@Naoki Yoshida-> Make Samurai a Tank class!

I honestly am interested in samurai being a tank they could add parry mechanics like in ffxv.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

If this would be Samurai, it just should be a Tank class!
https://imgur.com/D4kJRvU

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That Guy is zenos yae valgus, the garlean ruler of ala migho and son of the actual emperor but yeah he looks like he use a katana

I just want to main a tank to go through the queues quicker.

SAM is popular, and the game need too much tank. If SAM is going to be tank... :o

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Originally Posted by Rahdah

SAM is popular, and the game need too much tank. If SAM is going to be tank... :o

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Dark Knight was very popular at beginning, but most people can't/don't want to play tank.

Reusing post from similar threads...

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Originally Posted by Alacran

For those that believe that a DPS RDM with a single sword can't be as epic as DPS SAM.

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/...20141229032134
Gabriel Belomnt- Lords of Shadow 2 Sword animation

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Originally Posted by Alacran

They wont see how ridiculous a two handed Katana wielding Samurai will look behind the enemy. Welcome to 4.0, 24 man raids...

http://i.imgur.com/p2D6Jap.png?1

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Originally Posted by shao32

That Guy is zenos yae valgus, the garlean ruler of ala migho and son of the actual emperor but yeah he looks like he use a katana

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Shao I think we actually might get Samurai as a tank as it blends in so well.
1. Second high damage off tank makes the balance between the 4 tanks complete:
Paladin -> the ultimate defensive tank.
Dark Knight -> also a good main tank, blood weapon can be used with grit off from now and then but Na/EU basically made PLD and DRK the main tanks.
Warrior -> high damaging off tank with crazy damage compared to the two other tanks.
Samurai -> high damaging off tank just like Warrior.
So that sums it up: 2 Main tanks and 2 Off tanks: balance.
I also believe it will be like this: Samurai will be the new tank, Red Mage will be the new DPS job and we might get a 4th Healer.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

Shao I think we actually might get Samurai as a tank as it blends in so well.
1. Second high damage off tank makes the balance between the 4 tanks complete:
Paladin -> the ultimate defensive tank.
Dark Knight -> also a good main tank, blood weapon can be used with grit off from now and then but Na/EU basically made PLD and DRK the main tanks.
Warrior -> high damaging off tank with crazy damage compared to the two other tanks.
Samurai -> high damaging off tank just like Warrior.
So that sums it up: 2 Main tanks and 2 Off tanks: balance.
I also believe it will be like this: Samurai will be the new tank, Red Mage will be the new DPS job and we might get a 4th Healer.

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Or more likely we'll just see DRK and PLD marginalised in favour of higher DPS tanks by the community like we saw with PLD in 3.0/3.1

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Originally Posted by Brightshadow

I honestly am interested in samurai being a tank they could add parry mechanics like in ffxv.

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The problem this game has is its so heavily scripted. You can't parry or dodge boss attacks or anything significant. It's a big part of why parry is as bad as it is.

Back in the day Warrior was the parry tank but look how that turned out. So well that they revamped it entirely pretty quick after arrs launch and now devs are looking to remove parry entirely cos it just doesn't work.

It's the same when people suggest dodge tanks. Bosses never miss so a dodge tank wouldn't work either. the very design of the game is what breaks these things.

In ffxi samurai made a fairly solid tank. Tanked many a boss on my samurai. ultima omega, odin, various sky bosses and bosses within temenos and appollyon. It was quite effective parrying triple attacks from byakko in sky or something such. But it wouldn't work in 14 due to encounter design.

it's also why they're looking at removing accuracy as well because of the way encounters are designed. and how damage works. there's no variance in defence or anything such. if your attack hits one mob for 5k damage it'll hit every mob in the game for aboutr the same. you don't have high def mobs low def mobs high eva mobs low eva mobs. the only difference is how much hp they have.

the game doesn't have encounters where you need low acc but high attackpower, against tough enemies. or encounters where you need low attack power but high acc against weak but incredibly evasive enemies. it's designed in such a way that everything just hits and the only variable is how much hp does it have...

