Please, Developers, Please! Put an end to Easy Mode thinking

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

They should have just made FF14 a facebook game.

Then I wouldn't be so upset about a FF title being the complete opposite of its MMO predecessor.

They are really taking this game in the extreme opposite direction.

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like they said they always wanted to? its SE they dont do the same shit twice.

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Originally Posted by Cycloptichorn

Seeing as I wasn't responding to you with the post I wrote, I have no idea where your fit of rage is coming from.

The idea that having a chocobo to ride around on isn't 'stimulating,' because there's no quest for it that is challenging for an r50 player, is ridiculous. I can't say it any clearer than that. The quest would last what, an hour or two? We don't even know because it's not out yet (not that this has stopped you from bitching about it). But you'll be riding around on the damn thing for hours and hours and hours. Is the method of delivery of the content really more important than the enjoyment the content itself brings you? I say no, it is not.

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Ok, I now realize you were the OP; and yes, I found your OP to be ridiculous as well. I'll give you the same advice as Doctor Mog: suck it up or quit. This constant whining that emanates from some players here is unbecoming.

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My friend, read my posting history. (I realize that that's a ridiculous thing to ask, was being purely rhetorical, so I'll abbreviate it here: I'm in total support of this game and its new development team, and I mean no harm. I have written time and again to support the new direction of the game and to plead for patience. I am of the believe that good things come to those who wait, and I don't for a second think, like the whiners do, that the development team is somewhere sitting in water at a spa, sipping sake. I urge patience, and a wait-and-see attitude.)

My main concerns, however have to do with the cumulative sense of a certain lack of challenge, a generically, non-layered, shallow attitude in determining the hurdles of the game, and I think I should write to give my feedback, because I am becoming really concerned about it. I don't think I'm being negative, nor am I a disrespectful poster. Not once did I write rage into the post I addressed to you, so I am as surprised as you were at my (mind you, non-existing) rage. I don't mind having a heated debate, though.

I am not saying that I won't enjoy HAVING the chocobo. I will. I want one as much as you do. I'm just saying that I wont ejoy GETTING it as much as I should. It's the desires that keep us moving in these games, it's our coveting and wanting that makes us have fun. Not the owing. As a matter of fact, think of it... you gloat and bask in the glory of your newly acquired items, and two weeks later they're routine and you've moved to desiring something new.

But I wasn't yelling at you. Sorry if I came the wrong way. (Perhaps I shouldn't use single capitalized words for emphasis.) I don't come here to yell at anybody.

R
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"And indeed, Nathaniel, each one of my desires and my longings has enriched me more than the always deceitful possession of the object of my desire"
André Gide The Fruits of Earth

You did a R5 leve as a R25 and complained it was easy. Credibility is out the window.

As for some other whiners: Get off your fail-logic express. Grind does not equal difficulty.

OH NOES CHOCOBO FOR 3K SEALS BUT I WANT TO DRUDGE THROUGH THE SNOW AND FALL ON SPIKES SO I CAN FEEL SPECIAL WHEN I FINALLY GET IT!!

Who gives a shit, really? You've been teleporting for free for the last year and you're complaining about a mount's cost? I'm sorry if you want to feel superior to the peons as you ride on your derpobo but y'all need to get over yourselves. A game is supposed to be about fun, not about how long you made yourself suffer just to attain something. Go play FFXI or Lineage 2 if you want to grind your ass off.

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Originally Posted by EmeraldHill

You did a R5 leve as a R25 and complained it was easy. Credibility is out the window.

As for some other whiners: Get off your fail-logic express. Grind does not equal difficulty.

OH NOES CHOCOBO FOR 3K SEALS BUT I WANT TO DRUDGE THROUGH THE SNOW AND FALL ON SPIKES SO I CAN FEEL SPECIAL WHEN I FINALLY GET IT!!

Who gives a shit, really? You've been teleporting for free for the last year and you're complaining about a mount's cost? I'm sorry if you want to feel superior to the peons as you ride on your derpobo but y'all need to get over yourselves. A game is supposed to be about fun, not about how long you made yourself suffer just to attain something. Go play FFXI or Lineage 2 if you want to grind your ass off.

