Awfully weak story... or is it? [WARNING:SPOILERS]

OP: your argument begs a political discussion about pro/anti big government. The downside of Gaius is that, like Aristotle, he believes that government belongs in the hands of an elite minority (the aristocracy).

Whereas the Grand Companies (more so in the case of Gridania and especially Limsa Lominsa than the Sultanate of Uldah) espouse a more power to the people, small government-style of leadership.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

If you consider enslavement/pillage/rape of entire nations as "the right" then, I suppose.

---

Who did Gauis rape? He enslaved and pillaged Ala Mihgo, but you know what? With how every single Ala' Mighan npc acts, I could honestly say I hope they never get it back. He brought stability and prosperity to another city as told by his 2nd-in-command.

Well duh when I was talking with gaius in the last dungeon he asked me who I was fighting for eorzea, myself or friends. I picked my myself if I could I would slash into friends there too. When he said do I believe in eorzea I went lol no. As a black mage eorzea would murder my friends and not bat an eyelid and after doing all the quests to 50 I no longer trust anyone. Ishgard was the worst country I have ever been to.

Plus after watching gridania 1.0 and the doing the quests here in 2.0 I could see why the dusk elves stayed under ground instead of living in the forest and the resistance fighters? Oh we won't save his life because the forest said so even as he is bleeding out! Ul'dah spending loads of times screwing over their own nation, corrupt guards everywhere exploiting refugee's and doing anything under the sun. A woman was going to be sold into sexual slavery and the crowd did nothing and don't get me started on the whole kobold issue. Titan did not try to temper you like the other primals he wanted to kick your ass since you broke the oath and started murdering kobolds.

Personally? If I had the choice? I would not want to join a grand company but the game forced me. Plus that garlean roe general? His country got better after the empire took it.

There are no bad guys here.

Overall seriously? Screw everyone I don't care anymore.(Apart from cid :X) I am now fighting for myself and my beastmen black mage buddies. Plus after reading the lore forum I am questioning how good hydaelyn actually is. Anyway it won't matter since I am going to the void when I die since I am a black mage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinros

Plus after watching gridania 1.0 and the doing the quests here in 2.0 I could see why the dusk elves stayed under ground instead of living in the forest and the resistance fighters? Oh we won't save his life because the forest said so even as he is bleeding out!

---

That scene with Grienfarr during the GLA class quests in 1.0 wasn't because 'the forest said so', that was just the stuck up Wood Wailers talking, simply because Grienfarr was a GLA who 'fights for profit'. Besides, Greinfarr didn't do himself any favours by attacking the Wood Wailers, even if he was being taunted. It's like attacking a cop, of course they're going to respond to violence in kind.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinros

Ul'dah spending loads of times screwing over their own nation, corrupt guards everywhere exploiting refugee's and doing anything under the sun. A woman was going to be sold into sexual slavery and the crowd did nothing and don't get me started on the whole kobold issue. Titan did not try to temper you like the other primals he wanted to kick your ass since you broke the oath and started murdering kobolds.

---

Well yeah, it's Ul'dah. It's stated constantly money talks there - a jewel balanced on scales with a flame is their actual flag for crying out loud. The Brass Blades are corrupt because they're little more than thieves with authority (it was even stated as such at the very beginning of the Ul'dah storyline) - the Sultanate is so undermanned they use mercenaries for their military - it's to the point that anyone with a strong sword arm could become a Brass Blade, well, except the player of course ;)).

As for the refugee woman, well, Unghust was a creep, but he got his just deserts in the end, becoming nothing but a mindless slave to Ifrit and (presumably) is executed by the Immortal Flames accordingly. The townspeople didn't step in because, lets face it, he's leader of an armed gang. It's called 'bystander syndrome', until someone finally has the guts to do something, no one will. The same thing happens in real life all too often sadly.

