Please read about Physical Levels and Removing them.

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Originally Posted by LuciBlack

I like the P.Lvl system...

What if we had a seperate P.Lvl for each class?

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yes saved presets would be the best all around solution, but FIRST they need to fix how stat works .

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Originally Posted by LuciBlack

I like the P.Lvl system...

What if we had a seperate P.Lvl for each class?

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omfg man, i see what your saying but people are having a rough enough time losing brain cells trying to grasp the system already in place lol. i think there could be more done with it, but really looking at the whole picture it really isnt all the necessary which is likely why they want to scrap it. no matter what they do with it the same people are still gonna cry and scream that the hard core guys are too OP cause we spend too much time working towards it. course in the light of things you can break an MMO crowd into 3 basic groups:
1) minority group A: the hard core - end game / raid crew (main goal - to be among the first to achieve the unachievable)
2) minority group B: the casual - weekend warriors (spends more time whining in the forums about min group A then playing)
3) the majority group: these guys are the broad spectrum between hard core and casual. most just play to enjoy their game time, with no real desire to complain in the forums nor to be the best of the best.

the real problem is now the forums are going to be riddled with a huge mix of everyone due to the recent tragedies that inflicted Japan. i feel bad for all the peoples effected by those tragedies, i feel even worse for the poor soul that will be getting tasked to go through all these posts ;/

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Originally Posted by LuciBlack

I like the P.Lvl system...

What if we had a seperate P.Lvl for each class?

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It would honestly be better to just let classes have their own stat distributions at that point in time.

Always the most ignorant players who have the loudest mouth/can't shut up.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

I think they should remove Physical Levels, Remove Point Assignments, Give stat bonuses for equipping skills and bonus traits for equipping certain patterns of skills and make skills equipped on core classes give more bonuses then skills equipped cross class.

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i support this. kind of like a blue mage for attributes in FFXI with the addition of supporting your current class.

I don't really think this system needs changing at all.

The limit on how much you can redistribute adds to the challenge and planning for the week.

*shrug*

If anything I think there need to be something added to phs lvl's once you hit 50. Merit points? other abilities?

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Originally Posted by God

I don't really think this system needs changing at all.

The limit on how much you can redistribute adds to the challenge and planning for the week.

*shrug*

If anything I think there need to be something added to phs lvl's once you hit 50. Merit points? other abilities?

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"Merit points" probably when we hit the actual cap they have planned (it's definitely not 50) I would expect more abilities and the like since they want to add class diversification.

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Originally Posted by God

I don't really think this system needs changing at all.

The limit on how much you can redistribute adds to the challenge and planning for the week.

*shrug*

If anything I think there need to be something added to phs lvl's once you hit 50. Merit points? other abilities?

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planning for the week would be fine if you could play on one class for a week, but in truth you can fatigue a class in a few hours so that plan goes out the window the first day. if they only want you to play a class at a time they should remove fatigue and allow all points to be reassigned once a week. if they want you to do multiple classes a day then they should allow each class to have its own points so you could change easily. either way i am fine with, but they have it in the middle which makes both option hard to do.

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Originally Posted by God

I don't really think this system needs changing at all.

The limit on how much you can redistribute adds to the challenge and planning for the week.

*shrug*

If anything I think there need to be something added to phs lvl's once you hit 50. Merit points? other abilities?

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Merit points actually would be a pretty good idea once they establish the system. It would give people something to do inbetween the updates for rank cap raising and thus provide the game with more "content." As for changing the system it should be done where each class gets their own points to assign. The thing about this "challenge" of deciding how you will distribute points isn't really a challenge but more of a force pushing people to specialize in 1 class type rather than various ones. Say an Archer is 50 in only this class and there is also a player who has Archer to 50 and Thaumaturge to 50. With the current system the person who only has Archer will obvious focus on Archer attributed like STR,DEX,etc. while the the person with the Archer and Thaumaturge to 50 may have their attributes distributed evenly across all of them. So the person with the 2 classes to 50 will do potentially less dps than the person with just the Archer. Same in comparison to a person with just Thaumaturge to 50. The rate at which you can reallocate points is too slow. The only REAL solution to keeping physical level would be if there was a full point reallocation after the 3 hour period, but even then you have to spam the enter key to keep bringing your stats back up. The whole concept of this game from the start was to have people try out other classes and not just specialize. Physical level makes this not work.

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Originally Posted by Isaaru

Merit points actually would be a pretty good idea once they establish the system. It would give people something to do inbetween the updates for rank cap raising and thus provide the game with more "content." As for changing the system it should be done where each class gets their own points to assign. The thing about this "challenge" of deciding how you will distribute points isn't really a challenge but more of a force pushing people to specialize in 1 class type rather than various ones. Say an Archer is 50 in only this class and there is also a player who has Archer to 50 and Thaumaturge to 50. With the current system the person who only has Archer will obvious focus on Archer attributed like STR,DEX,etc. while the the person with the Archer and Thaumaturge to 50 may have their attributes distributed evenly across all of them. So the person with the 2 classes to 50 will do potentially less dps than the person with just the Archer. Same in comparison to a person with just Thaumaturge to 50. The rate at which you can reallocate points is too slow. The only REAL solution to keeping physical level would be if there was a full point reallocation after the 3 hour period, but even then you have to spam the enter key to keep bringing your stats back up. The whole concept of this game from the start was to have people try out other classes and not just specialize. Physical level makes this not work.

