2.2 has sucked all the fun out of the game...

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

You're on Diabolos. If you don't like people complaining about being gated, Hows about you and the rest of your static help me get a Titan X win? :)

Seriously... I know the whole fight, don't have lag and I normally never get hit and even with echo I can't get a win. I'm not really sure what else I can do here.... I'm not going to pay 500K plus just to be able to move on to newer content.

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Don't you have an FC of friends you can scrounge up to do this? I mean..2 weekends ago we spent a few hours unclogging the Titan Ex drain and got 6 of our members through it. Can't your FC do that too?

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

I mean..2 weekends ago we spent a few hours unclogging the Titan Ex drain and got 6 of our members through it. Can't your FC do that too?

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I've asked a few times, but only one person spoke up (saying they'd help later on). I don't like to be a pest, so I've just been trying to PF it. I've never been that guy to ask for FC help every time I need anything.. I normally only ask in desperation. I have a feeling the people capable of downing it can't stomach doing it over and over in order to help out all of the FC members that need it (who can blame them?). Plus, with the new patch, they're all busy doing things they actually want to do or need to progress their own characters. I'd feel bad trying to guilt people into stopping what they're doing to help me.

I'll keep PFing it, but after doing it every day for the last few weeks, it's getting to a point where I don't really look forward to logging in anymore.

I must be on of the few that love 2.2 then
I took a break during 2.1 and came back recently and I absolutely love the new 2.2 main scenario, Hildibrand and the addition to tribe quests
And I've been crying out for leviathan for ages, even with no drops I will happily help those that need it

I bought Dark Souls II when Patch 2.2 was released so I probably will return for 2.3 if it contains either a new class/job or the that other form of PvP(Homeland? Homefront?) I forgot the name but I am highly anticipating information on those upcoming features.

Eh I like it. The fate part isnt the most fun but you dont have to do it anyway. there are 3 different i100 weapons. I like the new dungeons. I like the new gear i can use for glamour from them(bard chest is nice).

The Zodia was designed for the grind. I dont like it per se, but i can deal with it since i want to ultimately see where it ends up. It won't be the best weap in the game(that's only for coil), but it could be an alternative to the i110 tome weap later on.

And i got my belt and head from t6 so I''m peachy ;)

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

well for the new dungeon, i do have a paladin i87 and a monk i92... the ilevel recquire normally is far below, then yeah it's easy. they really need to add ilevel sync.. it become ridiculous.

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I've downed them both easily at a hair under 60 on Blm and War with strangers. That's how easy they are. They really need to spread the difficultly out a bit more so I don't have to deal with raging speed runners in ridiculously easy content.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

I'll keep PFing it, but after doing it every day for the last few weeks, it's getting to a point where I don't really look forward to logging in anymore.

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Honestly, if it's between quitting or asking for help then just ask. Go "Hey guys, I'm not trying to be a bother, but I'm having a hell of a time getting a win in PF. Can you guys help me out real fast so I can progress?" If they say no then you might need a new FC. :/ FC's should exist so that members help one another. The hope being that one day you'll be able to help the next group that gets stuck.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Honestly, if it's between quitting or asking for help then just ask. Go "Hey guys, I'm not trying to be a bother, but I'm having a hell of a time getting a win in PF. Can you guys help me out real fast so I can progress?" If they say no then you might need a new FC. :/ FC's should exist so that members help one another. The hope being that one day you'll be able to help the next group that gets stuck.

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wish I could 'like' this multiple times. Pay it forward. :)

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Originally Posted by Araeya

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I'd like to point out that I like Araeya's perspective the most out of the posts I've been reading.

I agree that there are avenues for the "hardcore" that wants to do the endgame content full of challenges, as well as those that want to get similar gear, yet without the more "hardcore" (term used loosely) aspect. Personally, I feel like the two roads just don't mesh very well; the people that love grinding will love the Relic, while the people that want to do Coil will do Coil, and Echo buff will make content easier and more accessible.

It all sounds good on paper. In practice, there are a few issues that I have, but no system is perfect.

-Atma is extremely time consuming (as intended, you may say, but I think the rates are kind of asinine). The 2nd half of the quest seems well enough alone, but the first being extremely luck based is going to cause frustration for people who are just plain unlucky. No one wants to grind for the sake of grinding; if Fates inherently had some sort of reward other than experience (and Seals had more applications), they wouldn't be so dead, in my opinion. Add in the fact that you're doing low-level ones with 90% of your skills locked and it becomes very mind-numbing with no real sense that you're actually doing anything.

