Please Allow 50's to Enter Ishgard w/o having completed MSQ

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Saying that its fast to complete the MSQ is not a good argument for your case. As it takes a significant amount of time to complete. Time spend on just the MSQ, not other things such as (other) dungeons, fates, gathering, crafting, talking with people, etc,etc.

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Only for veterans who remember suddenly that they have still to do the MSQ.
New players spend the time on level up their classes while doing the MSQ.

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Originally Posted by Kauthryn

The Duty Roulette literally exists for this reason, though. So long as high level characters receive rewards, they will queue. The game is going to be top heavy if you keep people from making low characters and the gating of like, dungeons and having to do the intro baby quests doesn't really help with queues.

These things are attempts at confirming a bias, not examining the problem objectively.

You will also note that I said it is largely irrelevant, as if in HW you can level/gear through the MSQ, then it becomes the most efficient way to level and there's nothing wrong with the gate if it's open.

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I think you've been objective, but I don't agree with you.
You speak like alts shouldn't have to unlock everything over again with the MSQ.
Part of making an alt is starting from scratch. That's just the nature of it.

You level all your classes again and you get the MSQ back, experiencing it first-hand.
I mean, if it wasn't really about that then they could simply duplicate your character with all classes leveled as high as you got them.
That would be a bit ridiculous though.

There are achievement sharing in other games, but those aren't this game.
The achievements aren't actually related to the locking in this game, like it is in some others.
It's not that simple to take that tech and adapt it to this game.
This game was set up to bypass those comfort systems in the first place, by allowing you to play all the classes into one character.
The whole system is designed differently with that in mind.

So they could do a lot of work to remake that tech for a game that tried to not to need it.
But then there are actually people who build alts to redo everything like a fresh character.
I know a few. I've done it myself. The experience of starting from fresh is part of that.
So I don't think it does justice to people who would play like that.

So I don't really see a problem.
If someone thinks having an alt is worth it, they'd go through the process.
If they don't, don't make an alt.

Making an alt in this game is meant to be a bigger deal because one character gets access and builds up (unlocks) a lot more than other games that have stuff like account-wide achievements.
I don't think that should be overlooked.

The problem I have involves those 8 player trials that you already have issues finding people to do.

Drop them to 4 player or remove them entirely. Castrum and Westwind had hour long waits for them for crying out loud.

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Originally Posted by Nadirah

The problem I have involves those 8 player trials that you already have issues finding people to do.

Drop them to 4 player or remove them entirely. Castrum and Westwind had hour long waits for them for crying out loud.

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This has long been discussed and was addressed for 3.0, to enable ease of access to instances.

Partial parties will be optional in ARR content (pre 50), and possibly even chocobo companions can fill vacancies.

Also- first-timers to dungeons will be in priority DF queues.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Only for veterans who remember suddenly that they have still to do the MSQ.
New players spend the time on level up their classes while doing the MSQ.

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No, I speak from the experience of someone that did it recently (2 months~ ago) with plenty of time left, and whos doing it all again.


I find it strange that so many agree with your odd reasoning...I mean theres a pretty obvious error in your argument:
A lot of the MSQ happens at level 50, at which time new players will have already completed ''leveling up''...
In addition even the leveling up part of the MSQ takes quite a bit of time to complete.


As such its an incredibly poor argument to use.
Because indeed, for everyone, it takes quite a bit of time to complete the MSQ, its not by any means fast.

Take it from me, someone that agrees with the content being locked behind the story: your argument of the MSQ being fast to complete is just plain incorrect.

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

If someone thinks having an alt is worth it, they'd go through the process.
If they don't, don't make an alt.

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Indeed, such is my opinion as well.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

No, I speak from the experience of someone that did it recently (2 months~ ago) with plenty of time left, and whos doing it all again.


I find it strange that so many agree with your odd reasoning...I mean theres a pretty obvious error in your argument:
A lot of the MSQ happens at level 50, at which time new players will have already completed ''leveling up''...

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A lot of the MSQ at 50, what? There are roughly half the quests needed for the Astral quests compared to the Umbral. A very large portion of the overall MSQ happens from 1 to 50, whereas the Astral quests are only roughly 100 very easy and quick quests, with the exception of the few dungeons and trials.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

No, I speak from the experience of someone that did it recently (2 months~ ago) with plenty of time left, and whos doing it all again.


I find it strange that so many agree with your odd reasoning...I mean theres a pretty obvious error in your argument:
A lot of the MSQ happens at level 50, at which time new players will have already completed ''leveling up''...


