If you are a WHM without Swiftcast, you are holding back your team at endgame

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Originally Posted by Slambo

If I'm casting raise YOU are doing it wrong. you show me a fight with a guaranteed 1 shot to someone (every time) and I'll agree with you though.

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What this guy said.

I got Swiftcast, but I started doing coil before I had it. It didn't hold my team back; we did just fine. It's a great skill to have, but it's not mandatory.

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Originally Posted by Jyoeru

Like I said, I am only level 24 MRD right now. We shall see. I have flash. I just rarely have to use it. That could be a lower level thing. But, just to prove a point, I am going to avoid using it as much as possible to see if I can tank fine using just my skillset. It's something I do. If I am wrong, I will use the X-class skills.

And if you don't need to use everything to do the job, then don't? I mean, that's part of doing it right. Save that TP for the moments you need it.

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This thread is getting pretty hilarious.

And while you are at it, please be sure never to get Provoke, or if you obtained it in a moment of weakness please remove it from your skill bar.

After all, any party member who pulls a mob from you must be a poor player and probably deserves to die. And in AK you can always ask a Dragoon or Bard to pull that Succubus for you (since your Tomahawk skill won't reach), and when she gets closer you can then just grab her with Provoke.

Oh wait...

EDIT: the tone above may be a little snarky, and sorry for that. There is a legitimate debate in this thread. Some cross skills, like Provoke are essential to do a job. No serious raid group would accept in a Warrior as tank knowing he never got around to getting it. But most cross skills are more in the grey area. Swift isn't Provoke, doesn't fall into the can't-play-your-job-properly-without-it category, but it also isn't one of the many useless cross skills. It sure does make it possible to play your job more strongly. Not having it is a little like when a tank is about to die choosing to just sit there and do nothing for a full GCD before starting the Cure II induction. Sure the tank might be able to survive that if he's fast enough with an 'oh crud' skill, but what is gained by risking it? And sure a Bard can do without BfB or deciding not to pay for that relic weapon after defeating Titan HM, but why would a Bard choose to be less effective in a group than he could be?

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Originally Posted by wildgalax

Idk why you are bringing "watch a video" now, honestly whats wrong with going to a fight and trying to figure it out yourself without being spoonfed. My friend spent recently all day in titan and ifrit after countless wipes and trying to figure out the fight without guide and he said its not most fun he had in a long time. And idk with this attitude if you wipe you lose you seem to be chasing, like my friend said its part of the journey.

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Haha it's just an example of how a player could possibly avoid being hit by stuff and not need a battle res. I guess you can translate that to "intrinsically know how to dodge things by ones own non-badness" or whatever. I don't get it, so I guess people dying over and over and over again is fine as long as you don't have to bring them up? You support doing blind runs on new content but think battle res is for losers? Could you contradict yourself more?

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Originally Posted by Jyoeru

Maybe a swiftcast heal would have saved them. But then the guy next to him dies, and all the sudden you don't have a swiftcast rez.

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Uh okay, now you're making arguments for just never casting spells at all here. Not just avoiding getting them, but straight out you're crafting an argument for "well I might cast heal and the guy next to the guy I healed dies, better to have not cast heal". Also it's kind of hilarious you're advocating "You died so stay on the ground and watch and don't mess up next time" while moaning about elitists. Even super high-end raiders don't raid under the assumption of a 0% error rate.

Replying to you guys is just an exercise in hyperbole and mental gymnastics. You're arguing that an ability you both took and use is not quite as good as people think since DPS can just move out of fire. All the while you're using the same exact arguments DPS use to justify their failures. It's just amazing how hypocritical you guys are. If anyone in this game operated by your warped logic (logic which you guys don't even operate by) there would be no DPS rotations, tanks wouldn't use cross class cooldowns, dps wouldn't use cross class cooldowns, because at the end of the day this is a game and having an expectation of ANYONE is plain wrong. I'd like to thank you for providing possibly one of the most pedantic and meaningless sticking points I've seen in all my MMO history.

