Re-rolling from Warrior, thoughts?

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Originally Posted by nimrod

Well knight and soldier with 2 adds are also "hard" hitting in that regards.
Sure PLD tanks at that video the dreadnauts, the Warrior put way more DPS out in those phases as an offTank as PLD could do. I can´t judge about 2 PLDs, guess its not really easier cause u have the dmg loss from having 2 of them in.
I guess "undergeared" it will be sure easier to manage the first two turns, but with "decent" gear for that instance its easy to roll both a PLD and a Warrior. My argument was about rolling a Warrior is also good... some ppl are saying warrior would be trash and thats not the case at all in the moment for endgame or even before that warriors can Solo tank everything plds can if played right.

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I dunno, I've never seen a warrior take the double dreadnoughts, or the 4 stack dreadnought

they might be able to once they're in mostly/full ilvl90 gear, but at that point you're just farming - not doing progression content

I suppose they do more damage than paladins, so I'll concede that warriors are the better damage dealer

I love my PLD. I tried tanking as a mrd/war yesterday and felt so squishy. I know they have the same defense but it's tough on a healer after you've blown your regen/defense abilities. I can definitely understand why people are picking pld over war. At this point with such huge hits coming from the bosses it's really hairy in Heal intensive fights.

I wouldn't give up on war because it does have it's merits. I will continue to work on mine and get better with it. They are two completely different worlds when it comes to tanking however.

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Originally Posted by Trife

This attitude is everything that's wrong with this community...

"It's too hard with WAR pout, pout. So sad it's not even funny. I don't get this mentality with gamers nowadays that, if it isn't easy, it's not worth their time.

I'm sure it's very possible with WAR, just takes a different strategy or maybe more thinking, (I know, I know, booo to thinking!).

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Asinine. This is like calling a tennis player lazy for using a full size graphite racket rather than a half-size wooden racket. It isn't lazy to use the best tool for the job; it's intelligent. You ascertain the best tool for the job, then you apply it appropriately. There is no circumstance in which WAR is the best tool for the job besides aoe damage. Yes, people can and are using WARs to a point, but it's not because they are the optimal (or even an equal) choice. It's because people leveled WAR and still want to play FFXIV.

Imo, fixing war is easy...

Take paladins stun, give it to warriors, give paladins warrior's stun.

Paladins have more mitigation etc etc so Warriors should have the short stun. And it make's more sense for a barbarian to have a low CD stun than a Holy Paladin. Secondly, make more of warrior and paladins skills cross class so both have more options.

Also, with Puglist leveled to 8 you get Second Wind and Feather*w/e it's called and paladin to 22 you get provoke, and some 10% mitigation buffs (Convalence) etc. Weave those cd's in with Inner Beast and Infuriate and you can do something paladins cannot. We can instant heal on big hits. We can prepare for and mitigate dmg from the big hits. Warriors not using Inner Beast right is why they have such a bad rep. Unchained is crap and should only be used if your the OT on a 1 Tank fight. If you have Hate issues and need unchained to hold agro then your undergeared.

E.g. a warrior with FeatherDance and the pld (10%) reduced dmg thing popped can innerbeast back over 1-2k HP basically negating some large hits. And with infuriate you can get off two inner beasts, and you can get off an inner beast in your main rotation every 6th attack. Stack some skill speed and you get them off even faster.

My advice for the OP is to play a few classes and choose the one that you enjoy playing most. Games are meant to be fun. Have fun. If you're not playing a class that you enjoy to play, what's the point of even progressing any further?

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Originally Posted by Ryios

Imo, fixing war is easy...

Take paladins stun, give it to warriors, give paladins warrior's stun.

Paladins have more mitigation etc etc so Warriors should have the short stun. And it make's more sense for a barbarian to have a low CD stun than a Holy Paladin. Secondly, make more of warrior and paladins skills cross class so both have more options.

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The stun doesn't really help much in later dungeons that I've noticed. All the bosses moves go off either too fast or are not affected by stun. Granted my experience with this is limited to Stone Vigil. I do think they should remove the long cooldown for the WAR's stun though. It still isn't going to help them much.

