Questions/Theories About Coil (Long Read SPOILERS)

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Originally Posted by WellGramarye

I never noticed movement when I was screen shotting but I digress. The rubble still seems to have a trajectory from the damage to the salvage. If it was just gravity effects there would be no reason for the rubble that is far off to be floating as well; else everything would be floating. There is clearly rubble just fine sitting on the ground.

As for the civilizations, this is an issue with the current state of the game. Since I never played any of pre-ARR there is no way for a player to know or confirm any of that within the game. None of the npcs mention anything about it and the ones that do have dialogue actually conflict with it.

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Most 1.0 players are in the same boat. We only knew of the Sil'dih and Gelmorra but there wasn't a lot of info on them, or atleast in Sil'dihs case we only knew the downfall of it. Now we know a lot more of Gelmorra in terms of helping found Gridania and more of the existence..Sil'dih information is still the same. Then we have Nym, Amdapor, and Belah'dia being added now. Nym and Amdapor actually having more in-depth information for us in terms of how they lived, the war they participated in while Belah'dia is just chilling in the desert with a dungeon people don't really like to do lol. But this is why we have the Lore section so we can help compile things and answer questions or voice theories/speculation. Sadly I wished we were getting Dev responses like we did with Ferne and the CG Midlander thread. Seems like all we're doing now is speculating and only getting info with the patches, no more realizations with Dev help and more in-depth explanations.

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Originally Posted by WellGramarye

These are the only two pieces I could find other than the Boulder Downs one; which is already been noted in this thread. None of the Aetheric spots in La Noscea seem to actually have a visible site of wreckage. Coil 1-5 isn't visible in the Wineport area and there is no site of wreckage on Umbral Isle nor the shore of the Salt Strand.

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Turn 1's entrance is actually quite obvious,
When you first speak to the NPC, she tells you that you that you'll have to sneak inside castrum occidens, the nearby base, to enter it.
If you enter castrum occidens you'll notice a long fence with an armored door, behind these lies a loooong road toward the center of the dalamud crystal and if you look carefully you can see the allagan construction and the entrance ^^ (tho I don't see the reason the sneak in since you alone can easily defeat the whole base >_>)

While looking around with a friend we found what is most likely to be t6's entrance, so we went around Eorzea looking for all dalamud fragments (coil entrances). I'll post the screens later with the roads and entrances highlighted ^^

I have read a bit into this and it kind of changed into an elder primal debate. There's an interesting speculation thread about Odin on forums. That he's not actually a being I guess, but more so a title. And its why he takes on the form of whoever defeated him. I guess kind of like the Lich King. You defeat him and get his title and powers. So Odin is always really a different person. And the initial Odin is actually the ancient Allagan warrior who defeated "Odin" so long ago. Its why he's a man and a god.

Nah my guess is he just takes the looks of his previous killer (or whatever player was chosen for whatever reason) to simply have a physical form... Maybe that's why he can appear so casually ^^

As for OP's last question : why the Allagans didn't kill Bahamut but sealing him? Simple, if u look many other games / movie lores, u'll see that either:
1. They regard death penalty is ethically wrong BIG TIME.
2. Sometimes, to inflict more punishment and torture, its much better to seal them ETERNALLY wandering the universe or space or dimension or plane or whatever
3. Or, the third option is, the Allagan with their superior technology which could have enslaved Primals, valued Bahamut as a living weapon asset, which they can seal comfortably if they're not at war.
4. Bahamut is tied very closely to the planet, a surge of aetherial freed from consumption or leech from the Primals, may have devastating effects on a planetary scale

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Originally Posted by Empressia

As for OP's last question : why the Allagans didn't kill Bahamut but sealing him? Simple, if u look many other games / movie lores, u'll see that either:
1. They regard death penalty is ethically wrong BIG TIME.
probably not, seeing as how they have no problem with enslaving other races
2. Sometimes, to inflict more punishment and torture, its much better to seal them ETERNALLY wandering the universe or space or dimension or plane or whatever
possible, but i don't think the allagans were capable of time/dimension travel of that scale.
3. Or, the third option is, the Allagan with their superior technology which could have enslaved Primals, valued Bahamut as a living weapon asset, which they can seal comfortably if they're not at war.
if they had the assets, they simply would have just used the same technology they used to enslave dravinia then.
4. Bahamut is tied very closely to the planet, a surge of aetherial freed from consumption or leech from the Primals, may have devastating effects on a planetary scale
bahamut is made of a massive amount of aether, the planet's life-blood. look at what his release did to the world.

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5. They lacked the technology or resources to simply kill the elder primal, so instead tried a last ditch-all-or-nothing attempt to seal him before the situation was beyond hope.

they succeeded, but ultimately the empire fell as result.

As of pre-2.2 I would strongly urge caution, there are a lot of people doing spoilers on a lot of info sights.

Please give us time to complete content and find out for ourselves with new info.

