Thematic issues. Why all the sci fi.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

So a sci-fi cyberpunk mega city with neon ads and Starbucks is now considered Magitek?
Thanks for clearing that up.

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The cyberpunk mega city fueled by magical rocks, yes.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

So a sci-fi cyberpunk mega city with neon ads and Starbucks is now considered Magitek?
Thanks for clearing that up.

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It... factually is, this is very thoroughly explained, all their technology is fueled by Electrope, which is a material that serves as a catalyst for aether conversion, Solution Nine is a city absolutely brimming with magical energy.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

So a sci-fi cyberpunk mega city with neon ads and Starbucks is now considered Magitek?
Thanks for clearing that up.

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you are right, should be call "Electroptek"

Magitek is a very specific thing of reverse engineered allagan tek.
But they can just fart out a full Star Wars rip off insert for all I care. Doesnt mean I need to laud it as logical worldbuilding or good writing.

Solution 9 is a clear insert of cyberpunk. My main issue is still how they are using Sharlayan and the loporrits to fart out tek since Endwalker. Dawntrail might be a crap story, but Endwalker sowed the seeds for all of this with how they rushed.q

It's funny seeing people complain about tech when there's a giant mecha steam punk time machine with transforming robots and fighter jets hanging out in HW.

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

Magitek is a very specific thing of reverse engineered allagan tek.
But they can just fart out a full Star Wars rip off insert for all I care. Doesnt mean I need to laud it as logical worldbuilding or good writing.

Solution 9 is a clear insert of cyberpunk. My main issue is still how they are using Sharlayan and the loporrits to fart out tek since Endwalker. Dawntrail might be a crap story, but Endwalker sowed the seeds for all of this with how they rushed.q

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Dalamud was just a hecking huge industrial source of magick and a prison in space and in endwalker we had a Moon being a spaceship. Fact is both were almost design by ancient. Nothing very... farfetch here.

Solution 9 being a cyberpunk city is not so stupid and w/o any sens. Electricty is a source of power, if you look at us a civilisation, since electricity is a thing we are taking the "same step" (as an image of course...) they were just faster than us and have good electricity storage device (what we do lack of thos). There is sens in Solution 9 imo

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Originally Posted by CalvinDescoles

Dalamud was just a hecking huge industrial source of magick and a prison in space and in endwalker we had a Moon being a spaceship. Fact is both were almost design by ancient. Nothing very... farfetch here.

Solution 9 being a cyberpunk city is not so stupid and w/o any sens. Electricty is a source of power, if you look at us a civilisation, since electricity is a thing we are taking the "same step" (as an image of course...) they were just faster than us and have good electricity storage device (what we do lack of thos). There is sens in Solution 9 imo

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You can try to write it for the writers all you like. But there is 0% chance that Solution 9 wasnt directly inspired by Cyberpunk and because it was / is popular.
SE is probably gonna be in panic after they run out of FF's to rip off. They might have to start being original again.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

This is already happening with Garlond Ironworks.

They’ve already been supplying Eorzea with airships and motorcycles. They also have had computers they seem to be using for themselves. But they have been spending most of their time and resources on technology to fight a worldwide war against the country they defected from. Since the world is at peace now I’m sure they’d be realistically supplying Eorzea with Garlean tech.

Garlemald was already a superpower and Allag was before them so I don’t think Alexandria would be the first, just the only. They very nearly got there before we stopped them but the story is still new and we have more patches to go to see where their place in world society ends up.

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Who in Eorzea is riding a motorcycle? Why is airship service still dependent on wooden craft lifted by gas bags that move at the speed of smell? Why are goods still moved with chocobo-drawn carts? Why were the fighting forces of the three Great Nations using axes, swords, and bows to take on an army equipped with machine guns, armor, and long range artillery? You can't tell me that after years of cold war and open conflict with Garlemald, every Wood Wailer, Brass Blade, and Yellowjacket wouldn't step over his own mother to get his hands on a modern repeating firearm.