And as for Titan, the jury is still out on exactly who broke the treaty between Limsa and the kobolds, but the fact is, Titan would still have posed a threat anyway even if the kobolds had been left alone. Primals corrupt their followers and make them more hostile. It was stated as such in 1.0 and is the same in ARR. So your character would have had to have fought him eventually regardless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinros

Plus that garlean roe general? His country got better after the empire took it.

---

Considering Garlemald's history of brainwashing those they conquer, I'm not liable to take what Rhiatyan said at face value. He's definitely a noble sort, but still, he's fanatically devoted to Gaius, would kill his own mother or drink a baby's blood if Gaius ordered him to, and thus, no matter how you look at it, he is Eorzea's enemy, like the rest of the Garleans. Really the only sympathetic Garlean in the game is that marooned Juggernaut pilot in Raincatcher Gully who says he hates the Garleans, doesn't believe in their propaganda and only wants to go home to see his family.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinros

Overall seriously? Screw everyone I don't care anymore.(Apart from cid :X) I am now fighting for myself and my beastmen black mage buddies. Plus after reading the lore forum I am questioning how good hydaelyn actually is. Anyway it won't matter since I am going to the void when I die since I am a black mage.

---

Heh, considering it was shown in both 1.0 and ARR that the beastmen are one step away from slaughtering each other if given the chance, good luck with that. Oh, and when you finally become a voidsent and are sent back to whatever dark hell you crawled out of, give my regards to Atomos. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Considering Garlemald's history of brainwashing those they conquer, I'm not liable to take what Rhiatyan said at face value. He's definitely a noble sort, but still, he's fanatically devoted to Gaius, would kill his own mother or drink a baby's blood if Gaius ordered him to, and thus, no matter how you look at it, he is Eorzea's enemy, like the rest of the Garleans. Really the only sympathetic Garlean in the game is that marooned Juggernaut pilot in Raincatcher Gully who says he hates the Garleans, doesn't believe in their propaganda and only wants to go home to see his family.

---

I don't think there was enough detail to think he would be that kind of person. All we did get was him question Gauis giving command. He also did not attack you on sight. In fact, he gave us a chance to what Gauis has done for his people.

When Gauis unleashed the "supposed" true power of the Ultima weapon was "I did not want this."

He was never shown to have a hypnosis power, and it was a lesser rank Garlean that used it.

Honestly the whole Garlean/Eorzea conflict is more like WoW's Alliance versus Horde, e.g. we don't like the other guys because they're not 'us', except since the Empire are obviously supposed to be the bad guys this doesn't quite work out. There's really no moral superiority of either side, and if anything the Garlean Empire probably has more progressive ideas. For example Gaius's proposal of wiping out the Beastman while they got the Ultima Weapon sure sounds like a pretty good idea given there's a clear history of Beastman aggression. For all the talk about peace with Beastman, you still more or less ended up just killing every Beastman that wasn't a Sylph to keep them pacified, and I'd say Gaius has the right idea. If you can't coexist with them, you might as well kill them all. The Primals can't be summoned if they have no followers, and sure the Beastman will fight hard but that's why he has the Ultima Weapon.

If the story is supposed to make sense, Eorzea would've already been wiped out by one of the Beastman tribes since the existing powers are woefully inadequate at dealing with them. When considering the Primal's ability to temper new followers and that Echo is obviously an extremely rare power, it's more like a miracle how come none of the three factions have already been wiped out.

I have a question, IDK if it's OT but I was considering Fufuchas opinions on the war. While doing the Botanist quests, I was fairly sure I saw a jewel on Fufuchas head hiding under the hat. Is Fufucha Garlean? Because they have the third eye-thingy. Can Lallafells be Garleans? Or do they all look Hyur-ish?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

I don't think there was enough detail to think he would be that kind of person. All we did get was him question Gauis giving command. He also did not attack you on sight. In fact, he gave us a chance to what Gauis has done for his people.

When Gauis unleashed the "supposed" true power of the Ultima weapon was "I did not want this."

He was never shown to have a hypnosis power, and it was a lesser rank Garlean that used it.

