So is there anything good about Dawntrail at all?

Just finished the MSQ yesterday and this is my first visit to the forum since DT launched. I stayed off the forums because I didn't want to get spoiled, but I also assumed since the vast majority of people here do not like this game, that there would be nothing but negative comments here.

And the first thing I saw when I got back on the forums were numerous complaints about the graphics update even this was probably the only aspect of the expansion (along with the music) that has received near universal acclaim everywhere else. Even on r/ffxivdiscussion which is far more critical of the game than r/ffxiv. Or hell, even on r/mmorpg, which hates this game as much as you guys do. And they were quite complimentary of the graphics update. So, yeah. it appears I was right. (As an aside, my Highlander looks amazing since the update. Didn't even use my free fantasia because it looked that good to me.)

All that being said, I found the expansion itself to be...mixed. I actually enjoyed the first bits more than I did EW's first half, but then I hit a wall and it became a slog for me to get through. It wasn't just that the pacing was slow, it's that it was like watching paint dry. I can handle slow. And I don't need action all the time. But I just found it boring and uninteresting.

Then around level 95 the story picked up dramatically, and by the time I got to the final zone, the game had done a complete 180 and started hitting extremely hard emotionally. Far more than Endwalker, in my opinion.

But I still found the writing to be lacking in some parts.

Overall, I would give the expansion a 7/10. Below Endwalker, Shadowbringers and Heavensward, but above Stormblood. It's solid but I had issues with it.

Try the expansion out for yourself. I'm currently at level 97 out of 100, so I'm finished with most of the current msq content. I'm enjoying it so far. I even had a couple of tear jerker moments. I feel like the surrogate older brother to Wuk Lamat. She improves as a person as the story progresses. The flow of battle in dungeons is as good as ever. Patiently waiting for what endgame brings when I get there. Cheers.

This thread reeks of toxic positivity. Job design is at an all time low, and this alone makes it a pain to play. I don't want a visual novel or afk game.

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Originally Posted by Teno

This thread reeks of toxic positivity. Job design is at an all time low, and this alone makes it a pain to play. I don't want a visual novel or afk game.

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Yeah it's insane.
Level 90-100 was basically just all traits. There wasn't anything worthy of level 100 ability wise, this is a massive capstone and all we got was just boring 2 minutes burst CDs. If I was on the job design team I'd be embarrassed about this.

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Yeah it's insane.
Level 90-100 was basically just all traits. There wasn't anything worthy of level 100 ability wise, this is a massive capstone and all we got was just boring 2 minutes burst CDs. If I was on the job design team I'd be embarrassed about this.

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Dancer makes me cry. Our 96 ability was just "When you Flourish, your Standard Step is now instant cast." That's it. It still has a GCD. Still does the same damage, has the same effect. It just is instant cast. Which takes away the only fun part of DNC, which is, you know, the ACTUAL DANCES.

"Revisit" is a cool trait for Gatherer's.


Uh...that might be it. :eek:

I've enjoyed the dungeons and trials so far. Also the graphical update is a massive improvement to the game.
The MSQ was mid.
Gamers complain.... A LOT....

Best set of dungeons we've ever gotten with an expansion. Normal mode trials were fun as well (havent done the Extremes yet because my mouse broke) Music is great.

I've been enjoying Dawntrail immensely and I just don't get the Wuk Lamat hate. I think the real world could use more upbeat people who look for the good in others like her. Sure beats the alternative IMO. I have very little to complain about with Dawntrail so far. I'm honestly glad I didn't get a bunch of new buttons to add to the host I already have, and I am glad that my main job Sage didn't get turned into some complicated dps-wannabe like some want healers to be.

Dungeons - bosses = Fun
Sights, zones = Fun
Music = Hit and miss, some are great, some are absolutely horrible. Minus for Soken as a whole
Characters = Good, but execution was done badly
Story = Horrible shonen anime level mediocrity, the writers have watched too much anime and are spewing it all over the screen. It made me feel like they think the audience are children.
Graphics update = I've liked them so far, the environmental changes and character changes are good.

More enterable buildings would be a nice addition, the zones are great, but all the locked buildings just rob the zones of immersion.