Again, the tech itself isn't the problem, it's the inconsistency of its use and implementation. The technology exits in the vacuum of the MSQ or side stories, and we're just supposed to accept it. Koana went to Sharlayan and learned about aetherytes, then went home and built a continent-spanning aetheryte network. Okay, cool; but how? He couldn't do it entirely by himself, but he also wouldn't be able to teach the countless engineers, technicians, and construction workers needed for such a project. What about his train to nowhere? Where are the steel mills that made the plate for the locomotive, and the rails? Maybe the steel was imported, but who in the known world has that kind of manufacturing capacity aside from Garlemald?

I could keep going on, but I'll stop for now. Unless 8.0 completely remakes the world, we will always have this incongruity between medieval fantasy and high-technology that doesn't mesh very well. Good sci-fi, just like a good magic system, has to have rules and logic. You can't just make stuff up willy-nilly and expect your readers/watchers/players to not question it.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

It's funny seeing people complain about tech when there's a giant mecha steam punk time machine with transforming robots and fighter jets hanging out in HW.

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Alexander's design is much more preferable and blends in better to the fantasy world than solution 9/cosmic exploration/loporrit tech does. Not to mention they don't have cars and motorcycles just sitting around as props. Like someone here said, sure you can make an excuse to bring those designs into the world, but that doesn't mean it blends in well or that its good.

Wuk Lamat could discover a relic her dad was storing in the back of the palace that she uses to power herself up and challenge you to a duel and beat you in front of everyone despite the fact you're the WOL. And when it does your only dialogue option could be to congratulate her and tell her she's become the greatest hero the star has seen. It CAN happen, it just wouldn't be a good addition to the game.

It's not about the existance of sci-fi, its the low effort of just inserting a city that looks like our current gaming PCs, adding our current phones, energy drinks, cars, etc.

Old FF games had tech, yes, but they were all stylized in a way that made them unique and fit the world because the ppl who came up with the designs were actually creative and had skills. And then the writers were also skilled enough to make it make sense within that world. There is absolutely no reason S9 couldn't completely overrun the entire world with the armada that attacked Tural, much less their entire army. The woodwailers in Grid would have no chance against a cyborg with a laser gun much less 100 cyborgs with laser guns and a warship with tech that is hundreds if not thousands of years more advanced than theirs. Unless of course you have the FF power of friendship and tacos.

Anyone can fart out what we are getting now and it doesn't feel like it belongs because it doesn't. It belongs in our world. FFXV imo had this same issue. The moment i saw a irl car and clothing I was instantly turned off of the whole game. That is fine in some games, but it feels just dirty in a FF game. You can have vehicles, that is fine, but make them fit the setting, don't just import our current cars into the game.

Some of you may be content with just being given whatever. But a lot of us have a little higher expectations out of a company that brought us so many amazing, well crafted and carefully thought out FF games.

That incongruity with Solution 9 is a deliberate narrative choice. It's part of DT's themes and is the focus of some of its story. Sometimes media will present you with something that triggers negative emotions in order to lead you down a narrative path. You are expected to be somewhat media literate and capable of reflecting on your reaction to things in the game, instead of going with your first knee-jerk reaction and assuming the cause is due to an error in design.

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Originally Posted by Exmo

That incongruity with Solution 9 is a deliberate narrative choice. It's part of DT's themes and is the focus of some of its story. Sometimes media will present you with something that triggers negative emotions in order to lead you down a narrative path. You are expected to be somewhat media literate and capable of reflecting on your reaction to things in the game, instead of going with your first knee-jerk reaction and assuming the cause is due to an error in design.

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But DT isn't good. And it is not a knee jerk reaction. Guess what expansion Solution 9 is part of? Imagine using DT's narrative choice as a defense for this lol.