---

Does not take hypnosis to brainwash. Garlemald in 1.0 was seen to use fear, intimidation, and misinformation to indoctrinate the children of Ala Mhigo (other places too) Indoctrination actually makes you believe what you are told, right or wrong, is the truth. Garleans don't need gods, because they are made to believe wholly in the Emperor. Not just as a man, as the one true voice of reason. The only law of humanity. The only true god. They're really not much better than tempered beastmen, their primal is just a man instead.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

I have a question, IDK if it's OT but I was considering Fufuchas opinions on the war. While doing the Botanist quests, I was fairly sure I saw a jewel on Fufuchas head hiding under the hat. Is Fufucha Garlean? Because they have the third eye-thingy. Can Lallafells be Garleans? Or do they all look Hyur-ish?

---

The original people of Garlemald are a different race all together. They are, from Cid and Nero, usual blonde Hyur like people, and the mark on their foreheads is actually a third eye, not a jewel. Now many Lalafel tribes do where jewels, but they are not to be mistaken for Garlean eyes.

Totalitarianism or Democracy?

I think we should have to right to be stupid if we want. It's a lot better than to be made stupid by force.

The difference is choice.

I enjoyed the story, and i rather have few meaningful story quests and tons of less meaningful story quests, than just few meaningful story quests and nothing to fill inbetween. Not every single word and NPC speech have to teach us about Dalamud and the empire... We're adventurers, we help everyone in need!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KaleHitsuga

Does not take hypnosis to brainwash. Garlemald in 1.0 was seen to use fear, intimidation, and misinformation to indoctrinate the children of Ala Mhigo (other places too) Indoctrination actually makes you believe what you are told, right or wrong, is the truth. Garleans don't need gods, because they are made to believe wholly in the Emperor. Not just as a man, as the one true voice of reason. The only law of humanity. The only true god. They're really not much better than tempered beastmen, their primal is just a man instead.

---

Exactly
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU5N2...ailpage#t=7407

And don't forget, the empire want to do a genocide on all beast tribes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU5N2...ailpage#t=5859

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

Who did Gauis rape? He enslaved and pillaged Ala Mihgo, but you know what? With how every single Ala' Mighan npc acts, I could honestly say I hope they never get it back. He brought stability and prosperity to another city as told by his 2nd-in-command.

---

I had to lol at that one, using one bad guy's word to justify said bad guy's faction's actions. :D Maybe someone need to pay more attention to in-game texts, here's one straight from a main story NPC:

Quote:

---

Glaumunt: An' then the imperials came an' took it all away. When Ala Mhigo fell, they put my family in a camp. Bein' a lad, I was made to do hard labor, while my mother an' sister were forced to do far worse... They hid their sufferin' from me as best they could, but I knew, an' the thought of it drove me mad. We had to escape. An' so I hatched a plan to get us out o' the city.

---

but hey, it was all really for the best, just like how Imperial Japan brought "stability and prosperity" to the rest of Asia, and comfort women were really volunteers right? :rolleyes:

I believe you never went to Little Ala Mhigo, or Qarrymill, or even outside Ul'dah and talked/read what NPCs there are saying. Garleans are conquerors without remorse. I guess being part of a country who does the same IRL *spoilers* USA *spoilers* makes you sympathize with garleans more than the people fighting back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by d4rkie

I believe you never went to Little Ala Mhigo, or Qarrymill, or even outside Ul'dah and talked/read what NPCs there are saying. Garleans are conquerors without remorse. I guess being part of a country who does the same IRL *spoilers* USA *spoilers* makes you sympathize with garleans more than the people fighting back.

---

That's almost funny, it's almost like you're hopping on the bash-US train, because generalizing 300+ million people makes you cool :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Felis

Exactly
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU5N2...ailpage#t=7407

And don't forget, the empire want to do a genocide on all beast tribes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU5N2...ailpage#t=5859

---

Yup. As far as the beastmen go, that also extends to the player, as was mentioned in 1.0 (as shown in a cutscene in that above link), the Garleans regard anyone with the Echo as a 'beastman' due to it's ability to allow communication with the beast tribes. Thus, for those wishing they could be a part of the Empire, well, they'd soon find life in Garlemald very unpleasant, and I guarantee, would be very quickly regretting their decision. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naunet

I agree whole-heartedly!

