“non-essential” premium content, does SE want this kind of reputation if it continue?

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Retainers started to cross the line, the amount now is past crossing the line, now they are locking basic UI features behind a second sub fee? I don't think so. So everyone posting this wait and see is BS, and yet SE reps can reply here:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...76#post4649276
So clearly SE is not understanding the worry of this issue, so I offered more detailed insight why it is a worry (for those questining why I made this thread at all)

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I disagree that retainers are crossing the line. Yes, it is technically a competitive advantage to be able to sell more stuff at once, but given how little gameplay advantage gil provides, it's so negligible as to be safely ignored. They aren't locking any UI features that offer any advantage being the app subscription fee. The feature that does offer an advantage, dealing with the marketboard, is available for free in game.

The simple fact is, all of this game's many extra fees and charges are buying one of two things: glamour, or convenience. If you want the convenience but don't want to pay extra for it, I feel for you, but that doesn't make it a slippery slope towards doom.

As a side note, Square Enix only responds when they have something concrete to say, so their lack of a response on this issue is not surprising, nor does it indicate how they've prioritized the issue.

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Originally Posted by Talraen

I disagree that retainers are crossing the line. Yes, it is technically a competitive advantage to be able to sell more stuff at once, but given how little gameplay advantage gil provides, it's so negligible as to be safely ignored. They aren't locking any UI features that offer any advantage being the app subscription fee. The feature that does offer an advantage, dealing with the marketboard, is available for free in game.

The simple fact is, all of this game's many extra fees and charges are buying one of two things: glamour, or convenience. If you want the convenience but don't want to pay extra for it, I feel for you, but that doesn't make it a slippery slope towards doom.

As a side note, Square Enix only responds when they have something concrete to say, so their lack of a response on this issue is not surprising, nor does it indicate how they've prioritized the issue.

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Moving items from retainer to retainer is a basic feature that comes with the game, this is something when you buy the game itself along with some of the sub money funds. I did not say it brings an advantage, I am implying, and something I said before, is this is no different then konami charging 10 dollars per save file, and I would argue this is worse since that is a one time fee.

Your own argument is a slippery slope, oh the gold saucer is only optional, lets add a 2 dollar a month access, etc..

Regardless I did also speak with my wallet, My sub did end, and I do not have much time left on the forums.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

My sub did end, and I do not have much time left on the forums.

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finally something positive from one of these threads

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

no different then konami charging 10 dollars per save file, and I would argue this is worse since that is a one time fee.

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... really? Being able to sell more items compares to requiring to you delete your entire character should you want to start fresh? This is what people mean when you reach way too far. Is this app scummy? Yes. Few would disagree, at least in the West. But you're making silly comparisons and exaggerating how bad it is, which does little to serve your argument.

I mean, let's dissect this. Say the Moogle Coins sell for $1. Myself and another crafter get into an undercutting war. Now I have all afternoon to play from my house while the other person needs to leave, but opts to buy Moogle Coins. Say we undercut each other by 100 gil every five minutes. They'll have spent $12 with absolutely no guarantee their item will sell before mine. Not exactly what I call "winning," even if I readily agree Moogle Coins shouldn't be a thing.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Moving items from retainer to retainer is a basic feature that comes with the game, this is something when you buy the game itself along with some of the sub money funds. I did not say it brings an advantage, I am implying, and something I said before, is this is no different then konami charging 10 dollars per save file, and I would argue this is worse since that is a one time fee.

Your own argument is a slippery slope, oh the gold saucer is only optional, lets add a 2 dollar a month access, etc..

Regardless I did also speak with my wallet, My sub did end, and I do not have much time left on the forums.

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I would agree that it's no different than Konami charging 10 dollars per save file. I don't think that's pay-to-win either. I mean, FFXI was charging for character slots from the start, and FFXIV has a higher-tier subscription with more characters since 2.0 launched. This isn't new stuff.

My argument is not a slippery slope, because I'm not arguing that anything is going to lead to anything else. I'm not even sure what you mean by that, honestly.

If you're willing to cancel your subscription to protest these new fees and options, more power to you. It's good to stick to your standards.

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Originally Posted by Rinuko

If only we could block some forum users

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You can, but the threads they make will still be there, and if anyone quotes the blocked person's posts, they will show up for you. Just not the original posts.

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Originally Posted by Talraen

FFXI was charging for character slots from the start, and FFXIV has a higher-tier subscription with more characters since 2.0 launched. This isn't new stuff.

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XI still charge for extra slots AND inventory space.

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Originally Posted by Talraen

If you're willing to cancel your subscription to protest these new fees and options, more power to you. It's good to stick to your standards.

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Probably lapsed before this, he/she just likes to complain and exaggerate. Like making multible threads when threads dies.

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Originally Posted by Talraen

I would agree that it's no different than Konami charging 10 dollars per save file. I don't think that's pay-to-win either. I mean, FFXI was charging for character slots from the start, and FFXIV has a higher-tier subscription with more characters since 2.0 launched. This isn't new stuff.

My argument is not a slippery slope, because I'm not arguing that anything is going to lead to anything else. I'm not even sure what you mean by that, honestly.

If you're willing to cancel your subscription to protest these new fees and options, more power to you. It's good to stick to your standards.

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Where do you see me saying about pay to win in that post? I was specifically talking about blocking a basic UI feature behind a paywall.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

... really? Being able to sell more items compares to requiring to you delete your entire character should you want to start fresh? This is what people mean when you reach way too far. Is this app scummy? Yes. Few would disagree, at least in the West. But you're making silly comparisons and exaggerating how bad it is, which does little to serve your argument.

I mean, let's dissect this. Say the Moogle Coins sell for $1. Myself and another crafter get into an undercutting war. Now I have all afternoon to play from my house while the other person needs to leave, but opts to buy Moogle Coins. Say we undercut each other by 100 gil every five minutes. They'll have spent $12 with absolutely no guarantee their item will sell before mine. Not exactly what I call "winning," even if I readily agree Moogle Coins shouldn't be a thing.

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No, your not understanding, again this has nothing to do with sell space or putting PTW advantages in the game. You do not extra fee basic UI features that should be in the base game, that act alone puts it on konami or EA, that is not an exaggeration. Something you do not agree with does not mean it is an exaggeration, stop giving them passes, it is how they keep pushing down the slippery slope, doing small concepts like that to keep pushing down more and more. Paying for 2 then 4 then 6 retainers was getting bad enough.

Also grats you just described how they can put loot boxes in this game without being under the name "loot boxes"

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Not exactly what I call "winning,"

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If anything you would be the winner by making him spend IRL money :P

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

snip

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I disagree that it's not an exaggeration. You are absolutely exaggerating. I thought your main complaint about this app was its supposed p2w advantages. Now it's UI features? Way to stick to your guns.

Can we just agree that it's scummy, we won't pay for it, and have that be that?