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I know personally i never said a grind was difficult, however grind is just a derogatory term coined up to counter the word progress. I find the whole "PWEASE PWEASE SE I DONT WANT PROGRESSION, I JUST WANT IT ALL NOWZZZ!!!!" to be ignorant and a lazy mentality.

I personally wouldn't find it fun to start at level cap with full gear, and anything i ever wanted just an NPC speech away, there's no character progression in that.

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Originally Posted by Bled

I know personally i never said a grind was difficult, however grind is just a derogatory term coined up to counter the word progress. I find the whole "PWEASE PWEASE SE I DONT WANT PROGRESSION, I JUST WANT IT ALL NOWZZZ!!!!" to be ignorant and a lazy mentality.

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Who is saying they want it all now?

What casual players want are some goals that can be achieved with a few hours of playtime a week. It's not instant gratification they want at all, just a significant experience that doesn't take up 40 hours a week like it was a second job.

Grinding is not a derogatory term. A game series like Disgaea prides itself on grinding. But at least they make the game accessible to those who don't want to achieve level 9999. It shouldn't be impossible for FFXIV to mix casual and hardcore content either.

The very best of what the materia system offers is hardcore content. Casual players just don't have the time to get anything better than the basics, unless by some miracle, hardcore players can make the good stuff affordable. There's an example of where a grind will make those with plenty of time to waste push further ahead than those who can't.

Getting a chocobo to raise doesn't require a grind; it's a transportation feature that should be reasonably accessible to the masses. It's silly to insist on it being hardcore. It didn't even require a grind in grind-happy FFXI. It's just a ridiculous demand that's out-of-place with the times.

i mentioned this in the yoshi thread, hopefully they read it and consider it for this game or at the least start to consider it for other mmo's they make. rather then make them all easy so it works for the masses, do kinda what diablo3 is doing. they have a hardcore mode where u lose all your stuff when u die, but they layered them onto same servers as everyone else.

rather then easy modes only or go hardcore only, or instead of seperate servers they can do this for mmo's in general.

layer hardcore players and casuals, separate there auction houses, set different rules for both for the specific things that make it so. and then still allow it to be full server of mixed players that can still do everything else together. caps and forced party, or low drop rates, and battle bosses being extremely challenging ...things like that for some then others it can be more lenient and easy, they have theres all quicker.

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Originally Posted by weeble

i mentioned this in the yoshi thread, hopefully they read it and consider it for this game or at the least start to consider it for other mmo's they make. rather then make them all easy so it works for the masses, do kinda what diablo3 is doing. they have a hardcore mode where u lose all your stuff when u die, but they layered them onto same servers as everyone else.

rather then easy modes only or go hardcore only, or instead of seperate servers they can do this for mmo's in general.

layer hardcore players and casuals, separate there auction houses, set different rules for both for the specific things that make it so. and then still allow it to be full server of mixed players that can still do everything else together. caps and forced party, or low drop rates, and battle bosses being extremely challenging ...things like that for some then others it can be more lenient and easy, they have theres all quicker.

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and once again you are incorrectly putting the casual = easy and hardcore = difficult scenario. i don't see the casuals in here asking for easy mode. i see them asking for options for different play styles(solo or party, questing or grind) and people attacking them for it. i haven't heard casuals in here complaining darkhold was too hard nor did i hear them saying the nm's were too difficult.

i see casuals asking for nothing more than not just adding time sinks that they cannot do. i don't see an issue with there they feel about that, but i wish there was some long term goals. the thing to me is they could do those long term goals like relic's or long quest items to where even the casual player can complete eventually.

they could make it to where it is a progression based type quest where you cannot access the next stage until you complete one section. each minor section could take an hour or so before you get access to the next part and have to move to another area. this would allow hardcore players(all i think of when i say hardcore is more time) to complete the quest in a few weeks/months, but would not exclude the casuals completely. sure it may take them a year to get that super elite item because they can only play one small piece a day, but at least they could feel like they were progressing towards it and would eventually be able to acquire it.

the thing i don't want to see is 1 spawn a week hnm's or whatever again. to me, that is not a good thing to have for hardcore or casuals. that's good for the ls's that use claim bots and nobody else.

remember i say this as one of the hardcore players, but i can still look and see where the casuals are coming from. casual payers are not wanting easy mode in general no more than hardcores all want to see 1 week mob spawns. i personally just think everyone wants a game in general that they can play and enjoy.

