PvP - Do we really want this kind of thing in Final Fantasy?

Why do you guys have that constant need to control everybody else's game? You did it in FFXI, now you want to do it in FFXIV. When PVP is added, it's going to be optional, so you're not forced to participate at all. Why do you feel the need to take it away from everyone who could possibly enjoy it just because you don't like it? I'm not a big fan of PVP and still I enjoyed the occasional LS-organized Brenner/Ballista.

PS: FFXI has always been completely unbalanced in PVP and PVE.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Miliant

Why do you guys have that constant need to control everybody else's game? You did it in FFXI, now you want to do it in FFXIV. When PVP is added, it's going to be optional, so you're not forced to participate at all. Why do you feel the need to take it away from everyone who could possibly enjoy it just because you don't like it? I'm not a big fan of PVP and still I enjoyed the occasional LS-organized Brenner/Ballista.

PS: FFXI has always been completely unbalanced in PVP and PVE.

---

iam gonna agree 100% on what you said, your words are gold of reasons

PvP was an afterthought in XI, i imagine they will put slightly more emphasis on it in 2.0, but don't expect them to do the constant updating and matinence it may deserve. it will look impressive and probably be impressive, but FF has always been a PvE game, so i suspect they will not disrespect the PvP players, but they won't bend over backwards for them either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Miliant

PS: FFXI has always been completely unbalanced in PVP and PVE.

---

Ironically, XI has one of the most balanced pvp systems out there (60 cap and below). This is mainly due the fact that both pve and pvp work under completely different rules and gameplay mechanics.

Asking for balance in an mmo pvp makes me lol though.

Yes, this is what we want in a Final Fantasy game. PvP=good

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vahzl

What a great way to provide developmental feedback to proposed features upcoming, that could define the entire game.

Thumbs up for the most useless poster on the forums.

---

I think this question is worth than "i don't want" because, thoses that doesn't take part of PvP doesn't have to.
And it will not change the equilibrium (is that english?) of class/jobs because they probably get each of them a special template of skills for PvP with their own skills.

And i'm pretty happy because actually there's no "hide" skill and backstab ! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

I want to see PvP as long as it's kept in its own area that's completely optional. Consensual PvP if you will. As long as it does not interfere with the PvE aspects of the game, it's fine. I think this is what we're getting anyway so I'm happy with it.

---

Hi Vahzl,

Great topic.

I'm with you and Arcell on this.

As long as PvP is its own separate system, with its own rules and balancing that *doesn't* affect or change the way we play Final Fantasy XIV PvE (the majority of the game), then I'm fine with it being there as a side thing.

If Yoshida-san suddenly wants to make PvP the main focus of FF XIV to copy other MMO's, and we start seeing Ability changes in our regular PvE System because of PvP "Balancing," then I'd definitely vote "No!" to having PvP.

Otherwise it's fine as a separate system.

I'm looking forward to see some pvp, especially for the fact that yoshi-p is a veteran in that subject and i'm really curious to see his ideas and features about it (having played UO and DAoC so much). So, yes he can.

PvP is fine. Its how they add it in the game might be a problem.

Not really, but it doesn't sound like we have a choice. Yoshida is counting on the top 15% to inspire the rest of the playerbase to level up and strive for greatness.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kensredemption

Didn't they say something about designated PvP areas on the world map? I would think that potentially people would wander into those areas either to farm for crafting materials or get to locations required for quests. That's all I was thinking when I posted that statement.

---

There are areas specifically for PvP in 2.0 but YoshiP did mention there will be a warning before entering the zone warning the player that they are about to enter a PvP area. So if the noob didn't read that warning and enters and gets killed by other players too bad lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nikita

It was 15% of Japanese gamers. The 3:1 ratio of this thread is a clear indication that the 15% statistic doesn't apply to all regions. Lol.

---

mmm don't think so in Japan PvP isn't that common so most JP players don't care or want PvP at all.

I stand corrected! It was excluding Asian gamers o_O

I want PvP because my BF might not play if there's not PvP. :P

I pvp everyday in the market wards >.>

It's not all rainbows and chocobos there, it's shank or be shanked!

/iwill(under)cutyou

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Evenstar

I agree with adding optional PvP, but I also hope they are not going to make the same mistake Blizzard did. Blizzard is constantly (or at least was) balancing classes just to make sure PvP is balanced and fair for all classes. This kinda destroys the PvE aspect of the game from time to time.

