Can we please get more cool looking outfits for male characters?

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Originally Posted by Pingosteel

http://www.finalfantasyxiv.com/Eorze...N_Census_L.PNG

http://www.finalfantasyxiv.com/Eorze...N_Census_L.PNG

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This is the very reason I try to come up with my own custom glamours. I hate looking like everyone else. As it is, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to many people use Au Ra Horn Type 1 and Tail Type 4 that I avoid these options at all cost. I'll give it to males tho, cuz they don't look the same like the females do after awhile. Plus 1 for looking more original guys, even if you don't have many glamour options.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

There's a roughly equal split between the number of male and female characters present worldwide, no? I could have sworn that was the case with the official census, at least...

Ultimately, though, there's a notable number of people - myself included - who would buy something like Hien's outfit in a heartbeat if it was made available on the Mog Station. The development team need to throw more bones to those of us who play male characters.

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I can promise you, the Hien and Gosetsu (Maybe even Xenos honestly) outfits are an unavoidable Male-only eventuality.

They have a recent trend of only releasing one new outfit at a time. Them happening to release 2 female ones in a row isn't some indication to rally around a point that they're already addressed, and have been actively doing better with in in-game items.
Past glamour-specific outfits have all been neutral, or offered male/female/neutral options like the Hanish set.

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Originally Posted by CosmicKirby

I can promise you, the Hien and Gosetsu (Maybe even Xenos honestly) outfits are an unavoidable Male-only eventuality.

They have a recent trend of only releasing one new outfit at a time. Them happening to release 2 female ones in a row isn't some indication to rally around a point that they're already addressed, and have been actively doing better with in in-game items.
Past glamour-specific outfits have all been neutral, or offered male/female/neutral options like the Hanish set.

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We haven't gotten a Gaius set or a Nero/Livia set, so I wouldn't hold my breath for Zenos.

Since we’re inevitably getting Lyse’s second outfit and a Yotsuyu set down the line (not to mention the Krile robe brought up back during the fan fests), its not like the imbalance is going to change. prior to the last 2 items, we'd been getting a male and female set for a while. Why not speak out when ignored for 2 updates? :I

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Originally Posted by ErryK

What looks silly on Highlanders and Roes? Been playing as a Roe/Highlander male exclusively for 2 years now. Haven't noticed anything look silly unless you make it look silly.

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Caster and Dexterity Lore sets and maybe the WHM AF2.

https://i.imgur.com/4tEJ47q.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/dzKEfwc.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/yFXjBg1.png

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Originally Posted by Rokke

We haven't gotten a Gaius set or a Nero/Livia set, so I wouldn't hold my breath for Zenos.

Since we’re inevitably getting Lyse’s second outfit and a Yotsuyu set down the line (not to mention the Krile robe brought up back during the fan fests), its not like the imbalance is going to change. prior to the last 2 items, we'd been getting a male and female set for a while. Why not speak out when ignored for 2 updates? :I

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Because there isn't actually an imbalance on the Mogstation, and they've only released one outfit at a time for a while. Any gender-locked outfit will be 'ignoring' the other gender. Unless you just 'really' want a predictable flow of ONE MALE, ONE FEMALE, back and forth forever.

And of all the Garleans, Pretty-boy-mc-not-Sephiroth is easily the most marketable..

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Originally Posted by CosmicKirby

Unless you just 'really' want a predictable flow of ONE MALE, ONE FEMALE, back and forth forever.

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You make it sound so horrible when in fact that's one of the few ways to make sure people don't feel as left out as they do now. Otherwise, think about it like this - we get female only outfits so many times in a row. Ok, but you're going to get your guys only outfits soon and in an equal amount otherwise we're getting into the equality everyone's talking about. Sounds good? Not really. Not only will the people who want to dress up their guy charas had to wait this long and maybe gave up by now, but now the people who want to dress up their lady charas will have to wait an equal if not longer period of drought because SE needs to make it up to the guys. The longer such a period will last, the harder it'll be to pacify costumers with things like 'but it's their turn'.
The only real counter-argument I can think of to having the gender-locks alternate is that they can't think up enough male-exclusive outfits to put in the shop to match the female outfits... but that'd be admitting the problem threads such as this are addressing in the first place!