If the mined data is to be believed, The Allagans were using Dalamud as a solar energy collector. Using Bahamut as a key component in the process, Dalamud sent solar energy down to the crystal tower. It is indicated that Bahamut could probably be killed, but using him as part of the solar collection system served two purposes: Rendering Bahamut inert while providing The Allagans with energy. Now what was that energy being sent to the Crystal Tower being used for..?

I know I might be a bit late to the coil lore party and with patch 2.2 coming up soon this all might be irrelevant but when I first saw Bahamut in the coil I didnt see Bahamut as being torn apart. I see him as being re-formed

If Bahamut is a primal, then he would be like Garuda and them a non-corporeal entity/intelligence which can be drawn into a physical form in our world through a summoning requiring a large amount of aether (usually in the form of crystals collected by worshipers). Then once the energy runs out, or the primal is defeated, they return to the void or wherever they come from. However Bahamut had been in Dalamud for aeons without returning and that is what I think his ‘amour’ does. They aren’t tools to control him, they are tools to tether him to this world, so the Allagan could harness his energy without him dissipating.

After the Cataclysm and Bahamut doing his “2-hour”, his energy would have been spent and he could have returned to the void, his armour remnants falling to the ground and being buried with the rest of the Allagan/Dalamud debris (which is why people think he disappeared). However because they are tethers, they are slowly re-forming Bahamut in pieces far underground where we venture into the coil. In the various turn you see a head, a hand/arm and a wing, but they don’t seem to be in position to connect. Plus it’s been 5 years and the head is only partially restored. I think that the storyline of the coil might be a race to disable the controlling technology before Bahamut is fully reconstructed and the wreaks havoc again. I mean if he goes big-bada-boom and then comes back in 5 years to do it again, the world won’t last very long.

But I am no lore master and I will probably be proven wrong soon. But idk, it’s just when I first saw the cut scenes after and saw Bahamut for the first time, I didn’t get the “oh this is what’s left of him” feeling but an “oh he is regenerating” feeling.

Two things not yet mentioned I feel it might be worth contributing.


1: As we have learned from Leviathan and the Whorleater, and to a lesser extent Garuda, corrupted crystals have an effect on Primals. Namely they can disrupt or even disable their control over aether. And what is Bahamut's physical body down in the coil almost completely covered in? Could that be by design?

2: If Elder primals are, as their names would imply, the oldest and most powerful of the primals, then it might stand to reason that they had to be called into being by older, more powerful beings themselves. I also find it unique that there are specifically TWO such Elder primals. Coincidentally the game also has TWO very old, very powerful beings in its lore: Hydalaen and Zodiark.

Suppose for the sake of argument that Zodiark itself "summoned" Bahamut. That would explain:

The Ascians fascination with him.
His lack of need for crystals or worshippers.
His unrelenting hostility towards Eorzea.
His penchant for causing GLOBAL mass destruction, as Hydalaen HERSELF is his primary enemy.
His singling out of Louisoix - Hydalaens former primary ally as the Archon.

Furthermore, this would lend credence to the theory that the crystal of his heart is, or is a piece of, Zodiark himself. SE has a notably similar event in their company lore - Yu Yevon, a magical entity who summoned the colossal and destructive being Sin to serve as his body and protector.

So what about Odin?

Well it would stand to reason that is Bahamut were summoned by Zodiark, that Odin would have been summoned by Hydalaen. Lets look at some piece of that puzzle:

What is Hydalaen's modus operandi? She:

Chooses one person to be her crystal bearer.
Empowers that person to stand against the darkness (Zodiark and his powers).
The chosen person becomes extraordinarily powerful (to the point that our player character "makes sport of killing gods" as Merlwyb phrased it)
Odin makes an implication of his present or former humanity.
He takes the mortal form of whoever killed him last.

That last line there seems to be the strongest indication of my theory. What if rather than a mere game mechanic (bragging rights of the kill), the change of his form is actually LORE based. A sort of warning. "I become like you" can also imply "You become like me." Or "In some unnamed way, we are, were, or will be alike."

Assuming this is true, then it might fit that Odin was once some incredibly ancient champion of Hydalaen herself. Perhaps initially a Crystal Bearer. In order not to lose her champion after his mortal death, Hydalaen herself summoned him back as what we would call an Elder Primal. One that would remain sealed in a place of Hydalaen's natural splendor (the lush forests of Gridania), and be released to defend the world in the event of either great catastrophe, or perhaps in reaction to Bahamut specifically. Again, there is SE precedence for such a being: WEAPON. So why would it be that Odin merely wanders around, waiting to be fought? It might simply be that, as we are so often told, Hydalaen is weak and the last of her strength is waning. Odin was released by the Calamity, but she is now too weak and unable to control him in his Primal state. So she needed a NEW champion. One who could act of their own free will, not needing her power to control.

I'm also willing to bet, that like how Bahamut has a physical form that is sealed away (in the Coil), and a "manifestation" form (what was sealed within Dalamud), we have only too seen Odin's manifestation. Somewhere, probably within the Shroud, is his physical body, entombed by Hydaelaen.