Can an expansion survive without a DPS?

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Originally Posted by Valence

But wait there is more: uptime actually never mattered on result. Melees (and casters) in ShB (and before) were already way above rphys on every chart.

Always has been :gun:

The only thing that uptime mattered for was actual effort.

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Yeah, i mean.. Phys ranged has issues.
But they're at least still valued for their utility.
Any new tank would just become another jobber for Warrior mains to feel superior over.
I'd genuinely be sad if we got a cool new tank, because Warrior players will just end up having it all streamlined and homogenised, and coming out the winner.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

So far for 7.0 will have 4 tanks, 4 healers, 3 aiming, 2 maiming, 2 scouting, 4 casters, and 2 limited jobs. To make it fare we need 1 more aiming, 2 more maiming, and 2 more scouting jobs to even them out. 8.0 should have another maiming or aiming job and another scouting job.

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u forgot striking

Do we really need more tanks and heals when everyday we have comment about how each tank plays the same and healers are boring. There is no point in adding healer and tank as long as they have not fixed that.

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

Do we really need more tanks and heals when everyday we have comment about how each tank plays the same and healers are boring. There is no point in adding healer and tank as long as they have not fixed that.

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I mean we can functionally argue the same about DPS

What did RPR add to the design space, it’s a melee rip off of a bad MCH rework after the heat gauge blew up in their faces in 4.x

All the jobs are stale at this point

at this point in the game I will actually be incredibly shocked if Viper doesn't have some form of 0-100 job gauge. that's how predictable and stale job design is.

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Originally Posted by WantlessYoYo

Basically the title
Can an expansion survive without a DPS as one of the new jobs? -Not counting limited jobs

Looking back at past expansions there always has been a DPS as one of the new jobs

HW introduced DRK and MCH
SB had both SAM and RDM
SHB had GNB and DNC
EW RPR and SGE
And now DT will feature another 2 DPS Viper and Picto

You guys think if we ever got 2 supports (say 1 tank-1 healer, 2 tanks or 2 healers) could an expansion survive the hype?

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HW had 3 jobs. Youre forgetting AST was also launched that same time

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Originally Posted by GoatOfWar

Yeah, i mean.. Phys ranged has issues.
But they're at least still valued for their utility.
Any new tank would just become another jobber for Warrior mains to feel superior over.
I'd genuinely be sad if we got a cool new tank, because Warrior players will just end up having it all streamlined and homogenised, and coming out the winner.

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They're valued for what utility exactly? Everybody has utility those days. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying nobody appreciates curing waltz, or a bit more party mitigation, but is this truly such a boon from the role those days?

They can't even raise.

I'd trade half or all of my utility as a rphys player if it meant I was actually bringing something on the damage department to my party. It would be sad, but I'd do it in a heartbeat. It's not like mitigation abilities are exactly thrilling to use those days anyway.

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Originally Posted by Valence

They're valued for what utility exactly? Everybody has utility those days. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying nobody appreciates curing waltz, or a bit more party mitigation, but is this truly such a boon from the role those days?

They can't even raise.

I'd trade half or all of my utility as a rphys player if it meant I was actually bringing something on the damage department to my party. It would be sad, but I'd do it in a heartbeat. It's not like mitigation abilities are exactly thrilling to use those days anyway.

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Raid buffs are also really nice.
But yeah, i'm not disagreeing with you per se.
I'm just saying that at least you've got *something* going.
PLD and DRK are just Warrior downgrades now.

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Originally Posted by GoatOfWar

Raid buffs are also really nice.
But yeah, i'm not disagreeing with you per se.
I'm just saying that at least you've got *something* going.
PLD and DRK are just Warrior downgrades now.

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Raid buffs are just damage in disguise

Even with their buffs they are still low on damage

About the only niche case you can make is you can feed gear to a melee player who gets dance partner but that’s incredibly niche

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Originally Posted by GoatOfWar

Raid buffs are also really nice.
But yeah, i'm not disagreeing with you per se.
I'm just saying that at least you've got *something* going.
PLD and DRK are just Warrior downgrades now.

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No, I actually have nothing. Supersnow said it already, but you can turn that raid damage buff into personal damage and rphys would still suck the same way. It doesn't add up. And it's the same with SMN and RDM now.

But on the other hand if you make everybody the same on that department, then you can just remove melees from the game since ranged jobs will be able to do do what melees do on melee spots anyway. It's cursed either way.