I agree. In FFXI all a PL did was take the thrill of almost dying out. Now it takes all the fun stuff out of the party.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitzace
Stop PL Petition .
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12-09-2011, 09:50 AMToxicFox
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12-09-2011, 04:01 PMDarkrose
What I don't understand is that why they not take what work in FFXI and apply it here if it work in FFXI? Why decide to innovate something new and totally make it turn into a big mess? In FFXI I was totally ok with PL because a high level mage can help you cure outside. It go a little faster, but it fair, you still doing the kill and level up appropriately.
Now in FFXIV, they add in linking. It make it hard for party to level up because of links and they make mob HP lower, this just scream PL every time and now everyone just doing it. Pull a bunch of link and claim it and PL kill it all. After getting to level 50 within days people don't know what the hell is going on. They do not know anything about their job. I party with people who ask what best Marauder skills to use at level 50 and what should they equip? Man are you kidding me? Why even bother playing anymore? It just destroying the game and community. I have no more fun in FFXIV as I use to anymore now because of PL. -
12-11-2011, 12:35 AMArcell
So just because the community favors PL and wants to take the fast track to 50 the entire claiming system should be revamped to punish us again? Restrictions end up hurting EVERYONE, not just people who PL. The community is forcing people into PL, not the game. The systems present in the game have nothing to do with this. The problem is the community favoring this type of gameplay almost exclusively. I would rather they didn't put so many restrictions back in place to the point where XP parties are the ONLY way to go.
The solution? Find like-minded people on your server and party with them. Clearly you're not the only one who despies PL so find a LS that doesn't condone it or at least people who want XP parties. I'm sure if you looked you'd find at least one full group of people who feel the same way as you.
Personally though, I don't give a damn about people using PL. What I've told the people I play with is: I don't care how you get to 50, it doesn't matter to me. What matters is that you know how to play your class. If you intend to take a class as your main, make sure you know how to play it. That is what matters to me. -
12-11-2011, 02:19 AMToxicFoxHow would changing the claim system to what FFXI had put restrictions on players? I think the current system is worse then FFXI cause not only does it allow PL it can cause you to get hate on other peoples mobs. I've been casting on CNJ and had people hit the mob I was casting on rather often so I would have to stand there while they kill it. Me as a 24 LNC hit a NM and a much higher level hit it right after I did. The higher level was forced to tank until I could do enough dmg to take hate. The only nice thing about this system over FFXI system is the fact that if someone gets a NM your hunting you can walk over and kill it for faster respawn.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcell
I'm tired of the like minded player speech. What should I do when the party I've been in for the past 2 hours needs to change camps but instead someone decides to turn into a PL? It happens a lot when the exp slows down. The more and more I party the more I realize that the party system is very broken.
I'll use this one again. If they put god mode in the game would you support it? It would be your choice to use it and everything. -
12-11-2011, 02:47 AMArcellYou're tired of being given a productive solution to your problem that doesn't require the devs revamping the whole system to accommodate a vocal minority? Yeah, I guess that would get pretty annoying. Again you're blaming the system for the actions of people. There is nothing wrong with the system. The problem is that you apparently run into everyone who wants to PL.Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicFox
No, I wouldn't. God mode allows a player to breeze past and complete any and all content with no chance of ever losing. All power leveling does is allow players to hit the cap on a class. It is still possible for them to fail any and all content, especially end-game content. Everything else in the game aside from the actual act of leveling still requires work. It's not like God Mode at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicFox
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12-11-2011, 06:56 AMToxicFoxThe reason you don't support god mode is the same reason I don't support PL. They both allow people to get past a lot of content without any chance of failing. Although using your argument to support PL it is still a choice whether you use it or not so it should not bother you just find a group of like minded people. The fact is it isn't so easy to find a group of like minded people. A lot of people are in the grey over it but agree its overpowered. They still use it for the simple reason being they can. Choice isn't always a good thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcell
Do not think for one second that people that want PL to go are the minority. There has been no poll to determine this or any evidence to support that claim. Until you can bring me proof that more people would rather see PL stay as it is then the people that dislike it do not assume we are the minority. The only evidence I can point at says otherwise which is that fact the my first post has 9 likes while the second post (yours) has 6 which isn't enough numbers to go on accurately.