FFXI did it right. They added PvP, but hardly balanced the classes for PvP. They just gave you the option to do it, but didn't care too much about it. I trust Yoshi to not completely destroy everything he worked so hard for just for the love of some PvP.

Personally I can do without PvP, but I know some people really want to see it, so I am fine with that as long as it is optional and you do not get balancing issues that completely destroy some classes in PvE aspect of the game.

---

This is too true. If i want to play a pvp game i would probably try out Aion again as it seems to focus more on pvp (last time I played). The reason I like FF14 is I prefer PVE. For the time being I know the game wont be tweaked to satisfy PVP balances potentially crippling some classes in PVE. If they can somehow work a zone where, if a player chooses to enter, all classes are affected by PVP only balances then I think everyone will be happy :D.

Edit: As a person who strives to Min/Max his characters, I hope they don't add "pvp" gear, or if they do have it restricted to the pvp zones. The reason for this is sometimes pvp gear comes along that is much better than pve gear, when used even in PVE content. I don't want to have to pvp to min/max :(.

Why would anyone even assume that PvP wouldn't be limited to specific PvP instances/areas? The devs have made it clear on many occasions that randomly ganking female players is hardly Final Fantasy, and there would always be some sort of in-game world limit to it.

Of course the Colosseum and Frontlines PvP events are going to be either instanced or(in the case of the latter) sign-up only. Bring it on, says I.

i want to see forms of pvp, so yes, but i don't want it being implemented as a substitute for large scale pve. from what i understand we got crystal towers on way and hopefully when they called it large scale pve it is at the least 32man stuff. but in no way do i want to see pvp stuff being added over large scale pve stuff. add pvp for pvp people to get a fix, i know i would of stayed in ffxi if wotg added a pvp to it so having it is good. but again not in place of pve. a mixed bag of crap is a mixed bag of crap. this game is first and for most a pve game after all.

To a certain extent I think that some of the OP's concerns about homogenization between classes as a result of PvP do not necessarily apply to this game. The lead example that seems to be referenced here is World of Warcraft, and to be fair this has occurred many times in that particular game's history. However I think it is also significant to consider that while in WoW one cannot easily change from class to class, in XIV the option does exist. The fact that we can change classes at will makes poor PvP balancing less of an issue of someone choosing the wrong class at the start of a game and instead an issue of working on X class over Y class because X is simply better suited. This is not to say, however, that if everyone who wants to PvP should all be socially locked into a single class. Ultimately some attention will have to be paid to certain classes dominating others and maintaining that at least the majority of classes remain PvP viable. Although the amount of attention that would need to be centered around the issue would likely be far less "all-consuming" then the OP seems to suggest.

Personally I am for the addition of PvP to this game. I believe it is good to host a variety of content as it welcomes a variety of different players that posses a multitude of viewpoints over how to play the game. It creates heterogeneity among the player base. Furthermore in the modern MMO market, especially in the western markets, it is becoming increasingly difficult to focus on simply one aspect of player interaction and still have a lucrative game. Ultimately I feel that the addition of PvP would inject a great deal of vitality into what is currently a rather stiff game. Keep in mind that while PvE content needs to be constantly produced by the developers, PvP content largely feeds itself.

if there is pvp, how many player will name their character stabby mcstabstab

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by neorei

if there is pvp, how many player will name their character stabby mcstabstab

---

=O /reroll

It will be instanced so: Yes to PvP.

Quote:

---

GameWatch - At last interview you said you wanted to include PvP system; what will happen? Will it be starting when the New FFXIV starts?
YoshiP - We are still working on this; system is already planned for the New FFXIV. With the battle framework changes in 1.19 we did include PvP design. Doign basic player duels we can make it in time but we have to include as a PvP content so even if the map is ready we have to prepare the players matching system an ranking system as well. We are also thinking of things which you can only gain through PvP, we also have to prepare a reward for that. If we’re going to work on this as a content it will have some cost. From that it will depends how much will be ready. Would like to release not too far from the New FFXIV’s start.

GameWatch - how about 1 on 1?
YoshiP - I don’t think 1 on 1 duel is much fun, so thinking of light party 4 vs 4 or full party 8 vs 8. For colloseum think of it as dragon balls Tenka ichi butoukai (Tournament) where you can see the oponent and starting. We are also thining of one large PvP content with it’s own area and large-scale battle.

