SE, the concept of "Limited Jobs" is a really bad idea, turn back now

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Unfortunately, the Trust system is currently regulated to Shadowbringer content only. Regardless, this still makes Blue Mage a solo only job. So... I'd rather they put their resources to content that actually matters. Perhaps I'll be proven wrong, but I fully expect Blue Mage to be Hildebrand-esque, where they update it every seven months with a couple quests and one or two new abilities. That just doesn't scream excitement to me.

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Yoshi in an interview mentioned; "With the Trust system, these players can experience the story of Final Fantasy XIV and learn party dynamics by playing with their favorite NPCs. Then, once they feel ready, they can shift into playing with other people. The challenge level of content using Trusts will steadily rise, and so it will not always be the easiest option to play with them exclusively."

Seems odd if they restrict it to Shadowbringer content if part of the purpose is to expose players to party dynamics. By the time a player gets to Shadowbringer content if they haven't been exposed to and learned party dynamics something has functionally gone awry.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

Solo focused, not solo only. It still needs groups to get some of its stuff. You're getting things wrong right off the bat, and you repeatedly get that point wrong.
You also argue that because it's not what raiders would want it's a waste of resources that should've gone into making them happy. Not everything in an MMO is raiding, so no not all content needs to be for them.
The only "dangerous precedent" would be caving to this kind of tantrum.

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who even talked about Raiding scene. You can't even queue up into Duty Finder for NORMAL stuff with it unless you have a premade party. A lot of people queue up solo for normal content.

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Originally Posted by Rysir

Unless you have a rather large FC you will be at the mercy of the log in times of specific people just to have you bum through content.

This also makes it a requirement of an FC to properly utilize a solo job. Think on that for a moment.

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If you're getting carried, it wouldn't take many people. If you're doing it all at level, sure you may need to line things up a little more. But then there's also things like friends? Linkshells? Human interaction?
And, for the record, I'm loving how the thought that it's a solo class is falling apart here. Their endgame is solo, the build up is collaborative.

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

who even talked about Raiding scene.

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The initial response from the raiding community has been overwhelmingly negative.

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Right there in the OP.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

If you're getting carried, it wouldn't take many people. If you're doing it all at level, sure you may need to line things up a little more. But then there's also things like friends? Linkshells? Human interaction?
And, for the record, I'm loving how the thought that it's a solo class is falling apart here. Their endgame is solo, the build up is collaborative.


Right there in the OP.

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A lot of people that are not raiders have mentioned their displease with this too, not just raiders. No need to make this about raiders. This is more than that. A job that can't even do casual content normally like any other job.

I won't press that like button of the OP, because I actually like the idea of FFXIV having "limited jobs" which are the closest things resembling the iconic and special gameplay these jobs have in the franchise. Altering them drastically to make them fit in the current mainstream formula isn't something I'm looking for.
They described how would BLU turn out if implemented in FFXIV four years ago, and that's exactly what we got. Pretty happy with that. If classes such as Beatsmaster and Puppetmaster follows, that's all good for me.

I don't normally post on the forums, but I felt the need to since I agree wholeheartedly with the argument being made. Yes I was looking forward to the Blue Mage being in the game, but now not so much. To me they shouldn't have bothered to call it a limited combat job, an stuck it with the other gathering professions because that's what it's all about apparently. Gathering skills. Jokes aside, it does set a bad precedent. For all we know, new jobs in the future will all be limited for balance reasons, and what we got will be it. I'm not even much of a raider, and I'm rather displeased with this course of action. I haven't talked to anyone today who is pleased with it. At the best I've talked with people who were merely okay with it. As if they hold back some amount of displeasure and are settling with what we get. In this case I'd rather not settle for a half-job.

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

A lot of people that are not raiders have mentioned their displease with this too, not just raiders. No need to make this about raiders. This is more than that.

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If you have a complaint about the raiders angle, take it up with the OP not me.
I'll debate a point presented, but I'm not going to argue against every last possible angle if they're not even put forth here in the first place.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

If you're getting carried, it wouldn't take many people. If you're doing it all at level, sure you may need to line things up a little more. But then there's also things like friends? Linkshells? Human interaction?
And, for the record, I'm loving how the thought that it's a solo class is falling apart here. Their endgame is solo, the build up is collaborative.