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Originally Posted by Isala

Dancer makes me cry. Our 96 ability was just "When you Flourish, your Standard Step is now instant cast." That's it. It still has a GCD. Still does the same damage, has the same effect. It just is instant cast. Which takes away the only fun part of DNC, which is, you know, the ACTUAL DANCES.

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Last dance was okay. everything else was just boring.

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Originally Posted by Hycinthus

Reading the forums, there seems to be nothing good about DT at all.
Maybe it's my fault reading before even completing DT. But the negativity starts to affect me, and I'm losing motivation. I just landed in Tural, and I immediately feel like logging off, because I've been hearing all bad things about Wuk Lamat.

So is there anything good to look forward to from DT?

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It's literally the same over again. Just with mediocre story. If you dont care about story like me, then it should be about same experience than last few expansions.

There's your mistake, don't read the forums :D or any website really, just play the game and form your own opinion without anybody else influencing it.
I had a blast throughout the entire game and it might actually be my favorite expansion, only on the first day did I think the start was a bit slow.
Couldn't believe when I came here and read the negativity after I finished MSQ. That said, I also checked 3 other language ffxiv places and they were 9/10 positive about Dawntrail.
While here it's like 9/10 bad :D also if you read the metacritic user reviews more than half that I've seen are just transphobic lunatics, pardon me, "anti-woke activists".
Of course there's also legitimate criticism from normal people, who actually play the game.

Anyway, since you're interested in other people's opinions, here's some of mine:

The 2 new cities are the best in the game
So are most of the new zones
New dungeons and trials are better
Graphics update is perfect (graphics don't look different, just higher definition)
Story is fun, feels like you're going on a grand adventure, so Alphinaud wasn't lying in the trailer!

But again, just ignore all the internet forum bs and enjoy the game.

If you're happy with the way things have been through all of EW, then you'll be happy with Dawntrail. It takes absolutely no chances, doesn't update anything gameplay wise, and has the same tome stone grind the game has always had.

The story is horrendously bad. I think anyone denying this is just a fanboy of the game to an extent that doesn't allow for constructive criticism. The pacing is poor, the quality of the writing is poor, the scions are essentially just there and offer almost nothing to the story, and even your character is mostly pointless and doesn't need to be there. I'm all for a fun adventure filled romp with low stakes adventuring....but that's not what we got. Anyone saying it is, hasn't finished the story.

The dungeons are a little harder than we're used to but ilvl creep will probably change that overtime.

Overall, the expansion is more of the same. That's either good if you're happy with the way things are or bad if you believe the game has gotten stale.

Encounter design is so much better, its not even close, these have been the best dungeons and trials in years, much better than anything Endwalker had. Dungeons actually have some teeth to em, bosses are always doing something, rather than standing around doing nothing until its mechanics o'clock. The bosses have some fun mechanics you'd normally see in raids/trials, so its nice that they are being a little more experimental with dungeon design, they are also harder without being punishingly so, which is nice to see for story/casual content. I enjoyed every dungeon and I have high expectations for the upcoming raids.

I also really loved the locations this time around, very lush and vibrant, I enjoy the Mesoamerican inspired culture and architecture, as well as the high technology of Solution Nine/Living Memory. The music is also fantastic, Soken doesn't miss.

Job design has come under heavy scrutiny and rightly so, but overall, they mostly just expanded on how jobs played in EW so I'm still enjoying most jobs, in particular, Gunbreaker has never felt better and I'm really digging both Viper and Pictomancer, which feel a lot more experimental in their implementation.

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Originally Posted by Teno

This thread reeks of toxic positivity. Job design is at an all time low, and this alone makes it a pain to play. I don't want a visual novel or afk game.

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I'm gonna be honest, by now surely you knew what FFXIV is? It's been like what, 5, 6 expansions now-it's always had a thousand cutscenes. So I don't know what the visual novel thing is about, but anyways. Like many others, I personally avoided the forums entirely because I did not want to be spoiled about anything. Not the story, not the mood, nothing. You'll find in life that if you don't listen to people telling you how they feel, you can actually form your own experiences and opinions!!

