Request: Please give us alternate ways to obtain PVP armour and weapons

Whoever in this thread suggested getting top 100 to get a voucher to either buy the current reward or past rewards is quite reasonable in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Kaiche

If not laziness and entitlement what is it?

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Having to deal with garbage. I don't mind competing. However, I won't go through an army of people with anger issues for a mount.

Hi Aviars,

Like I said, we can go around and around all day talking about how exclusive means one thing when talking about one reward, but something totally different when referring to other rewards. That's not something I made up or lied about -- it's a decision made by SE because it's their product and their right. You like to totally gloss over that part yourself, so don't sit there and pound your chest like you're some shining beacon of honesty and purity.

They could've easily said "Top 100 Ranked Players get Exclusive Rewards that can't be obtained in any other way" - yet they didn't. This covers them in case they want to leave the door open in the future to make those things (or something similar) obtainable in other ways in the future. Will they? Who knows. I'm only saying we have precedents to show that they have gone back on their "promises of exclusivity" before. Do I think they should do it again just because they did it in the past? What I think or what you think about whatever isn't relevant, because at the end of the day it all boils down to decisions that are in the best interest of the players, which in turn help to generate more subscriptions.

To be perfectly honest, the way they've handled exclusivity in the past, I think gives players mixed signals. If I order the digital collector's edition of Stormblood, I get "exclusive" things that show that I am a loyal player that supports the development of the game. But even now, I can go into my account, pay $10 and get the collector's edition of ARR even though ARR has been out for years now.

Even if they instituted a practice that handled exclusive items with the choice of "all or nothing", either we'd have everything we want otherwise obtainable in game or on the mog station (increasing revenues and subscriptions), or we'd have nothing (Mog station would be a wasteland). So they pick and choose what remains exclusive, and what does not. It's their prerogative -- we're only making conjectures based on what information we have.

And while we're on that topic, why are PVP rewards some sort of reserved and sanctimonious symbol of skill when other endeavors, that one might argue would require just as much skill or effort, are not? Ultimate Coil aside (because apparently it will always be synced), do you put in any more or less effort than the top 100 people to clear Kefka or any other current raid? If they limited those to the top 100 people in a datacenter to clear it, most people wouldn't even bother -- just like most people don't even bother to PVP because they imagine the rewards are out of reach right from the start.

And I don't know about you, but I feel like PVP needs a fresh influx of hungry players, and dangling a reward that so few can obtain is not the way to encourage that. This is why from the start, I have made the suggestions that I've made. I think we can both agree that neither of us wants to see PVP die out, but it's hanging on by a thread as it is.

Yes, originally I suggested making the original rewards more obtainable by others in time - but I can also see your point of view, that you fought tooth-and-nail to get there and therefore only those in the top 100 should be able to earn that reward.

I think we also agree that for those that make it in the top 100, they should be able to choose from among the available top rewards -- that nothing is barred off from them because the reward itself changed. I think we could also agree that whatever reward they do choose be available account-wide.

If we're being totally honest, I think putting highly sought-after rewards behind such gates with insane requirements and then asking players to slog through broken and/or exploitable content is like promising someone a 4-course meal and then feeding them a brick. By the same token, I don't think that everything should be handed out like candy. Somewhere in the middle would be perfect. Not too much of a boring grind, but not too easy either.

I'd be perfectly happy with an alternative that can be purchased with wolf collars so that you guys have your winning item and other players who want these things have something markedly different. In fact, with regard to the Hellhound, they can make it look exactly like the ones in POTD or the Void Ark and I'd be pleased as punch. Those differ enough from the original Feast rewards, so anyone who cares will notice the difference.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Seems like someone thinks they are better than they actually think they are. Literally Dunning-Kruger effect right here. Literally "I didn't win but I know I was better than everyone else." You apply that sentiment towards Feast and contests you lost to rationalize your own defeat, how it's not your fault you lost.

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I think you misunderstood. I did win. I'm explaining that sometimes, you can pour tons of time and effort into a thing (like ranking in the top 100 or drawing a sophisticated graphic), or you can put less time and effort into another thing (like ranking Gold or Platinum or sketching a thing quickly), and it ends up paying off. Correlation doesn't always imply causation. All I can do is make a request -- just like people have requested bunny suits, moogle suits, 99 totems for a mount -- and maybe it will be honored, maybe it won't.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

First off, the context is clear that these rewards were for the seasons top ranked players. They even say in the blog post in is for RANKING players. Not some randoms that want it because they asked nicely. First example of you selectively ignoring parts of the blog post that contradict your ignorant worldview.

