Women and Armor!

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Originally Posted by Elgeron

Actually is not that they are powerful looking, because a lot of sexy clothing doesn't looks powerful. Is more that players can be sexy, yet play as powerful warriors or mages. Just take a look at a lot of movies were the women characters weird ridiculous sexy, yet kicks everyone ass. The clothes don't look powerful, is the character that is powerful while looking sexy. What I meant to say is that the gear itself isn't powerfull looking but the player look sexy while being powerfull, but I think my poor wording is too blame there.

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Understood and agreed. It's just that the females are required to look sexy if they want to wear that gear. The most common response I hear to this is that 'Well they can choose to wear something else, there's lots of non-revealing gear in this game' and my point is, they shouldn't have to wear something else. If they want to wear the iconic Kain-style Dragoon AF, they shouldn't have to settle for a revealing knock-off when men don't have to also.

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Originally Posted by Elgeron

One problem I see in these kind of arguments of that the gear "is not practical and realistic", but almost all off the high level gear is ridicolous impractical, even the ones that cover the full body. You can alledge suspension of disbelief but that may be too subjective to arrive to a general consensus. Instead I think the focus should be in the fact that there are significant differences between male and female version of the gear ( that has nothing to do with differences in anatomy) which dramatically affect the aesthetics of the characters. The cool and badass Ninja armor is instead sexy for female players, while the sexy gear for men is also sexy for women. This take away variety for players of female characters to have more styles and customization. In the case of the Dragoon armor it takes part of the armor, making the design feel kind of incomplete or poor compared to the male version.

Other minor thing to add is that the coatee is a crafting gear, wich kind of strike me as unpractical even on the male version, it looks too elegant and restraining to do things as blacksmithing. And even with the belly hole, Dragoon gear still looks very powerful.

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I think we're essentially on the same page. I personally preferred the more 'practical' aesthetic of the gear released with Version 1 (highest level armour was Iron Plate Mail iirc - I know cobalt came later). But within the bounds of the new aesthetic, I don't mind the gear being unrealistic or impractical, as long as the changes between genders are there for purely 'practical' reasons (ie: the bra being added to the open shirts and the harnesses so that those babies aren't swinging loose and upping the game's age rating).

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Originally Posted by BlaiseArath

I don't think "Sexy"(Don't think thats the right word but its whats been used) armor should be removed entirely and replaced by a new line of conservative armor that covers your body from head to toe like the Darksteel trash can armor, like some of you seem to be requesting,

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Literally no-one has asked for this. It's one of the most frustrating parts of being on this side of the debate. People don't read, assume they know what you're asking for then misrepresent you. No amount of correcting them every makes them see they made a mistake though.

Another problem arise when we think how much of the people in this topic represent what the general playerbase actually like. A lot of player do not participate in the forum's activities nor even visit it. And that without mentioning the Japanase playerbase who may have different point of view. So I can be wrong about being any significant number of the female playerbase enjoying the sexy clothing in FF XIV or perhaps is the opposite and only a small fraction actually wants regular clothes.

We would need polls, surveys and the like, but making the majority of the playerbase actually participate sounds very complicated. And nothing asure SE would take it in account.

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Originally Posted by Elgeron

Another problem arise when we think how much of the people in this topic represent what the general playerbase actually like. A lot of player do not participate in the forum's activities nor even visit it. And that without mentioning the Japanase playerbase who may have different point of view. So I can be wrong about being any significant number of the female playerbase enjoying the sexy clothing in FF XIV or perhaps is the opposite and only a small fraction actually wants regular clothes.

We would need polls, surveys and the like, but making the majority of the playerbase actually participate sounds very complicated. And nothing asure SE would take it in account.

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I'm realistic enough to know that if they asked the playerbase if they wanted the next ilevel upgrade armour to be sparkling shiny trenchccoats of awesomeness with shoulderpads of epicness for men and a dental floss/postage stamp combo for women enough of the playerbase would say yes. There's a reason there are so many MMOs have battle bikinis for women and burly macho gear for men. It's what the playerbase wants to see.

It doesn't make it right, however.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

It doesn't make it right, however.

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In theory, it does - unless you want to stand against the whole concept of Democracy. I can understand it's not right for you - but majority wins, in the end. Especially in business-related activities, since it means more money.

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Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

In theory, it does - unless you want to stand against the whole concept of Democracy. I can understand it's not right for you - but majority wins, in the end. Especially in business-related activities, since it means more money.

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People voted in Hitler. Democracy is fallible.

Being popular and being right are not always related.

(inb4 Godwin's Law. I wasn't comparing anyone to Hitler)

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Originally Posted by Aegis

People voted in Hitler. Democracy is fallible.

Being popular and being right are not always related.

(inb4 Godwin's Law. I wasn't comparing anyone to Hitler)

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Not how that works ""As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches". Godwin? CHECK!

It took 35 pages, but there it is. Gnite folks!

Quick history lesson, just because, you know - I'm being pedantic. Hitler wasn't popular. His party received just over a third of votes. He came to power undemocratically.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

I'm realistic enough to know that if they asked the playerbase if they wanted the next ilevel upgrade armour to be sparkling shiny trenchccoats of awesomeness with shoulderpads of epicness for men and a dental floss/postage stamp combo for women enough of the playerbase would say yes. There's a reason there are so many MMOs have battle bikinis for women and burly macho gear for men. It's what the playerbase wants to see.

It doesn't make it right, however.

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I may be naive and too idealistic by saying this, but I trust the a considerable amount of the playerbase would actually preffer either variety or good designed clothes.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

People voted in Hitler. Democracy is fallible.

Being popular and being right are not always related.

(inb4 Godwin's Law. I wasn't comparing anyone to Hitler)

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Of course it is fallible. That does not mean that it's not the lesser evil, tho.

Point is, what you believe to be right might be wrong for me, and vice versa.
There are only two ways to settle this: 1) Naked violence and 2) Democracy. Sadly, generally accepted morality kinda condemns option 1), so we are left with 2).

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Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Of course it is fallible. That does not mean that it's not the lesser evil, tho.

Point is, what you believe to be right might be wrong for me, and vice versa.
There are only two ways to settle this: 1) Naked violence and 2) Democracy. Sadly, generally accepted morality kinda condemns option 1), so we are left with 2).

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Naked Nakedness however, society is all in favour of :)

To be fair, most societies with a human/civil rights mandate (like the American Constitution or the Magna Carta) use a three part system where at least one branch is unelected specifically to avoid popular injustices. This is usually the judiciary branch. If a majority of the population vote for the slavery or punishment of a minority, the judiciary are there to strike down any laws passed to that effect.

Give me the perfect, benevolent dictator anyday.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

Naked Nakedness however, society is all in favour of :)

To be fair, most societies with a human/civil rights mandate (like the American Constitution or the Magna Carta) use a three part system where at least one branch is unelected specifically to avoid popular injustices. This is usually the judiciary branch. If a majority of the population vote for the slavery or punishment of a minority, the judiciary are there to strike down any laws passed to that effect.

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Right. Unless corruption happens, and it ALWAYS happens.
But we are digressing.

I feel like this thread somehow caught the attention of SE, for better or worse. The decision is up to them (and Japanese players, mostly).