I mean while Final Fantasy has always had sci-fi aspects (and i do hate sci-fi I mean i extremely hate star wars) to a point it is standable, like ff7 with the Mako/reactors and the guns etc was good because it was still over all FANTASY. The issue is I don't think people understand the difference of it existence in the game, and it absorbing the game completely. FF13 was horrible because that was all the game was sci-fi with little to no fantasy, same for 15 tbh now ff10-ff7-ff9-ff6-ff5-ff4 did so in a balance reasonable way. Its also not about having sci-fi its about doing it in a non lazy way, I'm sorry but gaint robot goes boom is a lazy way. Examples of non lazy are like Sephiorth,Kuja,zidane even vivi tbh

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Originally Posted by Ath192

But DT isn't good. And it is not a knee jerk reaction. Guess what expansion Solution 9 is part of? Imagine using DT's narrative choice as a defense for this lol.

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Open the schools

Garlemald
Allag
Mare Lamentorum
Alphatron
Whatever the planet of the Karellians is.
Solution 9/Everkeep

XIV juggles a lot of visual styles and themes and sometimes they come and go. Nbd.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

Alexander's design is much more preferable and blends in better to the fantasy world than solution 9/cosmic exploration/loporrit tech does. Not to mention they don't have cars and motorcycles just sitting around as props. Like someone here said, sure you can make an excuse to bring those designs into the world, but that doesn't mean it blends in well or that its good.

Wuk Lamat could discover a relic her dad was storing in the back of the palace that she uses to power herself up and challenge you to a duel and beat you in front of everyone despite the fact you're the WOL. And when it does your only dialogue option could be to congratulate her and tell her she's become the greatest hero the star has seen. It CAN happen, it just wouldn't be a good addition to the game.

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I disagree that it blends in better. Alexander sticks out like a sore thumb. It's ugly and bland and looks obscenely out of place in the otherwise beautiful area that you find it. It's almost like it came from a different game or something (haha). It also introduced time travel which I consider to be one of the worst plot devices ever conceived, right next to "They're not actually dead".

Now I don't actually care about any of that because I think it's silly. However it's the exact same sort of rhetoric shared in this thread. If you thought the above was silly, congratulations, because that's YOU.

Also here's another thing. Back in ARR there was a loud minority of people who'd say that the second half of Shiva's song was terrible because it was some Japanese pop song that didn't fit with the game. Flash forward to today and people are creaming themselves over blends of orchestral, rock, pop, metal, and other musical numbers not typically associated with high fantasy. Trying new things is good. Variety is nice.

Final Fantasy has always had Sci-Fi stuff, and nobody should ever really be arguing that point. However each title has had a different amount presented to the player that ultimately "makes sense" to the overall setting/story of said game.

FF14 does this as well with ARR/HW/SB all just being Garlean / Allagan tech. ShadowBringers is technically also Allag, but drastically more minimalist due to the 1st/Crystarium not really having a need to advance their technology until the Crystal Tower appeared, along with the flood of light and sin eaters as well. Then came Endwalker's huge jump with the Loporrit's tech and Sharlayan's tech, and I suppose even technically the Omnicrons too, which now results in our in-game world having a moon that is actually a spaceship, and an actual spaceship spaceship that can travel to the edge of the universe. Dawntrails' tech jump though with Solution 9 is MASSIVE compared to what even Endwalker told/showed the players, with having a device that can erase/change memories as well as pretty much make it's wearer semi-immortal by using the souls of the dead to power it as well as an entire city made of living memories.

So while Sci-fi should be expected, having Dawntrail throw players into Cyberpunk 2077 and telling us things like "here we have a way to turn dead people's souls into fuel for our pseudo-immortality system lmao" and "We have a shiny rock that holds a fuck ton of energy that can used for pretty much anything and everything you can think of lmao" along with several other advancements with their tech is pretty jarring, especially when the entire story up to that point is dealing with a nation that is constantly screaming "Culture is the most important thing to our people, and we won't change/adapt for anything."