I would just be happy with caster gear that isn't some monstrous Robe you're character is drowning in or some asymmetrical nightmare that looks like two different outfits sewn together. Seriously the whole FF series has taken this odd turn towards strange outfits that look like two mismatched outfits mashed together because the character just couldn't decide what they wanted to wear.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

The only real counter-argument I can think of to having the gender-locks alternate is that they can't think up enough male-exclusive outfits to put in the shop to match the female outfits... but that'd be admitting the problem threads such as this are addressing in the first place!

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Well, you're supposing a rather absurd theoretical here. One that isn't worth worrying about.

The real counter argument is that a predictable release schedule isn't as marketable. Say you're a guy character who plays mostly for glamour. A guy outfit comes out on the mogstation but you don't want it. These outfits come out like every 2 months or so, and the next set will be female. What's keeping you playing for the next 4 months?

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Originally Posted by CosmicKirby

What's keeping you playing for the next 4 months?

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This point is moot given how often and frequent we have Yoshi-P saying that they don't mind people taking breaks and actually encourage it. And someone taking a break but coming back when their outfit comes in is better than people who are tired of being disappointed on a principle level and drop the game outright because they feel like they don't matter as customers who pay the same sub.
To actually address your question, that's a problem that exists currently as well, doesn't it? Not liking the outfit they release? The difference is that in the suggested situation I know for a fact that I will definitely, 100%, have a shot at an outfit I might like when my turn comes. But in order for me to have a chance at an outfit I'd like, they need to make an outfit for my chara's gender, don't they...? Currently, we don't have even that, while we do have what seems to be a growing pile of broken promises on the matter.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

This point is moot given how often and frequent we have Yoshi-P saying that they don't mind people taking breaks and actually encourage it.

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It's most certainly not Moot from a marketing perspective. And Yoshi is very much not in charge of that department, nor is he in charge of the Mogstation. As the way he has requested Krile's outfit and the like proven otherwise.

Currently, having a bit of un-predictability in Glamour/Mogstation releases does in-fact help sales. There's a reason Impulse Buys are a very marketable field.
People are less likely to spend on non-essentials if given time to think it over.

It's impossible for the developers to please everybody. Yet if they alternated between adding male and female outfits to the Mog Station then I am certain it would please a rather large portion of the community. The Edda outfit was created from scratch and added due to popular demand so it's clear that the developers will engage the community for suggestions - and keep people up to date with future plans - where female outfits are concerned. Now we just need to hope the same starts to happen with outfits for male characters, too.

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Originally Posted by CosmicKirby

People are less likely to spend on non-essentials if given time to think it over.

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It'll still be an impulse buy because we don't know for certain when outfits will drop, nor what outfits they'll be. From a marketing perspective, I think it's a bad idea to treat about half your characters like they don't exist because then you won't just lose out on the money they would've paid on glamour, but also their subs.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

It'll still be an impulse buy because we don't know for certain when outfits will drop, nor what outfits they'll be. From a marketing perspective, I think it's a bad idea to treat about half your characters like they don't exist because then you won't just lose out on the money they would've paid on glamour, but also their subs.

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I do think they are well aware of that 'marketing perspective' and care for the whole playerbase, though it doesn't hurt them to give one of them more attention if the expected income from the said side is higher when it comes to certain items.
People vote with their money. And it seems it still goes well enough for SE to keep that direction going.

So, unless you guys make a major stink about this, the trend will go on.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

So, unless you guys make a major stink about this, the trend will go on.

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People have already said they're cancelling their subs, and a staff member actually bothered replying this time around. Something like that? :3

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Originally Posted by Leloa

I agree, add cool male outfits and make them unisex, still waiting for Cid' attire to be for girls too. I'd also like many other recipe glamours too that are suitable for guys.. those eastern dresses never really cought my eye and I like my brd to look tomboyish.

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Girl, literally no. We, as in everyone, as in BOTH genders already have Cid's hair. How about adding male outfits and keeping them male locked? Like the Sailors outfit was supposed to be, or the Thav Bolero, or the Gamblers outfit?

