Can we go back to banning people for ERP crap?

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Im kinda tired of mmos becomming an outlet for sexual degeneracy

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Then I guess MMOs should have less & more Limited Glamours.
These ERP things happen because people are given the ability to make their Avatars Sexy and "appealing" to others and themselves. Take that ability away...boom problem solved, no more Degeneracy!

But honestly....if its Private and secluded to one area, I think it wouldnt be a Problem.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

But honestly....if its Private and secluded to one area, I think it wouldnt be a Problem.

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Unfortunately that wouldn't be good enough for these people...

And one has to be deluded to think that mmo's "become" an outlet for erotic chatting. They are chat-rooms with settings, both visual and some times auditory, it's inevitable that people will use them for more than just playing the game itself.

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Originally Posted by Juri_Licious

Degeneracy

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Why even post this?

This thread looks like a witch hunt. Beware!

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Originally Posted by Zer0

Seriously I go to any main city and it's nothing but spam from people advertising their stupid erp cafe. Can we go back to banning them please? I'm tired of nonstop erp cafe spam.

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it's always puzzled me how folks can even catch a ride with erp. I mean, humans only have 2 hands, and all the technical relaying sort of kills the mood in the first place. IMO, it's some very immature and deprived folks straining for some fun; I do believe everyone deserves the opportunity to try for a bit of hanky-panky, but, seriously, if it's going to be a thing; then, give them an erp chat channel and ban them hard for spamming anywhere else.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Im kinda tired of mmos becomming an outlet for sexual degeneracy

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It's called expressing themselves. :^)

Waiting for the day when people learn how to differentiate a ban from a suspension.

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Originally Posted by SweetestLily

Waiting for the day when people learn how to differentiate a ban from a suspension.

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enlighten us

Although you may not yet realize it, what you're actually complaining about is Roleplaying in general as a whole as well as mass gathering events.
The majority of these clubs, nothing crazy is happening. You go in and 40 people are beeskneeing and talking/joking with their friends. There are also the sfw versions which are more or less the exact same thing, except those tend to be more like..you sit down and have a little meal and enjoy the lovely effort that they put into decorating the house for this. I have gone to many many many venues as well as had friends who worked in them. In the 2 years I've spent in xiv, I have never once seen any perverted text appear in these venues. Not once. -I've seen someone slip a misstell and say it in LIMSA but not a venue lol. I'm on Aether though so that could be why, I've never been to Crystal ones. Although I heard a lot of fuss about how TERRRRRRRRRIBLE quicksands in Balmung was only to see like 200 people standing there talking about random other things. Maybe its worse at certain times? I dont know, but that was a big nothing-bomb too tbh.

When it comes tooo nsfw venues. Does ERP happen? Yes, but it happens in tells. If you cant see it then why are you crying? Are you really being upset by your own hallucinations? If its legitimate foul text that you're seeing out in the open, thats entirely reportable. Just report it? The whole 'their advertising is annoying' thing though...I think you should at least be fair and admit that you don't like any of these social gatherings period. Because that's what it it really is. Its huge gatherings with a dj streaming and you dont like to see them spreading the word about it. Which if you want to play a solo game thats fine, but this is an MMO which means that yes, there will be large social events run by players. I dont know why people join MMOs and then have meltdowns that there are other people doing other things in it. Like, a-doy...

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Originally Posted by Bukachu

enlighten us

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One is permanent and one is not. So people saying they got banned when in fact they just got a 3 day suspension is false.

Wouldn't it be easier to ignore them?

If people were chasing after you all day everywhere you go flashing their cat boobs at you I'd understand; but it's just a advertisement.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Im kinda tired of mmos becomming an outlet for sexual degeneracy

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"Becoming."

I remember being hit on constantly when Perfect World was a thing a decade or more ago and Second Life pretty much shot ERP/being sexual online to a place of no return.
There's no "becoming", MMOs/social hangout type games have been pervy for a long time now.

Kinda just have to accept it and if it bothers you, avoid it. There's no stopping it though.

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Originally Posted by Batbrat

Although you may not yet realize it, what you're actually complaining about is Roleplaying in general as a whole as well as mass gathering events.
The majority of these clubs, nothing crazy is happening. You go in and 40 people are beeskneeing and talking/joking with their friends. There are also the sfw versions which are more or less the exact same thing, except those tend to be more like..you sit down and have a little meal and enjoy the lovely effort that they put into decorating the house for this. I have gone to many many many venues as well as had friends who worked in them. In the 2 years I've spent in xiv, I have never once seen any perverted text appear in these venues. Not once. -I've seen someone slip a misstell and say it in LIMSA but not a venue lol. I'm on Aether though so that could be why, I've never been to Crystal ones. Although I heard a lot of fuss about how TERRRRRRRRRIBLE quicksands in Balmung was only to see like 200 people standing there talking about random other things. Maybe its worse at certain times? I dont know, but that was a big nothing-bomb too tbh.