Can't wait for every nation to go "Solution 9 tech? Nah, our nation and people don't want or need ANYTHING they're offering lmao" because S9 is just another one and done area that we move right on from once Dawntrail is over and then 8.0 will show us something even MORE technologically massive, and so on and so forth.

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Originally Posted by Daughterofdeath

good because it was still over all FANTASY. The issue is I don't think people understand the difference of it existence in the game, and it absorbing the game completely.

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Your experiences may vary greatly from other players. Some like Lord of the Rings. Others enjoy the Discworld series. Some enjoy a blend of the two.

Let's consider what makes something FANTASY.

Does it include non-human characters? Maybe. Pointy-eared non-humans are popular (elves). As are vampires, werewolves and Space Aliens. Science fiction can also incorporate non-human characters.

Can characters use magic? Yes. Maybe. Science fiction cannot differentiate between advanced technologies and magic. Or is it fantasy fiction that cannot differentiate? Both?

Does it incorporate dragons? Sometimes. So does science fiction, or, perhaps Fantasy With Science Fiction overtones. Pern, anyone?

Does it incorporate vaguely medieval societies? Not necessarily. Sometimes, although not even Middle Earth, with its lack of technologies, was medieval. And don't get me started about
Modern Urban Fantasy.

Does it incorporate advanced societies? Not necessarily - but people have been invoking "Atlantis" since Plato [see Can characters use magic?]

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Originally Posted by ZXN

Dawntrails' tech jump though with Solution 9 is MASSIVE compared to what even Endwalker told/showed the players, with having a device that can erase/change memories as well as pretty much make it's wearer semi-immortal by using the souls of the dead to power it as well as an entire city made of living memories.

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There was already devices that erased people's memories in Endwalker. In fact there's been time travel and memory wiping since ARR. I mean I get people didn't enjoy Dawntrail's story. I thought it was terrible too. But these things aren't new.

I don't even mind the mix of high fantasy and sci-fi aesthetics. Final Fantasy as a franchise has been doing this for ages, that's nothing new.

No, what bothers me most is that the tech and aesthetics of Solution 9 are just plain ugly and poorly thought out.

They set up this dystopian world where people use souls as currency and can't remember anyone who's died, and then proceed to do little to nothing of interest with that setup, and instead just muddy the waters on established lore about how souls work in the world of FFXIV. The only part of the story that has been taking the lore of Solution 9 seriously at all is the Arcadion raid series, because the MSQ sure didn't want to explore how unstable and dangerous such a system of soul exchange would be for the stability of a nation. But because Arcadion is optional side content, they won't be able to do anything of lasting meaning or impact to the world in it anyway, so while it's the only side story in Dawntrail I've been enjoying at all, I don't expect it to actually amount to much in the end.

So while I'm all for a mixing of sci-fi and fantasy, I just want it to, y'know, be well thought out and interesting. And maybe less ugly. Or maybe...ugly in a funny way, like Allag and it's historical need to put LED light strips inside of every surface, because at least that's memorable.

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Originally Posted by Kennar

Who in Eorzea is riding a motorcycle? Why is airship service still dependent on wooden craft lifted by gas bags that move at the speed of smell? Why are goods still moved with chocobo-drawn carts? Why were the fighting forces of the three Great Nations using axes, swords, and bows to take on an army equipped with machine guns, armor, and long range artillery? You can't tell me that after years of cold war and open conflict with Garlemald, every Wood Wailer, Brass Blade, and Yellowjacket wouldn't step over his own mother to get his hands on a modern repeating firearm.

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I don't know who is driving a motorcycle in Eorzea except for the WoL, but Garlond is making them. Eorzean airships are also getting sleeker over time as you can see with your own FC-craftable ones, Ishgard's one parked outside the Sea of Clouds, and the personal ones used by the WoL and sky pirates. They're steadily advancing the technology. Things are still delivered via chocobo cart just like how things aren't delivered via helicopter everywhere just because we have them in our world. Not sure why that needed explanation.