GameWatch - this is completely new system?
YoshiP - This is completely new; We are calling this PvP Front Line for now

GameWatch - For image it’s ok to say it’s battle between powers?
YoshiP - Yes

GameWatch - will this be with the existing 3 cities or 3 companies?
YoshiP - We cannot say the details yet but please think of it as several powers mixed in and fighting.

GameWatch - How many players maximum can fight?
YoshiP - That will depend on the power, I think it will be fun with about 40.

GameWatch - how about 100 vs 100?
YoshiP - Depending on the Players leader it may be possible. Depending on the PC spec there may be players who have to look down or they can’t move (laugh). With MMORPG if you wanted to max out you can try to do so. In the MMORPG I used to play with large-scale raid we had too much players to defend the enemy and it blew the server..... that time we didn’t calculate the server spec (laugh)

GameWatch - With the new enging it seems those types of problems can be solved.
YoshiP - There will be physical limitations; We wont put any stop with this times engine so the player can decide on the maximum limit or can turn off all the effect; it’s set up that way. If you use a high powered machine you should be able to withstand it, other than that it will depend on the zone servers maximum limit (laugh)

GameWatch - For image does it require strategy?
YoshiP - Yes I would like for them to take over bases.

GameWatch - When will this be released?
YoshiP - This will be after the colloseum.

GameWatch - PvP Front Line may become one of the major contents for FFXIV
YoshiP - That’s true for PvP lovers would like them to enjoy

GameWatch - Will the PvP Front Line be like DAoC where it’s a major existance or will it be where you don’t have to participate?
YoshiP - I talked to the DAoC staff how “That battlefield was too large” for FFXIV we wont make it that large and the battle will go on for about 24 hours and that will affect outside also. For example it will be interesting if that controlled the entrance of another content. It has it’s own zone so for those that don’t like PvP they don’t have to step in. For the growth you get inside there will only be for PvP; For PvP lovers want to make it where they want to keep on staying.
When taking out China, Korea, and other Asian areas there are about 15% of users in total that has strong motivation with PvP. First I want to make the content for them so we don’t want to force all the players and we’re carefully designing this one. But we want to prepare something where you can cheer your powers PvP mania and because of those PvP players working hard, others will be able to fight monsters mainly.

GameWatch - Are you thinking of world vs world battles?
YoshiP - No, I am thinking of PvP Front Line as per world. I want to make a ranking system showing world number one. However when the community separation starts, it’s highly possible to to do cross world matching, I think it’s OK for management side to prepare a once a year event to have a cross world PvP event.

GameWatch - However preparing PvP for 15% of the user seems bit dynamic but is this because you like PvP personally? or are there other reasons behind it?
YoshiP - I believe in a MMORPG it has to be designed with online heirachy, a structure where top players of the community will pull other players, those 15% of the players don’t only play PvP they are top on everything. Therefore to have thoes top players reside in Eorzea I believe this is required. From player populatoin it’s onlly 15% but those 15% can affect a lot and I want to take care of them.
When looking at just FF you probably don’t need PvP but looking at global standard and long term servicing game I believe this system is required. Also PvP doesn’t have any goal, situation is also different. It’s same as a fighting game, there is never a situation occuring twice which is the appeal for PvP. Myself as an developer I want to make/challenge in creating a PvP which is FF like.

---

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post402107

I wouldn't want PvP to be like it is in WoW. I would like the option. Something like XI as well as an option to challenge someone to a dual. Maybe have the official system have you pick a nation to PvP for and your nation gets special rewards the higher it's standing is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kanjitai

I wouldn't want PvP to be like it is in WoW. I would like the option. Something like XI as well as an option to challenge someone to a dual. Maybe have the official system have you pick a nation to PvP for and your nation gets special rewards the higher it's standing is.

---

brenner and ballista didnt have reward and they both suck. btw WOW was not the first team to implement PVP in thier game fyi so comparing them beside ffxiv is stupid.

In a sense, there's been some PvP in older FF games.

*spoilers for FF2, FF4, FF7, FF10, FF12*

In FF2, when you beat yourself furiously to increase your HP. Because waiting for the enemy to hit you just doesn't cut it sometimes.

In FF4, Cecil and Kain jump a little girl, Cecil dueling Kain, like all young men when Cecil must fight himself, Party vs Yang, and when Rydia gets charmed by a lamia and casts Bahamut on the party ~ PvPness in progress!

In FF6, when you take four party members to the tyranosaurus and you kill three of them off so that Sabin gets more XP than everyone with his double XP relic, spamming Bum Rush til' Tyranosaurus dies.

