Get rid of SAM Limit break gimmick already (FL)

People complain about SAM LB being broken but ignore how NIN can literally get multikills at 50% or lower

Ninja can be annoying but, at the same time, I just don't find it as utterly frustrating as Samurai. And, specifically in FL, when you have a crowd of 8+, you just have no real idea on who is who, especially on the fringes.

I like it, when i die to this bs lb, sam has in 99% of the cases jumped to my ranger ass, surrounded by bunch of alliance buddies.
Who then kill them.

tbh im more annoyed to have a nin on my alliance stealing every kills... hp dose go down fast and if I am below 50% a lot of things can oneshot me like mch lb, most of the time I will try to keep my hp around 90%. And if I die to nin at least i know what happened... most of the time is because i was out of position or we got pinch so everyone is low. Dying to sam lb is just random.

From my stats in 7.2 ninja is the best job in FL at getting kills followed by monk, machinist, reaper and then samurai is in 5th. However samurai dies the second most (likely because they tend to die immediately after LB), is dead last in assists and the 5th worst job in damage. All samurai has going for it is kills from their LB lol. Its annoying to deal with their LB but overall samurai is a pretty bad job in FL. You can also easily counter samurai LB by playing healer with stoneskin or SCH adlo deploy. Or play any job that can stun them after they activate the debuff. I regularly hit samurai with monk LB when I see them prepping it.

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Originally Posted by TofuLove

I thought about another LB variant that would make the game more refreshing from a perspective of sam. Continuing the thought of making sam like blm.
If you make LB that pierces guard, lets say for 5 attacks, or maybe make it something a touch broken - like 8 attacks, reduces cast times or maybe even removes them (kinda like ew blm) & maybe increases damage output (let's say a 10%-20% buff). Dropping the LB to 60s recharge time would actually make the class a little bit more refreshing to play and could be very strong, but not broken.

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5 or Twelve forbid 8 attacks would be too much. RPR's ability to deal 36k of unblockable damage (in one gcd and an ogcd) was shot dead with the update that divorced Harvest Moon from Death Warrant, so as an equivalent, it'd be more like 3 attacks, as then that's 12k 12k 10k~ as a rough potential if SAM were given that guard bypass (with instant cast). That is, if you wanted to see it as an LB of 60/45 secs cd.

It's not SAM, but I've long entertained how to make NIN's LB different. (I'm going to spoiler this part to cut down on tl;dr factor just a bit).

I'm not really into the gotcha OHKOs or assassination type moves in here even if I do play those jobs, so I figured something like a poison. At first I thought maybe something that prevents potting temporarily (lame), then... something that freezes the MP bar long term, but is purgeable with full elixir.

Then... I thought, maybe a really weak DoT (or a more innocuous debuff like a very slight increase to cd timers on the target afflicted) that again is only purgeable with full elixir, however on the second use on the same target, it'll knock them to 1% or... maybe 10% (or something other than 1% anyway) if that's too extreme, it's the mechanism I'm trying to present. It'd be a faster cd LB given it'd be a low damage skill that doesn't really do anything much until the second use. Thought maybe it'd be cool to bring in a little of ROG/NIN's old trappings, and also more of an attritional aspect that works(?) Some kind of venom like you see in Guild Wars.

Back to SAM and idk mah goiz. Seeing responses at either extremes; that it's too op and that it's "easily" bypassed. It's neither. When my PC isn't crapping out on me I can easily make dives with Bloodbath and emerge alive. It's only jobs with full action lockout (<cough> MNK) that can stand to do anything, and even then if focus is weak, Bloodbath will passively heal me when cc'd. The toughest part is selecting a target on a dime when it's a big dive (since I don't got one of them fancy forbidden plugin things /smile) sometimes input lag is too much because of stutter. Then the attempt is abandoned if it means conserving BH (if it's FL). Also with Bloodbath I will run at enemies no matter what, so a lot of the time I just get to attack freely because they're too scared and never know when I actually have LB lmao.

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Originally Posted by echo78

From my stats in 7.2 ninja is the best job in FL at getting kills followed by monk, machinist, reaper and then samurai is in 5th. However samurai dies the second most (likely because they tend to die immediately after LB), is dead last in assists and the 5th worst job in damage. All samurai has going for it is kills from their LB lol. Its annoying to deal with their LB but overall samurai is a pretty bad job in FL. You can also easily counter samurai LB by playing healer with stoneskin or SCH adlo deploy. Or play any job that can stun them after they activate the debuff. I regularly hit samurai with monk LB when I see them prepping it.

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A sam with a premade is super annoying, they are really tanky and they will just dive your entire alliance with bloodbath, their pocket healer will keep them alive then they will randomly lb and kill 5 people in one go. Even the sam get kill afterward they will bring down a bunch of people. resin and repeat. its just really cheap. You pretty much cannot counter it because if you want to cc or lb them you risk dying as well because of the pocket healer they can survive that 2 sec cc then lb your entire party.

I've had games when I'm doing everything right and then clip a SAM with AoE at the wrong time and without knowing. Everyone just tells you that the counter play is, don't attack SAMs and don't use AoE. Sounds unreasonably stupid to me.

You can guard agains it once it is togled on you... its like 3 seconds planning.

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Originally Posted by Themarvin

You can guard agains it once it is togled on you... its like 3 seconds planning.

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Guard won’t do anything.
This is a common mistake made by new and casual players.
You need an action that creates a damage-absorbing barrier.
Many PvP actions provide this, but players often fail to use them properly.