Is it necessary to advertise "LGBTQ+ friendly"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Klytania

I've always thought this was an insane premise. Also really only applies to content creators. But still, who do game devs think they are? Trying to police people outside of their product?

---

They have the right to their own property and some behavior or opinions are hurtful to the image of the company thus they can ban for example a toxic streamer even if they don't do anything wrong ingame but for example use slurs in their streams while playing XIV.

But fear not, you can still exercise your free screech rights on either public or your own property. But the game is neither of both, it's a private property on which you have no right other than the owner gives you.

My FC has never uttered these words even though we most certainly are, and the not only just the FC master but many officers and members fall into the category.
But we've never really seen a need to do this since it really should just be considered the default and accepting of everyone.

Also we don't particularly advertise in general. Word of mouth and the random nice players we meet has been more than enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wilford111

I don't see any bigotry happening in here. Recognize having a problem with someone's dumb ideas and mannerisms rather than having a problem with their identity.

---

The following thread received a huge and really frequent amount of hateful replies (and many likes on said replies) that ranged from bigots repeatedly accusing people who wanted slightly more representation as being insecure in their sexuality or gender identity, being unhealthily obsessed with what genitalia that a transgender person might have, purposefully misgendering transgender people, perpetuating unfair LGBTQ+ community stereotypes related to AIDS, and there was even someone expressing shame that certain marginalized people didn’t kill themselves along with other really nasty rhetoric; those were just a few of many examples: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...threads/424766

The moderators have thankfully cleaned up some of those offensive remarks, but some homophobic or transphobic comments persist and continue to appear across newer threads, and it’s from far more than just a few people. Whether some people here want to admit it or not, these forums clearly have some degree of a bigotry problem that isn’t being readily moderated, with the offenders often continuing to post edgy remarks or spam trolling threads immediately after having some of their hateful posts deleted for violating the forum’s terms of service, either doubling down on their bigotry or not facing any additional consequences besides removed replies.

Clearly, the universal solution to the controversial housing, PVP, Hrothgar, plug-in, Healer, and Kaiten issues is to directly advertise the game to trolls.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VictorSpoils

Clearly, the universal solution to the controversial housing, PVP, Hrothgar, plug-in, Healer, and Kaiten issues is to directly advertise the game to trolls.

---

what would that accomplish?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ranaku

They have the right to their own property and some behavior or opinions are hurtful to the image of the company thus they can ban for example a toxic streamer even if they don't do anything wrong ingame but for example use slurs in their streams while playing XIV.

But fear not, you can still exercise your free screech rights on either public or your own property. But the game is neither of both, it's a private property on which you have no right other than the owner gives you.

---

But they said they can ban for behavior outside of the game. So is this now modified to "while playing" the game?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Veranolth

Kinda narrow-minded for some people here to think it's just a bunch of virtue signaling or that it's mostly gay people bringing the fact that they're gay all the time, and it's narrow-minded people that make it so FCs feel the need to advertise as LGBTQ+ friendly because, in our case with my FC personally, we try to avoid any drama. We want our small community to be a safe space and there's nothing wrong with wanting that. If there's an issue in the FC we discuss it before it blows up just so we don't have to deal with drama. There's people from all walks of life. I myself am trans and having to come out as trans in previous FCs/guilds sucks because you don't really know if people are accepting of that or not.

---

lol sounds pretty intolerant to different views to me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

lol sounds pretty intolerant to different views to me.

---

https://i.imgflip.com/6fxkq5.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

lol sounds pretty intolerant to different views to me.

---

You sound pretty intolerant yourself, and you go as far as making fun of transgendered people with your next reply, so you're not only intolerant but also ignorant.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BrokentoothMarch

I don't tie myself to anything based on sexuality or identity. I tie myself to people in this game based on whether we do the same kind of content and have the same kind of interest.

It's that simple.

---

Well said. From what I've seen, many guilds that advertise "LGBTQ+ friendly" end up being "LGBTQ+" focused.

No, I’m not making fun of trans people. I’m making fun of snowflakes that get upset over just about anything. You’re the intolerant one for thinking I’m talking about transgender. Get out of here bigot..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BrokentoothMarch

I fail to see the issue. Sadly, Discord is not affiliated with FFXIV and rightfully so. I don't see why people doing things outside the game should be... Punished in game. At that point, the correct report would be submitted to Discord or for you to simply leave. I'm not sure about you, but I don't make a habit to stay where I'm not wanted.

