Its time to remove job-based glamour restrictions.

If the crafting AF was actually useful it would matter... but because everyone just uses the shared set... the crafting AF is a waste... I think they could make a craft able glamour versions of those sets, so we can use pieces we like. The Job AF stays with its own Job though. No reasons for a PLD to be dressed as a AST.

The GSM shoes from HW would look amazing with one of my WHM glamours. And there's other pieces we have wanted forever. The ALC skirt since 2.0.... there's no reason we can't glamour like this, it just how SE made the glamour system, and thanks to eureka we know they can make them usuable by all. They just have to add them, even in patches as filler would be nice.

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Originally Posted by Victoria_Silverdawn

If the crafting AF was actually useful it would matter... but because everyone just uses the shared set... the crafting AF is a waste.

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That could almost have been valid (not sufficient, but a valid counterargument) before the glamour dresser was added. But now we can have the shared set glamoured as whichever class's AF we're on at the moment, so AF is finally getting more use.

For that matter, the same is true of the AF for combat jobs. It didn't get used much when it couldn't be glamoured to shared sets either, but we're seeing more of it around now, too.

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

That could almost have been valid (not sufficient, but a valid counterargument) before the glamour dresser was added. But now we can have the shared set glamoured as whichever class's AF we're on at the moment, so AF is finally getting more use.

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That would be true... but not not everyone uses the glamour chest, as you can use the old glamour system. What you are talking about is a multiglamour system. Which allows each job set it's own look, except SE set up glamour so it's based off gear, not sets. What I am talking about is using some of those nice pieces of armour, and giving them a new use. Cause if they are reusing gear anyways, why not add nice ones.

And the way you just described how the chest works, is the same for battle jobs. Switch the AF to the job used.

But crafting AF has no use. Omni crafters use shared sets, and the AF crafting was outdated when it was added. Only use is people that have only a few crafts and the AF doesn't have the stats to make the 3 star HQ as easily.

Not to mention comparing crafting AF and battle job AF usefulness is like comparing oranges to apples. Battle sets are based off of job lore. There's no reason a PLD should wear the Astrologian gown, or a BLM wearing WHM robes.

Crafting sets, are just cool outfits that make you look like a worker in that trade.

If SE made the glamour chest right, we wouldn't have to worry about each jobs AF sets.

If we're going to see jobs glamour restrctions removed, then I want to see Gender-based glamour restrictions removed aswell cause theres alot of nice outfits for females that can look good on guys and we already have the bunny bustier that breaks that gender norm. Females can already wear pretty masculine outfits and if SE is going to make all male summoners wear freaking skirts and expose their legs then why the hell not?

Now you are going into a whole other thing then asking for glamour restrictions removed. AF and all other gear is basically designed for both male and female. There's a few pieces that are female specific and if you are saying certain gear might look good on men, not everyone want to see a Roe in the thanarvian panties. And they look good because they are female specific. And if it's female or male specific, the quality is better.

Some gear is designed female specific, which means they designed it for female races. For then to make them fit males, they have to rework them as, you probably are aware... males are built differently... shocking I know.
They are having trouble making the race specific underwear available to everyone... which we have been asking for since 2.0

And using the bunny set as a example for them allowing female sets on men, allow me to list others they did female to male:
they did that for the spring dress... no one wears it...
you cry for the bunny set... no one wears it...

What specifically that women get that men can't?
From what I remember, there's a high house dress, which men got a counter part, thanarvian, which they eventually allowed women to wear the male one, the spring dress, the autumn dress, the fancy frilly one, which we now have a male counter part. The mob shop exclusives.

If they are going to waste time and resources, do it for things everyone can wear. That's less work taken away from other content, and we get things we all want. Not just 2% of the player base that wants the drag queen outfit set that they won't wear after one time.

They have been doing gender neutral things, like the hairstyles... they aren't that great, the latest one from HoH looks better on women, except for male cats... the quality of the hair isn't that great, because it has to fit every character model, not just male or female.

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Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet

If we're going to see jobs glamour restrctions removed, then I want to see Gender-based glamour restrictions removed aswell cause theres alot of nice outfits for females that can look good on guys and we already have the bunny bustier that breaks that gender norm. Females can already wear pretty masculine outfits and if SE is going to make all male summoners wear freaking skirts and expose their legs then why the hell not?