It was a crime to give ya'll Cid's weave for the girls, but someone needs sentencing for dishing Aymeric's out too.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

+1. I half held onto hope there'd be a match for Lyse's outfit when I logged into the mog shop today. I was so bummed I couldn't even fully rejoice at the Shatoto minion.



These are two separate problems, one of which affects female characters as well. Not saying that's a downside if they address the dying thing, but it won't help what we're talking about here, being the obvious bias on the development team's side.

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They are very specific about gender locks on the npc attire.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

People have already said they're cancelling their subs, and a staff member actually bothered replying this time around. Something like that? :3

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A 10-page thread and a staff member giving a filler response of "we're making male outfits which you will see...eventually," isn't a huge stink. I'm also pretty sure only one person said they were cancelling their sub.

Don't get me wrong, I advocate for new male outfits, even if they're locked to men only, and I am also puzzled by how Hien's outfit wasn't added alongside Lyse's. Ultimately though, let's not kid ourselves here.

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

]It was a crime to give ya'll Cid's weave for the girls, but someone needs sentencing for dishing Aymeric's out too.

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Wasn't Cid's hair added in a patch? With that kind of attitude men shouldn't have access to any of the female Type-0 hair either. Maybe stop with the extremities, yeah?

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

People have already said they're cancelling their subs, and a staff member actually bothered replying this time around. Something like that? :3

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'We are aware of [...], look forward to it!" - You should already know that these are standard replies here, like you would see on many other game titles on reddit and otherwise.

So unless you get a direct answer from Yoshida himself regarding this, never assume this will get through the right channels to receive serious consideration.

And, yes - I am quite a naysayer regarding this, but given what happens currently about Star Wars : Battle Front 2 and Destiny 2 and how it got so bad between the devs and playerbase, suffice to say the approach around issues here needs to be addressed a bit firmer, lest we fall into the same patterns.

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Originally Posted by Oscura

I am also puzzled by how Hien's outfit wasn't added alongside Lyse's.

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Aw man, can't wait for that recolored Tailfeather set. The big thing that'll be worth it in Hien's outfit, if they'll be released, it's the additional items like his haircut, facial hair, and sword.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Aw man, can't wait for that recolored Tailfeather set.

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Hey man, don't get an attitude with me. It was originally mentioned in the OP.

It's like every time there's a thread complaining about something there's always people getting sarcastic and b*tchy.

I'm really getting to the point where I honestly doubt that they'll make anything equal in terms of glamour for male and female characters. I just don't trust them anymore, since the list of unfair bias towards female characters keeps growing. And growing. AND GROWING. And they've been having the legendary male bunny outfit (never mind the vast sets of all the other female only gear they won't even touch) over our heads for literal years now.

Nice to know the reason I choose to play this game (Male Miqo'te) is something that is becoming more and more like a punishment in glamour.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Caster and Dexterity Lore sets and maybe the WHM AF2.

https://i.imgur.com/4tEJ47q.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/dzKEfwc.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/yFXjBg1.png

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This caster/healer gear was what was in my head specifically when I said that. There are others as well.

These were specifically designed for a female form whether they say so or not and look odd on males, especially beefy ones.

If this outfit had been for males and was dyeable, I would have bought it on 9 characters (male and female). That's what - $135 (assuming they make the outfit $15 for dyeable) they missed out on because they are too lazy to spend an extra week morphing the already existing mesh to be wider to accommodate male bodies. And that is just me. I know plenty of people who took one look at it and rolled their eyes and put away their wallet. Sure, some people bought it. But way more people would have if they spent an inkling bit more effort on it.

I see better, faster, more inclusive work from 12 year old Sims 2 modders than Square Enix.

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Originally Posted by Tsumdere

I see better, faster, more inclusive work from 12 year old Sims 2 modders than Square Enix.

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Those are completely not comparable - creating outfits for FFXIV requires creating appropriate meshes for all character models and make them capable of being decently displayed to a ton of different other players at the same time as well as creating dye palettes in something like 40+ colors.

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Originally Posted by ColorOfSakura

Those are completely not comparable - creating outfits for FFXIV requires creating appropriate meshes for all character models and make them capable of being decently displayed to a ton of different other players at the same time as well as creating dye palettes in something like 40+ colors.