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I'm not "some random" -- I actually do PVP, and I enjoy it. In fact, it was the seasonal reward that got me into it in the first place! So the incentive and desire are definitely there. And you know what? If they want to keep those things exclusive for ranked players and give the rest of us something similar but make the items distinctive enough so that anyone who actually cares can see the difference -- I've got no problem with that at all.

Just because someone makes a request doesn't make them wrong. You might not agree with my suggestion or my approach and that's your choice, just as I may not always agree with you. We can pull from different places and sources and hypothesize this or that, and we may be right, or we may be wrong. SE is the one with all the data.

I am not the one who started this thread, just as there are other threads throughout the site and different regions all suggesting the same things (also not started by me). Clearly, the desire is there. We just have to see what action, if any, will be taken in recognition of it.

Personally I won't be wasting my time in this thread anymore, specifically to deal with you or anwa anymore. Sieren pretty much nailed it in the head about how you repeating yourselves doesn't do anything to argue a point other than that you disagree. Also the fact you selectively ignore what I say doesn't help either.

If anyone else has a point to actually debate, I will gladly partake. But There is no debate when you keep claiming "It's not wrong to disagree" and nothing else.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

Hi Aviars,
I am not the one who started this thread, just as there are other threads throughout the site and different regions all suggesting the same things (also not started by me). Clearly, the desire is there. We just have to see what action, if any, will be taken in recognition of it.

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You do know that you hi-jacked this discussion right?
This is about vendor PvP gear you get with pvp points, not exclusive rewards.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Personally I won't be wasting my time in this thread anymore, specifically to deal with you or anwa anymore. Sieren pretty much nailed it in the head about how you repeating yourselves doesn't do anything to argue a point other than that you disagree. Also the fact you selectively ignore what I say doesn't help either.

If anyone else has a point to actually debate, I will gladly partake. But There is no debate when you keep claiming "It's not wrong to disagree" and nothing else.

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Reason I keep bringing up my point is because you are unwilling to accept that and the end of the day your position just as my is based off a subjective value thus inherently cannot be objective. I am trying to understand what makes it so that item "HAS" to be only for top 100 players. You did say SE made a promise, end of the day a promise does not mean it has to be forever. If you could simply tell me how earning something over a certain length of time inherently in the context of a video game detracts objectively from the value of an item that has subjective value. Since I think we can agree that no item has inherent value. That is what I am trying to understand here. If you had data for example showing that making the reward available to a wider range of players would lessen the competitive for grind to top 100. I do not see how making it so some people on the bottom getting the reward makes the desire for those wishing to prove they are the best or seek competition any less meaningful.

Or you use arguments based around the current status quo or the precedent set by SE that they have a desire for exclusive rewards. Which currently they do, but who is the say their position is current set in stone, and they are unwilling to make change. In the end your argument simply comes down to well the current status quo supports our claims yet you are refuse to accept that the company reserves the right to change their position. Also, I am not trying to change your mind, I already admitted that if any change were to be made to the current system that reduces the requirement for the mounts below the standard of being meant only for top 100 players would detract from the value of the reward which I agree is an objective effect. My argument is that while the effect by objective, the reasoning behind it is still objective, since in the end it is still your choice as the owner to allow changes effect what personal value perception of the reward. In the end we have differing views, but the view I have is objectively wrong because the current status quo is on your side, that seems counter intuitive. Since by you saying that it is wrong means that any request made on the topic is moot. If someone is not pleased with the current system how are they meant to enact change if it goes against the status quo. Or at the very least that is how I interrupted your statement, sorry if I misunderstood.

To Sieren I am not trying to ignore your point regarding that I am more or less arguing that who one finds attracted to is a choice. Which I am not, I do not agree it is a choice, but goes into areas that I do not feel appropriate for the forums. Though I do think someone has the "choice" to act on such urges. For example if you have a feelings for your best friends wife, you have a choice to act on it.