When it comes tooo nsfw venues. Does ERP happen? Yes, but it happens in tells. If you cant see it then why are you crying? Are you really being upset by your own hallucinations? If its legitimate foul text that you're seeing out in the open, thats entirely reportable. Just report it? The whole 'their advertising is annoying' thing though...I think you should at least be fair and admit that you don't like any of these social gatherings period. Because that's what it it really is. Its huge gatherings with a dj streaming and you dont like to see them spreading the word about it. Which if you want to play a solo game thats fine, but this is an MMO which means that yes, there will be large social events run by players. I dont know why people join MMOs and then have meltdowns that there are other people doing other things in it. Like, a-doy...

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Balmung Quicksand was a place where you knew ERP happened, but mostly it was tavern rp. It's always been busy, any time of day, for easy walkup bar rp. It's gotten worse and most erp now comes from Wanderers lol. Because of the "haha erp" reputation we had for... being normal roleplayers... people took that personally and decided that if they wanted easy erp to just hop to Balmung. Most venue ads I see aren't even on Balmung, they're all on other servers with Diabolos and Marlboro being the big ones. Not to say that Balmung or others don't have them, they do, same with erp...

...but erp is on all servers. Thirsty people gonna thirst and they'll get that erp water somehow, no matter what server they're actually on.

I always just assumed 18+ PF's implied it was an erp venue without stating it outright. The hosts have plausible deniability in case they get reported.
I wouldn't be surprised if there were people going to these venues thinking "18+ doesn't necessarily mean there's any erp" only to find out that it's totally a trap.

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Originally Posted by Senn

I always just assumed 18+ PF's implied it was an erp venue without stating it outright. The hosts have plausible deniability in case they get reported.
I wouldn't be surprised if there were people going to these venues thinking "18+ doesn't necessarily mean there's any erp" only to find out that it's totally a trap.

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Some venues don't offer ERP but still list as 18+ because they simply don't want to hang out with those who aren't adults. I used to co-own a lounge that had a strict No ERP rule but we still listed as 18+ because no one working there wanted to really hang out with anyone still in high school. It's usually pretty obvious if a place is trying to cover for brothel workers compared to just wanting people their own age around.

interesting topic went no where really fast waiting for it to reach melt down status.

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Originally Posted by Zer0

Seriously I go to any main city and it's nothing but spam from people advertising their stupid erp cafe. Can we go back to banning them please? I'm tired of nonstop erp cafe spam.

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I'm not a fan of ERP but there are people who stay with the game strictly to do just that.

Just cause you don't like it doesn't justify a ban. Sorry you'll either learn to deal or just suffer in silence.

I sincerely doubt every RP cafe is a hidden ERP club. The PF ads for that stand out easily, they're all marked 18+ and/or named in a way that implies their nature if not outright confirms it. I dunno what to tell you OP, just read on and go to SFW places. They have nothing to do with you, people shouldn't be banned for minding their own business.

I don't like pornography blasted on social media but y'know, I just ignore it/don't follow and life goes on. I'm never forced to see it. Same in FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Senn

I always just assumed 18+ PF's implied it was an erp venue without stating it outright. The hosts have plausible deniability in case they get reported.
I wouldn't be surprised if there were people going to these venues thinking "18+ doesn't necessarily mean there's any erp" only to find out that it's totally a trap.

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Some just don't want underage people around, regardless if it's SFW or not. If something devolves into not T-rated friendly, be it language or whatever (not that teenagers don't sling around f-bombs or anything, but) they just don't want to deal with it. Again, a lot of roleplayers, both non-erp and erp, don't like the fact that someone can lie about their age and don't want to deal with that if it's the case, and it makes it easier to kind of... vet who they may be playing against.

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Originally Posted by Tetsujin

I sincerely doubt every RP cafe is a hidden ERP club. The PF ads for that stand out easily, they're all marked 18+ and/or named in a way that implies their nature if not outright confirms it. I dunno what to tell you OP, just read on and go to SFW places. They have nothing to do with you, people shouldn't be banned for minding their own business.

I don't like pornography blasted on social media but y'know, I just ignore it/don't follow and life goes on. I'm never forced to see it. Same in FFXIV.

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They definitely aren't. Most PFs will say exactly what they are or hint that there may be "extra services" or whatever, the rest truly are everyone's AU coffee shop dreams of sitting in a cafe/restaurant/tavern and getting a smaller venue of walk up rp instead of just the Quicksands or something. I helped a friend in one, and it was just talking with the people coming in, other people talking with the others, etc. A couple people went to the upstairs and took it to party/tells... but my friend basically did the equivalent of a broomstick on the ceiling and chased them out if they were going to be doing THAT in the cafe lmao. It's not welcome everywhere, most try to keep it at least PG-13, but some are more obvious than others.

