Dark Devices - Exploitation

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GiseleValkyrie

Question is are you doing it to grief like one of the posters here? Tho I don't think it should be bannable if you are doing it to cause grief and get caught in the act i guess so.

---

The description tells players what to do, I'm still going to kill the targets that contribute to the progress bar and hand in items on FATEs that require it. It is not griefing, it is following the FATE's instructions to progress, if everyone else wants to farm the trash mobs that's fine, but I'm going after what I need to kill to end the FATE and move on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Musashidon

question though is ending it early griefing or some bannable offense? (to the players ending it early might as well ask and find out right?)

---

If you talking about me I dont end it early thats impossible I do on the other hand kill the targeted mob as in what the Fate tells me to kill and I do ignore people telling me to not to. But again I really dont know what people are shouting, yelling, or telling since I got them all cut off anyway. I never roll in a fate in a party never Fate Grinded leveled my second class thru dungeons only and my first through story and side quest the only reason you would never see me doing a Fate party is if my FC asks me and I would be rolling on my level 50 for it.

Also, me killing the targeted mob is also working as intended lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Musashidon

question though is ending it early griefing or some bannable offense? (to the players ending it early might as well ask and find out right?)

---

if they come and say, yes... they will have a riot, because it means every people doing the objective to any fate can be banned. a couple of exemple:

- boss with add fate, people can argue, you must kill the add first before finish the FATE?
- the turn in item fate, same trouble people turning them item instead to farm monster.

but still something bother me with Camate answer, without offense, how the fact that some people can get more of 200.000 exp in 10 minutes is working as intended? i doubt any fate was make for give this much of exp! we are not talking of a lot of exp, but an humongous exp! we are talking of more of 10-15 times the reward of the fate earned in 12-13 minutes.... i'm the only one to notice a trouble here?

No silentwind you aren't the only one to notice the problem, however the developers have made their official stance on it we just have to accept it at this point. People will take the path of least resistance it's in our nature as human beings.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Musashidon

question though is ending it early griefing or some bannable offense? (to the players ending it early might as well ask and find out right?)

---

What a totally puerile question.

/shakeshead

the trouble is they don't want to loose potential subscriber, then instead to say, this is an exploit or a bug, they say nothing and fix it later. but it lead to a problem more bad the community is becoming more and more ugly as the time pass. speedrunner, trashtalking against first timer, harrassing because you break them fate by doing the fate as intended, leecher, leaver,...

indeed we do point the trouble of the gain of exp here... but it's a perfect example of how the community is because of the lack of action. the game is good, but it's an mmorpg, if the community is horrible.... well you get the point.

What the, I'll politely call the "non-DDers" don't understand is that while many people do rage at the people completing the FATE early, there is quite a large number of people (at least on Gilgamesh) that finish the FATE early SOLELY to agitate or raise a giant middle finger to the people attempting to farm it. Hell, even a few people in this thread have said that if they get yelled at, they'll kill the lambs SOLELY to spite the other people. That's just as selfish and belligerent as the people chastising the people who innocently didn't know in shout or whispers.

Of course it is, and that's all this fate effectively breeds on either side. I don't condone either side harassing the other out of intention, if you want to complete it - then do so. If not find a fate party and grind with the masses the fate spawns regularly enough that even if its interrupted you'll still get a fairly effective bonus to experience. Just take it in stride and try to make the most out of what you can.

1. Community complains about not being able to level secondary classes easily.
2. Community finds a way, but complains it's an exploit.
3. Rep says it's not an exploit.
4. Community complains

WTF?

.... I'm trying to figure out how that is considered an exploit in the first place. God damn you people bitch for the sake of bitching.

People complain about lack of variety in leveling a second class, not the act of leveling one. Endlessly doing fates because its far superior to the rest of content is the primary complaint. People voicing opinions is what these forums are for, if you have nothing constructive to put forward other than complaining about others complaining i suggest collecting your thoughts. Try throwing out an alternative idea or something at the very least don't just come in here and insult people for not seeing everything the way you do.

I wanted to share a conversation (the pink text in the picture) that I had with one guy who was trying to get people mad at him.
http://imageshack.us/a/img199/4076/8qlh.png

I don't think he understood why I wasn't screaming at him.

I typically try to make sure the people in my party don't rush to judgement and start insulting others right off the bat, even if they know that the person is doing it purposefully.
By the way, the other guy I messaged at the top didn't know about the fate, and he joined a party after we got people to stop yelling and calmly explain to him over shout what was happening and why they wanted to play it that way. The second line from the bottom is when we all rushed the lambs at the end.

A little composure and kindness goes a long way.