There's also the whole Thancred thing, which is quite possibly the greatest missed opportunity in story-telling in this game.His character would have been so much better if he had been an actual villain and not some male damsel in distress. A plot where Thancred has been secretly double-crossing the Scions all this time, funneling intel to the Garleans or, even better, the Ascians to further some greater plot? Yes, please.

But nope.

---

so much that.... i was so excited when you see the bad guy was him

......and then soooooooooooooooo disappointed when they talk about him being 'controlled' :\

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

I had to lol at that one, using one bad guy's word to justify said bad guy's faction's actions. :D Maybe someone need to pay more attention to in-game texts, here's one straight from a main story NPC:



but hey, it was all really for the best, just like how Imperial Japan brought "stability and prosperity" to the rest of Asia, and comfort women were really volunteers right? :rolleyes:

---

The same can be said for a good man with a few bad eggs in his military. One man can not control every action his troops take when they are around.

One soldier was viciously cutting down an already dead man in the Waking Sands when they took Minfilia. The White armored commander shot that imperial for disobeying her and she's obviously fiercely loyal to Gauis. She could be copying what Gauis would have done.

Unless I see a cutscene specifically showing showing something truly immoral I can't believe he was a truly bad guy.

There is far more evidence to show he was a man trying to do his way for the greater good. Like Durian from the Wtachmen, killing millions to save billions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Enkidoh

snip

---

Honestly I just don't view anyone as "good" in this conflict at the end of the day. Oh and about the void yea I will tell atomos you said hi and most likely diabolos is a voidsent too so I will say hi to him as well. :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

The same can be said for a good man with a few bad eggs in his military. One man can not control every action his troops take when they are around.

One soldier was viciously cutting down an already dead man in the Waking Sands when they took Minfilia. The White armored commander shot that imperial for disobeying her and she's obviously fiercely loyal to Gauis. She could be copying what Gauis would have done.

Unless I see a cutscene specifically showing showing something truly immoral I can't believe he was a truly bad guy.

There is far more evidence to show he was a man trying to do his way for the greater good. Like Durian from the Wtachmen, killing millions to save billions.

---

You're really grasping at straws here.

Did Hitler personally run the camps? Did Tojo gas and experiment on prisoners himself? Of course not, dictators seldom do the dirty works themselves, but did they authorize it? hell yes. Gaius RULED Ala Mhigo, to suggest that labor camps and systemic exploitation of the local population could be the work of "a few bad eggs" in a super-authoritarian state is laughably ignorant at best.

Seriously, the examples you're using, it's like claiming a mass serial killer is actually a nice guy because he helped an old lady cross the street in the morning. FFS, that scene in the Waking Sands is to show thte players how ruthless and how little Livia cared for people's lives, even one of their own.


FFXIV isn't some deep philosophical character study, Gaius is about as typical as it gets for your sunday morning ruthless tyrant B that tried to rule with an iron fist, which has only been done about 238749023847283907 different times already.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

...

---

Why are you using actual history in a game for one thing.

And yes characters are very boring in this game. God forbid I use my imagination and interpretations of what I see as a way to make someone more interesting. Other than Gauis, Darnus, Cid, and Hildibrand, no one else is worth remembering.

If he were really that bad would the first thing out of his mouth after seeing Ultima true power in Praetorium really be "I didn't want this"? I'd picture a maniacal laugh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

Why are you using actual history in a game for one thing.

And yes characters are very boring in this game. God forbid I use my imagination and interpretations of what I see as a way to make someone more interesting. Other than Gauis, Darnus, Cid, and Hildibrand, no one else is worth remembering.