-Extreme mode Primals: I seriously do not get with the big deal is on this one. Since when have any Primals not required you to beat the other ones first? Titan's a roadblock, fine, but I don't know how anyone could have figure an Extreme fight would not require you to do the other Extremes first. O_o

-Echo buffs will make things easier and will help groups immensely, but I think that they won't help a lot of instances where the actual cause of the problem is something else; you still won't be able to strong-arm a lot of the content. I think that's the problem with a lot of the "hard" content; you can just brute-force a lot of it with the high ilvl gear, and a lot of people are going to want to wait for Echo buffs. I was trying to help a friend do Titan HM and a lot of players don't even want to attempt it until Echo kicks in. You are still going to have people that don't want to learn the content, only now they'll be more likely to do it because they have more "I can haz win?" buttons in the form of high gear that's obtained fairly easily, is effective, and Echo. It kind of kills the experience for a lot of people.

I think we already covered that not all FCs have enough members ready for Coil or are available for your playing hours (or some have members that just can't be bothered, but that probably means you are better off moving on), so I won't keep beating a dead horse there.

It really just feels like there are more ways to get "stuck" between the two routes and that's what can really lead to the frustrations...but there's really nothing one can do about the dungeons except keep trying. I am totally for Atma drop rates being increased, though. Its already a long grind to the finish line as it is.

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Originally Posted by MrEzekial

Dude.. people don't remember what playing FFXI was actually like.

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People who claim this game has hardcore "grind" never played xi, played it and quit, or simply lie about playing it.

Se is trying to balance content to please both hardcore and casuals, players pissing off about 2.2 grind don't get it, or simply don't care, id bet on don't care.

The next patch will most likely introduce a ton of casual content, at which point hardcore players will scream bloody murder.

"Something" has to block access to endgame content, be it titan ex or whatever, again they don't care.

CoP in old pre-nerf days had "artificial difficulty" to it, a much worse mechanic than RNG, you did everything right and still lost, titan ex isn't any more trouble than old school CoP, again they never played, quit , or lied.

What was left out of the comment describing titan ex being so much more trouble than old-school CoP, was that getting people to carry you through it after they had already done it was nigh impossible, most of the gear sets they had for it were sold off so they had to re-aquire them, or better yet they expected "you" to farm it all up for them. Most simply didn't want to ever see CoP again, until they nerfed it at least.

I suppose it's a fair observation to say grind is defined differently by different players, as far as I am concerned, there is "no" grind in 14.

The only things I really don't like about 14 is being forced by DF/PF into playing with asshats outside of my FC, all content should be FC accessible, but that's my opinion, the targeting system, and the way voke works on paladin.

As always someone will probably point out this toon doesn't have any of this content I have mentioned done, don't bother, I play a different hyur female now.

2.2 honestly I feel was a small step in the right direction for this game, the path is was on was 100% unsustainable longterm for a large segment of the population.

So far pre-2.2 the game has catered to only those with limited time. The weekend warriors. Once mastered the games content took maby 4-5hrs a week to do everything worthwhile in the game. For a hardcore player that 1/7 days worth of playtime.

Long term content and things that are not insta-drop where needed. And I hope SE ignores the so called 90% that is saying how horrible this is... because 95% of the game is already geared to those people. Casual need to stop whining when 100% of everything is not catered to them. Hell the Upgraded relics in general are gimp even when fully upgraded when compared to the BIS piece.

People who hate working for items... do one of the many alternatives this game has....... This is how a mmo should be made content for everyone, not content for the lowest denominator or largest segment of players only.

Now with that said almost everyone I meet hates the relic system. Casuals, midcores, and hardcore alike. The casuals hate it because it requires a huge time sink, many hardcores hate it because the weapon requires work and it is subpar, Other hardcores hate it because it forces us to do FATES which huge segments of the population just hate all together. Midcores are some of everything it seems.


SE needs to revamp longterm content:
1) Make it equivalent to the BIS gear when 100% drops are not garenteed. Make the work worth it.
2) Base some of the goals on guilds. Require more then mindless solo zerg. Longterm goals are more bearable when you are doing them with a guild or friends.
3) Stop making items strait Stat increases.
4) STOP PUTTING CONTENT IN FATES!!!!!!


To the casuals who are flipping out because 5% of the game is not for them. Deal with it and play the other content that was designed for you or quit, stop trying to ruin it for those who want stuff to do after more then 10hrs a week of playtime. Remember Relic Weapons are not any better then stuff that drops from Non-Grind related activities.

- I began crafting an item needed (50 High Quality total) for my new crafting weapon. After I ran out of High Quality resources, I moved on to the Normal Quality resources. To my amazement, I was able to craft
at perhaps a 85% High Quality pass rate. During the process I converted my old tool and melded another one gaining 1 extra craftmanship skill. Went on to attempt to craft up the rest of my non
HQ resources only to have a 2% HQ pass rate. (I did not upgrade my tool enough to change my progress rotation) All i did was fail, fail, fail, fail. I went back a few hours later. Same thing: fail.
Equipped another tool like the one i was using before, and did nothing but pass. I was penalized for having BETTER equipment! This game is fail lmao indeed!!!