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it's not the physical level making it not work. it is the having to reallot points each time you change classes. they want you to change classes, which is why they have fatigue in place, but they do not have individual points per class. i think physical is nice in being able to have some bearing on another class, but dropping to a lvl 1 with as many points as that class has at lvl 50 is overboard.

i still say the easiest way to do things is to just only give smaller amounts of points as in 1 per phy level and 1 per class level they each class has its own points. it would give some bearing of a class when they first start off on physical level, but not completely give you max stats. it would also allow the accessories to become helpful with the +5 and +7 stuff since you would only have 100 pts to deal with at most instead of hundreds.

example:
phy 50 pug 50 = 100 pts
phy 50 thm 1 = 51 pts
phy 50 bsm 31 = 81

that would force you to have your own individual class point allotments for each class while giving some credit for the leveling you have done so far in the game, but not give points like you had all classes to 50.

i think they should make changes to the point system too!
lala's can have as much hp as roe's
and vice versa with mp =( makes the races pointless as well as stat bonus items =/

EDIT: i thought i should add, im no game maker and im sure the dev's are doin there best to fix various bugs and what not in game =)

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Originally Posted by Cornyboob

There has been discussion amoungst some peers who play FFXIV with me about the potential loss of Physical levels. Some even think it should warrent a new poll regarding this issue alone taking into account the simple fix method this article proposes.

The Devs have outlined that physical levels points alotment as it stands will be changed to a integrated preset on a class by class basis. Potentially making it not possible to be as diverse as it currently can be as it works now pre patch.

We would like to keep the flexability.

Propose these changes then offer the choice of which method should be used and a different answer may be seen.

It is felt that simple changes to the current system might be best and a serious look at the question of weather it should be changed at all. Please take a look at this simple list of changes that might negate the need to substantually change the fundamentals of the game engine.

List of proposed changes:

• When you reasign points it should reassign all points instead of a anoyingly small amount.
• add some ui elements to alot points faster then currently possibly maybe a dropdown or number ticker like the ones used in the sell ui elements for bazaar pricing. including a option to used preset class recomended spec choices
• save assigned points and reload automatically on class change when you apply new weapons. for example you might need to alot points to DEX as a weaver but maybe you are a conjurer or thaumaturge and dont have DEX with current system it would take days to reallot to be optimal to make 1 item.
• save the actions assignments to make changing classes not need such a involved manual overhaul after every simple job/class change.

This simple list of changes to the current system would let us be as flexable as we need to be on the go.

What do you think?

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Quote from Letter from the Producer, V
"The bonus point allotment system was intended to be a means by which players could customize their character's individuality. The free distribution of attribute points has given rise to certain problems, however, such as compatibility issues with the Armoury system, and the lowered effectiveness of the attributes themselves. In particular, this lowered effectiveness of attributes also extends its influence to items, and is therefore something that we feel must be rectified. To do so, we are currently looking into the following two options:

1. Removal of the bonus point system, and the addition of automatic allotment of attribute points based on class.
2. Removal of physical levels, and the addition of class-specific allotment of attribute points for each class based on rank."

Now with option 1 the stat/gear system would be setup up exactly like FFXI. This means that the amount of points allowed to use is different for each class based based on the rank of the class and most likely equivalent to that if compared to physical levels. Now with this setup attribute stats will be allowed to increase to their highest potential since SE has direct control of class stats. With this setup you customize your character with gear rather than with allocated points. This will also add to class uniqueness since no class will have the exact same stats and thus will make actions more effective on certain classes.

Now with option 2 this thread's OP (which I also quoted) gives a prime example of how things will turn out. This option also increases the potential of attribute stats but not as high as option 1. This will put much more emphasis on customization through allocated stats while allowing maybe up to 10-20% of customization for gear (attributes only).

Personally this is a very hard decision for me to choose which is ultimately best because they are both very good solutions and I would be happy either way.

As from a min-maxer perspective you could spend just as long deciding on allocated stats as gear choices so I don't think that is a valid argument.

As for the proposal of this OP it wouldn't matter if all or a small amount of points are given back when you reassign because you can do this for each class and not have every class affected from 1 set of allocated points (same for bullet #3). Some type of UI element to speed up the process is a very good idea. A number ticker as well as + and - symbol for adding/removing stat points would be great. Also, IMO it would be better if SE made it so that when clicking on the + or - symbol that it adds/subtracts the required amount of points to increase/decrease the next attribute point rather than having to add multiple points so you don't lose track, especially if you don't have quite enough points to increase any stat and forget you have points spent the next time you level (rank up when this changes).

Now after knowing the exact details of both options please choose carefully which option you prefer and also know that 56.0% voted for option 2, 28.4% voted for option 1, and 15.6% voted to keep the current system (for those who voted on the official FFXIV Poll 2). So expect to see option 2 implemented into FFXIV unless you voice your opinion here.

As for class/job actions not staying the same and being similar to the way to the way attribute points will be in effect in option 2 has nothing to do with option 1 nor 2, nor even physical levels. However, this would be very convenient and I support this idea fully since I don't use 80% of the actions from Class A on Class B.

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Originally Posted by Reika

Hate to tell you, but all the advance classes except Ranger, Ninja, and Samurai were Hybrids. PLD is a WAR/WHM, DRK is a WAR/BLM, RDM is a WAR/WHM/BLM, so on and so forth. They may have all had their own special abilities no single class had, like PLD had Flash, RDM had Elemental sword attacks, Etc. That does not mean they were not hybrids. They just took knowledge from both worlds and combined them to form new special skills.

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WHM has flash :P