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

Paladin -> the ultimate defensive tank.

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In a game where the only thing that matters is DPS a defensive tank doesn't work. which is why paladins have had so many offensive buffs since 3.0 because defence is a joke. DPS is king.
it's kind of the same thing happening to whm, dubbed by many as the pure healer class. but there getting sidelined for more dps cos nothing needs pure healing

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

Or more likely we'll just see DRK and PLD marginalised in favour of higher DPS tanks by the community like we saw with PLD in 3.0/3.1

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With all due respect, this game needs more Tanks and Healers to not jeopardize the state of the game. DPS ques take usually 20-30 min, hence when Ques as tank it's instantly. Square Enix needs to draw players and giving Samurai a Tanking class will appeal to more. If SAM was dps, how will this affect the que times? Ppl will be in que for hours like at the release of Ninja.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

With all due respect, this game needs more Tanks and Healers to not jeopardize the state of the game. DPS ques take usually 20-30 min, hence when Ques as tank it's instantly. Square Enix needs to draw players and giving Samurai a Tanking class will appeal to more. If SAM was dps, how will this affect the que times? Ppl will be in que for hours like at the release of Ninja.

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could be 100 tank classes and 10 dps classes people would still be waiting for tanks..

the game needs more dps. specifically ranged physical dps that aren't casters.. because 50+ the game has zero of those.

why not make sam a ranged dps class XD. SAM/RNG in XI was a pretty awesome job.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

could be 100 tank classes and 10 dps classes people would still be waiting for tanks..

the game needs more dps. specifically ranged physical dps that aren't casters.. because 50+ the game has zero of those.

why not make sam a ranged dps class XD. SAM/RNG in XI was a pretty awesome job.

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Oh come on Dzian! That's the whole reason why Samurai, who is loved by many, should be a tank class so the DPS don't have to wait long for a dungeon que!! Also I think you should be happy with red mage to be honest:
DPS: http://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/...55deba880e.jpg

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

That's the whole reason why Samurai, who is loved by many, should be a tank class so the DPS don't have to wait long for a dungeon que!!

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We'd have couple first weeks plenty of tanks, and once people would have leveled up.. they'd return back to DPS.

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Originally Posted by Anzaman

We'd have couple first weeks plenty of tanks, and once people would have leveled up.. they'd return back to DPS.

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Maybe Samurai is a keeper? :3

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

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dont get me wrong, i expect to get SAM as tank and RDM as dps, or in case to no add SAM this expansion, we go to get at least a tank or a healer for surebecause we need more jobs for that roles, i see SAM is the perfect match for the migthy WAR, with all the balance we go to get at 4.0.

just point that pic is zenos yae valgus, as been confirmed the past event, at the same time yoshida confirmed they hold a katana but is not a weapon tied to the char or something like that if i remember well so meaby we go to get a sam with a triple sheath, how knows.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

With all due respect, this game needs more Tanks and Healers to not jeopardize the state of the game. DPS ques take usually 20-30 min, hence when Ques as tank it's instantly. Square Enix needs to draw players and giving Samurai a Tanking class will appeal to more. If SAM was dps, how will this affect the que times? Ppl will be in que for hours like at the release of Ninja.

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I won't disagree with you but having 2 damage based tanks and 2 defensive based tanks will not help things with the current game design as having better DPS is more important than having better defence so we would have really unbalanced end game tanks.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

why not make sam a ranged dps class XD. SAM/RNG in XI was a pretty awesome job.

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because people don't want samurai, they want a DD with a katana. not a tank, not a ranged, if you make samurai any other class than a katana DD, they will not bother playing it and will get really salty.