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Originally Posted by AmyRae

Who is saying they want it all now?

What casual players want are some goals that can be achieved with a few hours of playtime a week. It's not instant gratification they want at all, just a significant experience that doesn't take up 40 hours a week like it was a second job.

Grinding is not a derogatory term. A game series like Disgaea prides itself on grinding. But at least they make the game accessible to those who don't want to achieve level 9999. It shouldn't be impossible for FFXIV to mix casual and hardcore content either.

The very best of what the materia system offers is hardcore content. Casual players just don't have the time to get anything better than the basics, unless by some miracle, hardcore players can make the good stuff affordable. There's an example of where a grind will make those with plenty of time to waste push further ahead than those who can't.

Getting a chocobo to raise doesn't require a grind; it's a transportation feature that should be reasonably accessible to the masses. It's silly to insist on it being hardcore. It didn't even require a grind in grind-happy FFXI. It's just a ridiculous demand that's out-of-place with the times.

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Grinding is a term used in video gaming to describe the process of engaging in repetitive and/or non-entertaining gameplay in order to gain access to other features within the game.

Above is the definition of a grind and it has heavy derogatory overtones.

I get it casuals want to experience all the same content and achieve all the same goals, but lets face it guys weather you have time for a game or not should not reflect on the games development. I feel for the casual crowd having 40 hour jobs (like my self) and a life outside of video games is vary time consuming however just because you can only devout 10 hours a week should not mean that the game itself is ridiculously easy. A job is a paid position of regular employment which i know for a fact that a majority of you dont get payed to play video games so lets drop the "o my god this game takes time it must be a job"... A real job actually involves physical/mental work.

Disgaea does in fact pride itself on grinding yet that does not make the term any less derogatory, Disgaea if you have ever played it is a very humors title with an even more humors development team. When the developers of Disgaea made statements of the grind in their game it was for a lack of a better word, wrapped in humors satire.

time invested = reward if you don't invest the time =/= reward.

I agree the Chocobo achievement quest should not be a accumulate x amount of this seal and turn in, that's what ultimately lead to WoW's demise. Personally i would have liked to seen a deep story driven quest, with multiple layers for the chocobo license.

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Originally Posted by Bled

Grinding is a term used in video gaming to describe the process of engaging in repetitive and/or non-entertaining gameplay in order to gain access to other features within the game.

Above is the definition of a grind and it has heavy derogatory overtones.

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no, it is the truth. pulling the same mob over and over to kill it for hours on end is exactly that. standard bashing crafts for days on end making the same item is exactly that. they are both repetitive and non entertaining, but the only reason you do them is to gain sp/exp to gain ranks so you can do other things. they completely fit the definition you gave and it matches them both perfectly.

either way the point i was making was simple, there are many type of players and they all like different styles. instead of calling a game, one for the masses but still removing many of the game types and saying take it or leave it, cause theres more of the others players ...create a mmo that can work for all of them, seperate game styles. have the options to play them on easy medium hard, so to speak.

also i've seem plenty in the forums actually saying the dungeon was hard, not many though, an i am not trying to really say hardcore or casual. i should i guess use the words different playstyles instead since the only thing people will see is those 2 words in all of my thread instead.

these forums wouldn't be bustling with people complaining and argueing if we weren't all looking for something different from each other so why not layer servers to work for both, it is all i'm saying. catering to specific players or "the masses" is just another word for dumbed down. some don't want that, give us both. make a game from scratch to be hard, then dumb it down for some not all.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

no, it is the truth. pulling the same mob over and over to kill it for hours on end is exactly that. standard bashing crafts for days on end making the same item is exactly that. they are both repetitive and non entertaining, but the only reason you do them is to gain sp/exp to gain ranks so you can do other things. they completely fit the definition you gave and it matches them both perfectly.

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Welcome to MMO's if you don't like that PORTION of the game which resembles growth and progression, then your in the wrong genre. When you take out levels (leveling), skill, mobs, sp, exp, fighting, group fighting, what have you, well... you pretty much end up with a book (which is fine just not the reason i play games).

If something is difficult it takes invested time to reap the benefits.

If i had a super challenging fight yet i beat it on the first try, is that really truly difficult? Difficult is characterized as causing hardship or problems any content you can blow through with no problems makes things less difficult in my eyes.

