4.1 and us tanks

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09-29-2017, 11:10 PM
Tint

did i hear right that WAR gets an aoe shield?

and that DRK gets nothing?

...i am not really thaat surprised to be honest...

so PLD and WAR have both better mitigation, damage, selfheal and utility now than DRK..?
09-29-2017, 11:13 PM
Claire_Pendragon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schrute

Pld is very comparable to WAR in dps atm and plds bring a lot of raid utility. Cover in 4vs is a godsend -covering the main healer after almaguest to stop Aero and earthshaker from killing them, allowing both tanks to remain in tank stance, not to mention divine veil and passage of arms for almaguest and any other big raid wide dmg going out. War has no raid utility to midigate raid wide dmg and in many cases PLD can out dps war. It should not be this close between the two. I do not see how making unchained not sharing a CD timer with IR would make it OP. OP for pulling yes but other than that it will never be used again because it is a HUGE dps loss to use it in lieu of inner release. I suggest MINOR potency buffs because of how unforgiving WAR rotation and the fact war brings way less raid utility than PLD. And if war's utility and identity is locked into being the best dmg dealer of the 3 tanks then it should be without question.

WAR is unforgiving compared to the other tanks, I agree, but when played perfectly, the best players can out DPS the other tanks. Which is why any DPS increase, is only going to make them the go to tank like in HW again.
PLDs utility is in teamate support, and WAR has 2, both of which are hard to see for different reasons. But the one that currently matters to every group composition, is holmgangs short timer.

WAR is no longer as good in the OT role, as DRK and PLD are.

Thats why lowering the dmg of a single target for WAR i think is better, than giving it to DRK, as some ppl suggest.
(Its the closest thing to a cover/TBN, w/o being a direct copy. Similar to tempered will is to plunge, yet different)

Some want WAR to deal more DPS as its support, but with how every fight is a DPS check, and every fight can be won with WARs lack of teammate support/raid wide mitigation, it's too desirable.
(If this were an offline game, id agree to giving WAR more offense.)

Instead of direct potency buffs, some sort of way to lessen the penalty to mess ups would be better, as that would clear up the DPS, w/o going even higher than the current best WAR players. (I couldnt even suggest where to start on this, so I could be wrong, and it may be possible to raise potency buffs to fix this, w/o helpping the best players.)

As for unchained with IR, as I said, it "sounds" like it would make WAR a little too good, but I could be wrong.
Part of me thinks it should be a sort of middle ground.
Like, they share a CD still, but the CD of the oppossing ability is only half as long.
I know ppl want to stack them at times, but if the CD wasnt as long for the other, it wouldnt feel AS much of a loss, knowing they can alternate between them if they NEED to. (as WAR will be MTing more often than not now.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tint

did i hear right that WAR gets an aoe shield?

Wait what? was this in the live letter and i missed it?
(woulda preferred a dmg down, of minor potency, like -7% if this is true.)

but to address the DRK comment, DRK gets TBN, the problem being that DRK is now the "lesser" in every category, even team support, if WAR gets a AoE shield that is anywhere near too potent. (anything above 10% is too potent/unfair)

EDIT: actually a way to ballance this sort of, is to make TBN be mixed with Dark Arts, and become an AoE. It would be a DPS loss, but if the group cant survive, its something.
(Of course then WAR really needs something to lower dmg dealt to the raid, like a 2nd reprisal)
09-29-2017, 11:21 PM
Tint

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Wait what? was this in the live letter and i missed it?

it's from the unofficial translation... :O

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ve_part_xxxix/

"Shake it Off to become some sort of defensive buff barrier for the party" - under job adjustments for WAR
09-29-2017, 11:26 PM
Claire_Pendragon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tint

it's from the unofficial translation... :O

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ve_part_xxxix/

"Shake it Off to become some sort of defensive buff barrier for the party" - under job adjustments for WAR

Bah, thats what I get for sticking to the forums to see the translations lol, they just put "We'll give details about adjustments in the patch notes"
09-29-2017, 11:27 PM
NellMoshroca

So Square continues to ignore DRK and it's multitude of problems.....
09-29-2017, 11:31 PM
shao32

Quote:

Originally Posted by NellMoshroca

So Square continues to ignore DRK and it's multitude of problems.....

worse, if that shake it off barrier its a thing we are complety doom, DRK need more love that WAR idk why they hide all the info about us.
09-29-2017, 11:49 PM
Claire_Pendragon

Quote:

Originally Posted by shao32

worse, if that shake it off barrier its a thing we are complety doom, DRK need more love that WAR idk why they hide all the info about us.

