Change/Remove Lalafell "Lifter"...

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Originally Posted by VoidsentStatus

Hence why I put a line saying "as if we didn't already have enough to deal with." Just because a problem exists doesn't mean you get it to make it worse as much as you want. If it's something as simple as changing a dye or removing a text that could help in the smallest margin of minimizing, that shouldn't be off the table with feedback.

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It's really not going to minimize it even in the smallest margin though. As I said, everyone has already made up their minds on this. Can you find one person whose opinion on whether Lalafells should be considered children was decided by the addition of this chair? If not, how exactly is this making it worse for you?

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

That sounds like great advice to me. NSFW lalafell is disgusting. They have toddler like bodies what the hell possesses people to make nsfw with them? Ostracising creepy weirdos is normal and I hope it continues, lala nsfw enjoyers can stay in exile where they belong thanks. I don't want anything to do with people like that at all.

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Want to know what's funny about that? That you should probably uninstall the game in that case since it has nsfw references all over of lalafell being in nsfw situations. Dungeon of lalafell being sex victims, lalafell engaging in sex gossip, bragging about sex body counts, fantasizing and or being in romantic relationships with non-lalafell, oh and the official lore encyclopedia has a bit about one of the main villain characters of ShB that's a lalafell being head over heels wanting "to be seen as a real woman" by another person in the group sexually.

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Originally Posted by Kneecap_Stabber

It's really not going to minimize it even in the smallest margin though. As I said, everyone has already made up their minds on this. Can you find one person whose opinion on whether Lalafells should be considered children was decided by the addition of this chair? If not, how exactly is this making it worse for you?

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Because that's how argumentation points work. If someone says this is why I believe x, for a and b reasons, adding c gives more reason to believe said argument. That is what is called evidence. Having more or less does sway judgements. Similar to irl, there are people firmly on either side of a debate that can't be shifted, but there will also be people on the fence that see valid points on both sides and actually nitpick on the amount of compelling evidence from either.

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Originally Posted by VoidsentStatus

Because that's how argumentation points work. If someone says this is why I believe x, for a and b reasons, adding c gives more reason to believe said argument. That is what is called evidence. Having more or less does sway judgements. Similar to irl, there are people firmly on either side of a debate that can't be shifted, but there will also be people on the fence that see valid points on both sides and actually nitpick on the amount of compelling evidence from either.

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No one is fence sitting and nitpicking the compelling evidence on whether Lalafell are children, because they have played the game and met characters like Nanamo, Teledji, Tataru and so on. It is abundantly clear that they can be adults in lore, and abundantly clear that they look childlike. People who can't get over that childlike appearance are going to treat them as children regardless of the lore. So the chair contributes nothing to either side of this pointless argument.

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Originally Posted by Kneecap_Stabber

No one is fence sitting and nitpicking the compelling evidence on whether Lalafell are children, because they have played the game and met characters like Nanamo, Teledji, Tataru and so on. It is abundantly clear that they can be adults in lore, and abundantly clear that they look childlike. People who can't get over that childlike appearance are going to treat them as children regardless of the lore. So the chair contributes nothing to either side of this pointless argument.

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Yes, there are people fence sitting because it's a common issue in the venue community where people are torn between their personal feelings and obeying RP etiquette which goes off lore, hence why different venues have rules addressing nsfw lalafell on each side, or just flat out ignore it until it becomes a problem or allow people to separate themselves in chat in the discord or in-game from where nsfw lalafell content may be. This has been talked about for years on various ways to handle things, because lalafell being in nsfw situations in venues has been a thing on Primal and Aether as a minimum since the scene first got made over 3 years ago.

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Originally Posted by VoidsentStatus

Yes, there are people fence sitting because it's a common issue in the venue community where people are torn between their personal feelings and obeying RP etiquette which goes off lore, hence why different venues have rules addressing nsfw lalafell on each side, or just flat out ignore it until it becomes a problem or allow people to separate themselves in chat in the discord or in-game from where nsfw lalafell content may be. This has been talked about for years on various ways to handle things, because lalafell being in nsfw situations in venues has been a thing on Primal and Aether as a minimum since the scene first got made over 3 years ago.

