Reminder that war is still good.

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Originally Posted by Argyle_Darkheart

Removing gauge cost from Onslaught would arguably be a nerf because the DPS gain would theoretically be balanced around by removing potency elsewhere. That is, our final DPS would stay the same, but we would now have to Onslaught on cooldown, reducing its availability as a gap closer.

The "issue" with Onslaught right now is that the gauge to potency ratio has changed, but Onslaught received no potency increase to compensate for it.

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Having onslaught at 30 secs with 2 charges is not a nerf. Having it on 10 sec cooldown and costing rage does effectively, by that i mean actually, make it more available as a gap closer than having it on 2 charges.

Not reallt anyway.

Think about it. 2 charges lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Having it on a 10 sec cooldown lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Its only past the 30 second mark that a 10 secons cooldown matters.

But tack on a rage cost and actual mechanics of a fight, and it really doesnt matter that its on a 30 sec cd.

I meant *does NOT

I meant *10 second cd

Cant edit on phone.

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Originally Posted by NyneSwordz

I meant *10 second cd

Cant edit on phone.

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Just change from the mobile site to the regular site on your phone, then you can edit all you want.

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Originally Posted by Argyle_Darkheart

Removing gauge cost from Onslaught would arguably be a nerf because the DPS gain would theoretically be balanced around by removing potency elsewhere. That is, our final DPS would stay the same, but we would now have to Onslaught on cooldown, reducing its availability as a gap closer.

The "issue" with Onslaught right now is that the gauge to potency ratio has changed, but Onslaught received no potency increase to compensate for it.

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I'm thinking that making Onslaught basically dps neutral compared to FC would maybe be the best solution for this. In addition, if the gauge cost were reduced to 10 and it applied the Storm's Eye buff but for a shorter duration like 15s while increasing the recast to 30s, so that you still need the combo to upkeep your buff just less frequently, it would allow WAR to apply the buff way more quickly at the start of a fight, only requiring getting to Maim to be able to use it. This would make it optimal to use as frequently as possible instead of holding on to it for mechanics, but that is no different than the other tank gap closers. They should also make the time on the Storm's Eye buff work more like Darkside where things add increments of time to it and it caps out at 60s.

So basically ...
Onslaught - lvl.62 - Ability - Instant - Recast: 30s - Beast Gauge: 10 - Range: 20y
- Rushes target and delivers an attack with a potency of 120.
- Applies or extends the 10% damage dealt increase of Storm's Eye by 15s.

Just a bit of a quick off the cuff idea that could potentially address a few of the things players have expressed as issues. It may require some slight other tweaks to things like the cure potency on the Storm's Path combo since you would be able to do it a little more frequently.

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Originally Posted by NyneSwordz

Having onslaught at 30 secs with 2 charges is not a nerf. Having it on 10 sec cooldown and costing rage does effectively, by that i mean actually, make it more available as a gap closer than having it on 2 charges.

Not reallt anyway.

Think about it. 2 charges lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Having it on a 10 sec cooldown lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Its only past the 30 second mark that a 10 secons cooldown matters.

But tack on a rage cost and actual mechanics of a fight, and it really doesnt matter that its on a 30 sec cd.

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Nah, the better solution is to get rid of potency on gap closers so they're actually used for closing gaps. Dumb design choice that's only leading to greedy shenanigans.

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Originally Posted by BarretOblivion

Why would they nerf any potencies? Lol. They didn't nerf the potencies of any of the other tanks just because they got a OGCD gap closer.

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Are you clueless?

Assuming we're calling for adjustments to Onslaught based on usability and not as a means of directly increasing WAR's DPS, it's understandable that WAR's DPS should stay roughly the same. You also have no way of knowing that SE did not adjust the potencies of jobs with their respective gap closers in mind. That is, just because you didn't see a direct nerf doesn't mean that potencies aren't lower than what they would have been without DPS positive gap closers.

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Originally Posted by NyneSwordz

Think about it. 2 charges lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Having it on a 10 sec cooldown lets u gap close 3 times in 30 seconds. Its only past the 30 second mark that a 10 secons cooldown matters.

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You're not thinking very deeply about this. It's generally not about how many times you can use a gap closer, it's about when you can use it. If a gap closer is DPS positive, in and of itself, then that will dictate much of its use. And sure, you can always adjust your timing to actually use a gap closer for its utility, but that doesn't mean you'll want to.

What's more usable as a gap closer: a DPS neutral Onslaught with a recast of 60 seconds or a DPS positive Onslaught with a recast of 30 seconds and 2 charges?

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Originally Posted by Arewn

It will not be a nerf in any capacity whatsoever.
Using Onslaught to get rid of 20 gauge so that you don't over cap gives a functionally identical result to using onslaught and overcapping by 20 because it didn't consume any gauge.
Overcapping gauge is intrinsically bad because it is a waste. But there's no further penalty to over capping then that. So given a situation where Onslaught is now free and you overcap as a result, you haven't lost anything. In both cases the gauge would have been "wasted" relative to one another. Either "wasted" by over capping, or "wasted" because onslaught isn't free. You're just able to use Onslaught more freely and frequently by making it free, which is a buff no matter how you look at it.
It's not a big buff, or a big deal. It borders on QoL more then anything. And more gauge management tools would be appreciated. But it's not a nerf to make it free.

Arrogantly making allusions to "playing at an optimal level" and "the best players" doesn't make you sound any more convincing, nor does acting aloof about it. Present the facts on how it works and let your point stand on it's own merit.

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It seems it got personal for you, I`ll stop here.

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Originally Posted by Inuk9

It seems it got personal for you, I`ll stop here.

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If 'getting personal' is shpwing quite plainly why your argument was wrong methodically, point by point, then i gues it got personal? He just properly disected your arguments for it and your point fell apart. Thats not personal. Thats just being found wrong.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

If 'getting personal' is shpwing quite plainly why your argument was wrong methodically, point by point, then i gues it got personal? He just properly disected your arguments for it and your point fell apart. Thats not personal. Thats just being found wrong.

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Ok, lets take the primordial argument from him who "disected" (lmao)

"So given a situation where Onslaught is now free and you overcap as a result, you haven't lost anything."


If you truly believe that then you don`t know how to Warrior, so sorry =/

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Originally Posted by Argyle_Darkheart

Are you clueless?

Assuming we're calling for adjustments to Onslaught based on usability and not as a means of directly increasing WAR's DPS, it's understandable that WAR's DPS should stay roughly the same. You also have no way of knowing that SE did not adjust the potencies of jobs with their respective gap closers in mind. That is, just because you didn't see a direct nerf doesn't mean that potencies aren't lower than what they would have been without DPS positive gap closers.



You're not thinking very deeply about this. It's generally not about how many times you can use a gap closer, it's about when you can use it. If a gap closer is DPS positive, in and of itself, then that will dictate much of its use. And sure, you can always adjust your timing to actually use a gap closer for its utility, but that doesn't mean you'll want to.

What's more usable as a gap closer: a DPS neutral Onslaught with a recast of 60 seconds or a DPS positive Onslaught with a recast of 30 seconds and 2 charges?

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What are you even talking about?

My point is in a 30 second time frame the availability of gap closers is the same across the board.

Are you ever going to need to gap close AND use a gap closer for dps plus purposes more than 3 times in those 30 seconds?

No.

In fact, I cant think of an instance where you would ever need to gap close more than once every 30 seconds so what is ur point?

Can you?

So the useability of any gap closer as a gap closer is limited by the need to GAP CLOSE.

Am I right?

Unless you can name an instance where you would need to gap close more than once every 30 seconds your argument is just wrong.