If he were really that bad would the first thing out of his mouth after seeing Ultima true power in Praetorium really be "I didn't want this"? I'd picture a maniacal laugh.

---

The examples were there to point out the massive holes in your reasoning.

Feel free to RP to your heart's content and interpret things however you like, but this isn't a RP thread, wrong place if you didn't want people poking holes in your setup. Also, not every "bad guy" need to be a Kefka-level megalomaniac, but I did find Gaius's reaction to be rather hypocritical - he's done far worse to others than what happened in Praetorium.


Also another correction, Hildebrand is the ONLY memorable character so far :p

The reason you people are arguing so much is because the story is actually better than you may think it is.

If I was the writer I'd be very pleased with this discussion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

The examples were there to point out the massive holes in your reasoning.

Feel free to RP to your heart's content and interpret things however you like, but this isn't a RP thread, wrong place if you didn't want people poking holes in your setup. Also, not every "bad guy" need to be a Kefka-level megalomaniac, but I did find Gaius's reaction to be rather hypocritical - he's done far worse to others than what happened in Praetorium.


Also another correction, Hildebrand is the ONLY memorable character so far :p

---

Not role-playing, just perceiving it different.
Dark Souls is notorious for this. You have 2 sides, one wants you to allow the bonfires to be kindled for the sake of the age of fire, while the other side wants darkness to reign. Both sides manipulate you to doing what they deem as "good". Though in actuality neither of them is good. Cause the light path needs you to sacrifice humans to light the fires which ends up making undead, and if you don't link the flames darkness reigns which is bad as you can see if you play the Abyss DLC.

So when I see Gauis, who has laid out what he wants in front of me, I have less questions to ask.

Versus

Grand Companies and Minfilia's group. They have lied, killed and raped as well. they are no different that the Imperials.

The only difference between them is that the Imperials have there shi* together and actually doing something about it. What happened to Minfilia's idea about making peace with the beastmen? It's gone, now she wants them dead as much as the GCs do.

it's just the lesser of two evils.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mekhana

The reason you people are arguing so much is because the story is actually better than you may think it is.

If I was the writer I'd be very pleased with this discussion.

---

It's really not. Technically we never see Gauis die, so he's most likely still alive. Other than that there's not much to look forward into the story. I couldn't care less about any of the 3 GC or Minfilia, or the Ascians. They are all so bland it's painful.

I lied the only thing to looking forward to is Hildbrand's epic return.

Hello, what's going on in this thread? Oh, Ala Mhigo or Garlean, you ask?

Well, Ala Mhigo has WIDARGELT.

So...hail Gaius!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

What happened to Minfilia's idea about making peace with the beastmen? It's gone, now she wants them dead as much as the GCs do.

---

She never said "go and kill all the beast tribes"
The Garleans on the other site ...

The Garlean solution to the primal problem is killing all the beast tribes. No beast tribes = no primals.
You can see that Minfilla search another solution.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gardes

Hello, what's going on in this thread? Oh, Ala Mhigo or Garlean, you ask?

Well, Ala Mhigo has WIDARGELT.

So...hail Gaius!

---

And Garlemald had Darnus, so what?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

So when I see Gauis, who has laid out what he wants in front of me, I have less questions to ask.

Versus

Grand Companies and Minfilia's group. They have lied, killed and raped as well. they are no different that the Imperials.

---

Who did the GCs and Minfilia rape? Some a-hole in Ul'dah threatens to, and suddenly all of Eorzea is branded rapists apparently. The GCs kill only for defense of the realm, even if the local militaries of each nation are a bit more liberal in that sometimes, and the Scions never asked you to kill anyone until Gaius' "surrender or face extermination with the beastmen" statement. As for lying, well, everyone lies. Just depends what it is for.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

Why are you using actual history in a game for one thing.

---

I'd like to point out that all writers look to real history for inspiration on their fictional stories.