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Originally Posted by Bled

Welcome to MMO's if you don't like that PORTION of the game which resembles growth and progression, then your in the wrong genre. When you take out levels (leveling), skill, mobs, sp, exp, fighting, group fighting, what have you, well... you pretty much end up with a book (which is fine just not the reason i play games).

If something is difficult it takes invested time to reap the benefits.

If i had a super challenging fight yet i beat it on the first try, is that really truly difficult? Difficult is characterized as causing hardship or problems any content you can blow through with no problems makes things less difficult in my eyes.

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how am i in the wrong genre? all i did was point out you made a completely false statement by saying someone is trying to cast an insult by using the word grind. i have no problems with grinding, but i also don't look at it as a bad thing. grinding is doing something over and over to get higher ranks and there is nothing wrong with it, but you acted like that word was some kind of profanity laced insult.

grinding is exactly what it is. it is grinding through the repetitive and boring aspect to gain access to other pieces of content and it is in most every rpg and mmo on the market. it is not a bad thing.

you showed a definition and stated it was insulting and all i did was point out that they were exactly what the definition implied it was. it is not a bad thing for something to be a grind so don't take saying it is a grind as some kind of personal attack.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

how am i in the wrong genre? all i did was point out you made a completely false statement by saying someone is trying to cast an insult by using the word grind. i have no problems with grinding, but i also don't look at it as a bad thing. grinding is doing something over and over to get higher ranks and there is nothing wrong with it, but you acted like that word was some kind of profanity laced insult.

grinding is exactly what it is. it is grinding through the repetitive and boring aspect to gain access to other pieces of content and it is in most every rpg and mmo on the market. it is not a bad thing.

you showed a definition and stated it was insulting and all i did was point out that they were exactly what the definition implied it was. it is not a bad thing for something to be a grind so don't take saying it is a grind as some kind of personal attack.

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If you enjoy it then why to you categorize it as non-entertaining... I like progressing my character so as a result i like growing levels by defeating mobs. and every aspect of the game has repetitive natures yet we avoid from calling them grinds why? because we actually enjoy them?

i stated that the term was derogatory not some insult, the term is disparaging and it dosent have to be if you don't label it as such..

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Originally Posted by Bled

If you enjoy it then why to you categorize it as non-entertaining... I like progressing my character so as a result i like growing levels by defeating mobs. and every aspect of the game has repetitive natures yet we avoid from calling them grinds why? because we actually enjoy them?

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grind can be very entertaining if done correctly. take weapons in moon(they were magic type) they took alot of work to do, pulling for brd was lots of fun for me even though repetitive. imps, specially at the lowest levels, any mob that needed debuffs and dispells, mages had a lot of work and grinds were very fun. thf? specially garleigh and lowbie levels, lining up and everything, fun fun fun all day. add something for every class to stay on top of an not be half afk eating chips and watching tv while do it and then it not boring.

gear itself the longer it takes to get the more happier u will be when it drops. the reality is weather u want a challenge or not, you are basically looking for a offline game. those take a week or month to beat no matter how hard, it's the grinds that keep you playing for years, it's progression, it's hard to get gear and weapons. or you move on to a new game like offliners. it will never matter how hard it is, outside of av hard, u still be done quick. and no matter how u look at it SE or any other game ain't putting out that much content.

we would have to pay like 80bucks a month for a game with enough content for everything to be without grind. aka cost of a offline game.

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Originally Posted by weeble

grind can be very entertaining if done correctly. take weapons in moon(they were magic type) they took alot of work to do, pulling for brd was lots of fun for me even though repetitive. imps, specially at the lowest levels, any mob that needed debuffs and dispells, mages had a lot of work and grinds were very fun. thf? specially garleigh and lowbie levels, lining up and everything, fun fun fun all day. add something for every class to stay on top of an not be half afk eating chips and watching tv while do it and then it not boring.

gear itself the longer it takes to get the more happier u will be when it drops. the reality is weather u want a challenge or not, you are basically looking for a offline game. those take a week or month to beat no matter how hard, it's the grinds that keep you playing for years, it's progression, it's hard to get gear and weapons. or you move on to a new game like offliners. it will never matter how hard it is, outside of av hard, u still be done quick. and no matter how u look at it SE or any other game ain't putting out that much content.

we would have to pay like 80bucks a month for a game with enough content for everything to be without grind. aka cost of a offline game.