And mayhaps it was their first offense. Though you may not feel vindicated, rare is the time a permanent on first offense is warranted.

---

This right here is why LGBT friendly FCs advertise, because there is a lot of "oh it wasn't so bad" or "it was just the first offense" and when you get into a group of people who are all doing these things every day you log in then it starts to wear on a person. Also as mentioned earlier ToS does not include discord or other chat and voice services which many FCs use as their primary means of communication, so if you want to actually participate in things with them you'll need to use it where they can abuse you all they like.

Also, you want to talk about drama, join any FC run by a couple, any problem they're having you're all going to be having.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

No, I’m not making fun of trans people. I’m making fun of snowflakes that get upset over just about anything. You’re the intolerant one for thinking I’m talking about transgender. Get out of here bigot..

---

I don't think I've ever read anything so lacking in self awareness. And this is the XIV forums.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MirielleLavandre

As a fairly old japanese woman with a husband, joining Lgbt FCs has often been eye opening but also a bit annoying because there seems to be so many things today's generation take as offensive that I know nothing about. Someone once got offended and went off on someone else over a Pepe lizard guy thing apparently being offensive? Then also over someone feeling unsafe because another member liked MAGA and didn't use 'partner' instead of 'wife'. I mean, who can keep up with what's offensive to people, especially marginalized groups, these days? Better to just join a group where you don't have to walk on eggshells as long as you're a decent human being. Also keep in mind what's known or understood as offensive in one culture might not even be known of to another (like American culture vs. Japanese).

---

Yeah. The problem with these types of groups is that a lot of queer folk are, and I say this with love, extremely terminally online. And since there's a certain contingent of people online who make it their mission in life to use just about anything as a hate symbol... It ends up making their groups very insular and unwelcoming, because those things legitimately get to marginalized people because of how they've been used against them.

It's extremely unfortunate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

No, I’m not making fun of trans people. I’m making fun of snowflakes that get upset over just about anything. You’re the intolerant one for thinking I’m talking about transgender. Get out of here bigot..

---

The fact that you are clearly trolling, and being upvoted for that trolling is all the reason that advertising as LGBT friendly is necessary.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YukinaErde

The fact that you are clearly trolling, and being upvoted for that trolling is all the reason that advertising as LGBT friendly is necessary.

---

That’s a fallacy.

Honestly the fact that this thread exists and people are whining about some small groups of people advertising themselves as LGBT friendly is really all the proof you need that its necessary.

Dont like it? dont join them. whining about them just proves you have hate and fear in your heart from their mere existence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YukinaErde

Honestly the fact that this thread exists and people are whining about some small groups of people advertising themselves as LGBT friendly is really all the proof you need that its necessary.

Dont like it? dont join them. whining about them just proves you have hate and fear in your heart from their mere existence.

---

Lol yes, post on a public space, and if anyone criticizes they are in fact intolerant, and hateful.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alaray

I don't think I've ever read anything so lacking in self awareness. And this is the XIV forums.

---

Lol I don’t think I’ve met anyone that lacks critical thinking as this guy before

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Why don’t you show the post I’m replying too so it’s not taken out of context? Or do you enjoy skewing the facts?

---

Uh sure? You didn't even quote a post yourself so I can only assume you were replying to me, but either way I've added it, better?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Lol yes, post on a public space, and if anyone criticizes they are in fact intolerant, and hateful.

---

The choice of venue for being a hateful phobic bigot doesnt change or stop the hateful phobic bigotry. So idk what your comment is intended to say aside from you not understanding basic communication.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyd3l

Hardly. But for not wanting to be ridiculed about their lifestyles and having to endure this kind of 'humor'.

---

Again, not the entire thing. Good job with the skewing part.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Again, not the entire thing. Good job with the skewing part.

---

Seriously post it yourself then, I don't even know what you're talking about. Show me where things are taken out of context.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Lol I don’t think I’ve met anyone that lacks critical thinking as this guy before

---

I haven't read a single thought provoking word from your line of multi-posts, btw there's an edit button in case you couldn't read it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YukinaErde

The choice of venue for being a hateful phobic bigot doesnt change or stop the hateful phobic bigotry. So idk what your comment is intended to say aside from you not understanding basic communication.

---

What are you even talking about? Lmao you talk about my lack of comprehension, but it looks like you’re the one that lacks it.

Again, it’s a public space, people are free to say what they want. When people say something that’s opposite to what you want to hear, you don’t even try to articulate a proper argument to get your point across. You go right into saying dumb stuff like they are hateful.