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Job locked items can just have the restriction removed and be good to go. Gender locked items have to have entirely new models created. It's not the same situation.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Job locked items can just have the restriction removed and be good to go. Gender locked items have to have entirely new models created. It's not the same situation.

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Obviously. That doesn't change my stance though.

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

That could almost have been valid (not sufficient, but a valid counterargument) before the glamour dresser was added. But now we can have the shared set glamoured as whichever class's AF we're on at the moment, so AF is finally getting more use.

For that matter, the same is true of the AF for combat jobs. It didn't get used much when it couldn't be glamoured to shared sets either, but we're seeing more of it around now, too.

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Not enough glamour plates, not for omni-crafter/omni-gatherers. Double, triple my plate count and I might give in.

Even then, though, it's kind of ridiculous. Most of the job AFs are iconic, spanning games. The crafting/gathering AFs are just simply not in the same boat.

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Originally Posted by Victoria_Silverdawn

That would be true... but not not everyone uses the glamour chest, as you can use the old glamour system.

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Sure, not everyone uses the chest, just as not everyone uses AF, and not everyone crafts. But all three of those are available.

Actually, since patch 4.3 removed the only downside to using the dresser, I doubt there are very many who don't use it, other than those who simply don't care about glamour. (And this whole topic is irrelevant to them in either direction.) The remaining issues with the dresser are just its limitations. Since you can only have 10 plates, you have to choose which classes or jobs you'll use them for, and not everyone will pick crafting. Many of us do pick crafting for it, however, particularly since that mostly avoids the dresser's other big limitation, that it can only be used in town or housing areas.

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Originally Posted by Victoria_Silverdawn

And the way you just described how the chest works, is the same for battle jobs. Switch the AF to the job used.

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Exactly. I even said "the same is true of the AF for combat jobs." You're the one trying to convince people they're different when they aren't.

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Originally Posted by Victoria_Silverdawn

But crafting AF has no use. Omni crafters use shared sets, and the AF crafting was outdated when it was added. Only use is people that have only a few crafts and the AF doesn't have the stats to make the 3 star HQ as easily.

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When we're talking about glamour, stats are irrelevant anyway. Crafting AF *as glamour* has a couple of very important uses, including the one that combat AF has. When I switch to leatherworker, I'm immediately identifiable as a leatherworker because I look like one, just as whenever I switch to blacksmith I'm immediately identifiable as a blacksmith because I look like one, and so on. The fact that underneath that glamour lies the same shared set is irrelevant to the appearance of each individual class.

This part is exactly the same as combat AF. Each job can be visually identifiable because they each have a unique look that no other job can use, and that look forms a significant part of the job's identity. Of course, many players choose to use other looks instead that aren't restricted that way, and will be able to use even more if our request for all non-AF gear to have it's job restrictions removed for glamour purposes is approved. But an identifiable look is available that represents what the job is about, and that part —the AF job restriction— should remain.

The other thing that makes it important (especially for DoH, but to some extent for all jobs) is that that appearance is what provides immersion for what you're doing. The actual crafting skills are the same for all classes as far as gameplay goes, but looking different helps me feel a difference between when I'm working leather, or hammering metal plates, or sewing, or cooking, etc. With combat jobs, you get different sets of skills with each one, and appearance is a secondary way of "getting into character" so to speak. But for crafting, appearance is the only way, and all the more important for that.

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Originally Posted by InkstainedGwyn

Not enough glamour plates, not for omni-crafter/omni-gatherers. Double, triple my plate count and I might give in.

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We really need a minimum of 26 glamour plates —as many as there are jobs— for it to work properly, (preferably rounded up to 30 or more so we can include a few casual non-job-specific outfits as well). But in the meantime, at least we can pick a category or two in which to separate out glamours on a shared set. I picked DoH.

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Originally Posted by Elamys

Eh, I'd like for the AF sets to at least stay job restricted, but give us set-specific glamours and that shouldn't be an issue. It just would be weird for a dark knight to be running around in the white mage set, yanno?

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I agree with this. It's the whole point in having artifact armor.