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Originally Posted by SweetestLily

One is permanent and one is not. So people saying they got banned when in fact they just got a 3 day suspension is false.

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they're called "temp-banned" and "perma-banned"...so it's not false.

I don't think 18+ is exactly an indicator of ERP either. I've seen some that just want to weed out minors so they're not hanging out with a bunch of adults.

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Originally Posted by rainichan

a lot of roleplayers, both non-erp and erp, don't like the fact that someone can lie about their age and don't want to deal with that if it's the case, and it makes it easier to kind of... vet who they may be playing against.

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I don't care what people do in private. But I am genuinely curious about this logic.

* Kids can and do lie about their age
* Lots of roleplayers don't want to play with kids in those settings
* Putting 18+ on the door vets them to makes sure they are not kids?

Puts on his wizard hat and robe...

I think it serves as more of a liability thing for people if children lie about their age and in the weird event it leads to court or something since they can't really hold you accountable if you had absolutely no knowledge. That's the only reason I could guess.

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Originally Posted by JennytheJester

I think it serves as more of a liability thing for people if children lie about their age and in the weird event it leads to court or something since they can't really hold you accountable if you had absolutely no knowledge. That's the only reason I could guess.

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They'll still side with the minor in a court case, even if said minor lied because its still an adult having inappropriate relations wjth a minor at the end of the day. The responsibility falls on the adult to be sure they're actually engaging with another adult. It's sort of like:

Judge to minor: You're a kid, you didn't know better.
Judge to adult: You're an adult, you should know better.

It's not illegal for a minor to lie about their age but it absolutely is illegal for an adult to have any sort of sexual conversations with a minor in any context.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

They'll still side with the minor in a court case, even if said minor lied because its still an adult having inappropriate relations wjth a minor at the end of the day. The responsibility falls on the adult to be sure they're actually engaging with another adult. It's sort of like:

Judge to minor: You're a kid, you didn't know better.
Judge to adult: You're an adult, you should know better.

It's not illegal for a minor to lie about their age but it absolutely is illegal for an adult to have any sort of sexual conversations with a minor in any context.

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Ah yes, because all adults are psychic and can tell another player is lying about their age.

Reminds me of a recent event with a YTer who was accused of sexual acts with a minor. Said YTer had proof the minor lied multiple times about their age (got those receipts) and intentionally accused the YTer of sexual acts. That minor was called out and worse for lying.

No, if a person lies about their age, there is intent behind it. Period. They know exactly what they are doing.

I love the direction this thread has taken; straight to the supreme court and then hell.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

They'll still side with the minor in a court case, even if said minor lied because its still an adult having inappropriate relations wjth a minor at the end of the day. The responsibility falls on the adult to be sure they're actually engaging with another adult.

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Yes. Absolutely.

Genuinely not knowing the other is under the AOC is a valid defense in some countries. But even in those, as you rightly say, with the uncensored chatlogs in evidence, one will be needing to prove in the positive "a reasonable adult" couldn't have known to the judge and jury.

To no-one in particular;

If the roleplay is not erotic, as the poster claimed, then AOC is not even entering the equation. If it's just a matter of the older not wanting to roleplay the "state of Ishgard's corrupt elite as we partake an ale by the fire" with a young person, then that 18+ sign is absolutely meaningless and utterly useless to have. It won't stop them, if anything it will draw them in.

Just accept it and once you see them fail to use words and phrases of collegiate level, roleplay a simple "Hark, is that mine faithful steed calling for his meal, I must away, so farewell to ye kind miss, and may ye have safe paths ((thanks and bye))" and turn your camera to look for a new person to roleplay with.

but

If the roleplay is erotic, well, that's caveat fabulator for making one's own judgement of the age of the other in terms of AOC laws. While the chatlogs read out in court will prove to the jury there was/wasn't knowledge, I don't think the 18+ sign provides a skerrick of protection nor any plausible deniability. Not in the slightest.

What it will come down to in this case is that should the adult aged erotic roleplayer get even the smallest hint or faintest suspicion during the roleplay, then it's legally on them to stop immediately.

Again, I really don't care what people do in private. I just think this "no, 18+ isn't a codeword for ERP" argument is a bit weak.

"nudge nudge, wink wink, say no more"

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Originally Posted by AngelCheese77

Ah yes, because all adults are psychic and can tell another player is lying about their age.