How bout we wait till 5.0 for samurai and it can be the hype class of the expansion. Dark knight was the hype for heavensward, red mage is the hype for storm blood, and Sam can be their hype for 5.0

I think dps queue times are longer than 20 minutes

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

With all due respect, this game needs more Tanks and Healers to not jeopardize the state of the game. DPS ques take usually 20-30 min, hence when Ques as tank it's instantly. Square Enix needs to draw players and giving Samurai a Tanking class will appeal to more. If SAM was dps, how will this affect the que times? Ppl will be in que for hours like at the release of Ninja.

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that's a problem of players choosing to play DPS over tanks/healers less a "we don't have enough tank class" issue.

adding more tank classes will not increase the amount of people queing for dungeons as tanks as several people have tried pointing out maybe not so plain and you have thus far missed this point, so here i am spelling it out in black and white.

if you have ever played more than 1 mmo you will know that people do not in general enjoy playing as tank, its alot of responsibility, knowing boss mechanics being the person who sets dungeon pull pacing, knowing the dungeon well enough to run it fast ect. most people would just wait for a tank to pull and mindlessly beat on things with health bars till they are dead.

thats why (dont remember who said it but) you could have 100 tank classes and 10 dps and you'd still have tank que problems.

to reitterate, people do not like to play as tanks (for one reason or another) therefore more tanks does not solve the problem of lacking tanks for ques.

They even tried incentive's for "adventurer's in need" aka tank (and some rare instances healers) and it still does not help with que times.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

could be 100 tank classes and 10 dps classes people would still be waiting for tanks..

the game needs more dps. specifically ranged physical dps that aren't casters.. because 50+ the game has zero of those.

why not make sam a ranged dps class XD. SAM/RNG in XI was a pretty awesome job.

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while samurai were technically trained to use naginata (dragoon) and bows (bard/archer) when you ask a random person what they imagine a samurai as the think Katana, would be odd if they went with anything else... besides if they add samurai ala katana style they better damn well add a sephiroth style masamune IDK if i have to buy it off the mogstation i will buy it for glam.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

could be 100 tank classes and 10 dps classes people would still be waiting for tanks..

the game needs more dps. specifically ranged physical dps that aren't casters.. because 50+ the game has zero of those.

why not make sam a ranged dps class XD. SAM/RNG in XI was a pretty awesome job.

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SE seems to group all ranged DPS together. Duty finder works in trying to put one ranged with one melee DPS if it can. Yoshi-P has talked how they think caster and physical ranged will be grouped together for new cross class skill system.

We got 13 jobs. 3 healers, 3 tanks, 4 ranged DPS, and 3 melee DPS. That is one "too many" ranged DPS if SE wants a job role ratio at 1 tank to 1 healer to 1 melee DPS to 1 ranged DPS. A new melee DPS makes a lot more sense.

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Originally Posted by DarkSlayerGrimm

oh god I can already see it if Samurai is added as DPS everyone will switch to it
>all fate parties,raid parties and trial parties will all be samurai dps.
>No queues will ever pop because everyone will be sitting in dps que as samurai
>Idyllshire will have samurai as far as the eye can see,all future content wont be completed due to the lack of tanks and healers because Samurai.
>Adding in new classes wont matter because Samurai


/joke
Lets just hope 4.0 tank job can match the Samurai hype

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1: that's what people said about nin...do you see lots of nins, around, nowdays? no?
2: unless you do PotD, where it doesn't matter what job you are. also lv 70, so ppl will want to cap their mains, first.
3: Idyllshire will be as populated as Mor Dhona post-HW release=not at all.
4: ppl who like to tank, will still tank. ppl who like to heal, will still heal. not everyone is interested in SAM, and will level their heal/tank mains to 70 before possibly trying SAM...possibly...after RDM/etc
5: there seems to be plenty of cheers for RDM too, and ppl can't even distinguish a dancer from monk, because dancer.

and pleeeeaaaassseeee NOOO tank sam -.-.-.-

To be honest adding in new tanks will help for a short time while people level those up but once you hit level 60 those same tanks are the ones who were running your level 60 expert and roulette to begin with. Now some may find a new tank they love and latch onto it (how it was for me and DRK and I refused to tank) but the majority who love tanking will still be tanking and those who refuse to tank, will refuse no matter what class you toss into it.