You speak out my entire thought and yes I support this suggestion.

Most likely in the minority, but i want more restrictions for race, gender, and jobs. I like individuality, uniqueness is supposed to be the in thing right now right?

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Originally Posted by Alacran

Most likely in the minority, but i want more restrictions for race, gender, and jobs. I like individuality, uniqueness is supposed to be the in thing right now right?

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True uniqueness comes from players choosing amongst many options, not adding superfluous restrictions IMO.

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Originally Posted by Hestzhyen

True uniqueness comes from players choosing amongst many options, not adding superfluous restrictions IMO.

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I want to be able to express individual style for "job" looks, and by doing so I need certain gears that are locked. I hate being forced to pick from a limited pool - I just end up like everyone else. I'd kill for a certain pair of blacksmith sandals for my monk.

For the whole "Make gender locked gear for males/females" SE has already said, "start threads requesting ONE set of armor to be gender unlocked".
If it gets enough attention/votes, they will work on it. (As they did with the bunny outfit.)

The problem is, people dont listen, and instead, the OP of each thread would list multiple outfits, making it impossible to see a single set as higher priority. (They only work on it over time in their free time, so it takes months)
Then it gets worse, that every time someone starts a thread, people might like it, but then they go off listing their own multiple sets in the same thread.

ONE set per thread, the end.

Thats the ONLY way to get SE to unlock the sets, and it will only be done 1 set at a time.

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Originally Posted by Alacran

Most likely in the minority, but i want more restrictions for race, gender, and jobs. I like individuality, uniqueness is supposed to be the in thing right now right?

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Very few people are going to glam an entire drg dungeon set onto a red mage. However, if I'm going for a knight-enchanter look, I might want to use some of the armoured gloves and boots, instead of being forced into the same caster sets every other red mage has to wear because like I'm restricted to like 1/6 of the gear in the game. You can mix and match tank chestplates with your dragoon sets to give it a different look.

You get more unique when you're not being forced to wear the same sets as everybody else on the same class.

What you want is exclusivity, not uniqueness.

I just want to be able to use my level 70 monk artifact armor on my samurai. And dragoon. and anything else because I love that set.

i dont see this happen i like the role sets being lock, anyone can wear a bikini but not anyone can wear a full plate armor, if they unlock all glamours for everyone then nothing stops letting SE just make 1 set per dungeons or raids bcs why bother? its going to be for all jobs so it will become a waste just desing 7 diferent sets every time, just make 2 or 3 like much and move on.

other think i like the job sets lock its that promote ppl play such jobs bcs looks cool with that glamour and its nothing bad either, i will support more diversity on the all jobs glamour rather that just let everyone wear anything, its what make every job-role special.

They've already said though, that they want the uniqueness to lay in the job actions. In the past, it was said that they were locked to certain classes so beginners wouldn't get confused -- is that a mage or a paladin? But by level 70 (or even 60), I know what the mage icons look like vs. the tank ones. So if I want to wear a mix of armor and cloth and be a battlemage, why can't I?

As long ain't weapon glam!

I want to be able to glamour that Roegadyn's (I forgot his name) chainsaw. RIP AND TEAR!

I did want to comment on one thing I read. While I'm all for removing job limitations on glamour, the glamour dresser is not the way to do it. They already changed it so that we can get back the items we put in; having it drop them to "level 1 glamour items" would mean you could no longer receive them back and given the way most things in this game seem "all or nothing" I think we'll need to look for a different solution.

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Originally Posted by InkstainedGwyn

the glamour dresser is not the way to do it.

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Agreed, some sort of Glamour converter or what not.

So here I am looking for a pair of gloves to complete my healers glam look. I found the ones I want. Mercenary's Mitts. They are perfect however I can't use them. They are Disciple of War only. I looked for a pair for casters and none exists. There are some you can buy with company seals but they can't be dyed.

SOOOOO.. yeah, I'm sad now.

Your GC might sell mitts for casters if I remember correctly. Somewhere around Lv35-40 (Coerthas arc levels!) I think.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Your GC might sell mitts for casters if I remember correctly. Somewhere around Lv35-40 (Coerthas arc levels!) I think.