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If they're decidedly basing their opinion of "RP Etiquette" on lore and not appearances, then I doubly do not see why this chair would change anyone's mind. The description doesn't mention anything about Lalafell being children, it simply has a childlike appearance, just as Lalafell themselves do. There is no rule against adults enjoying a childish pastel aesthetic. These RP people who can get over the appearance of the characters should just as well be able to get over the appearance of a chair, no? The more this is discussed the more I really cannot fathom why this is contributing to the issue at hand whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Kneecap_Stabber

If they're decidedly basing their opinion of "RP Etiquette" on lore and not appearances, then I doubly do not see why this chair would change anyone's mind. The description doesn't mention anything about Lalafell being children, it simply has a childlike appearance, just as Lalafell themselves do. There is no rule against adults enjoying a childish pastel aesthetic. These RP people who can get over the appearance of the characters should just as well be able to get over the appearance of a chair, no? The more this is discussed the more I really cannot fathom why this is contributing to the issue at hand whatsoever.

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Because you just listed the side of the argument that doesn't care about the chair. It's the other half basing their opinion on personal emotion who care about the chair's existence as they use it to justify said emotion. On a personal level, I don't even understand why a "lifter" is even needed considering lalafell have used chairs perfectly fine until now and hitting the edge of the table with your nose like in the description wasn't a thing in cutscenes that I can remember. The idea itself seems to be inspired by furniture needed by children traditionally.

All this for a chair.....

I understand that as a player of the Lala race, sometimes I want to make my character more adult (And we have clothes that can do that)but all this for a chair I think is unnecessary. It's just a joke (Which I laughed when I read it) MAYBE i would understand if it was something in the story but a piece of furniture in a home system that hardly anyone uses?

I've been playing this here since the PS3 days and I was forced to create a forum account today just for that.

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Originally Posted by VoidsentStatus

Because you just listed the side of the argument that doesn't care about the chair. It's the other half basing their opinion on personal emotion who care about the chair's existence as they use it to justify said emotion. On a personal level, I don't even understand why a "lifter" is even needed considering lalafell have used chairs perfectly fine until now and hitting the edge of the table with your nose like in the description wasn't a thing in cutscenes that I can remember. The idea itself seems to be inspired by furniture needed by children traditionally.

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"It's the other half basing their opinion on personal emotion who care about the chair's existence." That's precisely it though. You admit the people who base their opinion on lore aren't having their minds changed, and the people basing their opinions on appearances, by your own admission, are simply justifying an opinion they already held, and that they needed no further justification for. Everyone who cares about appearance first and foremost before lore already held this position, and the chair has changed nothing.

"The idea itself seems to be inspired by furniture needed by children traditionally." And why do the children need that furniture? Because they are 3 feet tall. Why do the Lalafells need it? They're also 3 feet tall. Whether or not you personally have had trouble fitting in furnishings, that doesn't discredit the perfectly logical reason as to why it would exist in the world. It's just a cute and funny chair, and as much as you want it to be emblematic of tipping the scales in some virtual race war, it's never going to be anything more than that.

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Originally Posted by NeoWave

All this for a chair.....

I understand that as a player of the Lala race, sometimes I want to make my character more adult (And we have clothes that can do that)but all this for a chair I think is unnecessary. It's just a joke (Which I laughed when I read it) MAYBE i would understand if it was something in the story but a piece of furniture in a home system that hardly anyone uses?

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I was lowkey surprised the community even picked this up to comment on it at a wide scale considering the proposed changes don't even affect the majority of these people. The majority aren't lalafell, the majority aren't in communities where the infant argument is prevalent to their daily life in the game, and the majority aren't in housing, let alone would use the item in its exact format as is. I have no idea why people care about feedback that doesn't negatively affect them.