I'm having more fun now than I've had since launch. :)

I agree with all of what Xatsh has to say here (post 131), and because of time I am "not" hardcore, the real problem with this game is the players not the content.

The mass % of players want easy-mode, the rest want challenge-mode, either way content gets devoured at such a rate SE cant hope to produce it fast enough.

To those who feel 10% of the player base should simply be ignored I would point out that 10% of sub fee profits lost would also mean 10% less investment capital for future content.

Casuals and hardcore I understand, elitists (generally assholes) I refuse to tolerate.

I am not now nor will I ever be a white knight or fanboy, I have a deep hatred for EA and a simmering one for Ubisoft, SE isn't that bad a company, I have played f2p stuff with many more stability and bug issues.

SE will get content out for both casuals and hardcore, they have already done so, people need to just quit crying and be more patient, maybe even (gasp) go outside.

I expect the real measure of 14s future success or failure will start to show with the first expansion next year, until then doom and gloom is mere opinion.

Later, have fun, going "outside" now.

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Originally Posted by Wicc

I'm having fun

http://media.giphy.com/media/14tFISDCGJyIjS/giphy.gif

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Same here.

I honestly don't know how anyone could say 2.2 sucked the fun out of the game? Did SE remove any part of what was fun before? To me, they made old content more accessible for everyone and added content.

And as for the atma fate grind. It seems to me like it was a good idea. (hear me out) Yes, at first, there were swarms of people doing fates for atma so lower lvl people couldn't participate. But the hype is wearing off and many people are done with fates. So higher lvl people doing fates can actually be helpful to others who are leveling. And what about the fates that need to be completed to unlock CT? Most people cannot solo those. And people who have already unlocked CT wouldn't participate in those fates otherwise. So the atma farm is helpful to those that need those fates to unlock CT.

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Originally Posted by Gumiho

blah blah blah

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I am not Asian or a robot, I only play a few hours a day a couple days a week for the past few months, and I managed to kill Twintania every week after the world first twister nerf. I don't see why you are complaining about the content blockage of Twintania. If you can't kill it--and even with the echo buff now--then you're clearly not ready for the content after, as it doesn't get any easier.

You're not going to have a good time playing alone, and that's the same with all MMO's. There is no respectable MMO I can think of where you can do end game content without a dedicated group.

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Originally Posted by Alipoprocks

So the atma farm is helpful to those that need those fates to unlock CT.

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You obviously haven't done the atma grind, or started myth farming/books. You're trying to give your input on something you haven't done.

I am having more fun than ever before

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Originally Posted by MrEzekial

You obviously haven't done the atma grind, or started myth farming/books. You're trying to give your input on something you haven't done.

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Yes, I have. I didn't take it too serious the first week. Also have had horrible luck, but at least I have 8 now. And as for the books, I am looking forward to the goal oriented nature of them. I experience the books through the members in my FC who are on them as well as my daughter's account of her experience with them.

So, yes, I can.

And I don't plan on spamming Brayflox for myth because upgrading my weapon is not that serious. My allagan weapon is good enough for now.

You clearly have an attitude problem.

For the most part I have been enjoying the new content and exploring the new instances however I see the ATMA fates as a huge time suck so I just don't bother wasting my time on them. I'll catch a fate here and there if I run across one on my travels but I just do not see the point of spending hours upon hours like many of my LS mates only to log at the end of the night with nothing to show for it. The Zodiac quest just seems lazily implemented IMO.

I like 2.2, particularly the 3 new dungeons, very fun.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2012/1...est_violin.gif
:P

But seriously, i'm getting bored of these posts. People moaned and complained that nothing required work, everything was too easy, they had no reason to go to old zones, they wanted reasons to keep playing on more than 1 day a week, and this patch started to remedy that (and not just with Atma). The drop rate MIGHT be a bit too low sure (i've not seen an official stat on what it is actually set to, so I can't give a proper opinion on that), but this is definately a (admittedly small) step in the right direction of providing longer term content that will keep people invested. This stuff was never meant to be farmed in one shot, it's SUPPOSED to be a long term goal that you dabble in every so often. And i'm loving the effect it's having on making lower level areas feel even more alive than they already were.
And if you don't want to do it, fine, just do Coil every week for your gear like you always have... nobody is making you.

Love 2.2, Can't complain about nothing to do haha.