And while I'm sure everyone would want guns, not even the Garleans outfit their entire army with guns as you can see by just playing the game. The vast majority of Garlean troops are still attacking with swords. Not even the most advanced Source-native country in the world is fielding fully armies exclusively carrying automatic rifles, what makes you think Eorzea would?

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Originally Posted by Kennar

Again, the tech itself isn't the problem, it's the inconsistency of its use and implementation. The technology exits in the vacuum of the MSQ or side stories, and we're just supposed to accept it. Koana went to Sharlayan and learned about aetherytes, then went home and built a continent-spanning aetheryte network. Okay, cool; but how? He couldn't do it entirely by himself, but he also wouldn't be able to teach the countless engineers, technicians, and construction workers needed for such a project. What about his train to nowhere? Where are the steel mills that made the plate for the locomotive, and the rails? Maybe the steel was imported, but who in the known world has that kind of manufacturing capacity aside from Garlemald?

I could keep going on, but I'll stop for now. Unless 8.0 completely remakes the world, we will always have this incongruity between medieval fantasy and high-technology that doesn't mesh very well. Good sci-fi, just like a good magic system, has to have rules and logic. You can't just make stuff up willy-nilly and expect your readers/watchers/players to not question it.

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In regards to trains, Tural has had trade with Eorzea for 60 years now, they don't exist in a vacuum. Ul'dah has had steam engines (off-screen) since at least ARR and you can see the train tracks in Thanalan so Ul'dah at the very least has that capability and they're not as well known for their metalwork like Limsa Lominsa is and we know they've been speculating ceruleum in the new world since the BLU quests. The signs in Shaaloani are even written in Eorzean so it would make sense if actual engineers were brought west and influenced things there rather than just 1 prince. We know that Tural has their own script because Wuk Lamat mentioned it in regards to Krile's letter being in Eorzean being notable.

Our own world has inconsistent technological development. In Europe we had rank-and-file soldiers carrying pikes despite musketeers having guns. We had 16th century ships that were both equipped with cannons but also had archers with longbows. And this in a world that doesn't have people who can wield magic to augment their physical strength or sling fireballs at their enemies.

I still say the inconsistent level of the world's technology makes perfect sense, when even before the aliens from another shard showed up all the high tech stuff was being invented and controlled by a hostile empire and has only spread elsewhere due to defecting engineers. You are out of your mind if you think that just because Eorzea has had Garlond Ironworks for about a decade that all of Eorzea would be suddenly uplifted and should be on the same exact technical level as the empire.

And in the end, I'm not sure why it's that big of a deal anyway. It's just fun and the super high tech stuff is completely isolated in their own zones. Final Fantasy XII had the same aesthetic with people with guns and aerial dogfights while there were also people with bows and swords on the ground. It's just how Final Fantasy is and it's fun. It doesn't need to have Brandon Sanderson levels of hard magic systems and in-depth in-game analysis on technological developments to be fun. Lord of the Rings never explains how magic works but is somehow the world's most popular fantasy anything and this goes way more in depth than that does.

Because Mass Effect is awesome.

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Originally Posted by Kennar

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I have more of an issue with the aesthetics and insert of clear pop-culture reference, also with the SUDDEN drop of something that doesnt gel together with the world at all. Or the deus ex machina of "smart scientist people" that learned things offscreen and can now suddenly pull stuff out of their arses because the plot demands it. "Oh we invented this in an afternoon, no more block in your sidestory or msq".

To answer your why don't everyone just adopt rapid fire machineguns. Well... You can see in the first cinematic, the bard blocks the bullets with magic, Eorzeans think guns are clunky at best. Gunbreakers -tanked- allagan artillery and guns that according to the lorebook were made to "mow down hundreds" thats how powerful magic is in this world. Thats where they got their name, they rushed to the gunnery lines and broke their guns. And those were guns at their absolute PEAK. I think even the cannons the Ala Mhigan resistance uses are guided by magic.
Guns are super useful, you can kill someone with a sharp stick if you are good enough. But magic in this world is just vastly all around a better weapon, defensively and offensively if you know how to use it well. Aether that is, you can harden your skin, you can wear armor to block bullets, you can have a magical shield to block bullets and tank them.