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See i agree but because it is entertaining that debunks the whole definition of "grind" thus i call it progression and think of grind as derogatory.

I don't want this game to be hard like FFXI!! I like easy and non complicated quest. Grinding hour for just a freaking level IS NOT FUN! I mean, people got lives and doesn't have time to waste 5 hours to lvl up or do a quest you know ....

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Originally Posted by Cxplorer

I don't want this game to be hard like FFXI!! I like easy and non complicated quest. Grinding hour for just a freaking level IS NOT FUN! I mean, people got lives and doesn't have time to waste 5 hours to lvl up or do a quest you know ....

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then play an offline game, no one is here to pay 16bucks a month for offline game time, but without the great offline graphics and gameplay. offline seems perfect for ya, it takes no time to do ..i don't get it. i want to pay monthly for something that is less story wise, gameplay wise and time sink wise then any offliner in creation ..don't say cause party play cause most that don't want grind also don't want party play. the reality is you got plenty of time to play the mmo, we humans live to be like 70-90's these days, u got lots of time to play ... what the prob is u want to rape a game and toss it away for the next. mmo's aren't like that, ...at least they shouldn't be.

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Originally Posted by weeble

then play an offline game, no one is here to pay 16bucks a month for offline game time, but without the great offline graphics and gameplay. offline seems perfect for ya, it takes no time to do ..i don't get it. i want to pay monthly for something that is less story wise, gameplay wise and time sink wise then any offliner in creation ..don't say cause party play cause most that don't want grind also don't want party play. the reality is you got plenty of time to play the mmo, we humans live to be like 70-90's these days, u got lots of time to play ... what the prob is u want to rape a game and toss it away for the next. mmo's aren't like that, ...at least they shouldn't be.

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I payed for the game and I have my rights to ask what I desire in it! Freedom of speech yo!

Also,you don't ven know my gaming habits so don't talk about them when you don't know nothing about me or what I do in my life.

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Originally Posted by Cxplorer

I don't want this game to be hard like FFXI!! I like easy and non complicated quest. Grinding hour for just a freaking level IS NOT FUN! I mean, people got lives and doesn't have time to waste 5 hours to lvl up or do a quest you know ....

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Maybe it doesn't take everyone 5 hours to figure out a "complicated quest". If you don't have the "5 hours" it takes you to do anything that is difficult, challenging, or complex then here is a idea... don't do it. But why do you have such a need to deprive people who want challenge and depth in their game the opportunity? We pay for the game too, how about you respect our right to enjoy it also.

Add this user to your ignore list? I think so...

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Originally Posted by Cxplorer

I payed for the game and I have my rights to ask what I desire in it! Freedom of speech yo!

Also,you don't ven know my gaming habits so don't talk about them when you don't know nothing about me or what I do in my life.

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your rights yo! or no different them mine. i'm stating my opinions, don't cry over them ...just answer the questions in stead. your money is no diff then any one elses, but lets not take into account the history off all mmo's being a grind, lets not take into account that ffxi was a grind, lets just take into account what this game launched with and ...it was a grind in it. they all have and had grind, you payed for a game with grind in it and now your grasping se's crotch for no grind.

i also don't need to know your gaming habits, i'm making assumptions weather they right or not towards you, others are in the category. your rank 35 only says one thing that u not play for over a month since it takes 1hr to hit rank 12 and it probably take nothing to hit 35. there people hitting 45-50 in 1 day, so i know exactly your game type, it's not playing at all and still wanting what everyone has.

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Originally Posted by Bled

Grinding is a term used in video gaming to describe the process of engaging in repetitive and/or non-entertaining gameplay in order to gain access to other features within the game.

Above is the definition of a grind and it has heavy derogatory overtones.

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So, how do you ask for grinding if you're embarrassed to admit that's what it is you want? And will you really be surprised when you don't get it?

