VIT and STR accessories

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Originally Posted by Brightsayge

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This guy.

Donjo, you're completely missing the point of what mitigation actually is. You seem to be confused and think that your HP mitigates damage.
Your idea of Sentinel, IB, Rampart or any other damage reduction cooldowns to be synonymous to having more HP is just absurd. Having more HP is having more HP. It does not mitigate damage.

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Originally Posted by Orlandeu

This guy.

Donjo, you're completely missing the point of what mitigation actually is. You seem to be confused and think that your HP mitigates damage.
Your idea of Sentinel, IB, Rampart or any other damage reduction cooldowns to be synonymous to having more HP is just absurd. Having more HP is having more HP. It does not mitigate damage.

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It's not absurd. It's absolutely true. Let's take Brightsayge's example.

I have 1000 HP. An attack is coming that will do 1000 damage. I use Rampart to help me.

Situation 1: I use Rampart. I have 1000 HP. The attack is reduced to 800 damage. I now have 200 left.

Situation 2: I use Rampart. I now have 1200 HP. The attack deals 1000 damage. I now have 200 left.

These situations are precisely, exactly identical and both are mitigating the attack. Using a mitigation cooldown is equivalent to increasing your maximum HP by some amount and increasing healing potency on yourself by the same proportion. We can replace anything that "reduces received damage by x%" with "Increase Maximum HP and Healing Received by x%" and nothing would change whatsoever.

It's the transitive rule of logic. If A = B and B = C, then A = C.

Mitigation = Damage Reduction. Damage Reduction = eHP Increase. Therefore, Mitigation = eHP Increase. Since your Maximum HP is the base at which all eHP calculations are derived from, increasing your Maximum HP is an increase in mitigation. The primary mistakes people are making here are as follows:

1. You're focusing too much on the red number instead of looking at the bigger picture.
2. We do not mitigate damage. We mitigate attacks.

Effective HP is not simply a number derived from maximum HP and mitigation. It is a statement of your ability to mitigate attacks based on your maximum HP and damage reduction.

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Originally Posted by Donjo

Situation 1: I use Rampart. I have 1000 HP. The attack is reduced to 800 damage. I now have 200 left.

Situation 2: I use Rampart. I now have 1200 HP. The attack deals 1000 damage. I now have 200 left.

These situations are precisely, exactly identical

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Situation 2 requires about 17% more healing. Those are not the same. You are wasting the healer's MP.

Situation one: Instead of the attack doing 1000, it deals 800 due to Rampart MITIGATING aka REDUCING the severity of the attack.

Situation two: The attack deals the same amount of damage. The damage is not reduced aka unmitigated.

Mitigation has more to do with reducing incoming damage rather than how much ehp you have.

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Originally Posted by MrSmiley

Most annoying part of tank for me is trying to keep up with two entirely different accessories sets. When should I be using str other than dungeons? I'm always unsure when I should be swapping or not.

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Since patch 2.4 I've just been using one mixed set that has some of both. You don't really need to worry about being completely optimal in every situation.

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Originally Posted by Donjo

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1000/(1-(0/100)) = 1000 ehp
1000/(1-(20/100)) = 1250 ehp

with the math above, using a constant hp pool, and varying the mitigation gained from cds, you see that the ehp is greater than the situation you are describing.
the problem is you believe that the hp gained from mitigation is the same as just adding the percentage of damage reduced as hp but it is not. your ehp increased by 50.

the larger the amount of damage mitigated thru cds the larger the difference will become.

reducing the damage by 50%

1000+500 = 1500 hp
1000/(1-(50/100)) = 2000 ehp.
now your ehp has increased by 500 over just adding hp.

ehp is a combination of hp and mitigation. two separate variables, that have a high correlation in affecting ehp but in themselves are completely independent. lower mitigation=lower ehp, lower hp=lower ehp lower hp =/= lower mitigation.

plus you have saved your healer almost 500 hp worth of healing and mana usage.

Zaft made a baseless claim, but Brightsayge proved my numbers wrong. Good on her. However... all this proves is that my numbers were wrong. It actually reinforces the idea that every method of damage reduction is equivalent to some increase in HP with a proportional increase in healing received. The problem here is that people are still caring too much about exact numbers.

Mitigation isn't just making the number smaller. It's so much more than that. It has little to do with how much damage you took; it really only has to do with a single question: did that attack kill you? An attack that did not kill you was mitigated. An attack that killed you was not mitigated. Very simple.

Mitigation is your ability to weather attacks. It is your ability to survive. Anything that makes the attacks less likely to kill you is mitigation.

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Originally Posted by Donjo

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If you don't have any protections, you can't mitigate damage. Therefore, damage mitigated is related to your protections. The first value, damage taken, is the damage you took to your health. The second value, damage mitigated, is the damage you prevented, or, in other words, the damage that you would have taken either way if your protections were 0.

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http://www.reddit.com/r/Smite/commen...akenmitigated/

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Mitigation is the reduction of attack effectiveness. Physical damage is mitigated by armor and block; magical damage is mitigated by resistance; and both are mitigated by resilience as well as by buffs and debuffs.

Not to be confused with avoidance, which includes such stats as dodge, miss and parry.

The crucial difference between the two being that an attack that is mitigated still does damage to the player at least sometimes (although an attack can be fully absorbed or fully resisted), whereas an avoided attack deals no damage.

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http://wow.gamepedia.com/Damage_mitigation

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Mitigation is the reduction of attack effectiveness. Types of melee and magical spell mitigation are absorb, armor, block, defense, resilience and resistance.

Not to be confused with avoidance, which includes such stats as dodge, miss and parry.

The crucial difference between the two being that an attack that is mitigated still does damage to the player, however an avoided attack deals no damage.

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http://www.wowwiki.com/Damage_mitigation

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DMG. Mitigation...What the heck is this? How does it work? And btw, how do I choose perks to my vest?

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It reduces the effect of an individual projectile. A sniper rifle bullet that does 100, if you have 5 DMG Mitigation, will do 95. Not a lot.

However, a shotgun pellet that does 18, if you have 5 DMG Mitigation, will do 13.

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https://steamcommunity.com/app/24387...0500794835017/

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Originally Posted by Donjo

Mitigation isn't just making the number smaller. It's so much more than that. It has little to do with how much damage you took; it really only has to do with a single question: did that attack kill you? An attack that did not kill you was mitigated. An attack that killed you was not mitigated. Very simple.

Mitigation is your ability to weather attacks. It is your ability to survive. Anything that makes the attacks less likely to kill you is mitigation.

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This is so wrong. By definition, mitigation ALWAYS pertains to reduction of something. It LESSENS the IMPACT of stuff. An attack can be mitigated whether it kills you or not and vice versa. And mitigation is, in fact, just making the number smaller.

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Originally Posted by Donjo

. An attack that killed you was not mitigated. Very simple.

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At this point i dont believe you are discussing the same points as we are. Simply because you fail to recognize the definition of mitigation in the context of the game. I could be wrong and you completely understand and are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

In the context of the game, mitigation refers to the reduction of damage through class abilities or game mechanics (stacking to absorb damage from a meteor or w/e).

mitigation is not a pass or fail test. i could have 1hp and get hit for 1k damage, but if i used a 20% damage reducing ability, i mitigated the same amount of damage regardless if i lived or died.

thanks for the fun im outta this thread =p