Main Scenario Restriction Bloodstorm - Very Very Bad idea.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

If they find the early game too boring, I wonder how they'll like doing the same content over and over and over at endgame :p

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I have been an FF fan my whole life.
I find 1-20 dreadfully dull which is compounded by mounts and companions not being accessible till 22-30 + slow GCD combat.
I find 20-50 more bearable but not insanely fun.
50 is where the game starts getting really good and at times damn fun.

The journey from 1-50 should not be a slow overextended 5000 mile journey with the gates of heaven always in view 5k miles away. It should be a steady but juicy rush, getting glimmers of the later goodies right out of the gate or soon. Sidequest are supposed to give you things to do outside the main arc of the story(the action), not fill 400-500 quests because then it is just padding or filler.

XIII gets crap from a ton of gamers. But it cut alot of filler/padding stuff out of the game. Not saying that 100% forward focus/no back tracking/no exploration and omitting sidequest entirely would be wise. But most play FF initially for the story, cut-scenes, job systems, and unique battle systems. Though their mmos tend to borrow from other IP rather than be it's own fresh thing.

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Originally Posted by SessionZero

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Maybe they started off with a bias towards disliking the game, I don't know. One was a WoW player so that might have something to do with it. My point was, reducing the barrier to entry juuuuuust a little bit might not be so bad for people coming on board for 4.0.

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I am 100% against a jumping potion.

--BUT--

I am totally on board with them reducing the meaningless quests that are part of the MSQ to date. Many of them were simply time killers and when they were realesed, they made some sense. Not much, but some. I think they should be made optional.

We are at 150-300 hours for the old content as some have stated. I agree that is a bit much, maybe 100-120 hours would be more reasonable. Zero (0) hours is not reasonable either.

The talk of people who want to play with their friends and can't because they aren't max level seems very shallow to me. I have gone back and done old content to help friends clear it, run dungeons orPotD to help them level.

If they really are your friend, and want to see you reach endgame, they will help you get there. The friends who basically say that you are on your own until you get there? Not how I would treat a friend.

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Originally Posted by Istaru

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Agreed on all points. 2.X, while I enjoyed it at the time because it was fresh and had context, had an over-abundance of A to B to A to B fetch quests and simple dialogue steps that could easily be condensed or removed entirely to streamline the path to 4.0 for new players. They absolutely should not remove the gates entirely, just streamline a bit.

And I actually enjoy when friends join up completely new and I get to go back and adventure through old content with them. It brings a sense of nostalgia and reminds me of why I started playing this game in the first place. Help your friends, people.

I've absolutely no issue in gating the new story content behind completion of ARR and Heavensward MSQ quests - it encourages people to play the content already in the game.

That said, I sincerely hope they avoid the same thing they did with Heavensward in that they locked the new jobs quite literally behind a gate, which put a lot of people off, A lot of people picked up the game around the time Heavensward came out with the intention of becoming a MCH, DRK or AST and I'd hate to see the same cockblock tactics for the new ones.

I think that'd be more than a fair compromise, honestly.

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Originally Posted by SessionZero

Agreed on all points. 2.X, while I enjoyed it at the time because it was fresh and had context, had an over-abundance of A to B to A to B fetch quests and simple dialogue steps that could easily be condensed or removed entirely to streamline the path to 4.0 for new players. They absolutely should not remove the gates entirely, just streamline a bit.

And I actually enjoy when friends join up completely new and I get to go back and adventure through old content with them. It brings a sense of nostalgia and reminds me of why I started playing this game in the first place. Help your friends, people.

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Amen.

And what a treat it would be if had features built to foster MSQ and sidequest grouping rather than saying solo only or group only.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

I am not following some of this logic I am a new player myself only been playing three months I thought mmos was suppose to last for years , like I hear lots of vets say they have been playin sense 1.0. I came into this game with the long haul mindset why would I want to pay for something that I can finish within a weeks time , I get the fetch quest stuff it can be annoying. But also like why cut everything down to the bare amount and you are literally payin for a sub to do nothing. This game and I thought all mmos was for the long haul approach to get players enough content for years worth of playing so what is the problem with doing all the msq. Dont gate the jobs, or certain dungeons, just let them be like the optional dugeons like aurum vale , or cutters cry but still require the msq to an extent.

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People nowadays want everything handed to them with little to no effort from their part. If a new player can't reach endgame within a week, he rants about too much grind and so on. We got all these facilities to help out friends that come to us, like unsynced DF, lots of classes, parties etc and still they complain. All has to be done with no effort and in days.
I've had no problem getting my alts to 60 and to the end of current HW, it's not such a grind as they moan. Yes some quests are a bit boring and could be deleted for what I care, but with all the skipping cutscenes it took me maybe 2 weeks to reach 60 and open access to everything.
You guys might aswell just go on youtube and watch playthroughs, then you don't even have to play hehe.

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Originally Posted by dejiko_san

Why would you buy an MMO RPG to skip the RPG part of it? The lore and storyline are a big part of the game...

I don't get it ^^;

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Agreed. When new players join FFXIV, they run through the MSQ, this gives them ample opportunity to befriend established players who can help them, and because everyone goes through the MSQ and associated primals and dungeons, it's a shared experience, something that we all have in common. If players could just join and skip all of that, there would be no shared experience, no common ground, no lore/story/history, just end-game. That sounds like a pretty empty experience to me.