Reminds me of a recent event with a YTer who was accused of sexual acts with a minor. Said YTer had proof the minor lied multiple times about their age (got those receipts) and intentionally accused the YTer of sexual acts. That minor was called out and worse for lying.

No, if a person lies about their age, there is intent behind it. Period. They know exactly what they are doing.

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It doesn't matter. Courts won't side with the adult in this situation because the adult should have taken further steps to prove the person's age (asking for an ID for example). My state for example doesn't allow for the excuse of "Well I thought they were older." to be used in any cases involving minors lying online. If the person is under the age of 14, there is no defense for the adult, period. It will depend state by state but generally the adult will end out worse than the child will because it's not illegal to lie about your age and good luck proving intent that the minor lied for malicious reasons and not just because they wanted to sneak on a website and not get caught.

I also don't understand how calling out a minor via YouTube and the actual court system are the same but okay.

If you can't deal with other don't play MMO.
If you can't deal with RP don't play RPG.

There are as many ways to play a role-playing game as there are players, been the only truth since D&D came out.

I mean......

I found a bestiality/incest Fellowship and "Stepbro" RP AND downright pedophilian RP in Fellowships just yesterday.

Openly advertised and everything. Why exactly isn't this getting taken care of?

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

I mean......

I found a bestiality/incest Fellowship and "Stepbro" RP AND downright pedophilian RP in Fellowships just yesterday.

Openly advertised and everything. Why exactly isn't this getting taken care of?

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Did you report it?
Further advertising it here in the forums might have the opposite effect

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Originally Posted by Etupa

If you can't deal with other don't play MMO.
If you can't deal with RP don't play RPG.

There are as many ways to play a role-playing game as there are players, been the only truth since D&D came out.

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think it lowkey threw over your head ngl

Ban it so we can actually get some variety in venues again instead of generic /beesknees in 2B leggings nightclub number #2873

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Originally Posted by Shibi

I don't care what people do in private. But I am genuinely curious about this logic.

* Kids can and do lie about their age
* Lots of roleplayers don't want to play with kids in those settings
* Putting 18+ on the door vets them to makes sure they are not kids?

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tbh a lot of teenagers are pretty obvious when they roleplay as opposed to adults. Not saying they're bad, everyone starts somewhere, but they do make it easy to figure out (for the most part) in how they write. Like yeah, they can lie about their age and all, but if they get found out, the roleplayers, regardless if it's been sfw/nsfw, will flat out refuse to continue their talking/roleplaying with that person. It's all about trust no matter what kind it is. Some don't mind doing general/sfw stuff, but in some venues where there's going to be anything that would be language or more no one wants someone underage there. They can only do so much, but they do try to watch people as best they can and try to make people comfortable.

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Originally Posted by rainichan

tbh a lot of teenagers are pretty obvious when they roleplay as opposed to adults.

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Yes I agree. I started roleplaying in 2006 in the Dune Universe and have done paragraph-style roleplay over many themes pretty much every day since then. Kids and teens are obvious. The longer you listen to them the more obvious they become.

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Originally Posted by rainichan

Some don't mind doing general/sfw stuff, but in some venues where there's going to be anything that would be language or more no one wants someone underage there. They can only do so much, but they do try to watch people as best they can and try to make people comfortable.

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That just reinforces my decade-held beliefs that 18+ signs are nothing more than TOS compliant codewords.

Let's drop the pretense and call a spade a spade. 18+ on the door does nothing at all to vet younger players or stop them lying, and it offers no protection at all legally. It's merely a hint to other adults that the bar-tender has (or tolerates) "something 'a little extra' hidden under the bar" for people in the know.

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Originally Posted by Shibi

Yes I agree. I started roleplaying in 2006 in the Dune Universe and have done paragraph-style roleplay over many themes pretty much every day since then. Kids and teens are obvious. The longer you listen to them the more obvious they become.



That just reinforces my decade-held beliefs that 18+ signs are nothing more than TOS compliant codewords.

Let's drop the pretense and call a spade a spade. 18+ on the door does nothing at all to vet younger players or stop them lying, and it offers no protection at all legally. It's merely a hint to other adults that the bar-tender has (or tolerates) "something 'a little extra' hidden under the bar" for people in the know.

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18+ in this case does as much, as 18+ does in case of a lot of other things on internet. like adults website, or video games that are rated 18+, yet I never had issues accessing them when I was below 18, and same applies to a lot of other people too.

at the end of the day, as an adult, you ask someone how old they are, and if they lie about it, and you have proof they lied about it, responsibility doesn't lay on you.

where I live, you're legally not responsible for it, as long as you can prove you were lied to and manipulated into believing someone was 18+.

its really not that deep.

with that in mind, I do think public ERP, or even public RP, or most things public, may or may not be enjoyable for other people, therefor being reasonable about it goes a long way.