But yeah, the implementation, the destruction of worldbuilding, inserting tech without thinking about the consequences towards their world and straight up.. weird corporate "insert popular thing" is just as cringy as some of the "Remember this numbered FF? We ripped off the entire plot and spam you with references."

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

I have more of an issue with the aesthetics and insert of clear pop-culture reference, also with the SUDDEN drop of something that doesnt gel together with the world at all. Or the deus ex machina of "smart scientist people" that learned things offscreen and can now suddenly pull stuff out of their arses because the plot demands it. "Oh we invented this in an afternoon, no more block in your sidestory or msq".

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You're still just complaining about things that have happened since the very beginning of the game, like the aether goggles. I mean what do you expect out of a game that has been doing the same thing for 10 years?

allagan aesthetics >>>>>>>> garlean aesthetics > solution 9 things&stuff

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Originally Posted by hydralus

You're still just complaining about things that have happened since the very beginning of the game, like the aether goggles. I mean what do you expect out of a game that has been doing the same thing for 10 years?

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I did not once mention anything about aether goggles, nor am I against them. Because they actually fit, flow and do not jump the shark.

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

I did not once mention anything about aether goggles, nor am I against them. Because they actually fit, flow and do not jump the shark.

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I brought them up because they're an example of smart people suddenly developing things off screen that solves problems. White Auracite is another example developed by that fart-in-the-wind Moenbryda. Or the stuff that Cid and Nero pull out of their asses. I'm just wondering how it took you until Dawntrail to figure it out.

Dunno why some have major issues when Emet-Selch himself said we would be surprised by the civilizations in the other reflections and Alexandria is from the 9th Reflection too.



https://i.ibb.co/HL1Dsjws/pua94kkhp1bd1.png

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

Or the deus ex machina of "smart scientist people" that learned things offscreen and can now suddenly pull stuff out of their arses because the plot demands it. "Oh we invented this in an afternoon, no more block in your sidestory or msq".

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Originally Posted by hydralus

I brought them up because they're an example of smart people suddenly developing things off screen that solves problems. White Auracite is another example developed by that fart-in-the-wind Moenbryda. Or the stuff that Cid and Nero pull out of their asses. I'm just wondering how it took you until Dawntrail to figure it out.

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You must have skipped the dialog from MSQ when it was plainly told that it took four centuries for Alexandria to reach the state it is in from the days of the Storm Surge meaning their scientist have been studying for centuries to get to where they are today and for the dimensional fusion to occur. But you don't have a problem with the three centuries it took for Garlond Ironworks and G'raha Tia to teleport the Crystal Tower to the 1st and you with the Scions way back in ShB.

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Originally Posted by Rinoa_353

But you don't have a problem with the three centuries it took for Garlond Ironworks and G'raha Tia to teleport the Crystal Tower to the 1st and you with the Scions way back in ShB.

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We would if it came out looking like the Burj Khalifa and had a couple of ferraris parked outside instead of just looking like a fantasy crystal tower. And Graha came out draped in Gucci and Balenciaga clothes.

Imagine if graha was standing outside like this waiting for you.

https://i.imgur.com/ToeiLaG.png

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Originally Posted by Ath192

We would if it came out looking like the Burj Khalifa and had a couple of ferraris parked outside instead of just looking like a fantasy crystal tower. And Graha came out draped in Gucci and Balenciaga clothes.