It's not just cause it sounds cool that garleans all have 'roman empire-ish' names, it's a way to let the reader/player get an idea about just who these people are by linking it to a real-world history counter-part. The romans did good things: roads, aquaducts, civil laws, etc. But they also enslaved people who didn't want shit to do with their way of life and murdered those they couldn't enslave.

My way or the high... death toll.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cobayn

It's not just cause it sounds cool that garleans all have 'roman empire-ish' names,

---

Speaking of which, our continent looks like..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gardes

Speaking of which, our continent looks like..

---

spain? ^^



/10char

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

Not role-playing, just perceiving it different.
Dark Souls is notorious for this. You have 2 sides, one wants you to allow the bonfires to be kindled for the sake of the age of fire, while the other side wants darkness to reign. Both sides manipulate you to doing what they deem as "good". Though in actuality neither of them is good. Cause the light path needs you to sacrifice humans to light the fires which ends up making undead, and if you don't link the flames darkness reigns which is bad as you can see if you play the Abyss DLC.

So when I see Gauis, who has laid out what he wants in front of me, I have less questions to ask.

---

Not every story follows the "both sides are equally good/bad" archetype, some are just simple clear cut stories. FFS, with your logic you'd probably argue Snow White was really the evil one, and the evil Queen was really just misunderstood. :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Grand Companies and Minfilia's group. They have lied, killed and raped as well. they are no different that the Imperials.

---

Lie #1, proof or stfu. No, seriously, where did you even got that from?

Quote:

---

What happened to Minfilia's idea about making peace with the beastmen? It's gone, now she wants them dead as much as the GCs do.

---

Lie #2, the only thing the Scions want as far as Beastmen goes is stopping the summoning of Primals, nothing else.

Quote:

---

it's just the lesser of two evils.

---

Except one of them is of your own invention for some odd reason :rolleyes:

Oh so it oks for people to say Gaius raped people? What was that cutscene with Ul'dah where you say the woman from the back stabbing merchant? It's implied that they going to make her a slave, and what did people used do to slaves?

Limsa broke it's treaty with the Kobolds and slaughtered them which is why we are fighting Titan and it's why we will fight Leviathan.

Minfilia doesn't even try to tell you to make peace with anymore, and she was completely adamant about this in 1.0. Since she isn't constantly reminding us anymore to make peace with them it make seem like she has realized the only way to stop the primals is to stop the beastmen.

This game story was probably one of the lamest stories I HAD to be forced to go thru.
Grand Companies: pointless and imcompotent
Scions: imcompotent and dare I say useless

All while doing the story, I felt like the BIGGEST PEON IN RECORDED HISTORY! You did EVERYTHING, go get this, go do that, go fetch, go save princess peach (Minifia) and her moronic sidekick, kill the primals or any story boss BY YOURSELF and this counrty we are not from. All while the GCs and Scions giving me orders and I just nod...

If I had my way would just shoot them all in the face just because all reasons stated above. Atleast go solo instead of having to join a GC. I never understood wh6 we need to join or help any faction if we have to do ALL the work.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kallera

Who is the more stupid, the "nonsense" game with a "mindless grind" or the critic still playing it as of yesterday?

---

I expected the grind at the end, as it is a mmo. However, the storyline itself was lack luster, and pretty disappointing. Also refrain from calling others stupid when you can't form a grammatically sound sentence.

All the implications of rape sickens me to no end. I didn't expected this in a Final Fantasy game. Then again, I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't the case in the japanese version, since americans seem so fond of rape and sexism.

Besides that... everyone already pointed out how you just go around doing errands for the grand companies and the scions, even those that they could solve alone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

The same can be said for a good man with a few bad eggs in his military. One man can not control every action his troops take when they are around.

One soldier was viciously cutting down an already dead man in the Waking Sands when they took Minfilia. The White armored commander shot that imperial for disobeying her and she's obviously fiercely loyal to Gauis. She could be copying what Gauis would have done.

Unless I see a cutscene specifically showing showing something truly immoral I can't believe he was a truly bad guy.

There is far more evidence to show he was a man trying to do his way for the greater good. Like Durian from the Watchmen, killing millions to save billions.