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Originally Posted by Divinemights

You do know that you hi-jacked this discussion right?
This is about vendor PvP gear you get with pvp points, not exclusive rewards.

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No matter what the reward is, I think both the OP and everyone else who posted here can agree that pvp participation is hanging by a thread. Whatever the suggestions are, and regardless of how feasible they are, nobody wants to see pvp wither.
We might not agree on the best routes to something, be it weapons, armor or mounts...but on its current path, pvp feels like it's on life dupport, and I'm not even sure a fresh coat of paint on rival wings can save it. We'll see.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Having to deal with garbage. I don't mind competing. However, I won't go through an army of people with anger issues for a mount.

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I understand that bad experiences / toxicity in pvp matches sucks and can ruin it for you (Overwatch for me was ruined by toxicity, consistent top 500 player for many seasons, quit in s5 for example) There's always a side to both stories though; Nobody is randomly toxic and when there's something to lose, It hurts more. At the end of the day toxicity in feast is mild at best... IDK why people exaggerate it so much. My advice is to grow thicker skin, Report if you must and perhaps look at yours and others gameplay - you may just find out a major mistake you did or why they acted in such a way in those situations. It wouldn't stop me personally but if you've quit, good luck with whatever you're playing now.

Now to everyone else:

I also agree that previous Top 100 rewards should be available to purchase with a top 100 voucher as you've clearly earn't it by competing and rising to the top + If you dislike the rewards of the current season then you can still buy something that you liked instead however, If you're not going to get in the top 100 then noway should you be able to have these rewards, it's as simple as that, why should you? You cannot dispute this argument without admitting you are too lazy or simply unskilled to achieve such rewards and if this change came true, The chance to obtain old exclusive rewards would be still there but you will still have to earn it exactly as everyone else did, This is a competition of the top 100 best players, after all. If I grinded each normal boss version of unending coil ultimate does that mean I should eventually be rewarded the same golden weapon or anything like it? Absolutely not!

We can talk about value and PVE vs PVP treatment all day long but what are you doing about it currently in-game? you have the opportunity to get these rewards fair and square, stop looking for an easy way out and just soldier on and win. you know there's a new player right now who is currently #2, he went for what he wanted, I advise you to suck it up and do the same.

Suggesting wolf collars as currency to buy top 100 rewards and Feast Victories Is a joke in itself in all honesty and completely disregards the effort it takes to get into top 100.
Regarding PVP participation in general, Yes, it could use some help but that's on SE to do content wise, if the content is interesting and engaging then it will attract players naturally, not to mention the rewards and titles for said activity; has nothing to do with the feasts rewards or exclusivity though, people who claim this will help oozes desperation.

I am done with this thread also, it boils down to : "Make this easier because I want it and since I can't get top 100 There has to be another way!" With the same old round-about arguments and avoidance of questions. It's sad to see that people refuse to just get good and accept that not everything is for you.

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Originally Posted by Kaiche

Now to everyone else:

I also agree that previous Top 100 rewards should be available to purchase with a top 100 voucher as you've clearly earn't it by competing and rising to the top + If you dislike the rewards of the current season then you can still buy something that you liked instead however, If you're not going to get in the top 100 then noway should you be able to have these rewards, it's as simple as that, why should you? You cannot dispute this argument without admitting you are too lazy or simply unskilled to achieve such rewards and if this change came true, The chance to obtain old exclusive rewards would be still there but you will still have to earn it exactly as everyone else did, This is a competition of the top 100 best players, after all. If I grinded each normal boss version of unending coil ultimate does that mean I should eventually be rewarded the same golden weapon or anything like it? Absolutely not!

We can talk about value and PVE vs PVP treatment all day long but what are you doing about it currently in-game? you have the opportunity to get these rewards fair and square, stop looking for an easy way out and just soldier on and win. you know there's a new player right now who is currently #2, he went for what he wanted, I advise you to suck it up and do the same.

Suggesting wolf collars as currency to buy top 100 rewards and Feast Victories Is a joke in itself in all honesty and completely disregards the effort it takes to get into top 100.
Regarding PVP participation in general, Yes, it could use some help but that's on SE to do content wise, if the content is interesting and engaging then it will attract players naturally, not to mention the rewards and titles for said activity; has nothing to do with the feasts rewards or exclusivity though, people who claim this will help oozes desperation.