It's nice to see there are people like you out there Demer. =)

It's not an exploit (and I don't know how anyone got to that conclusion) however it is an unbalanced Fate and should obviously be nerfed or redesigned. Fates are about public cooperation and the way that this Fate is designed, is so that private parties benefit from the public quest and the public who is not invited to the party or parties just happen to be full, cannot get the benefit from the Fate. As soon as your average player cannot benefit doing a public quest, it's becomes a poorly designed/thought out Fate and it is not in-line with the design of the game's Fate encounters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

1. Community complains about not being able to level secondary classes easily.
2. Community finds a way, but complains it's an exploit.
3. Rep says it's not an exploit.
4. Community complains

WTF?

---

When you simplify things like that, anything can look stupid. You can't use the blanket term "Community" when there are two different sides.

Ok, so farming it isn`t an exploit, but finishing it early also isn`t an exploit, if i want to finish it early for whatever reason, people will have to deal with it =D

Lol. So many immature people in here, wanting to end it for the sake of being a douche.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AridElf

The description tells players what to do, I'm still going to kill the targets that contribute to the progress bar and hand in items on FATEs that require it. It is not griefing, it is following the FATE's instructions to progress, if everyone else wants to farm the trash mobs that's fine, but I'm going after what I need to kill to end the FATE and move on.

---

Again if you are going in there just to piss people off then it could be the same as that if you just want to do the fate i don't see it as griefing as people said there are people who make parties who solo thing to do is grief the others farming is what I am saying I'm not lumpping normal players in with them

I kind of want the seals and the exp so i'll possibly end the fate as quickly as possible if I ever see it pop up. I don't generally play in fate parties and I'm not trying to be mean I just don't want to sit around while people farm and kill monsters. I just want to get my reward and move on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Calypsx

I kind of want the seals and the exp so i'll possibly end the fate as quickly as possible if I ever see it pop up. I don't generally play in fate parties and I'm not trying to be mean I just don't want to sit around while people farm and kill monsters. I just want to get my reward and move on.

---

But its not like more fates don't pop up, in other zones, at other times. Just admit it, your the person who likes pooping in the kool aid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Elazu

Lol. So many immature people in here, wanting to end it for the sake of being a douche.

---

mostly for the sake of getting the exp and move on, since i'm not really interested in farming them, but if that makes me a douche, w/e, i think douches are those who want to set a "real" way of doing fates.

if you wanna farm it, be my guest, but i don't want to =].

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MitArgento

mostly for the sake of getting the exp and move on, since i'm not really interested in farming them, but if that makes me a douche, w/e, i think douches are those who want to set a "real" way of doing fates.

if you wanna farm it, be my guest, but i don't want to =].

---

Again, someone not making sense. You want the exp, but settle with 1/5 of the exp for the sake of messing it up for everyone else in the zone. Why? I don't understand this mindset.

Aren't you setting a "real" way to do it by ending it early yourself?

Newsflash: When DD pops the other FATEs in the zone don't stop appearing. The first part of DD gives awful exp anyway. Why don't you go do the other FATEs and join DD when the 2nd part starts? Are you that dead set on screwing everyone else over?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Calypsx

I kind of want the seals and the exp so i'll possibly end the fate as quickly as possible if I ever see it pop up. I don't generally play in fate parties and I'm not trying to be mean I just don't want to sit around while people farm and kill monsters. I just want to get my reward and move on.

---

1. If you're in it for EXP, ending the DD FATE early just doesn't make sense. In order for you to make up the difference, you need to run 10 regular FATES which will take you much more time to complete.

2. By the time you're 45+ and consistently running DD, seals really have little value.

While i respect your preference to run solo, ending DD early for your own convenience and knowing that it will negatively impact dozens of other players just make you out to be a selfish jerk, and gets you added to multiple blacklists. When you hit 50 and need parties with these same people to get your relic weapon, this can certainly come back to haunt you. Is 10 or 15 minutes really worth that to you?

in the time spent farming DD, dozens of other fates will have popped and been completed. there is zero reason for anyone who knows about the farming to go to DD with the excuse that they need a fate to complete so are going to end it.

the way i see it is if you have 30 people asking you to stop what you are doing and you keep doing it, you are griefing. you are continuing specifically to take away from those 30 people, and you should be reported and punished. DD farming isn't a secret, you know exactly what your doing when you go there to kill the lambs, and you are specifically trying to complete this particular fate instead of the dozen other ones available, so you can ruin other people's game play.

this is stupid ppl arguing playstyle LOL, ppl farming have just as much right to play their way as ppl who just play to get it over with. sadly even though it doesn't make sense to end DD like that, how can anyone complain or punish another for it? yes they may have done it for whatever reason but that's how the game works everyone needs to just get over it and play how you like to play.