In FF7, smacking Yuffie around in a forest, any fight against Sephiroth.

In FF10, Kimahri attacks the party and you have knock some sense into Kimahri ronso-head. Does fighting your aeons or Jecht count?

In FF12, fighting a former guest party member, or fighting a party member's twin brother.

I know this isn't really what you meant. But there have been the mad times where Final Fantasy characters must face against each other.

I do not feel it is proper to balance a game that is heavily PvE with direct PvP. It would be a different thing if two teams face off indirectly against each other.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bearforce

brenner and ballista didnt have reward and they both suck. btw WOW was not the first team to implement PVP in thier game fyi so comparing them beside ffxiv is stupid.

---

I know in Xi those two didn't give rewards. I'm saying a system like that but with rewards be nice. getting items and gear that you can only have if your nation has a certain rank

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kensredemption

At least with a PvP function it would give the elitists a legitimate reason to act like a bunch of pompous pricks. Go for it, and know that I won't be counted among them because I don't care to harass other players in such a manner. Just don't get between me and my Main Scenario quests.

---

stay off pvp servers in mmos and i guarantee you wont be harassed..

i would like pvp in this game but this game has a long way to go combat and control wise before i would pvp imo.

Having found out how the mechanics on medals work, I'm not comfortable voting in this form of poll. However, me?

Yes, I'd like PvP to be in the game, at least in its planned form, and as long as PvE is the primary balancing factor. The defining MMORPG for me was Ragnarök Online, and the collosseum/zone restricted mass siege-PvP is something I remember with a lot of favour. Although, again, PvE was the primary balancing element.

That said, War of Emperium on RO took place in areas people could travel through (often quicker than travelling via normal roads), making for seriously interesting travel during the war times. I suppose that nice little feature won't be coming over, given Naoki Yoshida's instancing fetish and all.

Not that I'd likely use the feature much myself, I just kinda like these things being there in the background and having a knock-on influence on the rest of the game through the economy and such. .. Well, maybe the Colosseum a bit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bearforce

brenner and ballista didnt have reward and they both suck. btw WOW was not the first team to implement PVP in thier game fyi so comparing them beside ffxiv is stupid.

---

i loved brenner, and ballista. >.> just because they weren't to your taste doesn't mean they sucked.

People never paid attention to it in XI. If you don't want it don't go to the island. I know that some skills may alter from it but I see them concentrating on the PvE more especially if the PvP gets low numbers.

why are we talking about brenner and ballista? it's coliseum and frontlines; the entire concept is different. if i see images of pvp being a 'sporting' game then i'll be worried. but usually you don't see trebuchets at a game where everyone goes home patting each other on the back saying 'good game'. looks like pvp in this one will mean business. ppl really need to let go of ffxi.

Yes... Yes we do want PvP. If you don't enjoy it, don't participate in it!

That is all.

like yoshida said, pvp lovers is hardcore players!

(he said it in an interview, exact wording might be incorrect)

Never been a fan of PvP in any MMO but it never bothered me when others participated.
If XIV makes it so it's fun for me that be great, if not and others enjoy it that's great too. Not going to lose any sleep over it.

I'm not a fan of PvP, but arena would be cool.

Just no random PKing, and its all good.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zantetsuken

I'm not a fan of PvP, but arena would be cool.

Just no random PKing, and its all good.

---

Exactly, that's actually the only thing that ever bothered me. Especially in Aion where you could be in the middle of soloing and a group running by just killed you.

Yes, we want it in Final Fantasy.

PvP was actually something I originally didn't want to see in XIV and didn't think it would fit... Though after what we've been told of their plans for it, I'm really looking forward to it and think it will have it's place. :3 (I'll enjoy it as long as... IF there is a jump function added to the game it will be kept out of PvP! I want PvP, not BunnyvBunny)

The pvp they talked about sounds like it won't effect the PvE part of the game, as long as that stays true I'm okay with it. I'm not usually a person who partakes in PvP but I have in certain games, even joined a PvP server in DCUO back when it ws p2p. I might partake in XIV's PvP and if it is fun, then yay, and if it has rewards, cool! It just can't have a great effect on the PvE balance. XI didn't totally care about the PvP balance, I liked that approach. Jobs/Classes are the way they are, if you get beat by one in PvP due to them being OP in PvP, they shouldn't get rebalanced to the point where their gimp in PvE now. If OP w/e w/e w/e occurs then find a way to balance people only when they enter that instance like many other modern mmos are doing...or don't balance it and say eff it.