I am done with this thread also, it boils down to : "Make this easier because I want it and since I can't get top 100 There has to be another way!" With the same old round-about arguments and avoidance of questions. It's sad to see that people refuse to just get good and accept that not everything is for you.

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Honestly this should be the definite answer for this thread. Pack it up, close it boys.

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Originally Posted by Kaiche

I understand that bad experiences / toxicity in pvp matches sucks and can ruin it for you (Overwatch for me was ruined by toxicity, consistent top 500 player for many seasons, quit in s5 for example) There's always a side to both stories though; Nobody is randomly toxic and when there's something to lose, It hurts more. At the end of the day toxicity in feast is mild at best... IDK why people exaggerate it so much. My advice is to grow thicker skin, Report if you must and perhaps look at yours and others gameplay - you may just find out a major mistake you did or why they acted in such a way in those situations. It wouldn't stop me personally but if you've quit, good luck with whatever you're playing now.

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You see the amount of garbage I saw the last couple days in my ranked games (around 2 weeks ago) and last word you'd come up with is mild. You can't blame people for wanting these rewards outside ranked. Let's be honest here, getting to top 100 as it is now is nowhere near a challenge, from 0 to 1500 is a pure grind; from 1500 to 2000-2200 is a bit more of a struggle (depending on your luck and skill) but it's ultimately a grind too, as almost anybody can get there with either time or patience. A top 100 out of how much people? 300? Pretty sure even less are active in each data center, that's your current top 100 at the moment, which is why it is so easy in the first place. The question you should make yourself is why the Ranked community is so marginal? Easy to answer. People run away from the word Ranked. Effort and working hard for something have been proven to not be a problem for a big part of this community, people have gone through atmas, animus books, lights and a long etc. None were a problem. Sure some complained a bit, but people ended up swallowing the grind pill and accepted the grind as a part of this game. The last one was Eureka. A huge train of fates going from one place to another and pressing a few buttons for days. People took it.
Therefore, it has nothing to do with entitlement, effort or laziness. Telling people to go Ranked is like asking them to take a mud bath. Many of us (including yourself) know what kind of stuff is there having played games like LoL or Overwatch. Glad to see you haven't come across these issues here. I can tell you I have, and they were bad enough for me to take a break from FFXIV altogether (and I'm not stepping into ranked here again even if they threaten me with a blowtorch on my face). Locking rewards behind this mode? A bit of a waste if you ask me, though honestly the rewards do not even concern me that much, I'm more "worried" about SE's obsession to force ranked through PVPers throats over and over again, even at the expense of turning normal mode into a graveyard because they couldn't even bother to incentivize it in the slightest.

dam, now i want all the reward aswell.

can i have Kefka Mount from Savage just by doing the normal mode 100 times?
its just a grind man, its the same concept of grinding o8s

Been lurking around, and I have to say it is shocking how so many people seem to have bought into the whole PR lip service regarding the nature of the exclusive rewards. Let us be real the only reason behind exclusive rewards is to act as an incentive to queue for particulate content. The whole thing about rewarding dedication, and to foster a competitive community simply boils down to empty platitudes.

For those that want the feast mount without taking part in ranked your best bet is spread the word to as many causal players as possible to tell them not to queue for ranked feast, if the numbers dip low enough that the queues suffer I am sure they will add reward incentives to help with the queues. Granted this will not have much of an effect on players above gold, but asking on the forums for such a change really is an exercise in futility. Direct impact is the only thing will push SE to make such changes, so be the change you want and make it happen. With that being said your best bet would be to wait till the next season and spread the word to those that want the rewards to not take part, I am sure if this reward is as widely desired as some have claimed in this thread it would not be all that hard to muster up enough players to spread the word around to hamper queue times for the feast at the start of a season.

It would not make sense for them to create all new assets for the rewards so they will likely reuse older ones for the rewards, if they were to create reward based incentives to help with queue times. I think it is fair to assume that with SB PvP was an aspect they wanted to focus on so would make sense that they do not want it to fail. Good luck to those that want the mount, personally not sure why people are so into the mount designs, but to each their own.

Short version: Give SE a reason to place reward incentives to help with queue times.