Imagine if graha was standing outside like this waiting for you.

https://i.imgur.com/ToeiLaG.png

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Irrelevant when the circumstances were far different for each setting, G'raha had the existential threat of the Sin Eaters in a world with it's less advanced society than Eorzea for a century after arriving in the 1st that prevented expansion and technological advancement on a large scale. Alexandria on the other hand was living peacefully for centuries after their barrier was erected and allowed Everkeep to be built without an existential threat like the 1st had. The world before the Storm Surge was also advancing that led to the technological arms race for Electrope. It's why Alexandrians are pampered as a society, it was plain with their centuries long peace before the war Zoraal Ja created disturbed that. Alexandria being peaceful over the course of over four centuries prior to arriving to the Source would develop a society that places high emphasis on fashion, entertainment (The Arcadion) and more like irl western modern societies are. The Burj Khalifa looks more like the Crystal Tower than Everkeep and Sphene also didn't come out dressed like that too, so I dunno why you even brought this up???

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Originally Posted by Rinoa_353

Irrelevant when the circumstances were far different for each setting, G'raha had the existential threat of the Sin Eaters in a world with it's less advanced society than Eorzea for a century after arriving in the 1st that prevented expansion and technological advancement on a large scale. Alexandria on the other hand was living peacefully for centuries after their barrier was erected and allowed Everkeep to be built without an existential threat like the 1st had. The world before the Storm Surge was also advancing that led to the technological arms race for Electrope. It's why Alexandrians are pampered as a society, it was plain with their centuries long peace before the war Zoraal Ja created disturbed that. Alexandria being peaceful over the course of over four centuries prior to arriving to the Source would develop a society that places high emphasis on fashion, entertainment (The Arcadion) and more like irl western modern societies are. The Burj Khalifa looks more like the Crystal Tower than Everkeep and Sphene also didn't come out dressed like that too, so I dunno why you even brought this up???

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Idk why you wrote this giant paragraph. It has nothing to do with the circumstances and everything to do with the style of presentation. Modern real world and cyberpunk 2077 styles don’t fit the game.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

Idk why you wrote this giant paragraph. It has nothing to do with the circumstances and everything to do with the style of presentation. Modern real world and cyberpunk 2077 styles don’t fit the game.

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Far to late with that including with food I mean pizza and hamburgers dont really belong either lol been way to late for that since mch and sage were added

Like others have said, Final Fantasy has had plenty of sci-fi representation in the past. Plus, once the concept of the world being split into different shards of existence was revealed, a lot of people were interested in seeing a modern or sci-fi shard.
What I think is the issue is how they implemented sci-fi/cyberpunk in DT. It just feels hollow to me, lacking the imagination of the likes of VI's dark, magitek distopia, VII's capitalist-and-consumerism fueled dieselpunk, VIII's urban fantasy with some futurism, or X's blending and stretching of fantasy and sci-fi. I think also try to mix that with IX's imagery and lore, which for the FF series was a return to the high fantasy settings after VII and VIII's more modern sci-fi settings, is just a weird blend. (ಠ_ರೃ) ~?

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Like others have said, Final Fantasy has had plenty of sci-fi representation in the past. Plus, once the concept of the world being split into different shards of existence was revealed, a lot of people were interested in seeing a modern or sci-fi shard.
What I think is the issue is how they implemented sci-fi/cyberpunk in DT. It just feels hollow to me, lacking the imagination of the likes of VI's dark, magitek distopia, VII's capitalist-and-consumerism fueled dieselpunk, VIII's urban fantasy with some futurism, or X's blending and stretching of fantasy and sci-fi. I think also try to mix that with IX's imagery and lore, which for the FF series was a return to the high fantasy settings after VII and VIII's more modern sci-fi settings, is just a weird blend. (ಠ_ರೃ) ~?