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Those are undyable. There are Hard Leather Mitts for all classes, but they don't have the fluffy borders.

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Originally Posted by Krojack

So here I am looking for a pair of gloves to complete my healers glam look. I found the ones I want. Mercenary's Mitts. They are perfect however I can't use them. They are Disciple of War only. I looked for a pair for casters and none exists. There are some you can buy with company seals but they can't be dyed.

SOOOOO.. yeah, I'm sad now.

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Is it a cold environment glamour? There are astral silk gloves of healing (also casting), but I'm not sure if that fits your theme.

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Originally Posted by Ignimortis

Those are undyable. There are Hard Leather Mitts for all classes, but they don't have the fluffy borders.

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Sorry, reading fail, now I noticed that you mentioned them already.

There's also the Highland Mitts but they've got the decorative snowflake pattern on them.

Or are there maybe any previous Christmas outfits that come with mittens?

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Sorry, reading fail, now I noticed that you mentioned them already.

There's also the Highland Mitts but they've got the decorative snowflake pattern on them.

Or are there maybe any previous Christmas outfits that come with mittens?

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It depends what aspect of the mitts are wanted. The design itself, the fur trim, or both. I don't think there are Starlight gloves that fit what she needs. It's either Reindeer or Snowman.

Thinking of another possible idea, is to make a glamour prism, that can glamour gear to ur current gear, even if you dont meet the requirements, BUT it only comes from the mog station for nearly $5 per item (and eventually go down to $1 per prism.

This might get SE to move quicker on the idea lol.

"Certain jobs have a certain look."
We've had bikini/subligar tanks for a long time as well as snowman ____.

Let's just remove job based restrictions already. I'm still wishing they could at least have it where even Fending classes can wear any of that aesthetic. Or have Fending items not have to be constantly reworked cause I put a job-specific glamor onto my Fending gear.

As a healer main, IMHO we have some of the ugliest gear in the game. The light colored robe aesthetic is very tired. I would love to be able to use some of the more interesting caster gear. Usually they have a recolor of ours but at least when there is variation they usually have the better set than yet another Healer Nightgown.

well pagos shows we can live with it. I think it's time to go full ham on removing these restrictions.

I like it the way it is right now. The casual stuff like shirts and shorts or whatever are not job-specific, anyone can wear those. When you wear mage robes, or tanking armor, or leather, you have to match it to your job. If I see a healer wearing full tanking armor it would look at bit strange.

THIS NEEDS TO HAPPEN

I am a huge glamour enthusiast, so huge that I in fact have 4 alts, all different races, just so I can try as many combinations on as many models as I can, and I see so many Armour pieces that I think would look better on a different class. For example, one of my alts is a Hyur female, who I am trying to glamour into Lenneth, but alas, a certain headpiece and bottom piece I wanna use is restricted to DRG and MNK/SAM respectively.

I get that some people like to (whine) stay loyal to class identity, but that concept has been dead for years. But, to somewhat alleviate this problem, my idea is that remove glam restrictions between classes in the same armor class and one armor class lower, for example, let Tanks glam DRG armor, let DRG's glam MNK/SAM/NIN armors, and let MNK/SAM/NIN's glam each others as well as rangers armor...maybe even caster, and let Casters and Rangers glam each others armors. Let me emphasize that this is NOT what we want, but it WILL give many many many more options for us to use, cause right now it really is extremely restrictive.

But in reality, these restriction walls are completely obsolete already, seeing as most armors now literally look the same! for example lvl 68 maiming, scouting and striking gears looks exactly the same, except some color differences, lvl 66 fending and maiming gears looks almost identical, except the helmet and armor kilt. Even lvl 70 dungeon armors look freaking identical, except small changes, and now, the new 4.5 dungeons armors ALL look the same!

And crafter/gatherer gear should be glamable by ALL classes.