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Originally Posted by weeble

your rights yo! or no different them mine. i'm stating my opinions, don't cry over them ...just answer the questions in stead. your money is no diff then any one elses, but lets not take into account the history off all mmo's being a grind, lets not take into account that ffxi was a grind, lets just take into account what this game launched with and ...it was a grind in it. they all have and had grind, you payed for a game with grind in it and now your grasping se's crotch for no grind.

i also don't need to know your gaming habits, i'm making assumptions weather they right or not towards you, others are in the category. your rank 35 only says one thing that u not play for over a month since it takes 1hr to hit rank 12 and it probably take nothing to hit 35. there people hitting 45-50 in 1 day, so i know exactly your game type, it's not playing at all and still wanting what everyone has.

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We don't need to follow the norms of MMORPG. Thinking different and also do something different is good too. Innovation is what this game needs and making it harder won't do that.

R45-50 in one day?! How?! When?! Where?! loll

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Originally Posted by EmeraldHill

You did a R5 leve as a R25 and complained it was easy. Credibility is out the window.

As for some other whiners: Get off your fail-logic express. Grind does not equal difficulty.

OH NOES CHOCOBO FOR 3K SEALS BUT I WANT TO DRUDGE THROUGH THE SNOW AND FALL ON SPIKES SO I CAN FEEL SPECIAL WHEN I FINALLY GET IT!!

Who gives a shit, really? You've been teleporting for free for the last year and you're complaining about a mount's cost? I'm sorry if you want to feel superior to the peons as you ride on your derpobo but y'all need to get over yourselves. A game is supposed to be about fun, not about how long you made yourself suffer just to attain something. Go play FFXI or Lineage 2 if you want to grind your ass off.

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As usual, those that lose the sense of propriety the earliest, are the ones that make the least sense.

I'm not complaining about difficulty or the lack thereof. I'm complaining about the lack of challenge, depth and complexity... Perhaps you're unable to discern the difference, but believe me you, there is one.

As to my doing the leve at that rank, I wasn't expecting hard fights. I wanted to check out the new sidequests, which had been deployed just then. The quest I did was the only one I could find after running around the city and, being somewhat intelligent, I said to myself "I'll probably be able to see how sidequests are deployed, even if the mobs are too squishy for me." My issues with that quest, and every single other one I've encountered in the game, was not the strength of the mobs, but rather the fact that there was no build up to face the mobs, no environmental puzzle to solve, not even one degree of hurdling to make the quest feel like an adventure. And also, the fact that there were 17 mobs eagerly waiting to be slaughtered, just parked in a corner of the universe. I forgot to mention that every single one of them dropped the item that was required. Mobs, I might add, that existed nowhere else. The implementation of the quest seemed makeshift, inorganic, and not an integral part of the world.

I care for this game and I want it improved. I'm not whining, I'm giving constructive, and sometimes exasperated criticism. I am not a developer, not a game designer. I am a player and my criticism and review of the structures of the game come from my perspective, which is an important one, just as yours is.

I advocate for a game that can include both your vision and mine, but I don't believe we'll get there without level-headed, well-intentioned, respectful, articulate, and constructive criticism, and the dialog that ensues from that. I'm doing my part.

R

I've said this time and time before:

This game has always been openly developed and advertised as a more casual game. If that's not what you're seeking, you're playing the wrong game.

But to be fair, the game has actually gotten harder as time has gone on:

* Reduction of party size from 15 to 8 means you can't just throw more healers/damage at a problem. Party build is actually needed.

*Battle mechanics changes required players to re-learn their classes as well as actually manage their enmity and MP in the case of mages.

*Certain classes can't solo everything including the big NMs anymore.

*Leve fail/repeat was taken out, rewards for most things are now given for actually completing them instead of manipulating a system.

Yeah, the game is still a bit easy but they have been pushing it to be a bit more challenging.

As far as your complaints about the side-quests, they're just little bits of content meant mostly for the interesting lore and the reward. Yeah they could do some things to make this a little more interesting but the ease would be there regardless. Quest markers, the journal pointing you in the right direction, etc... are all meant to streamline the experience. You can't really complain about not running across difficult monsters on an R5 quest. It's an R5 quest, it's supposed to be easy. Go tell me "Knock in the Night" is easy solo at the specified rank.

Edit: There's another side-quest for Copperbell Mines I believe that involves killing undead, try that one solo at the appropriate rank. Not so easy now is it?

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Originally Posted by Rutelor

.... not even a brief wait for re-spawn???

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Oh yes, there is nothing more challenging than waiting briefly.

Solo stuff is going to be as easy as you make it. Turn up the difficulty if you want or go fight higher level mobs.

