que times.

Does this not just take away what it was set up for. I thought DR was there to help out other who haven't done these missions or not in groups. Rewarding people who help with bonuses.

People always assume that "everyone" in the game will always be queuing up with friends. Remember there are people like me that have no friends! so we sadly have to queue solo. So quit crying and let it happen.

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Originally Posted by Kayumi

Way not to read what I said. I am talking from a practical viewpoint i.e. empiric. It's simply what I have observed. Before roulette people (read: friends, couples etc) used to run dungeons together much more frequently. That is: farming together. They had the goal of obtaining their philo/myth so they teamed up and had a good time.

These days however with the roulette it is far more efficient to just do the solo daily high-lv roulette. Even if you don't do any other content that gives myth, simply doing the daily highlv roulette will get you capped. And this is exactly what people do: daily roulette and be done with it. The days of teaming up with your buddies/FC mates etc to farm philo/myth are -practically- (read: in actuality) over. Again, empiric statement.

You can talk all you want about SE not taking anything away but you are ignoring how human psychology works, people tend to take the path of least resistance. Yes I do want to run dungeons with people I know and I take every opportunity to do so (mostly running lowlv dungeons) but with the way things are, and heres the central argument: there simply is little to no reason to do so and it's also less efficient.

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Yes if your primary concern is being efficient, then doing the one roulette/day may be better. People have a choice, either slightly (very slightly) more efficient roulette or play with friends. Doesn't sound like such a terrible choice to make. Cap won't exist in 2.2 you can speed run dungeons with your pre-mades and get as many tombs as you want. Pre-roulette people ran with friends because it was the most efficient by far, not because they cared about being with their friends. Nothing forced that to change. If a couple minutes of efficiency is all it takes to make someone not play with friends, then it must not be that important to that them.

Well it looks like my hubby and I and stop payment again till 2.3.

Hey all. Just wanted to say, well, IT'S A VIDEO GAME, NOT A DATE NIGHT TO THE MOVIES. There are a lot of people benefitting from the Duties, if you want some alone time, get a room.

this is what i imagine when se announces that something is going to be in 2.16 then 2.2 then 2.3 and their net code and or infrastructure choices
https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/i...XH8tSABgkVj7yg

I wish they would remove the current DR (and the future "go with the people you would usually go with" DR) and replace it with the "I am here to help new people" DR.

It really saddens me that so many new players are treated like shit and rushed through dungeons (no cut scenes, no map completion) because some endgame players wants to hurry and get their tomes.

Hell, disable cutscene skipping and give some super bonus if someone gets a map completion achievement.

BS, it was to incentivize players to use the DF to help others completing story runs, that much you have correct. It was also to balance out the XP rewards for running at least 1 dungeon a day versus everyone FATE Farming to max level and making entire zones unplayable because of it.