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And if their framework is the likes that really requires they singlehandedly worked on each and every combination, something's very wrong and broken here

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Originally Posted by Theodric

There's a roughly equal split between the number of male and female characters present worldwide, no?

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No, because 20% of male lalas and hyurs are bots.

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Originally Posted by Tsumdere

If this outfit had been for males and was dyeable, I would have bought it on 9 characters (male and female). That's what - $135 (assuming they make the outfit $15 for dyeable) they missed out on because they are too lazy to spend an extra week morphing the already existing mesh to be wider to accommodate male bodies. And that is just me. I know plenty of people who took one look at it and rolled their eyes and put away their wallet. Sure, some people bought it. But way more people would have if they spent an inkling bit more effort on it.

I see better, faster, more inclusive work from 12 year old Sims 2 modders than Square Enix.

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Modders have no deadlines, no higher ups to answer to, no extra amount of work on their plate, aren't getting overworked, have a passion to do what they do.

I'm not saying that the devs are perfect, but they need to be given a small break.

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Originally Posted by Shouko

I'm not saying that the devs are perfect, but they need to be given a small break.

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They've had three years or so worth of break since they started neglecting male characters with glamour releases. It's time for the break to be over and for them to get to work on fixing the problem.

It's funny, because I explained this issue to a friend of mine who doesn't play FFXIV and doesn't really care that much (But I was fuming pretty hard and needed to vent), and his reaction to the mention that part of the problem is the devs 'not being comfortable' doing certain modeling work for male characters, and that project needing to wait until there were sufficient female staff free to work on it (as was said regarding the bunny suit a while back), his response was a shocked 'wait, is this a JOB or a HOBBY for them?'

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Originally Posted by Lukha

...his response was a shocked 'wait, is this a JOB or a HOBBY for them?'

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The issue is, they also need to turn a profit. I can see why they prioritize female glamours for that reason. They'll sell better. As for male glamours, its certainly easier to adapt existing assets, like they did with Aymeric. FFXIV is a wonderful game, and growing in popularity, but it still is growing, and needs to generate profit to stay competitive in the MMO market.

They'll sell a lot more actually if it wasn't just female glamours.
Male glamours released along with the females means an option for male characters, which means more profit for them.

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

They'll sell a lot more actually if it wasn't just female glamours.
Male glamours released along with the females means an option for male characters, which means more profit for them.

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I'm all for equal glamours, but the issue is pretty straight forward.

If 100% of glamour sales are divided into 70% female and 30% male, then making male glamours is half as cost effective as it is to make female glamours, since there are twice as many sales for female glamours.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

I'm all for equal glamours, but the issue is pretty straight forward.

If 100% of glamour sales are divided into 70% female and 30% male, then making male glamours is half as cost effective as it is to make female glamours, since there are twice as many sales for female glamours.

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If there are 0 outfits for males to buy theres a total $0 profit made off them. If that repeats for multiple cash shop/in game updates, you lose male characters when they notice they aint getting things, resulting in even less $$$ to be made off males. Its a sad circle that started the day they started releasing female only glams.

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Originally Posted by Rokke

If there are 0 outfits for males to buy theres a total $0 profit made off them. If that repeats for multiple cash shop/in game updates, you lose male characters when they notice they aint getting things, resulting in even less $$$ to be made off males. Its a sad circle that started the day they started releasing female only glams.

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I don't disagree, but its a bit hard to say there are 0 outfits for males on the shop. I think its more a matter of finding what audience they're supposed to be appealing to here. For female glamour its easier; sexualize it. Emphasize breasts, butts, hips, waists. For males... What then? Do we go for something dignified like Aymeric? Rough and rugged like Thancred? Something sexy?

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Originally Posted by Vexander

For males... What then? Do we go for something dignified like Aymeric? Rough and rugged like Thancred? Something sexy?

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Yes, all of those.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

I don't disagree, but its a bit hard to say there are 0 outfits for males on the shop. I think its more a matter of finding what audience they're supposed to be appealing to here. For female glamour its easier; sexualize it. Emphasize breasts, butts, hips, waists. For males... What then? Do we go for something dignified like Aymeric? Rough and rugged like Thancred? Something sexy?

