Same Red Scripts for CULINARIAN!!

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Originally Posted by Laurell

Didn't you reply to me earlier after I mentioned making Birch Rods to cap on the cheap? I'm aware of the cost vs. gain here as it has been my whole argument. Also after looking at your lodestone your "list of actions/crafts you needed" could be reduced mainly to "clicking buy" on the MB.

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Birch Rods:

1 Nugget - 1 craft

2 star sapphire - 2 crafts

1 leather - 1 craft

2 birch lumber - 2 crafts

1 growth formula theta - 1 craft

Total Crafts: 7

To be equivalent to morel salad in terms of crafting time (45 crafts total), they would need to yield about 75 red scripts per.

Not to mention this carpenter recipe requires you to be a master miner, master botanist, master gold smith, master leatherworker, and master alchemist. WHILE CUL ONLY NEEDS CUL AND BOT.

And you're not "capping on the cheap" if you're buying everything on the damn mb.

It's simple math. The fact that you're failing at it shows how little your arguments actually mean.

Culinarian requires the least amount of effort to gather scripts of all classes.

They require the least amount of material investment (35 items (rod) vs 11 (salad) )
They require the least amount of crafting time (45 crafts vs 90 for weaver hat)
They require the least amount of leveling/gil investment (only need botany and Cul 60 vs multiple 60 classes)

It's math. You're failing at math.

Birch logs are more cost effective to buy on the mb, especially since they are ''hidden'' on their node. Star saphires are real cheap to get as well. Aurum Regis Nuggets and Chimeric Felt are easy to produce, battle retainers can obtain the materials needed for the later pretty easily. The growth formula is the ''hardest'' part of that recipe.

If you arent limited to only CRP then its one of the better recipes to cap with, since it does not require adamantite.

90 crafts for WVR? I dont recall seeing a 5 scrip turn in item for WVR, like ever. WVR has always been 15-20ish for me. The only ones with a really poor option from what I've seen are GSM and CULI.
You failed to note that for culi the reason its so cheap is because each culi material is used in only few things, which is a double edged sword because that can also make them scarce on the board.



But I think it's mostly the fact that you need to make 45 collectible items, as opposed to other crafts that usually only need to make 10 or 15. Making collectibles, each week: it's rather tedious.

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Originally Posted by LongsunZhao

Culinarian is NOT balanced..

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My personal opinion: CULI shouldnt even be a crafting class at all. Same with fishing and gathering. I have no idea why they decided to add them as such. I guess because people wanted these jobs and decided to add them as full classes instead of making something for just them, like professions/jobs.

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Originally Posted by Ayerinn

Go look up the term "What If" as you clearly have no idea what that means



Oh really? Maybe you should level Alchemy then? Oh wait, you would need GSM too... it's fine this comment is all I need to know - back to not wasting my breath. I had no idea you were trolling this whole time, 10/10.

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Noble Gold is one of the best recipes for capping. Only requires GSM/MIN if you want to do it all yourself. Otherwise you can find the materials in large supply on the board.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Birch logs are more cost effective to buy on the mb, especially since they are ''hidden'' on their node. Star saphires are real cheap to get as well. Aurum Regis Nuggets and Chimeric Felt are easy to produce, battle retainers can obtain the materials needed for the later pretty easily. The growth formula is the ''hardest'' part of that recipe.

If you arent limited to only CRP then its one of the better recipes to cap with, since it does not require adamantite.

90 crafts for WVR? I dont recall seeing a 5 scrip turn in item for WVR, like ever. WVR has always been 15-20ish for me. The only ones with a really poor option from what I've seen are GSM and CULI.
You failed to note that for culi the reason its so cheap is because each culi material is used in only few things, which is a double edged sword because that can also make them scarce on the board.



But I think it's mostly the fact that you need to make 45 collectible items, as opposed to other crafts that usually only need to make 10 or 15. Making collectibles, each week: it's rather tedious.




My personal opinion: CULI shouldnt even be a crafting class at all. Same with fishing and gathering. I have no idea why they decided to add them as such. I guess because people wanted these jobs and decided to add them as full classes instead of making something for just them, like professions/jobs.