Right there in the OP.

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I don't know about you, but I play with my friends who are playing their own main jobs and having fun in the game with all the new and old things that we get to do together every week. Roulettes, Heaven-on-High, Extreme primals, helping eachother with rotations and leveling classes together, sometimes with 8, sometimes with 4, most often not with full parties so we make do with queuing. I would rather be able to play my favorite job in the series with them and have our "interaction" as you keep pushing it, than forcing them to babysit me for hours while I feel guilty.

I don't think I'd have as much of a problem with the opposite you mentioned. Have the leveling process and ability acquisition be a unique solo journey, but once at max level with a proper loadout, have it be able to experience the full game as any other job and the players behind them.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

This is an extremely bad idea. Please cut your losses: adjust the new class for group play and never introduce another Limited Job.

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So basically you never want them to do anything new? Just stuff every job into one of the extremely limited DPS / Tank / Healer boxes that 'group play' (specifically raiding) in FFXIV demands. I'm all for giving feedback, but 'limited jobs' that don't fit the established mould are an entirely new concept in FFXIV, can we at least play it, and give them time to adjust it, before we call it a complete disaster?

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

Many jobs have been greatly adjusted to fit into the FFXIV system, such as Summoner, which is nothing like its offline counterparts. You can absolutely balance Blue Mage for group play if you wanted to. Look at all the CC effects that don't work on bosses, for example.

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And yet 'Summoner', for years, has been consider little more than Summoner in name only, with many calls to give them more actual 'summon' abilities... but that wouldn't work in FFXIV*, there is a reason 'Summoner' is a DoT mage with a pet and burst phases that look like a more different pet.

If they did as you asked for Blue Mage it would similarly be 'Blue Mage' in name only, just another 'caster DPS' with buttons to press in a different order but otherwise no different to SMN (or RDM) that are firmly stuffed into the DPS box and only have a handful of not-too-powerful 'support' abilities.

* At least as FFXIV exists now. If they added a dedicated 'support' role then a proper Blue Mage could work, but that would require a major overhaul of how combat and encounters are designed and balanced, and the redesign of several jobs (lest BLU be mandatory).

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

Furthermore, just as you can't have balance breaking abilities in an MMO, you also can't have a solo-only class in an MMO, because it's literally pointless if you can't play the rest of game with it.

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You say that like Blue Mage is one of only a few jobs in FFXIV, or that high-end Raid is the only content that FFXIV has... and it's not like Blue Mage is going to stay in its currently restricted state forever; yes, it may never Raid (at a serious level), but the vast majority of content in FFXIV is not Raid, and there are already a number of good ideas floating around on how Blue Mage could eventually be allowed into Duty Finder.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

What about Puppetmaster? Beastmaster? Dancer?

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Again, do you really want those jobs in name only?

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

Limited Jobs are a terrible concept. Please, reconsider. I'm saying this now so that we don't have another disaster like the current White Mage Lily system, a problem that was called out before Stormblood launch but has remained an issue with no solutions throughout the whole expansion.

This is that call out. Don't repeat history.

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It's not repeating history, for once they have FINALLY done something genuinely new and all you can think is 'but I can't Raid with it on day 1'... please, give them time, show them that you want interesting and diverse jobs (and content) in FFXIV, even if they are 'limited' for a time (they can't rework the game over night) and maybe we can finally get some jobs (and content) that aren't just the same old song and dance with a new skin over and over again.

Oh, and it’s not like Blue Mage is the ONLY new job coming, you’ll get your new ‘raid ready’ jobs come 5.0, is it too much to ask that us casual plebs can have some interesting (and hopefully fun) new things to look forward to?

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

This is an extremely bad idea. Please cut your losses: adjust the new class for group play and never introduce another Limited Job.

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I'm afraid I have to agree here.
The whole concept of people arbitrarily being locked out just doesn't make any sense in an MMO.

Rework BLU (yes that means somewhat limiting it) and make it a proper class people can have fun with in endgame (which is the content that actually matters for most players).