The depth and complexity will be focused on Party play and PVP.

At the rate they are releasing easy mode content the more likely it's going to stay Free to Play... I would never pay to play a game that is just as easy as every other free to play mmo let alone an unfinished easy mode mmo...

In fact, I don't even play as we speak. I have not logged in for months. I check in every now and then hoping to read some good news...

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Originally Posted by Cxplorer

We don't need to follow the norms of MMORPG. Thinking different and also do something different is good too. Innovation is what this game needs and making it harder won't do that.

R45-50 in one day?! How?! When?! Where?! loll

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The norms of an MMORPG are what makes an MMORP.. if you took away those key aspects wtf would you call it? SE obviously has done just that and now look how their game turned out. FF11 still has a bigger player base than 14. Other FTP MMO have greater success than ff14 and I can guarantee you that future FTP MMO will be more popular than FF14 only because they utilize the norms of an MMORPG and then build off that.

well but they could have a done a quest where they tell you why the chocobos numbers were limited, like a great treat on them and you had to do a few objectives, like rescuing from beastman strogholds, killing predators that are really hard to kill, i dont know but something that makes you feel that you have accomplish something, like you can rent a chocobo, but if you want one for your own you need to do that quest that needs several r30 ppls to complete or just a few r50's to complete.


So the new guys will have a goal to focus on since the begining, i remember when i first came to FFXI it was like 3years online already, and seeing my friend renting chocobos and i couldnt, made me had a goal to get it so when i was leveling i was thinking in all that juicy stuff that was there but i needed to do lots of things before getting those so at the end you could taste all the hard work after achieving your goals.


I agree that we need stuff like that so even hardcore and casuals will have a good time

Alot of people complain about easy mode but people don't seem to understand THEY ARE STILL BUILDING THE BEGINNING OF THE GAME so when new players come into the game they have plenty to do, when they start getting towards the end of remodeling the beginning of the game you will start see some content with plenty of challenge and plenty of things to strive for.

Alot of people are getting player friendliness and easy mode confused remember this is still content for the BEGINNING of the game and it will take ALOT of time before you see challenge hit FFXIV. Anyone who played FFXI can tell you that they really liked it but it lacked alot of player friendliness in the form of huge time sink crap and a big lack of basic info that helps a player save time to get to do what they like doing quicker and easier which is what you get alot more of in FFXIV without the huge time sinks. If you want a challenge from this game you'll either be waiting along of time or you won't, players that have been playing for the last year or so with some max ranks fall by the wayside for the re-releases set to happen for the PS3 and PC therefore they have to have a solid foundation for the re-release, challenging endgameish content comes later.

Another one of these posts. They never end.

It's very difficult to find a Party (and manage your LS)...there's your Hardcore Content. ;>P

Easy?
Hard?
Long as the game is engaging and fun I don't care.

I would like to see more areas added to explore, large scale battles that take planning similar to dynamis and high end content that is hard but only hard if you don't plan things properly. Also leves should be left for the casuals that way they can still level up solo if they want but one major thing they should do is offer benefits for party play, I think the reason an MMO should work is because their is a comunity feel to the game and I think that's why XI worked well because it forced party play. now I'm not saying force party play but if their was some major insentive to party with strangers then you would meet new people and go out and have fun adventures. at the moment no one forms a party to go level with strangers because they can just do it solo hell I soloed (and duoed a little) to get MRD to 50 in just a few months and it really didn't take that much effort, if they reduced leve SP rewards and boosted party fighting SP I think that would get people out there adventuring with each other and not just doing solo grinding and solo leves because to me getting MRD to 50 on XIV was boring as hell because I hardly shared the experience with anyone, it was just me stood in an empty corner of a field map killing things. Also party play and skillful play go hand in hand, make the mobs a challenge so we NEED to use a tank along side a DD and a healer etc, and not just pick a class and solo it to 50, team work is fun and makes it feel more rewarding when you complete something.

I'm waiting on an expansion pack to hopefully bring new content in the form of areas to explore, oh remember that feeling when you'd just beaten the last promy boss and you appeared in a new area you'd never been to before? awesome! I want to feel that again...

Don't expect it to change, they either apparently lack the skill or the game engine simply can't handle any interesting mechanics.