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y lol thats already 95% of the game up to endwalker the only expansion we kinda can say didn't do it was shadowbringers but every other part of this game is 80% scifi lol its gone a bit far than just having it in the game its basicly the entire game at this point

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Originally Posted by Daughterofdeath

[Wh]y lol[?] that[']s already 95% of the game up to endwalker[.] the only expansion we kinda can say didn't do it was shadowbringers but every other part of this game is 80% scifi lol[.] its gone a bit far[ther] than just having it in the game[,] it[']s [basically] the entire game at this point

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And I think the inclusion of sci-fi in XIV has been decent. (─‿─)
The Allagan Empire is the usual cautionary tale of an ancient civilization who tried push the boundaries of control over nature and the human/humanoid spirit and technology and brought itself down by its own hubris.
Garlemald being the standard evil empire, driven to conquest by an underlying fear and paranoia over their lack of being able to control aether naturally in a world full of people that can, sublimating it as them being "savages".
Hell, I even enjoy the brevity the Loporits bring and didn't see any fault in Sharlayan creating a starship with their aid (I always assumed we were going to get a version of VIII's Ragnorok).
I just think DT's use of sci-fi felt hollow. Solution 9 and Alexandria just feel like they are just copying usual cyberpunk tropes without putting FF's usual creative spin on them.
I also think throwing in heavy inspiration for XI, which as I stated was the franchise's return to high fantasy, was tonally weird.
I think X might have been a better match to take inspiration from. Hell, I even think there are a lot of parallels that could have been made between Wok Lamat and Yuna's stories and the Endless and the Unsent. °˖✧◝(⁰▿⁰)◜✧˖°

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

And I think the inclusion of sci-fi in XIV has been decent. (─‿─)
The Allagan Empire is the usual cautionary tale of an ancient civilization who tried push the boundaries of control over nature and the human/humanoid spirit and technology and brought itself down by its own hubris.
Garlemald being the standard evil empire, driven to conquest by an underlying fear and paranoia over their lack of being able to control aether naturally in a world full of people that can, sublimating it as them being "savages".
Hell, I even enjoy the brevity the Loporits bring and didn't see any fault in Sharlayan creating a starship with their aid (I always assumed we were going to get a version of VIII's Ragnorok).
I just think DT's use of sci-fi felt hollow. Solution 9 and Alexandria just feel like they are just copying usual cyberpunk tropes without putting FF's usual creative spin on them.
I also think throwing in heavy inspiration for XI, which as I stated was the franchise's return to high fantasy, was tonally weird.
I think X might have been a better match to take inspiration from. Hell, I even think there are a lot of parallels that could have been made between Wok Lamat and Yuna's stories and the Endless and the Unsent. °˖✧◝(⁰▿⁰)◜✧˖°

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I think they have over done the sci-finess of the game with all the content and game amount being scfi and the lack of med-fantasy without sci-fi showing up the most we got on that is early heavensward which disappears after 58, and shadowbringers the rest of the game is sci-fi I think the sci-fi is so over done we could go through 3 expansions with no sci-fi in them and it would still have to much sci-fi in the game

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Originally Posted by Ath192

Anything Allagan isn't what's being argued against mostly. It is well blended and it feels more like ancient magical tech than star trek. You could tell they thought about how the Allagan technology and derived magitek would fit into the world.

It's the recent introduction of pop culture scifi and minimalism that doesn't blend well into the games aesthetic. When you walked into Azys La it the theme was clearly lost ancient technology and both you as a person and your character were in awe and wonder of what was introduced, likewise it looked much more retro-futuristic.

Now a days you're literally walking into trashy cyberpunk with shien streetwear and if you listen close enough you can probably hear the NPCs hollering at you YO YO YO WASSA HOLMES, YA GOT SOME ECSTACY ON YOU? all while they breakdance and drink fourlokos. I wonder if some people literally can't tell the difference. Like maybe an Allagan orb really is the same aesthetic as a harley davidson chopper or a DJI style drone to them.

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Emet did warn us.

"Expand your horizons. Go forth and seek discovery. Some of the civilizations in the reflections will surprise you."

It reflect where we are going to be with AI and more to it, and it is in many ways a scary view, the world alone today show quite a few of those things in DT. and also of the present world situations.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Emet did warn us.

"Expand your horizons. Go forth and seek discovery. Some of the civilizations in the reflections will surprise you."

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They didn't surprise me as much as disappoint me, but he did say that, not that it changes my opinion of good game design.