I was annoyed it was a buff, since WAR is more of the "Attack to defend" like inner beast, but Shake it off does come at a cost, it requires shaking off one of your other self buffs,, like vengeance/thrill, which makes it less bad. but DRK is still in need of some help now.

WARs in a good spot, but the problem is, word of mouth puts WAR in a bad spot.

Most ppl fear bringing WAR over DRK, but in reality, once ur doing savage, WAR is easily the better, I actually groan when i get DRK replacements for our WAR.
Similar with other people ive noticed.
(I also groan when i get a DRK tank in Lv61-69 content, if they dont have gear above the iLv, due to their lower amount of CDs, and need to treat it like a Lv70 dungeon)
09-29-2017, 11:58 PM
shao32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

I was annoyed it was a buff, since WAR is more of the "Attack to defend" like inner beast, but Shake it off does come at a cost, it requires shaking off one of your other self buffs,, like vengeance/thrill, which makes it less bad. but DRK is still in need of some help now.

WARs in a good spot, but the problem is, word of mouth puts WAR in a bad spot.

Most ppl fear bringing WAR over DRK, but in reality, once ur doing savage, WAR is easily the better, I actually groan when i get DRK replacements for our WAR.
Similar with other people ive noticed.
(I also groan when i get a DRK tank in Lv61-69 content, if they dont have gear above the iLv, due to their lower amount of CDs, and need to treat it like a Lv70 dungeon)

yup, idk i dont want to take hasty conclusions until the patch notes are up, but for now looks pretty bad for us and they silence about our changes make me fear we just get minor adjustment becoming the new paladin of heavensward.
09-30-2017, 12:25 AM
Aana

Quote:

Originally Posted by shao32

yup, idk i dont want to take hasty conclusions until the patch notes are up, but for now looks pretty bad for us and they silence about our changes make me fear we just get minor adjustment becoming the new paladin of heavensward.

Yes, lets please not do the hasty conclusions.

We don't know what kinda buff shake it off offers. DR? HP? Status Removal? Enmity reduction? Speed boost? DPS Buff? Who knows.

We don't know what 'activated by using other abilities' means. It could mean we need to build up say 5 stacks using CDs and be really hard to use once per fight.

It may be weak. It may be some stupid thing no one cares about for all this trouble.

"Other job adjustments" usually means minor tweaks like potencies which drk can get. Or they may get nothing.

We don't know. Please don't start whining about how fair and unfair the war/drk life is when we don't have any details about anything.
09-30-2017, 01:56 AM
Claire_Pendragon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aana

We don't know what kinda buff shake it off offers. DR? HP? Status Removal? Enmity reduction? Speed boost? DPS Buff? Who knows.

We know its a "Defensive buff party barrier" so not likely a DPS buff, since that woudl be offensive. If it requires a defensive CD like Thrill/Vengance, as they said, then it most likely would need to also add enough defense for the WAR to not mind sacrificing the CD. So most likely an AoE version of TBN. Status removal would sound reasonable, but is unlikely considering the cost. (and uselessness of not being able to remove anything important)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aana

We don't know what 'activated by using other abilities' means. It could mean we need to build up say 5 stacks using CDs and be really hard to use once per fight.

It may be weak. It may be some stupid thing no one cares about for all this trouble.

depending on which translations u read, it says it removes all defensive buffs, so if u pop them all, it eats them all. (and increasing the effectiveness of the party buff)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aana

"Other job adjustments" usually means minor tweaks like potencies which drk can get.

potencies is barely what DRK needs, which is why "other minor changes" isnt enough.
(Though a potency addition to blood spiller is needed, due to how TBN is a DPS loss, since MP is so much more valuable than blood, along with lost GCDs for both blood and MP by using the GCD.

WAR is already ahead, so its already within reason to be worried.
(Not like being worried does anything anyways)

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