In addition even the leveling up part of the MSQ takes quite a bit of time to complete.


As such its an incredibly poor argument to use. Because indeed, for everyone, it takes quite a bit of time to complete the MSQ, its not by any means fast.

Indeed, such is my opinion as well.

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You're operating under the assumption that the MSQs will continue to no longer give EXP after about cape westwind.
If you're leveling normally, then those quests SHOULD take you to about lvl 52 or so, maybe even 55 (there are only 2-3 MSQ dungeons and Trials have always given crap for exp). Those of us that did all the quests ahead of time have our "edge" in the fact that our gear greatly outpaces what will be seen in early HW areas, whereas a new player will have more levels under their belt to compensate for their inherent lack of super balanced stats.

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Originally Posted by kyuven

You're operating under the assumption that the MSQs will continue to no longer give EXP after about cape westwind.
If you're leveling normally, then those quests SHOULD take you to about lvl 52 or so, maybe even 55 (there are only 2-3 MSQ dungeons and Trials have always given crap for exp). Those of us that did all the quests ahead of time have our "edge" in the fact that our gear greatly outpaces what will be seen in early HW areas, whereas a new player will have more levels under their belt to compensate for their inherent lack of super balanced stats.

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They said going from 50-60 would be the same amount of time from going 1-50 in 2.0 days. I highly doubt a new player running cape westwind and the castrum's would receive such a significant boost in XP gains that they would be level 52 or even 55 by the time they hit 3.0 content. Expect leveling 50-60 to be much slower than what you expect and the amount of XP needed to be far greater in comparison to the previous 1-50 levels.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

I find it strange that so many agree with your odd reasoning...I mean theres a pretty obvious error in your argument:
A lot of the MSQ happens at level 50, at which time new players will have already completed ''leveling up''...
In addition even the leveling up part of the MSQ takes quite a bit of time to complete.

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You have to see it how it will be in 3.0, not how it is in 2.0. In 3.0 you will not have completed ''leveling up'' while reaching the lv50 msq.

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When the game launches, it will be like the start of the second season of a drama, so we'll still want new players to check out the first season. We want to keep the "first season" there, but allow players to quickly move through it so that they can enjoy the "second season," so based on that, we're increasing the ease of approaching the old content.

We'll be doing an overall review of the amount of experience given by main quest rewards in A Realm Reborn as well as the equipment handed out by quests and make it such that you can simply go from A Realm Reborn to patch 2.55 and have your item level be high enough that you can equip the gear and move right on to Ishgard.

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Originally Posted by m3eansean

They said going from 50-60 would be the same amount of time from going 1-50 in 2.0 days. I highly doubt a new player running cape westwind and the castrum's would receive such a significant boost in XP gains that they would be level 52 or even 55 by the time they hit 3.0 content. Expect leveling 50-60 to be much slower than what you expect and the amount of XP needed to be far greater in comparison to the previous 1-50 levels.

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They should be lv50 the moment they reach castrum with just the mainstory quests. But there are still other mainstory quests between the fight against Ultima and the march into exile. That should give them lv 52 - 53 before reaching 3.0, I guess.

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Originally Posted by m3eansean

They said going from 50-60 would be the same amount of time from going 1-50 in 2.0 days. I highly doubt a new player running cape westwind and the castrum's would receive such a significant boost in XP gains that they would be level 52 or even 55 by the time they hit 3.0 content. Expect leveling 50-60 to be much slower than what you expect and the amount of XP needed to be far greater in comparison to the previous 1-50 levels.

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Just saying, but how long does it take to go 1-50 for a brand new player anyways?

I ask that having an answer already from watching and helping a group of players in my FC who just came over from WoW.


ANSWER: Just under two weeks.


That is just a rough average because a couple of them are already well into relic weapon quest. I did chimera, hydra, and the HM primals on one person's run. Please keep in mind, these are fresh players to FFXIV with no prior experience with SE run MMOs, ie no FFXI vets. These are just decent players with real lives, jobs and other regular people stuff-they haven't been playing 24/7 for that 2 week span.

1-50 isn't that bad now and it is only going to get easier come 3.0. With the devs saying that 51-60 is going to be approximately the same amount of time in terms of exp needed, not seeing where its even going to be an issue worth comment once the expansion hits.

In fact, the situation looks like it will shape up to be a lot like when SE raised lvl caps in FXI after lvl 75 had been the cap for a long period of time. Only in FFXIV we are going to essentially be given a "free" level 60 just by finishing the next leg of the main quest. In XI you had to go out a find that new set of mobs to grind before you could recap that first job's exp each lvl cap increase.