Noble Gold is one of the best recipes for capping. Only requires GSM/MIN if you want to do it all yourself. Otherwise you can find the materials in large supply on the board.

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They are arguing how many "crafts" it takes to hit your cap, as if the only thing that matters is how many times you press your macro rotation or play whistle RNG.

Yes, you have less turn ins using weaver, but to make each item individually requires far more "crafts" actions than required by culinarians (see above). If you're buying the mats to avoid those actions then the weaver turn ins are far costlier in comparison to the CUL items as well, and now you're just arguing time vs cost.

There is no universe where CUL isn't at the top of the pile in the current situation.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

And you're not "capping on the cheap" if you're buying everything on the damn mb.

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I spent 150k less capping on Birch Rods than I would have on Deep Fried Oke. Tails... And don't talk to me about "buying everything on the damn mb" when you yourself are not even close to self sufficient in your crafting levels.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

It's math. You're failing at math.

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I must be?

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

Yes, you have less turn ins using weaver, but to make each item individually requires far more "crafts" actions than required by culinarians (see above). If you're buying the mats to avoid those actions then the weaver turn ins are far costlier in comparison to the CUL items as well, and now you're just arguing time vs cost.

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Not all crafts are created equal. Secondary mats can be NQed in literally seconds or even quick synthed while AFK. I still usually get max collectibility with unmelded i150 gear and NQ mats, so 80 of those "90" WVR crafts are utterly trivial. You really can't compare them 1:1 to a collectible craft.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

*snip* they would need to yield about 75 red scripts per.
*snip*
It's math. You're failing at math.

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I just find it amusing that, for someone making a personal judgement on another person's reasoned arguments (albeit with a very well-reasoned post), you would be so humourously blind to your own failings at reading and re-writing a simple five-letter word (or six, if you want to use the plural).
We collect scrips, and not scripts.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

It's simple math. The fact that you're failing at it shows how little your arguments actually mean.

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Oh, the enjoyment I get at seeing something so detrimental from someone guilty of a (within the situation where your language skills are unequivocally wrong, as opposed to the other's mathematical skills being situationally wrong) far greater sin.
Thank you for the late night hilarity. /doffcap

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Originally Posted by seorin

Not all crafts are created equal. Secondary mats can be NQed in literally seconds or even quick synthed while AFK. I still usually get max collectibility with unmelded i150 gear and NQ mats, so 80 of those "90" WVR crafts are utterly trivial. You really can't compare them 1:1 to a collectible craft.

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this.
I literally have hundreds of each material pre-made (via quick synth, because who has time to HQ materials?) because it saves space on my retainer.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

Not really. Say I'm trying to do my weaver turn in, the coif of aiming.
I need 2 felt, which requires 2 natron, for a total of 4 crafting actions
Crystal glass, which requires another natron, so 2 crafts.
Grade 1 dex dissolvent, 1 craft
Amp leather, 1 craft
Regis nugget, 1 craft.
So to make it requires 10 actions, for around 50 scripts. To hit cap requires 90 crafting actions.

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thus your reasoning about "requiring all of these craft actions" is a moot point to someone that has all of their crafters and gatherers leveled, which I actually did very painlessly (less than an hour or two a day; gathering all of my own materials) over the first month of HW via GC daily turn-ins. And another point that someone brought up: you aren't even doing these "craft actions" because you don't have the respective classes leveled. The only thing I have to say to you is "you're a hypocrite."

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Originally Posted by Sevyrr

We collect scrips, and not scripts.

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He's made the best point on this thread so far.

This thread is funny as hell to read.

Fact: people who have all lvl 60 crafters/gatherers gets to choose whatever red scrip item to cap per week.
Fact: people who don't have all lvl 60 crafters/gatherers gets to choose that whatever red scrip item available to cap per week.

Its doesn't matter how you do it! Just do whatever method to get 450/450 per week.

That being said, it takes ME 3 hours max to gather every ingredient for Morel Salads and cap for the week.

Pick your poison.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

And I also believe you can't quick syn crystal class either...