[QUOTE=OMEGAlomania;2021320]http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2012/1...est_violin.gif
:P

But seriously, i'm getting bored of these posts. People moaned and complained that nothing required work, everything was too easy, they had no reason to go to old zones, they wanted reasons to keep playing on more than 1 day a week, and this patch started to remedy that (and not just with Atma).


Except this isn't what either casuals or hardcore players want, what they want is easy mode/hardcore patches consisting of the content volume equivalent of the old novel "War and Peace" every 3 months or threaten ragequit.

All for $.50cents per day, which of course is also outrageous.

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Originally Posted by coffeepotz

Love 2.2, Can't complain about nothing to do haha.

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this is exactly where i stand with 2.2. i am loving it and i have something to do every single day instead of playing one day a week and then logging off for the next 6. i am glad they gave the atma quest and as soon as i finish books to get my blm anubis i'm starting on my scholar weapon next.

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Can't complain about nothing to do haha.

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Technically speaking, this is accurate. The problem is that there isn't anything I feel like doing. Mindless FATE spam + competing against RNG for *twelve*(?!) drops just isn't fun to me, and most of the new content is gated behind other content that I've yet to be able to beat.

Every patch there are always the minority/majority few that complains that the game is too grindy. Why? Its usually because they feel they are lagging behind. There are still quests and stuffs you still need to do before you can complete/attempt instances in 2.2. Like for example:

1. Have you killed Twintania? Well no ? Then work on it. Its 2.1 content but its a a GAME content that you have to do to get into 2nd coil of Bahamut. Its not like you killed Twintania 20 times before 2.2. Well NO. If you cant attempt it blame on no one but yourself. Its easier with party finder. Just open a practice party. Filter the players lacking in skills. Open a linkshell and get the good ones to practice with. Sooner or later you get into a static and things get more fun.

2. Gears. It was exactly the same with 2.1. We still need to farm for myth with weekly lock of 450. We still have 2 loots per turn every week and pray for good RNG. Its the same. So why complain now? Again. Because they are lacking so far back. They just want SE to put them in the same starting point with players who make an effort to gear and clear content. Really? #NOYOLOSWAG. Gears in 2.1 are not deemed obsolete in 2.2. You need them to attempt 2.2 content. Just progress nicely and you be able to get into content sooner rather than later.

3. Primals. Before Extreme. It was Hard Mode. Most people couldn't even get past Titan without a carry paying millions of gil for it. Then Extreme came. People pay for it. Well. Cant do Levi ? Its the same cycle since 2.1. So why complain now ? Why.. Because again lacking in game. Others are already clearing and farming it while you cant attempt it because you slack during 2.1. Casuals problem? Well i know a lot of casual players in game who could get their weapons and stuffs. They don't log in 24/7. They have jobs and kids to be responsible for. So whats your reason?

Its funny seeing people complain about content. Well SE did not obligate you to play, so whats stopping you? Don't complain about stuff being grindy, its too difficult, its too long.

Farming fates for ATMA? Goodness Gracious. Its not even a month since 2.2 and people are complaining about the drops. The next patch is in 3 months. Its suppose to sustain you for 3 months. If content are suppose to be done in a week or two. Its going to get boring and more players will quit. Its all about sustainability. Take your time. Don't get burnt out doing content. People with ilvl100 weapons, SO? Play it at your own phase. Just so you are able to clear content and go on to the next patch.

Personally for me i don't even bother with getting server first or world first? Why? Because there is still more to outside life than achieving those stuffs in game. Your friends quitting but you love this game ? Leave the FC, leave your friends. If your friends are only restricted to online communications and not outside life then i feel sorry for you and your friends. Leave them and join another FC/group. A FC/group that is willing to bring new players and tackle new content together. Sticking around for a friend has brought me no where in game. Finally i made the decision to go solo and find 7 others to form a static. Finally. After so long. Just after 2.2. We got our finalised 8. It was long but it was worth it.

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Originally Posted by whoopeeragon

Atma quest isn't the only thing they added in 2.2, you know...

Levi X.
Moogle X.
Coils.
3 new dungeons.

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All true, but if you think about it, many people have been trying to defeat Titan EX for months and it is a massive roadblock to being able to enjoy the new primals. (Echo serves as almost zero help in this fight)

Now you may say well you don't deserve to fight Moogle and Levi ex if you can't beat Titan, but both fights aren't anywhere near as hard as Titan Ex, its really odd game design to put easier content after harder content and has locked out a huge portion of the player base from enjoying the so called "new" content.

The 3 new dungeons are all great but extremely easy and have devolved into speed run rinse and repeat rubbish.

Coil 2 being locked out if you haven't beat Twintania is fine IMO because there is a understandable progression there, but I don't see why this is the case with Primals.