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Originally Posted by Hed

The stun doesn't really help much in later dungeons that I've noticed.

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Everything pre AK is easy mode and a non issue for either tanking class.

The stun is crucial on Chimera and basically a Must Have on Ifrit HM (it can be done without... but why deal with eruptions if a pld can stun every one of them). The stun becomes a huge factor later on Trash in AK, Primals, and BC.

Imo war and pld should be balanced in such a way that both are needed for 2 tank encounters (raids etc) so that they exactly compliment each other. And they are not far off from that, but I think they got the stun backwards, it should be pld's with the long cd stun and the war with the short cooldown stun. Or both should have a short cooldown stun. Or they should increase pld stun to match war and make them learn to alternate them.

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Originally Posted by Ryios

Everything pre AK is easy mode and a non issue for either tanking class.

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Like I said, my experience so far later in the game was limited to Stone Vigil where none of the boss moves can be stunned. I did notice on MRD in Haukke that the stun is not efficient at all. Having to either wait between maiden pulls or just pull and run was a bit annoying and did feel like it left the two imbalanced in that respect. The stun may not be crucial for dungeons pre AK but it is nice to utilize in earlier dungeons regardless.

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Originally Posted by Furious

Asinine. This is like calling a tennis player lazy for using a full size graphite racket rather than a half-size wooden racket. It isn't lazy to use the best tool for the job; it's intelligent. You ascertain the best tool for the job, then you apply it appropriately. There is no circumstance in which WAR is the best tool for the job besides aoe damage. Yes, people can and are using WARs to a point, but it's not because they are the optimal (or even an equal) choice. It's because people leveled WAR and still want to play FFXIV.

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There seems to be a great hostility to efficiency and mathematical optimization in this community. Sounds like the old men saying "in the good ol days" when confronting new ideas and technologies.

I remember these threads during 1.0 where everyone was ragging on PLD. Now it's the opposite. lol

Have both tanks leveled, they can share some of the gear anyway.

Has anyone ever considered that the "problems" with either tank being better depends largely on group makeup and player skill? It seems most people play much better when they pick a class they are comfortable with, despite it being "preferred" over others. I've run dungeons with both WAR and PLD, where both were far better geared than myself, and for some odd reason they would die while MTing (or OT, but rarely) and I'd have to pick up the slack. Despite them having all this gear and all the fancy cooldowns and abilities, they just didn't have the play style down.

Sure I've seen myself get crushed by bosses, leveling as a MRD/WAR, but I've learned how to compensate and when to blow cooldowns. I've run dungeons where Healers would just run around in circles because half the time I took damage, I'd just heal myself back up. I'd even tell healers to Heal themselves first after a big AoE because i can at least dump 2.5-3.5k hp back on myself within 4-6 seconds (This typically requires you to notice a big hit is coming, pop the required cooldowns before it happens and just double spam Inner Beast after the hit) of being hit. It's always great to turn a few heads when people have a predisposed line of thinking that as a WAR you're going to just get pummeled into the ground and die on every boss fight, and you end up keeping yourself alive for most of the fight. Learn the class well, then show those you run with whether or not you're worth the weight of your Ax!

Just a quick update on the matter, decided to level up a GLD to get some of the defensive cooldowns they have, mainly crit nulification and provoke is always nice, going to see how it plays out but so far I just want to play my WAR, GLD's are complete pansy's.

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Originally Posted by defraz

H

Learn the class well, then show those you run with whether or not you're worth the weight of your Ax!

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warriors really suck in coil is their main problem. They can tank the first boss, but can't let to many stacks or they just die. My group does no slimes so goes up to like 5 stacks by the end. 2nd boss ehh they could tank that one hes easy. 4th boss is the problem its a big burden on healers with how much damage people take on that fight and warriors just take way more damage then paladins because of cooldowns. However Their is a warrior in turn 5 that went full dex in his stats so his parry is really high, so if you tried that you might be successful. But on turn 4 you'll get one shot as a warrior, unless you have the some really good rng. so their inconsistent tanks, where as paladins go in pop 10 cooldowns laught at boss. Besides for liking the class warriors don't really bring anything to the table over warriors.