And that's not dipping into how many and what raw items you need, compared to something like morel salad

http://puu.sh/jF1vW/15aaf9ce24.pnghttp://puu.sh/jF1xQ/1d51dca317.png

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Can you tell me the name of that App please! @.@

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Originally Posted by seorin

Not all crafts are created equal. Secondary mats can be NQed in literally seconds or even quick synthed while AFK. I still usually get max collectibility with unmelded i150 gear and NQ mats, so 80 of those "90" WVR crafts are utterly trivial. You really can't compare them 1:1 to a collectible craft.

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Pick your choice of farming/buying 100 chimera manes, 50 crawler cocoons, 80 deepeye tears, 40 bear fats, 20 fleece, or gathering 90 morels and 45 emerald beans.

Or in the case of birch rods, 60 raw star sapphires, 30 rues, 30 salivas, 50 aurum regis sand and 30 arch skins. I mean at this point, if you're buying materials off the market board you're factoring in the player market now, which is varied server by server.

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Originally Posted by Sevyrr

I just find it amusing that, for someone making a personal judgement on another person's reasoned arguments (albeit with a very well-reasoned post), you would be so humourously blind to your own failings at reading and re-writing a simple five-letter word (or six, if you want to use the plural).
We collect scrips, and not scripts.


Oh, the enjoyment I get at seeing something so detrimental from someone guilty of a (within the situation where your language skills are unequivocally wrong, as opposed to the other's mathematical skills being situationally wrong) far greater sin.
Thank you for the late night hilarity. /doffcap

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I honestly, I don't see the point of replies lik this because you are quite literally, not adding anything to the discussion of scrip turn-ins except to insult or discredit someone else... without providing any of your own points to discredit otherwise than to be a smartass.

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Originally Posted by TechnoTechie

this.
I literally have hundreds of each material pre-made (via quick synth, because who has time to HQ materials?) because it saves space on my retainer.


thus your reasoning about "requiring all of these craft actions" is a moot point to someone that has all of their crafters and gatherers leveled, which I actually did very painlessly (less than an hour or two a day; gathering all of my own materials) over the first month of HW via GC daily turn-ins. And another point that someone brought up: you aren't even doing these "craft actions" because you don't have the respective classes leveled. The only thing I have to say to you is "you're a hypocrite."


.

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Time:Cost:Efficency. My current starred turn in is a pair of LTW maiming pants. That each requires 2 ampi leather, 2 chimera felts, 1 crawler silk and 2 dissolvents. I'd need 10 of these crafts to cap my scrips. Like I mentioned above, that's 100 chimera manes, 60 ampit skins, 80 deepeye tears and 40 bear fats, that's a lot of time spent just gathering the raw materials, especially with the horrendous drop rate (or retainers, but I digress because we're still going through the process of obtaining said items). You also can't quick syn most level 60 crafts reliably unless you've fully decked out all your crafters (meaning HQ'd main and offhands) because you can still fail quick synthesis.

I mean on my end, I already have 17 felts in my retainer anyway so it's not that big of a deal. But what if I didn't and it's mostly a spur of the moment thing? Unless I were to buy the felts myself, it'd take an hour of straight up farming (or 10 retainer ventures, but that has to be done ahead of time) and maybe get enough manes to make my 20 felts. Now I have to do the same for ampi skins and deepeye tear. And at least on famfrit, these are not dirt cheap, It'd cost me 500k alone to get 100 felts, versus 475k in morels (and everything else for morel salad is dirt cheap). But when you're factoring service prices, it does not make for a good, objective argument because it's varied from server to server. And lastly, buying on the market is not self-sufficient; the definition of that is you're obtaining the raw materials yourself to make it from the ground up.

The game is balancing the red scrip rewards between the amount of raw materials needed for each craft. Beforehand, those pants I just mentioned (or the birch rod) would have given only 116-23 scrips compared to 10 from morel. Would you argue that then, it'd be a fair distribution of red scrips, or is culinary still too far behind?

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Originally Posted by Dinalph

Can you tell me the name of that App please! @.@

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Garlean Database. It's not as good as Allagan Database though.