For ME I loved DawnTrail. I just finished it yesterday. That's not to say it was 100% perfect. Aside from me, nothing is.
Not a fan of wuk, couldnt tolerate the voice but that was no biggie, I just swapped to japanese. I dont care about anything in relation to who's behind the screens, I dont like scratchy harmonica sounding voices so I couldnt do it, I'm sorry everyone, I did try.

The story itself was boring in the first half but GOLLLLLLYYY!! It takes OFF!! I was firmly invested from the middle to the end. and once finished, I can say with ease, that was the most emotionally difficult expansion we've had yet. That actually had me so hurt and sad when I finished lol. So. Given how moving it was, and the characters we met later on, and the additional worlds...I'm sorry. but the only other expansion that competes for me personally is Shadowbringers. Those are my top two now. The story ended strong to me. I do have a lot of questions!! but I'm sure those will be answered in due time.

As for all the content..it's so much, I hardly know where to start. I'm working on my fates, crafters, gatherers, I got the new house, I'm working on getting the new housing items, then I gotta pvp, I gotta work on better gear, I gotta work on leveling other jobs, glam farming, maps-theres a lot. New zones are gorgeous. Extremely detailed, insanely massive. Jobs, I love pictomancer. 0 complaints. and I'm usually a whiner. Graphics update..bit laggy! but I cant pretend I wasnt wow'd this entire time so far looking at stuff. My character, I love him even more now.

Is it toxic positivity? No, I don't think so. Am I toxic, oh yes, every chance I get. But is me not hopping on the bandwagon around here and declaring how bad it is just because everyone else here is saying its bad toxic? I don't think so. It's like the dating pool. Online, there's nothing but incels crying about how hard it is to date. And then you go to walmart and even the weirdest people youve seen in your life have a spouse happily by their side. Places meant for complaining will have complaining. When you go out and actually experience with many others though, you'll usually find that the misery is actually few and far between. So go out and experience for yourself and form your own opinions!

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Originally Posted by Isala

Dancer makes me cry. Our 96 ability was just "When you Flourish, your Standard Step is now instant cast." That's it. It still has a GCD. Still does the same damage, has the same effect. It just is instant cast. Which takes away the only fun part of DNC, which is, you know, the ACTUAL DANCES.

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Dark Knight here, are you sure it is all that bad? I got Enhanced Unmend from previous expansions. I am happy to trade you my "2 second reduction per cast of unmend on your gap closer that does no damage".

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Originally Posted by Karkarov

Dark Knight here, are you sure it is all that bad? I got Enhanced Unmend from previous expansions. I am happy to trade you my "2 second reduction per cast of unmend on your gap closer that does no damage".

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I don't think I explained it well enough to actually tell you just how bad it is. It is literally a negative skill. It doesn't enhance the dance. It actually causes weird line-ups in our dance, because it screws with the normal timings. It's an actual detriment. Like, we would be better off NOT having this skill.

It's good, just ignore those people and play it.

It's mostly the story and job design people are taking issue with (Which are admittedly rather significant).

Everything else I'd say met or exceeded expectations.

It's more of the same, so it's got that going for it.

Story and Job Design is pretty bad.

However, Viper and Pictomancer make for an exception. Both are fun jobs to play.

Dungeon design and especially the bosses have been excellent throughout. I've enjoyed the new areas for the most part.

It's a mixed expansion for me but that doesn't mean it's all bad. There are some really good highs but some bad lows.

There're 3 things is good in DT
1. Zoraal Ja
2. Bakool Ja Ja
3. Gulool Ja Ja

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Originally Posted by Underscore

It's good, just ignore those people and play it.

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You heard it here, folks. Ignore anyone with a negative opinion, and shovel those feces right down your throat.

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Originally Posted by Isala

You heard it here, folks. Ignore anyone with a negative opinion, and shovel those feces right down your throat.

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Damn, and here I thought something was wrong with my tastebuds.
Guess it's this 'acquired taste' taste I keep hearing so much about.

There is a lot to love about Dawntrail. For one, the music is phenomenal. The zone design is exquisite - probably the best we've ever gotten. The way they flow into one-another and funnel exploration - and the aether currents aren't even a pain in the bum this time!

