Why Does It Feel Like Poor Play Is Acceptable (I'm Venting.)

This is entirely true. Before each major patch, players don't get worse, the good ones are just that much rarer while the bad ones just try so hard to catch up.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Cept the bad players will just skip the tutorial. Gating more content would have a much more noticeable effect. >.>

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Imagine the outrage if we made Hall of Novice a requirement to enter your first dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Jijifli

Imagine the outrage if we made Hall of Novice a requirement to enter your first dungeon.

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I dont think they should do that, but they should definitely do it some quests after to prepare them for next dungeons etc :). I honestly was thinking for a while to make a linkshell on my own server to help a lot of new players, because I think novice network is bad most of the time, besides there are too far ''mentors'' who doesn't even know how to play themselves,just leveled their classes to 60/70 to get the crown.

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Originally Posted by SuperZay

Maybe its his macro with /beckon tied to skill. Would make more sense with Provoke though.
Still not as bad as some summoners /bowing to their pets after summoning them.

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I play on ps4 and sometimes this happens to me^^ trying to unmend but then realized im on different set of crossbar and ended up sundrop dancing.. worst case i did lb tank in os3 by mistake..

Sorry OOT :D

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

.. That's fine actually. Faster is NICE. But 25 mins with no wipes? I'd be OK with that for DF. We're not talking about people being sub-optimal. We're talking about people being so close to non-contributory as to be just above AFK-ing.

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25 mins is when you are meeting people that do not know how to aoe properly, 25 is borderline "passable" When you get a person solo queue that averages 20-30 mins on healer, but 14-20 mins on dps, it really shows how much people do not know how to DPS properly. Also even at 23-25 min range, it is possible to be stressing the healer. Another reason for that slow is a new tank pulling small, so in that case that isn't a big deal, just depends what is going on really.

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Originally Posted by spagthetapdancer

I think you've listed some fine standards there. that's what I would consider a fairly realistic expectationfrom most people. it considered more than one context, and it's not exaggerated at all. I am just more concerned with not being subjected to a douchebag's inflated expectations and will
throw as many corpses under the bus as I need to to protect myself from those douchebags, collateral damage or not.

I'll just cut to the chase and give you an honest answer. you could be a reasonable person the entire time and it wouldn't matter. I'm not trying to protect myself form you. I'm trying to protect myself from douchebags, just like people in the OP's position are trying to protect themselves from having weird or negative experiences with particularly clueless players.

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That person's standaerds is the point of this thread, people not living up to those.

We are complaining about including but not limited to:
spaming 1,1,1,1,1
"I do not aoe because it costs too much tp"
being in an expert for 15 mins and only clearing the first boss, allowing a vote abandon request to be thrown since kicking a single person wouldn't fix the problem.
Spaming 1,1,1 with huge time gaps after CD is ready
spaming actions out of combo
brds putting dots on one monster
forever no bane SMNs in mass pulls
etc.

So yeah might be a good idea to read the posts better.

I always queue for in progress and it seems like its 50/50; either something terrible happened and if im lucky i get a great drama story, or nothing happens and someone just left and its normal

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Originally Posted by ko_

I guess my opinion wouldn't matter much at all, as I like the dungeons and have been grinding them nonstop cause I find them fun. I didn't know this much of the playerbase hated dungeons to the point it's a get in get out thing. I'm about to spam doma castle for as long as I can cause I like the music and boss fights. Why do I feel like I'm the only person who is goign to do that now? :C

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While I enjoy dungeons, many are almost insultingly easy. I had more fun in Kugane Castle the other day than I ever have all because my friend was forced to tank the last boss on BRD while I healed (WHM). The issue for most people nowadays is dungeons offer very little engagement. Stormblood also decided to put silly gimmicks in a few, which just irk me as a melee DPS. When you've been playing for over two years and most dungeon boils down to the same formula with virtually no challenge, they tend to get a little stale. It's why I was disappointed to hear the devs claim The Vault may have been too hard for leveling healers. No, it was a great dungeon! Make more of those and I'll care again.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

While I enjoy dungeons, many are almost insultingly easy. I had more fun in Kugane Castle the other day than I ever have all because my friend was forced to tank the last boss on BRD while I healed (WHM). The issue for most people nowadays is dungeons offer very little engagement. Stormblood also decided to put silly gimmicks in a few, which just irk me as a melee DPS. When you've been playing for over two years and most dungeon boils down to the same formula with virtually no challenge, they tend to get a little stale. It's why I was disappointed to hear the devs claim The Vault may have been too hard for leveling healers. No, it was a great dungeon! Make more of those and I'll care again.

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Ah then it's def a difference in time, as I'm just about to hit a week old. Thank you for that understanding and point of view. I don't feel as sad now.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

That person's standaerds is the point of this thread, people not living up to those.

We are complaining about including but not limited to:
spaming 1,1,1,1,1
"I do not aoe because it costs too much tp"
being in an expert for 15 mins and only clearing the first boss, allowing a vote abandon request to be thrown since kicking a single person wouldn't fix the problem.
Spaming 1,1,1 with huge time gaps after CD is ready
spaming actions out of combo
brds putting dots on one monster
forever no bane SMNs in mass pulls
etc.

So yeah might be a good idea to read the posts better.

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I did. days ago. my problem is that I don't trust you or anyone to have restraint with their standards. to keep them realistic, or really anything reasonable. Because while you might get people those things, I get "skip soar or disband" (I'm not joining those when I just came back from a break and arrive 3 weeks into the patch) or ilvl 320 requirements on Susano EX learning parties(current). I get one dude flipping out that people learning those EX's aren't pushing out 4200+ dps in patch 4.05.

Because the players in this game don't advertise their minimum acceptable standards in a group. they set standards that allow them leeway to make smooth, efficient runs with little to no wipes even when their group is learning. that has been my experience: people throwing the meta around like a beating stick even when it isn't appropriate. people using the top performers as a means of bullying the middle or lower end because it hurts their bottom line.

Why would I trust random peoples' standards if the bulk of the standards people I run into hold are like that? why would I allow others to subject me to theirs if I don't trust them to use moderation? I don't have to blindly trust what HyoMinPark because she blatantly explained hers with a degree of clarity. all you've posted in a list of exaggerated grievances with particularly clueless players no one in their right mind would support a group being subjected to. it's clearly hyperbolic even if the sheer quantity of players in this game guarantees they at least exist.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

Because they think its a game, and you think its a job.

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This is the best answer on this thread.