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Tbh I think the safest bet for them would be to make a counterpart to whatever their planned female set is: If the female set is gothic and frilly a la Edda, an elaborate tailcoat/pant (or even those poofy shorts/stockings I see on the male equivalent to lolita clothes) set would have been nice, for a sexy female set showing off boobs/butts have a sexy male set emphasizing the chest/V line, etc.

If we're talking about one off outfits, a mix of "cool" and "sexy" generally goes over well. The Uraeus coat continues to be one of the most popular shirts a guy can wear :>

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Originally Posted by ColorOfSakura

Those are completely not comparable - creating outfits for FFXIV requires creating appropriate meshes for all character models and make them capable of being decently displayed to a ton of different other players at the same time as well as creating dye palettes in something like 40+ colors.

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Originally Posted by Shouko

Modders have no deadlines, no higher ups to answer to, no extra amount of work on their plate, aren't getting overworked, have a passion to do what they do.

I'm not saying that the devs are perfect, but they need to be given a small break.

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Holy hyperbole. What I said was the equivalent of a gym teacher yelling "my grandma runs faster than you".

However, there is really no excuse for this. Unless the clothes are literally modeled straight onto the bases (think of painting clothes on a doll), there is no excuse. It's easy to take a clothing model and warp it - ESPECIALLY considering there is tons of overlap in body shapes. There is not a single race that is drastically different from the others, sans Lalafell which is a moot point because they already have a female Lalafell variant. And male and female Lalafells have identical body shapes. If they do model straight onto the body and it's the body swapping out rather than what is laying on top of it, they are doing it seriously. wrong.

And don't give me crap about it being hard to make things dyeable. Recolors are the easiest thing to do. There is a reason why modders had recolors of Lyse's outfit out within hours of the outfit being released. Besides, they should have a system that makes it so they do not have to manually recolor every piece with every single color option anyways.

They are literally not doing some things because "we don't wanna >:C" not because it's hard or time consuming.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

The issue is, they also need to turn a profit. I can see why they prioritize female glamours for that reason. They'll sell better. As for male glamours, its certainly easier to adapt existing assets, like they did with Aymeric. FFXIV is a wonderful game, and growing in popularity, but it still is growing, and needs to generate profit to stay competitive in the MMO market.

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I wasn't aware Gold Saucer glamour was giving SE money.

It's almost like only women can look good in clothing. Because bust, butt, legs, hips. Men? Naw. Men don't have anything on their bodies that any human on this earth would like to see with clothes.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

If 100% of glamour sales are divided into 70% female and 30% male, then making male glamours is half as cost effective as it is to make female glamours, since there are twice as many sales for female glamours.

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The male mogstation outfits are basically rags and metal lv30 leveling gear. The only sets worth something are Cid, Thancred v2, and Aymeric(and females have the hair) Females have Minfillia, Y'shtola v2, Edda, and now Lyse. Obviously sales for female glamours will be up if both of the newest sets have been locked to females. Obviously sales will be up if the devs are too uncomfortable to make anything remotely good-looking for men.

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

Yes, all of those.

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This.

Variety is the spice of life, after all. Furthermore, numerous posters - myself included - repeat the same requests in the relevant feedback threads time and time again. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I have made the request for Hien's hairstyle, outfit and stubble to be sold together as a package on the Mog Station on countless occasions. Each time the post receives upvotes and commentary in response.

Which brings me to my next point - there's some pretty glaring issues with some of the male character models that need to be addressed due to severe balance. Highlander men being denied a proper eyebrow option is rather bizarre and silly - especially when the females of the same playable race do not have such a limitation. A lot of people have been asking for that to be fixed and for more facial hair options to be added over time - yet we just keep getting new hairstyles instead.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

I don't disagree, but its a bit hard to say there are 0 outfits for males on the shop. I think its more a matter of finding what audience they're supposed to be appealing to here. For female glamour its easier; sexualize it. Emphasize breasts, butts, hips, waists. For males... What then? Do we go for something dignified like Aymeric? Rough and rugged like Thancred? Something sexy?

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Sexy, elegant, cute, pretty, rugged, silly, whatever. If they release a sexy outfit for females, males should also get a sexy outfit. If males get an elegant and dignified uniform/armor, females should also get something elegant and dignified. And so on. A wide range of looks is the best possible solution, since that way everyone can find something they like.