EDIT: I'm just repeating myself at this point, but it's just a silly and defeatist point of view to have. People should get abilities that help them to succeed. You're like a kid when asked "Did you bite Johnie?" you quickly reply "But he shoved me first!".

I didn't need swiftcast until turn 4 .. great skill I was missing out but I was still able to Whm without it ..

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Originally Posted by Zakalwe

This thread is getting pretty hilarious.

And while you are at it, please be sure never to get Provoke, or if you obtained it in a moment of weakness please remove it from your skill bar.

After all, any party member who pulls a mob from you must be a poor player and probably deserves to die. And in AK you can always ask a Dragoon or Bard to pull that Succubus for you (since your Tomahawk skill won't reach), and when she gets closer you can then just grab her with Provoke.

Oh wait...

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^This is exactly why. But whatever.

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Originally Posted by Worm

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lol.

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I think its the third time you brought up the term 'bad' after i used it, guess it left a mark on you haha. You also seem like one of those players that blames your party for everything and fails to take responsibility, wouldnt surprise me if you were one of the people that got forced to buy a titan run and as a result hold a grudge on healers for not saving the day with swiftcast. Damn those healers.

You also didnt seem to comprehend anything i said, I merely pointed out the double standards of having high expectations from a healer, whilst at the same time not doing the best from other jobs. But since your going to keep going anyway i probably should stop judging from this,
Join Date
Dec 2013
Posts
75
you should get troll of the month. bye.

I hated grinding to get it (Sorry blms- but the class is horrible boring)- but it is an essential tool.

I am annoyed by how many other healers don't have it. BTW- it is arrogant and just plain wrong to say that if someone dies it is always THEIR fault. As a healer, sometimes it is YOUR fault for not healing them. Maybe mechanics took you out of range of the tank, maybe someone else in the group didn't stack to absorb damage, so someone that was playing correctly died.

You can't just blindly blame others. Get swiftcast. If nothing else, use it on that delicious bard that feeds you mps.

-PS one of the reasons I love playing a healer (besides that it is fun)... is that I don't have to deal with other lazy and entitled healers that blame everything on others.

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Originally Posted by wildgalax

I think its the third time you brought up the term 'bad' after i used it,You also didnt seem to comprehend anything i said, I merely pointed out the double standards of having high expectations from a healer, whilst at the same time not doing the best from other jobs. But since your going to keep going anyway i probably should stop judging from this,

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Haha yeah okay. Do you really think you're not coming off like the same generic over defensive healer I've seen in multiple games? There's is literally no question of whether Warrior tanks should pick up their cross class, there's literally no question of whether DPS should pick up their cross class, how is it you make a sole exception for healers?

You're not pointing out any double standard, you are making the double standard. Us bads blame the heals and should get good, but healers can skip Swiftcast and well that's quite fine we're healers after all. Man do you know how many healers I've had to treat with kid gloves in raid because they have this attitude of yours? I think I've lost count.

edit: I'm sure you have a chip on your shoulder for wrongly being called out in some Titan hardmode months ago or whatever, but man I don't know what to tell you, I've dealt with so many foot dragging healers. It's just irritating to see you advocate foot dragging on PRINCIPAL, as if healers have a greater right to drag feet than any other class.

If a dps player skips dps maximizing skills, they get screamed at.

If a tank skips tank maximizing skills- they get screamed at.

If a healer skips healing/recovery maximizing skills- They should get screamed at- stop being lazy.

screaming to another player is wrong in the first place, screaming in a game that is meant to relax is wrong on many account, it show a lack of control, control that you need when you play. I admit I dont have it yet, I will have to bring that up...I dont believe it hinder the group, end game we are two, one or the other has it if none, well let us keep going, the one that is late, eventually will get there..and I will. Everything happens on its own time.

Mei