Liquid Flame is an example of how overly easy things are.

Once again, "expert" only means they are currently the highest-item-level-required (and usually, locked-furthest-behind-MSQ) 4-man dungeons currently available, meaning they require the most effort to be able to access. It has nothing to do with the actual skill level required to complete them.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

You are free to complain about expert roulette as anyone is, but you are also free to receive responses from people who think that complaining about something that needs to encompass the skill levels of 100% of the population doing endgame, is stupid. It's a non-issue, because you are doing content that has to be of a certain degree of difficulty. What might be difficult for you is easy for someone else, what might be easy for you is difficult for someone else, etc.

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Only there is no difficulty here. You literally can ignore 99% of expert mechanics and be fine, even on 210 Ilvl.

Unless I'm a god Warrior, there's something wrong.

I love the new dungeons. They're fun. I run them multiple times a day with my alts as well as dealing with my relic obsession.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

it isn't powerfull heals that mean tanks can pull 20 mobs at once.

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It is powerful heals that allow you to ignore non-lethal mechanics, because the damage you took has no consequence. The healer won't run risk of going OOM because he has to heal the damage you took and he won't risk having to let the tank die because he's busy fixing your error either. He'll dip out of cleric stance, hit Essential Dignity/Lustrate/Tetra, maybe throw a HoT and then go back into cleric stance. The error is fixed in under 5 seconds with one or two casts at negligible mana cost. This trivializes any mechanic that isn't completely unforgiving and why all "hard" encounters rely on lots of insta-kill and wipe mechanics.

As for mass pulls - that one is a little bit more complicated because it's indeed a matter of incoming healing vs incoming damage, as the stream is continuous. So you "can" theoretically work with increasing the damage, reducing the mitigation or reducing the incoming healing.

Reducing the mitigation might be warranted to some degree, but it makes tanks feel less tanky and the mitigation tanks contributes far less to the effective HP than healing. If you heal a tank with 15000 HP that mitigates 50% of all incoming damage for 4000 HP, you have contributed 8000 effective HP to his health pool. In order to achieve the same effect, he would need to get 4000 HP via gear or mitigate 60% of all damage - except then the heal would be worth around 10k effective HP. And that's just a single heal here, not multiple. That's why 3-man runs without a tank can usually continue with little issues, whereas 3-man runs without a healer result in people dying, wipes and standstill.

The issue with upping the damage instead of nerfing the healing is that it only makes things more unforgiving - In the extreme case of powerful healers and powerful damage, a healer could heal to full every second and mobs could get you to 1% every second. Now that's stress-free gaming, right? We are already at the point where healers can crit you for over half your health in a single, spam-able spell. How hard do you want to make mobs hit to match that? At this point, the issue is healer power, not the incoming damage. It's not one bit surprising that despite their low mitigation, healers rank highest in PotD. They are also the only role that has a skill flat out disabled in PvP for balance sake. How much more obvious do things have to get? >_>

And here I thought I was the only one questioning balance decisions.

i rememebr back in 2.0 release that Amdapor Keep normal( the current end game dungeon that time) were very challenging esp in df lol

Honestly I think the problem is the way SE handled the itemization of the game and the way gear stats work. Problem is not that the monsters are too weak, but the fact that the player is way too strong with the stats + all of the HW skills on top of that. We have way too many ohshit cooldowns, way too much mitigation, too many tools to make the enemy weaker or vulnerable to multiple sources of damage at once. The fact I can do any dungeon in this game as a 100% cleric stance SCH says a lot.

SE could have savage mode dungeons on top of what they have now. Make it so mechanics must be followed or the party wipes. Offer some better rewards. I think this would be a good idea for people want a harder challenge.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

That's irrelevant to what my point is, my point is that if you really want a challenge, go do Savage. Expert roulette dungeons are there for the basic rotations/DPS, not for you to be 'challenged' to the bleeding edge of your class's damage/defense/healing. Also, pretty certain Liquid Flame has more mechanics than any boss of Void Ark, that's where it was overly easy...

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Regardless, someone can still goof on something easy despite being at raid level. This game is just learning how to work within a set of actions that never change, bosses don't react any different at any level in this game, they're going to only hit whoever is top of the enmity list, tank is going to turn it around, and everyone is going to dance around out of AoE or whatever other mechanic is present.

Honestly the only reason Savage is "difficult" is due to the frequency at which the mechanics happen and DPS checks, that in my opinion aren't things that should be classified as difficult in my book. It's like Souls/Bloodborne being hard because 80% of the bosses take up your entire screen and have bad camera.

Once you are able to adjust to the rate at which things happen in savage and can break the dps wall, you realize absolutely nothing in this game is challenging.

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Originally Posted by Phireblast

None and I mean absolutely none of his attacks are threatening. Even if you were in unupgraded 3.2 gear, you can easily survive all of his mechanics if you ignore them. In fact, the damage of all of his attacks are so pitiful, you'd be wasting your time and DPS actually doing the mechanics.

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That is because the dungeons are tuned for 215 to 225 and unupgraded 3.2 gear is 230. You are going in with 15 more ilevels than what the dungeon is tuned for.

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Originally Posted by Yudzster

i rememebr back in 2.0 release that Amdapor Keep normal( the current end game dungeon that time) were very challenging esp in df lol

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That was due to the majority of the player base being in i45 to i55 gear and working towards i70 gear in a dungeon tuned for i55 gear.