There are a lot of job changes that are excellent. Dragoon now gets Stardiver in their opener, just like everyone else gets to use their big buttons at the start! Huton for Ninja is now a passive, the same way Greased Lightning became one for MNK! There are a bunch of nicely thought-out changes. People complaining about tank homogenization now have differences in gap closers, and more meaningful playstyle differences.

And the first three and a half zones are amazing MSQ-wise, too. There's such excellent cultural research there, I can't begin to describe to you how much care and effort went into the authenticity of the peoples we meet. There's a lot of love shown for the material culture of Mesoamerican and South American peoples there, and it shines through the same way Thavnair was a gorgeously thought-out example of Indian culture. There's love and reverence even in the bits that are anachronistic or out of place, an earnestness to the portrayal of cultures that is incredibly endearing.

There's the second dye channels, facewear, new jobs... There's a lot to love about Dawntrail. The reason why people complain so much is, I suspect, because they can see the good and so anything negative stands out all the more.

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Originally Posted by Isala

You heard it here, folks. Ignore anyone with a negative opinion, and shovel those feces right down your throat.

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The thread starter complained about not being able to enjoy the game because the negativity on the forums affected them. So yes, they should ignore it and just play the game and form their own opinion without any outside influence.
The negative opinions are for the developers to deal with, not some random player who just wants to enjoy the game.
Also, if you think DT is "feces", I can't imagine how you got through ANY of the other expansions. The hate is just getting ridiculous now.

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Originally Posted by Isala

You heard it here, folks. Ignore anyone with a negative opinion, and shovel those feces right down your throat.

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Echo... echo.... echo....

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Originally Posted by Karkarov

Dark Knight here, are you sure it is all that bad? I got Enhanced Unmend from previous expansions. I am happy to trade you my "2 second reduction per cast of unmend on your gap closer that does no damage".

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Enhanced unmend has all the utility, metamaxxing and charm of free cure.
What a trait.

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Originally Posted by GGBBM

The thread starter complained about not being able to enjoy the game because the negativity on the forums affected them. So yes, they should ignore it and just play the game and form their own opinion without any outside influence.
The negative opinions are for the developers to deal with, not some random player who just wants to enjoy the game.
Also, if you think DT is "feces", I can't imagine how you got through ANY of the other expansions. The hate is just getting ridiculous now.

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I got through ARR, because the game, as clunky as it was, was amazing. I got through HW, because the story was absolutely glorious, and we got new Jobs that were fun (barring AST) to play. I got through SB, because while Lyse was annoying, Hien was okay, and the Raids were wonderful. I got through ShB, because the story was compelling, and getting to see a retelling of the hidden story of III (What happens when light consumes the world) was fun as a long time fan. I got through EW, because it was the finale of everything we'd ever built up.

I can't stand DT, because it takes a giant steaming dump on the legacy of all of those expansions, and forces us to take such a backseat to someone's Mary Sue OC. The story is crap. The Job Design has been crap since SHB, but doesn't have the story to make it worthwhile to play. The Voice Acting is an abomination. The music is unfitting, and makes me feel like this whole expansion is a Live Action Disney Movie.

It's not an echo chamber, or hate, to state that this is the worst expansion in XIV's history. Even more than the hate Lyse got in SB. It literally takes all the parts of the game that people loved, and craps on it. And the dev team doubles down on their stupid decisions. "We thought people would like Wuk Lamat!" "We're removing skill from the brand new job because people found positionals hard in a week."

No. I refuse to accept feces being shoved down my throat, and I'm going to be vocal about how much of dumpster fire the Wuk Lamat expansion is.

So far, I can't say have enjoyed any of Dawntrail. Pretty sure I will never buy another expansion after seeing how bad this one is.

Personally me i can't even play it because this game now is too demanding. And it's not ONLY me.
But i was enjoying it BEFORE this update.
Do for me there is LITERALLY nothing good about this update .
I want back the game i was playing before 😭

The entire expansion is good. We've just entered into the pokemon effect/

"x thing sucks when it launches"
"x thing is good after a while"
"x thing was really great now that it's over!"
"I miss x thing from years ago"

long story short is people who play video games are not good judges of video games.