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

I'm a person and I enjoy both tanking and DPS, so you are wrong and if your small brains can't comprehend that, then I don't know what to say.

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But you do not represent everyone. Yes I am sure there are people who enjoy tanking, I do sometimes and other times I just wanna quit the dungeon cause my party is a giant pile of derp and is making my life a living hell cause THEY WON'T FOLLOW MECHANICS! But you do not represent everyone and neither do I, everyone has opinions on this and using yourself as evidence for why your opinion is more valid is kinda not gonna fly in some circles. Now excuse me while I do that to a degree myself!

I was TERRIFIED to pick up warrior. I was terrified that I was gonna fuck everything up and get yelled at a ton. Cause yes, being the tank carries a TON of responsibilities in the party, you need! NEED to be able to take a beating, know the mechanics, know the dungeon inside and out, cause you are the defacto leader of the group, you set the pace and that idea still stresses me out. But I have my fun, would SAM be a fun tank? Maybe, but in my opinion I think it would be more fun as a DPS and I won't spend my whole morning beating that drum, its just my opinion and we should just wait to see what happens. No matter what, I am sure however SAM is added will be fun.

But adding more tank classes will not fix the stigma around tanking. It will not make more people wanna be tanks. It will just give the current tank pool more toys to play with.

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Originally Posted by StarRosie

But you do not represent everyone. Yes I am sure there are people who enjoy tanking, I do sometimes and other times I just wanna quit the dungeon cause my party is a giant pile of derp and is making my life a living hell cause THEY WON'T FOLLOW MECHANICS! But you do not represent everyone.

Adding more tank classes will not fix the stigma around tanking. It will not make more people wanna be tanks.

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Same can be said to you: YOU do NOT REPRESENT other people EITHER. You as an INDIVIDUAL have an opinion, but YOUR opinion is not the VOICE of the ENTIRE FFXIV Community. Just to point that out aswell, and I was speaking on behalf of myself, hence the "I'm a person".

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Originally Posted by Madepossible

Same can be said to you: YOU do NOT REPRESENT other people EITHER. You as an INDIVIDUAL have an opinion, but YOUR opinion is not the VOICE of the ENTIRE FFXIV Community. Just to point that out aswell, and I was speaking on behalf of myself, hence the "I'm a person".

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I noticed that, edited the post.

Also maybe take a step back, cause you seem to be getting heated now.

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Originally Posted by StarRosie

Honey, I noticed that, edited the post. Should totally read it again :)

Also maybe take a step back dear, cause you seem to be getting heated now.

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Don't be condescending, it ain't cute being sarcastic to intentionally draw out negativity. Stop derailing.

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Originally Posted by Greedalox

Don't be condescending, it ain't cute being sarcastic to intentionally draw out negativity. Stop derailing.

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Ah, apologies, that wasn't my intention. But I can see what you mean, deepest apologies.

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Originally Posted by StarRosie

It will just give the current tank pool more toys to play with.

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well thats why they add more jobs in every mmo, its not like we need more that we have now, but add mre jobs in to the expansion is a way to make players come back and find new ways to do they role and how know meaby become they main, after all we dont need more jobs taht the original composition on 2.0 PLD,WAR,DRG,MNK,BRD,SMN,BLM, SCH and WHM

Please no...I want to be a SAM DPS...no more tanking ugggh. They already picked DRK for that, which works fine..we do not need another 2H tank ; ;