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Originally Posted by DeepbloodEclipse

I am a huge glamour enthusiast, so huge that I in fact have 4 alts, all different races, just so I can try as many combinations on as many models as I can

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Hello fellow glamour-alt-o-holic... I also have four characters (main + three alts) and yes it's lots of fun finding the right costumes for each! :)



I don't think your idea would probably work with their programming though. As I wrote (in maybe too much detail) earlier in the discussion, I'm pretty sure it's an "all or nothing" approach and it can only work based on what classes are allowed to equip the item. I don't think they can unlock it to some additional classes but not others. I suspect either everything stays locked down to its designated class or gets thrown 100% open - nothing inbetween, and no way to apply "special exceptions" to stop artifact gear from getting glamoured onto other classes. I think that's the key reason why everything remains locked.

I think that's also why a lot of the "less role-defined" gear does start to share designs in different directions - they're not so worried about those things being interchangeable between classes. I'm pretty sure the relic armour is what they're really worried about for role identity.



And if you try to get around that by changing the gear to be equippable by the other class even if it doesn't suit them... that makes a huge headache for using the "gear recommendation" system. Have you tried gearing up a tank in ARR while you have DPS/mage gear in your armoury? It doesn't care that your Lv32 armour still has higher defence than that Lv40 "all classes" robe, it's higher level and you can equip it, therefore you should be wearing it.

(And then there's the 'human error' factor... "what do you mean my gear is rubbish? It's the right level and the game says I can wear it!")



Crafting and gathering is in a bit of an odd inbetween because most of their unique gear, other than the individual job gear, has been all-classes up to Lv60. My understanding is that if it's all-classes, people can wear it into battle and build up spiritbond for "cheap" materia? I can certainly do that with ARR gear. Haven't tried in Heavensward. I can see why they might want to stop people doing that, and again the further locks on sharing glamour are an unfortunate side-effect of locking the gear itself to the appropriate class, rather than deliberately restricting the glamour options. Most of the Stormblood gear shares designs with gear available to the battle classes anyway.



Just to be clear - I would also absolutely love for things to be unlocked. It's just that, from what I can observe of how the game works and from what I've heard of the devs' opinions on unlocking things (ie. pretty definitely no relic armour), it's highly unlikely it will happen - and also that they can't "be nice and loosen the restrictions" because - I suspect - there's no loosening to be done. It's either on or it's off, and to protect the iconic job-identity relic armours they believe it needs to stay on.

I want the PvP sets from ARR to stop being job locked.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Snip.

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A friend actually suggested an idea where, you put an item in the glamour dresser, only then does it not have class restrictions, but if you take it out again, it's back to being what it was before entry, whole point of this was ofc not me trying to say unlock all class restrictions, we are talking about not restricting it for glamour. I don't really understand how this would artifact armors tho, but in the first place, why the eff cant we put augmented and lvl 60/70 af gear in armoire, we don't wear the gear beyond it being our entry lvl 50/60/70 gear to begin with, it just takes space otherwise.

As for integrating "no glamour restrictions", they managed to code in a glamour dresser, they should be able to manage such a thing.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't think they can unlock it to some additional classes but not others. I suspect either everything stays locked down to its designated class or gets thrown 100% open - nothing inbetween, and no way to apply "special exceptions" to stop artifact gear from getting glamoured onto other classes.

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I think it could be done as a rule-based change (as opposed to separate settings on every gear item). If the list of classes/jobs that can equip it is limited to one only, then that's also the only one that can glamour it. If there's more than one that can equip it, than any class can glamour it. That would separate out AF, and I'm pretty sure it's just AF, from other gear. Even dragoon gear, which tends to be separate from other jobs even on non-AF, has its non-AF gear list lancer and dragoon, while its AF gear lists just dragoon. (I haven't done an exhaustive search through every gear item in the game to see if there's any exceptions that wouldn't work, but I don't know of any.) So long as any new jobs added (that don't have base classes) share their non-AF gear with other jobs, that rule would continue to work, and I rather suspect that's going to be the case anyway.

An alternative, of course, is to give gear items two different "equippable by" lists, one for who can equip it directly, and one for who can equip it as glamour. That would take a bit of work to set up initially, since it would require a change to each existing piece of gear, but once set up, it wouldn't involve any increase in character data size or any of the other limitations that block them from so many things.

Either approach should be feasible.

I have to say, there's a lot of DoH and DoL gear that I would love to glamour into DoM or DoW gear, but will probably never get to see in battle (unless I start attacking monsters with my fishing rod)!