Why people says AST is bad?

Their core kit is good, and the sects' buffs offset the seemingly lower potency, but some spells, mainly their cooldowns are fairly lackluster:

Lightspeed's debuff doesn't belong outside PvE.
Sinastry should be affected by every heal, not only benefic, and on heals to yourself..
Collective Unconscious does too little for how much work it needs, particularly on diurnal, the buff needs to linger after it ends for some seconds or to be stronger.
Celestial Opposition needs a rework, for being your level 60 skill it's use is extremely niche, far more that our actual dissipation.

Now, on non cooldowns:
Diurnal's haste buff is stange, since speed buffs don't affect over time effects right now.
Diurnal's Aspected Benefic needs to be stronger, right now it barely beats two benefics on both power and mp efficiency, compared with regen's monstrous power and efficiency.
The cards could use some buffs, particularly spire, ewer, and maybe spear.

I gotta say Nocturnal Stance is underwhelming.

The shield just becomes a MP sink and 45 sec Aspected Helios + 30 sec Aspected Benefic regens is just huge on a tank.

I don't think anything hits hard enough to warrant Nocturnal over Diurnal right now.

Also: WHM regen + medica 2 + AST regens is really silly amounts of passive healing.

I haven't healed anything with a WHM yet, does the regen from Medica II stack with the regen from Aspected Benefic/Helios?

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Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

I haven't healed anything with a WHM yet, does the regen from Medica II stack with the regen from Aspected Benefic/Helios?

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Yes, WHM HoT's stack with AST HoT's no problem. It's a nice combo that eases up the need for spot heals.

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Originally Posted by Eudyptes

If a raid group is so bad that they need to rely on a class being better by such a small margin to make up for their lack of skill, they have no business raiding.

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now add Machinist to this equation and you'll this "small margin" growing.
not to mention this "small margin" you so call, would give the healers more openings to DPS during the fight if the astrologian was say.. a scholar instead
it's not a matter of a raid group being good or bad, it's a matter of being useful and actually easing up the life of your raid group rather than making it harder

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Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

I haven't healed anything with a WHM yet, does the regen from Medica II stack with the regen from Aspected Benefic/Helios?

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it does

Its also annoying that AST shields dont stack with SCHs.

I don't think it's bad at all. I've played with some amazing AST so far who have been very competent. I agree there are some tweaks to be made but overall most of the people don't seem to understand how to play the class effectively but the ones who do are pretty amazing. I still don't understand why people are spamming lightspeed and gravity for dps tho. It's an MP drain and a potency loss.

All that aside I think AST will get a buff at some point. It doesn't need a huge one just some genral tweaks. It's more than capable for raiding and my current static has a AST atm. I feel that they are better complimented with a WHM or SCH though as opposed to two AST in opposing sects.

AST are bad because:
Cant heal as good as WHM/SCH
buffs too weak/situational/short
Have MP issues
AST/AST combo seems not viable because Card buffs don't stack
lack of emergency heal skills

In before everyone realizes when Alexander raid (hard mode) comes out

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Originally Posted by Parawill

Care to explain the benefits? I'm not nit-picking, but rather curious to hear your opinion.

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In example:

1. A bad AST tends to think they have mana trouble, like I use to, until I learned how to play the job properly. Now I don't ever find myself out of mana even in a bad group for a long fight. This includes using Luminiferous too late rather than earlier, and using Benefic II too much after big damage when Benefic I will get them back up just fine before the next big damage comes, etc. Also, even after big party wide damage, if you have Aspected Helios up, you do not need to even use Helios. Just let the regen do it's thing and focus on tank. A bad AST panics too much and uses Benefic II and Helios more than what is needed.

2. A bad AST tends to believe the cards are too random and situational because they don't realize that about 80% of the time anything you draw is beneficial to the fight, or they are using the wrong buffs at the wrong time, or burning more than than they are using just to try and find a specific card, and they don't have proper use of spread and what to burn when. Around 70 to 80% of the time I can get and use something I want. A bad AST tends to not do pre-fight spread.

3. A bad AST does not make proper use of Time Dilation, Collective Unconscious, Synastry, Celestial Opposition, Disable, and/or Lightspeed. They may even neglect some of these altogether as though the don't exist, or think they are useless like Collective Unconscious. Let's take that last one as an example, which I find myself using multiple times every dungeon run. Here is a situation related to those large trash mobs. Aspected Helios the party, throw up Aspected Benefic on the tank, and a Bole if you have it (Bole optional), then Time Dilation on tank. Top tank up if needed. Now make sure you are in a spot where you won't be hit by AOEs. Pop Collective Unconscious and the regen on the tank is absolutely insane since they stack, while at the same time you are damaging all of the enemies simultaneously each tick of CU's DoT. It is a big contribution. Celestial Opposition + Gravity is a good combo. As one example take the large trash swarms in the Aetherochemical Research Facility. Disable should be used near the end of a cast, rather than earlier in the cast to reduce the chances of it being wasted on an auto-attack or timing out after an unexpected stun or other interference.

Also, read this for more info: http://guidescroll.com/2015/06/ffxiv-astrologian-guide/

He does not point out all of the stuff that I pointed out, but has really good info on use of cards, plus mana, and other little tidbits. There is a couple inaccurate things he points out, like when he says you should use Nocturnal if paired with a WHM. In reality, either Sect is good with WHM.

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Originally Posted by Yumi_umi

We all saw those solo heal whm and sch vids.
Question is can ast solo heal? Lol....
Ast life the hard life. The bastard child of healing if you must lol.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQryUmn4XCE

That isn't the only one. There are AST that have soloed all of the game's 8 man content.

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Originally Posted by chumsy

AST are bad because:
Cant heal as good as WHM/SCH
buffs too weak/situational/short
Have MP issues
AST/AST combo seems not viable because Card buffs don't stack
lack of emergency heal skills

In before everyone realizes when Alexander raid (hard mode) comes out

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AST are good because:
Heal almost on par with WHM/SCH
Buffs that no other healer has access to, can push through dps checks holding a strong card + buff
No mp issues because can shorten lumin. (refresh), and use ewer on yourself if needed.
AST/AST combo is even viable, because while you cannot stack buffs, you can have both astro's use a buffed single target card on their strongest dps.
Has a 40 second emergency heal that has higher potency than lustrate when used on a target with low hp, then follow with an instant aspected benefic.