---

He can't keep his army under control but he expects to bring order to the whole of Eorzea and the three city states?
That doesn't sound any better.


Also under militaristic societies, the burden of disorder falls on the authorities because they have a simplistic chain of responsibility. You can't hold Ul'dah responsible for a wayward merchant as you can hold Gaius responsible for his army. That's just the case.

Good intentions don't stop you from being evil. He is still coming into people's houses and telling them he now owns it. I don't care how disorganized and messy that house was before he came in, that's bad.
I've never heard dialogue or any implications that the Eorzeans want Garlean rule. All I've read is sentiments of disgust.
He would still be bad just by forcing rule over people, but if he can't actually have complete control over his army then his promises are empty as well.

He may not be the two dimensional evil villain, but he has set himself up as a villain. Good villains have reasonable intentions. They are still evil in the end.
Gauis is a good villain.

and the straw grasping continues...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

Oh so it oks for people to say Gaius raped people? What was that cutscene with Ul'dah where you say the woman from the back stabbing merchant? It's implied that they going to make her a slave, and what did people used do to slaves?

---

Gaius is the LEADER of the Legion that conquered and occupied Ala Mhigo, he is the top dog, the boss, it is his domain, whatever he says goes, which includes the oppression and systemic exploitation of the Ala Mhigans.

Random evil merchant guys is... some random street thug who was working with the beastmen(lol!) tribe, if you can't tell the difference between the two, you've got some problems. There are still criminals today that traffics in human, are you going to claim that nations today endorses slavery? because that's exactly the kind of leap you're making here with that merchant bit.

Quote:

---

Limsa broke it's treaty with the Kobolds and slaughtered them which is why we are fighting Titan and it's why we will fight Leviathan.

---

Seriously, at least get your primal/beastmen right, Leviathan is Sahagins, which has always been openly hostile. Also, read up more on the lore please, the conflict is borne out of the Kobold's continued expansion underground, it is essentially a fight over resources, and I'd hardly say the Kobolds were "slaughtered", as Limsa certainly don't have that kind of strength.

Quote:

---

Minfilia doesn't even try to tell you to make peace with anymore, and she was completely adamant about this in 1.0. Since she isn't constantly reminding us anymore to make peace with them it make seem like she has realized the only way to stop the primals is to stop the beastmen.

---

There was no open war in 1.0, the Empire hasn't invaded and set up fortresses in the door step of all the nations, and oh yea, Dalamud hasn't dropped on everyone's head, and Bahamut hasn't blown everyone to hell and back yet.

It's one thing to try to negotiate for peace before open war and when you actually have a measure of strength, it's another to try to do the same when you've been in open war for half a decade, your strengths are weak and decimated, and everyone knows it.

What is she gonna say to the beastmen? please stop summoning primals, i'll give you some pie? :rolleyes:

It's hilarious how far you're willing to stretch reality to white wash Gaius, yet how quick you are to condemn the rest of Eorzea as soon as you see someone litter on the sidewalk :rolleyes:

The story, for the most part, is insultingly bad.
So many sections of story quests that are built around the exact same same premise, of "proving yourself" to people, long after you shouldn't have to. All avoidable, if the main character wasn't a doormat, and your allies simply opened their mouths and vouch for you.

The Costa Del Sol feast was awful enough, but I think I was most insulted by the Coerthas quest line.

It was so lazy and stupidly written. So let me get this straight. Me, guy who slayed two primals, has the backing of the three Grand Companies, a member of the Scions, and all around awesome guy, has to jump through a thousand hoops simply to find out each a-hole I aid, can't help me open a friggin' door so I can go through more hoops just to recover a ship, that willl help save the world. and my character just stood there and took it

As for the OP, there is always that subsection of fandom that really wants to paint the bad guys in a positive "misunderstood" light. The empire is evil. Its like when fans do mental gymnastics to justify why the Sith aren't evil, when Lucas has made it clear to everyone else that they so totally are.