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Originally Posted by Kondor

I Really love this game but also i'm a leader of Free Company and i see how many people bounce from this game because first 50 lvl are borring and arenas form A realm Reborn are empty. Now i have to tell my new players they have to make 400 main scenario quest and spend almost 300 hours to do it to reach content with all players want.

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I really love the game as well. My purpose in playing - other than personal enjoyment - is to help others enjoy the game as I do, that's kind of the point of my FC too. With respect to the MSQ, it doesn't take 300 hours.

I'm a FC leader as well, I find that players who work their way through the MSQ stay longer than those who try to do everything they can to accelerate through the game as quickly as possible. I am certain that has something to do with their mind-set. Either they are looking at the game as a long term thing, or it's short term and they want to be at end-game instantly so they can play with their friends NOW.

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Originally Posted by Kondor

Sorry for that but i have to say it: Are you Fu... Kidding me?! Yoshida! Expansion is the best moment to reach new players - they must have options to reach new content as possible and play together with us because if they will be leave in central shroud alone they will just leave the game.

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I'm just gonna say this, because this is something that really bothers me. If you are an FC leader, and your Free Company members truly support each other and their friends, why are you not focused on doing content together and *helping* new players and friends to complete the MSQ content together. Work with those new FC members and friends. Give them the same respect and care that you gave each other when you first started. I hate seeing new players join the game and get tempted into one of the large end-game focused FCs. I hate it because I know that I'll hear from them about how glad they are that I or my fellow FC mates are happy to run stuff with them, because their own FC won't.

The MSQ is a *huge* opportunity for new players to get to know established players, and for established players to help new ones. I mean good grief, anyone who's a level 50-60 omni-crafter can make anything a new player needs so easily it's almost criminal that they don't. Those same players can run any piece of content needed with ease and show the new player the ropes and help them come to enjoy Eorzea. Removing the MSQ or skipping it removes some of the 'heart' of the game, I very much hope that SE, Yoshida and his team stick to their course with the MSQ and leave it largely intact.

There is no need to make something that is great, great again.

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Originally Posted by SessionZero

And I actually enjoy when friends join up completely new and I get to go back and adventure through old content with them. It brings a sense of nostalgia and reminds me of why I started playing this game in the first place. Help your friends, people.

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Yes, and you build a shared experience and history with those new players who become new friends.

In my opinion, this is the kind of thing that fosters healthy growth and strength in the community.

Like you and Istaru, I agree that removing the filler or fetch quests would be useful, to slim down the MSQ a bit and reduce the easy to criticize running around quests. I'd actually leave the quests in the game, and simply remove the MSQ tag from them, and leave them as side quests which players can opt to do in order to gain the lore that the side quests often bring. That would reduce the sheer grind required to progress through the MSQ without losing the sense of the MSQ.

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Originally Posted by Sandpark

I have been an FF fan my whole life.
I find 1-20 dreadfully dull which is compounded by mounts and companions not being accessible till 22-30 + slow GCD combat.

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OK, but I can bring a brand new character from level 1 to level 10-15 in all classes in a few hours - including crafts and gatherers. Focusing on a single class, I could easily hit 20 in very little time. The only thing slowing me down would be the initial dungeons required to progress. If you're working on several classes overlapping each other you have cross class skills to help, and the process really doesn't feel slow. If you focus exclusively on a single class it might be a bit slower, but to be honest the leveling during the first 5-10 levels can be so quick, it's really not an issue.

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Originally Posted by Kosmos

With respect to the MSQ, it doesn't take 300 hours.

OK, but I can bring a brand new character from level 1 to level 10-15 in all classes in a few hours - including crafts and gatherers. Focusing on a single class, I could easily hit 20 in very little time. The only thing slowing me down would be the initial dungeons required to progress. If you're working on several classes overlapping each other you have cross class skills to help, and the process really doesn't feel slow. If you focus exclusively on a single class it might be a bit slower, but to be honest the leveling during the first 5-10 levels can be so quick, it's really not an issue.

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100 HRS or 300 HRS. You still spend too much time doing things besides reaching the goal post. I am not trying to be snarky or anything if it seems that way I am sorry.

Sure I know you can because I can do that too. it's not so much the time spent that is the problem. It is how the time is spent being the problem. I level alts like crazy even though there is not much particular boons to doing so in this game. Doing so allows me to realize things that could affect a player's positive experience more.

You already have to pay to play, then you have to wait x amount of time to get to the feature you want to play most and the game goes out of it's way to start that off slow. Not saying their should be no progression or slower time. But while I don't expect to jump in an be expert in savage content instantly, I also can't see the majority of people wanting to do go through a bunch of little things to get to the good things.

This is why I think 1-50 should be significantly faster, even more so now that alot of that content is out of date or irrelevant if you remove tomestones from the equation.

The goal post for me isn't the journey or the endgame. It is whatever I am doing at this moment, not yesterday, not tomorrow, not two years from now. It could be great next year or great last year, the worst game at launch or the worst game come Stormblood. All that matters really is now.

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Originally Posted by Sandpark

100 HRS or 300 HRS. You still spend too much time doing things besides reaching the goal post.

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The goal post is creating the character, the main story and all the content that follows simply increases the score. Current end-game is only the 'goal' post if you are the kind of player who only wishes to participate in that type of content.