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Originally Posted by Zolvolt

The entire expansion is good. We've just entered into the pokemon effect/

"x thing sucks when it launches"
"x thing is good after a while"
"x thing was really great now that it's over!"
"I miss x thing from years ago"

long story short is people who play video games are not good judges of video games.

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The fact that you're comparing XIV to Pokemon, considering the state that Scarlet and Violet launched, and remains in, is more of an agreement with us than anything else.

It is good.. give it a try and dont care too much about the forum. Decide for yourself or ask around actually in the game - you will meet many people that actually like DT. I enjoyed it :D

The Forum Criers are getting paid by EA or something to downtalk everything in the game and litterally everything, even if it is something that people like very much and it is EVERYTHING they don't like :D

So ya dont worry about the forums, you may see one good thread now and then.

People should read Charles Dickens Book: Great Expectations

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Originally Posted by Isala

The fact that you're comparing XIV to Pokemon, considering the state that Scarlet and Violet launched, and remains in, is more of an agreement with us than anything else.

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I literally never had a problem with s/v at launch. Most of the issues people complained about were minor like players being able to run around through your battles in multiplayer. Or a little lag when loading too many overworld spites. (but you know what? they fixed those issues relatively quick) But that is besides the point that I was making. The story was still good in those games. The gameplay was still excellent and a huge improvement from past titles.

The same applies here more or less. You'll see all these people praising dawntrail by the end of it. Players are fickle and listening to them too much is a recipe for disaster. Just look at world of warcraft for an example of that.

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Originally Posted by Themarvin

The Forum Criers are getting paid by EA or something to downtalk everything in the game and litterally everything, even if it is something that people like very much and it is EVERYTHING they don't like :D

So ya dont worry about the forums, you may see one good thread now and then.

People should read Charles Dickens Book: Great Expectations

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Wasn't the gist of that pip was more a gentleman before being trained to be one than after? So when converted into ff14 terms, the most damage done to the story was by people claiming it the best thing since sliced bread in ~shadowbringers?

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Originally Posted by Zolvolt

I literally never had a problem with s/v at launch. Most of the issues people complained about were minor like players being able to run around through your battles in multiplayer. Or a little lag when loading too many overworld spites. (but you know what? they fixed those issues relatively quick) But that is besides the point that I was making. The story was still good in those games. The gameplay was still excellent and a huge improvement from past titles.

The same applies here more or less. You'll see all these people praising dawntrail by the end of it. Players are fickle and listening to them too much is a recipe for disaster. Just look at world of warcraft for an example of that.

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You literally had entire cutscenes running at single digit FPS! What the hell do you mean minor issues?!

Stuff I like about Dawntrail, as of lvl 97 MSQ:

• The instanced content has been fantastic. Easily some of my favorite dungeons in the game.
• The solo duties are top tier and the first one in particular is just awesome.
• The new zones are all beautiful and SE is going out of their way to flex the graphical updates.
• All the new glams I've seen are very striking and unique.
• The supporting cast is really endearing, especially Koana, Erenville, and Bakool Ja Ja.
• Koana in particular has some of the best voice acting in FFXIV. Seriously.
• The idea for the WoL to take a backseat role as a mentor of sorts was good - maybe not particularly well executed, but I do like their relationship with Wuk Lamat.
• Editing to add: the music!!! Holy shit, the music is so good. It's unreal how hard Soken cooked with this one.

Stuff I don't like:

• The story is mid and VERY dry, especially in the first two zones.
• There's a lack of real gameplay outside of instanced duties, which becomes very noticeable and grating when combined with the above issue. Fetch quests and "talk to 3 villagers" shouldn't be the best SE can do with lvl 90+ content.

I think there are definitely a lot of fair criticisms to be made especially in regards to the story, but to me it also seems like a lot of people set their expectations way too high for certain things after explicitly being told that Endwalker was a grand finale. I'm really enjoying Dawntrail for what it is, personally.

There's a lot of negativity, but keep in mind that people who are having fun are probably just playing the game instead of chatting on the forums. Hell, I'm only here because I'm bored at work. Try not to let it get to you before you've even given things a chance ^^