Like someone else pointed out in another thread, in other games you'll get a quest to extinguish a fire. The quest will visually give you a water bucket and have you splash water on the fire etc. In this game you get a ??? on the ground, click it and QUEST COMPLETE! epic firefighting skills.

Whatever though, SE has seemed to marked this type of gameplay as their style and refuse to stray from it.

HAY GUYS I SOLO'D A R5 QUEST AT R25 THIS GAME IS TOO EASY!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by EmeraldHill

HAY GUYS I SOLO'D A R5 QUEST AT R25 THIS GAME IS TOO EASY!!!!!!!!!!!

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u mad bro?

Maybe he used a horrible example but doesn't mean he isn't correct.

Darkhold cleared in bikinis. Nuff said

I didn't speak about hard fights, I spoke about challenge, born from depth and complexity. I would also like sidequests (and everything else int he world) to seem organic and unified, not--like my example in the OP--a makeshift addition, all seams and clumsy design, if there was any design at all.

I don't have anything about a casual game, on the contrary. I just don't think we should slack the vigilance about laid-back design, rushed design and boring game structures, whichever they might be.

trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls trolling genuine players.

i find the game plenty challenging, i definately don't count myself as hardcore, and i personally believe that the chocobo/seals deal is fine. Got to do three grand company quests and then caravan defense for the rest of those seals. OR get to R45 and have a good group for darkhold to do into the dark for the 4k seals.

i'd say that's plenty enough challenge to warrent being rewarded.

Things will be no doubt easy for Rank 50 players right now, because at this moment they're the creme de la creme. And there is no true endgame content for them to strive at right now i'll admit. but you must understand that just because it's not there RIGHT NOW doesn't mean it won't come. There's so many things being worked on that take precidence, if you're not enjoying yourself, take a damn break.

It's not like you're paying anything right now anyway to justify your apparent anguish.

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Originally Posted by Rutelor

"Your quest is to kill 5 Stuffed Dodos...! Oh... Yes... BTW... Here's the exact spot where they will be waiting for you to slaughter them."

That should've been enough to ring alarm bells, but, optimistically, I ran to the indicated spot, thinking that perhaps, on the way there, I would be overcome by difficulty and strife... but no. It was just a stroll in the park to get to the spot. Actually, that day, I didn't even cross a r1 mob, NONE!

But nothing really prepared me to what was going to follow: On arrival to the loudly marked point on my map, I encountered 17 fat, non-agressive, low-rank Dodos impatiently fighting each other for the turn to meet my deadly wand. I killed 10 of them with one AoE and the completion message appeared. I was r25 at the time, and the sidequest might have been a r5 one, but still... really, SE? Not a brief search, or some environmental puzzle, not even a brief wait for re-spawn???

Still, my optimist self decided "Oh, it's too early for complaints, they cannot be this obvious! They'll fix the spawn rate later, or something.... They just introduced the sidequests, there's tweaking to come, no doubt...! Besides, it's only a r5 quest!"

Ha!

Let's jump over the myriad other disappointments concerning challenge in this game that have slowly but surely set on since then. Let's turn to today's announcemets:

And now, you are introducing one of the most sought-after features to the game, one of the most desired items ever, and without any sense of build-up you announce simultaneously that any player (ok, not "any" but almost) will be able to both rent AND own chocobos. And I say to myself "Ah, but no doubt the quest to acquire the right to own them will be formidable... it will be peppered with peril, sacrifice and death!!"

Well, not really. You might as well have planted 17 grazing chocobos right next to the dodos, and made us go to the spot, touch one and have it instantly develop feelings of affection for us. For crying out loud!!!! We can still rent them! Do you really have to give us a title of ownership for meager 3k seals????

Is this how this game is going to be? For real?? I've wasted myself and my reputation defending, you, SE. Now, please, please... Deliver!

We come to these games to feel like heroes, not to pay you so that you stroke our egos by calling us one at the turn of 3000 seals. Just getting the right to rent chocobos, one of the great stimulating engines of low-level FFXI players was ten times harder (and more fun) than that!

Depth, complexity, challenge... not easy, breezy, hello-kitty stuff. I already own a Free Realms account, thankyouverymuch!

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Please go jump off a cliff

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Originally Posted by Burn

Please go jump off a cliff

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please ..you first :)