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Originally Posted by shao32

well thats why they add more jobs in every mmo, its not like we need more that we have now, but add mre jobs in to the expansion is a way to make players come back and find new ways to do they role and how know meaby become they main, after all we dont need more jobs taht the original composition on 2.0 PLD,WAR,DRG,MNK,BRD,SMN,BLM, SCH and WHM

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I see your point and agree to a degree, I am just wording it that way because the two core arguments I've seen on this thread for SAM tank have either been "We need to make SAM a tank or the current tank pool will get bored and shrink." or "We need to make SAM a tank so more people will want to play tank." and I disagree with those points. SAM can honestly go either way but I don't agree that we should make it go one way out of some obligation to keep a portion of the player base happy. If that makes any sense.

I'd like to see another tank/dps hybrid, like WAR. We know pld/drk off tanking is garbage. Having a viable high damage second off tank might finally knock warriors off of their pedestal. XD

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Originally Posted by Ariane

We got 13 jobs. 3 healers, 3 tanks, 4 ranged DPS, and 3 melee DPS. That is one "too many" ranged DPS if SE wants a job role ratio at 1 tank to 1 healer to 1 melee DPS to 1 ranged DPS. A new melee DPS makes a lot more sense.

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Frankly, 4 ranged jobs are not enough! For those who love to play mage, caster, wizard, 2 jobs are not enough! We have 3 tank, 3 healer, 5 war jobs and still only 2 mage DPS jobs. It breaks my heart that I only have 2 mage jobs to play with and that I have to endure such limitations. Other MMORPGs have more than just 2 mage classes but here? Still stuck with 2 mage DPS jobs with Heavensward! And I play Bard and Machinist as well and they're not mage, they're war jobs, don't lump them with the mage jobs.

I honestly could care less for Sam but do we really need Sam as tank when Dk is a tank?
Dps would be cool

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Originally Posted by Derio

I think dps queue times are longer than 20 minutes

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Five minutes on my MCH for pretty much everything. Sounds like a data center problem.

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Originally Posted by StarRosie

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we need more tanks and healers regarless how are, and is imposible to make everyone happy, in my opinion i dont care if SAM go to dps if we get a nice cool tank idk templar for examle.

SAM can be go in to 2 sides, but looking how ppl react they go after what looks cool and is fun, that happen with DRK and now we have many new tanks, what i mean in the end is what the game need, not what the player base want, if the game need more tank players the best way to get more is making marketing in with the role with a new super cool and fun job, if the game need more dps is the same.

so about "We need to make SAM a tank or the current tank pool will get bored and shrink"is true and false, whe need a cool tank with fun mechanics to refresh tank experience, not need to be SAM, but is a big plus.

and "We need to make SAM a tank so more people will want to play tank." well in part is true, SAM is a pretty demanded job, all want it to they role, so add SAM to the tank squad is go to increse tank population for a long time making new ppl go to try the experience of tank like DRK do in 3.0, and if the jobs iis like i say before fun can make new ppl main tankig or at least having it like second main.

It's true that 60% of the people who hate tanking will not tank however, the other 40% will play the job because of it being samurai. So it would increase the numbers of tanks. Perhaps not by a huge percent but somewhat.

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Originally Posted by shao32

we need more tanks and healers.

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I agree. Whole heartedly I agree. Again, SAM could go either way and be fun, personally I would PREFER a DPS SAM but a Tank SAM would be fine too. But I think there are other Jobs that could fit the tank role better. I see your points on how SAM would make more people decide to tank cause "SAM is cool." and concede that.

The other point though, that it needs to be a tank or the tank pool will shrink, I still don't agree with. If the tanking pool is that fickle about it, then making SAM tank would only delay what would essentially be the inevitable, which is that the tanking pool will shrink.

But yes, we need more tanks and healers (Which is why I'm hoping RDM comes out of no where as a tank, or sticks to it's jack of all trades motif and can be all 3 roles. But that would be a bit tricky I think.)

How much did Dark Knight increase the amount of active tank players? :p