if you want to blacklist someone because they ruined you lvl45+ fate farming (which at that level there are other ways to level up including the other fates in the area) then you take this game to serious. on the flip side if you ruin someones fate farm experience (LAWL) then be prepared to deal with the flame!

honestly ppl, all this thread did is tell more about this which will give both point of views more reason to argue (more ppl to ruin, more ppl to farm) -_-

personally, i don't go into this area anymore because of reaction like this... same as coerthas, is my favorite area, but seeins a zerg running there and there make it horrible... sorry to say this but the zerg/intense farming of fate is ruining the game actually!!!

that said, i will say only one thing, ending or not the fate is your right.... and both side seems to be right (since camate answer). it don't give you the right to say this one or this one is griefing.

Thanks for the clarification Camate. There still exists the problem of opposing play styles on this FATE as can be seen by the last several comments.

Personally, I basically farm FATEs for seals. If I'm in the area farming FATEs for seals and there are several FATEs up including DD, I will do the others first. However, if DD is the only FATE up I will end it early. I don't want to sit around for another 3-10 minutes for another FATE to appear when I can immediately continue farming my seals.

Also, several posters attacked Calyps for wanting to do FATEs in a very similar way. I truly don't think he is wanting to be jerk and I don't either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tiraelina

Thanks for telling us the dev team doesn't care about crafting or anything else pre-cap. Just RUSH RUSH RUSH. I would've loved to hear this before release.

---

Wow you mean you haven't suffered through the Story line yet? That story line alone tells you they want you to enjoy the journey.

If you want to not farm DD, then do other FATE's, there are hundreds in the game, you are intentionally being a jerk by ending it early after you've been enlightened as to why it is better and that other people are doing it that way.
You don't get to cut in line at the DMV just because no one is watching. Don't be a dick, the rule of the internet.
Let's all play by it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GiseleValkyrie

Again if you are going in there just to piss people off then it could be the same as that if you just want to do the fate i don't see it as griefing as people said there are people who make parties who solo thing to do is grief the others farming is what I am saying I'm not lumpping normal players in with them

---

I didn't mention anywhere that I wanted to piss people off, I'm just playing the FATE how it was designed to be played, regardless of if it's working as intended or not. I want my GC seals and I will do what I need to do in order to get them.

this is a funny thread.

Basically you're the bad guy now if you actually play the game it was intended to be played.

Good news is that Devs will let us play and level the way we really want. I am actually very surprised, in a good way.

I , for one, am very happy :)

Again, the CM has stated that the "way the game is intended to be played" is exactly what people are doing now.

So if you're ending it early because you believe this is the "intended way" you're wrong, or at the very least, you're not doing it efficiently as others have stated.

That being said, its perfectly valid to end it early.

Because...even if you do get into a FATE group, which is not guaranteed when people are busy busting their butts farming the waves of adds, you are not guaranteed good xp from it.

If you aren't one of the first groups there, camping one of the 3? spawn spots, or if there are too many people there for you to see the adds, then you lose.

You get maybe 1 kill every 30 or 40 seconds for that, which is, needless to say, horrendous xp.

So hey, I see no problem with you going off and ending it, to get your 10k->12k->20k->40k xp quicker.

When I was leveling, if I couldn't get into a FATE party for the first part of DD I went and did the other FATEs in the area - I amassed more exp and seals then I would have waiting for the people farming DD to finish it. Then, I would head over and finish the last 3 parts.

I don't really see a big deal with it considering how stupidly easy it is to get to max level your saving, what? 2 hours of extra work.
The problem with mmo's is that people don't want to put the time into them that should be required. They've essentially went from games with a virtual world you become engrossed in to a single player game with multiplayer options and no immersion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Orophin

Basically you're the bad guy now if you actually play the game it was intended to be played.

---

No, you're the bad guy if you're making a big deal out of it. Move on with your life and try not to cause drama like complaining about something when almost the entire community is against you.

Then "almost the entire community" has a serious entitlement problem. I can't wait for people who have such little interest in anything other than speeding to 50 as quickly as possible to get bored and quit. The game will be much better off for their absence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bufkus

No, you're the bad guy if you're making a big deal out of it. Move on with your life and try not to cause drama like complaining about something when almost the entire community is against you.

---

I don't think you should say 'almost the entire community is against you' based on a limited number of people posting on the forums. If you look at FFXIV Reddit, they have 2x as many people saying the complete opposite (and usually making fun of us that actually do post on these forums) in older threads. Newer threads since the mod comments have had less hate though (and generally a more 'whatever' mentality).

That being said, since the mods said it's fine, w/e.