What a joke.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alaray

I haven't read a single thought provoking word from your line of multi-posts, btw there's an edit button in case you couldn't read it.

---

Bro, I can say the same to you. Theres a delete button incase you cant read

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

What are you even talking about? Lmao you talk about my lack of comprehension, but it looks like you’re the one that lacks it.

Again, it’s a public space, people are free to say what they want. When people say something that’s opposite to what you want to hear, you don’t even try to articulate a proper argument to be fit your view. You go right into saying dumb stuff like they are hateful.

What a joke.

---

People are free to say whatever they want, just like I and others are free to say that those people are hateful phobic bigots for saying what they did. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Bro, I can say the same to you. Theres a delete button incase you cant read

---

Kinda wish the insult would've been an original one and not repacking what I said, but alas.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alaray

Kinda wish the insult would've been an original one and not repacking what I said, but alas.

---

Lol it has to be the same, that way you know how dumb you sound.

Which it seems like you did

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YukinaErde

People are free to say whatever they want, just like I and others are free to say that those people are hateful phobic bigots for saying what they did. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequence.

---

Lmao obviously. And the consequences of your rebuttal was showing how intolerant you can be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Lmao obviously. And the consequences of your rebuttal was showing how intolerant you can be.

---

I have no tolerance for those who are lgbtphobic. Why would I or anyone tolerate those who constantly spew and perpetuate such hate and violence against some of the most marginalized and at risk groups of people on the planet?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YukinaErde

I have no tolerance for those who are lgbtphobic. Why would I or anyone tolerate those who constantly spew and perpetuate such hate and violence against some of the most marginalized and at risk groups of people on the planet?

---

Good to know you’re intolerant of different views. Pretty much the definition of a bigot, btw.

I see OP played their hand in the last few pages of the thread lol.

When it comes to this issue, the reality is it's just a bunch of people getting irrationally frustrated/annoyed at LGBTQ+ visibility, and then making bad faith arguments or weird generalizations that attempt to conceal their unreasonable motivations. OP is a great example, initially pretending he totally just thinks it's redundant, but going on to agree with someone who is being openly hostile and posting "muh freeze peach" garbage.

It's not hard to understand why a trans person might not want to inadvertently join an FC where an officer is openly making jokes about trans suicide rates. Being able to join a group that has LGBTQ+ friendly almost certainly gives them the option to avoid that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

Good to know you’re intolerant of different views

---

calling lgbtphobia "different views" really just drives home the fact you are one of them. I urge you to try and be a better person.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LittleImp

I see OP played their hand in the last few pages of the thread lol.

When it comes to this issue, the reality is it's just a bunch of people getting irrationally frustrated/annoyed at LGBTQ+ visibility, and then making bad faith arguments or weird generalizations that attempt to conceal their unreasonable motivations. OP is a great example, initially pretending he totally just thinks it's redundant, but going on to agree with someone who is being openly hostile and posting "muh freeze peach" garbage.

It's not hard to understand why a trans person might not want to inadvertently join an FC where an officer is openly making jokes about trans suicide rates. Being able to join a group that has LGBTQ+ friendly almost certainly gives them the option to avoid that.

---

There's a reason I wanted them to post some more.

Quoted more as agreement, to be honest.

Just let them advertise as whatever their hearts desire as long as they are not mistreating others. Is it necessary or productive? not really, but if you don't like it just ignore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForbiddenMonk

No, I’m not making fun of trans people. I’m making fun of snowflakes that get upset over just about anything. You’re the intolerant one for thinking I’m talking about transgender. Get out of here bigot..

---

I am just going to say this. Why let anything someone else is advertising upset you THIS much? :/ Maybe learn to live and let live?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vav2021

According to the rules, at https://support.na.square-enix.com/f...5382&kid=68216 ,


To which the first example is

And I understand that they punish for off-game behavior. as well, so treating people like garbage outside of the game is punishable.

With all this being said, it almost seems redundant to advertise "LGBTQ+ friendly" in a game where you are required to tolerate it both on and off the game, seeing as how guilds that aren't friendly would be punished.

Is it redundant, or is it warranted even with the rules being as explicit as they are about a zero tolerance (on and off game) about it?

---

As a gay man myself I personally feel more welcomed when the FC actively advertises LGBTQ+ friendly, so although it might be redundant in the eyes of some, it's defnitely a nice detail.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LittleImp

I see OP played their hand in the last few pages of the thread lol.

---

What do you mean?