Now I'm noticing a bit of a pattern here. It would seem that the people who support PL have their jobs at 50 already. I would like to know if this is cause you leveled using PL or if you have been in the low levels at all recently? -
12-11-2011, 01:17 PMNakiamiie
I am FOR power leveling for a few reasons:
1) Having tried power leveling, I can now honestly say it is not faster than a good exp party. And so, not game breaking.
2) The Power Leveler is spending his own time doing something that does not benefit him directly, thus we can say that more time is spent on leveling up (The Power Leveleds' time + the Power Leveler's time).
3) It truly helps closing some gaps to better experience the content you enjoy doing with your friends (it's a game not a job).
4) Players being power leveled do not learn how to play their class well, they have to learn it during much more difficult content, reducing their chances to be picked for hard content until they go through the learning curve of their class (experienced players are still valued).
5) Like it or not, power leveling will always exist for a simple reason: not everyone have the same motivations to play a game.
That said, the only persons I am willing to power level are close friends or family members of mine. If some other people want to power level strangers for some more gil/whatever, let them be, it's like hiring private tutoring in real life.
My only suggestion for extreme haters of power leveling, just regroup together in a special linkshell and enjoy the game together. Your hardcore efforts will be recognized by your peers and ignored by others in any case. Why is there an elevator in a building when there is already stairs? Same for power level. -
12-11-2011, 02:31 PMToxicFox1: It is faster then a normal exp partyQuote:
Originally Posted by Nakiamiie
2: It requires just 2 active people to be playing the rest can be afk thus this makes it similar to a bot.
3: There is plenty of content to be enjoyed when leveling the first class to 50. More then one class at 50 is earned not given.
4: Players who do not know how to play their job do not have giant red flags on their head and are unlikely to tell you they do not know how to play.
5: PL can exist and I'm fine with that however I am not fine with it as it is. I would like to see it aimed more to healing rather then killing. -
12-12-2011, 04:53 PMDeadRiserLmao this is where I stopped reading.. when you said PL is slower than exp parties.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nakiamiie
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12-12-2011, 06:15 PMDarkrose
1) Having tried power leveling, I can now honestly say it is not faster than a good exp party. And so, not game breaking.
Have you even done PL Correctly. Get 4 people in a party, have them links and claim all the crab, use something to get all claim like Curaga. Have a level 50 Conjurer one blast them. BAM! Tons of Exp and Chains. I can level up to level 50 within one weeks doing this. Try that with a normal party.
2) The Power Leveler is spending his own time doing something that does not benefit him directly, thus we can say that more time is spent on leveling up (The Power Leveleds' time + the Power Leveler's time).
This ok, but what about people who never ask for it? We want to play and earn our job skills. We want to play our class better. Every party now just turn into PL. Just walk away and look for another party? Or I should just solo right? There many people just PL to 50 and they don't even know any skills to their job.
3) It truly helps closing some gaps to better experience the content you enjoy doing with your friends (it's a game not a job).
Oh please...What end game content is there to do in FFXIV anyway? Ifrit Battle? How many times can we do that until it get really old? Leveling up is part a part of MMORPG, it should take long and hard work to get there. Why not just put us at level 50 then?
PL should never happen when there is little to no end game content at all. Even if there is a lot, it motivate people to reach CAP soon to do end game. Not just easy way to 50. How about the game just start everyone at 50 then? That what your ideas mean anyway right?
4) Players being power leveled do not learn how to play their class well, they have to learn it during much more difficult content, reducing their chances to be picked for hard content until they go through the learning curve of their class (experienced players are still valued).
Oh really? Let get a level 50 to tank for us on Ifrit and see how many times he fail right until he learn his job? Leveling up all the way to 50 make you learn all about your job better. Not just a noob when we invite someone in to do Stronghold or Ifrit battle. We don't need a person who is rank 50 know nothing about their job to failed over and over again until he master his job...
5) Like it or not, power leveling will always exist for a simple reason: not everyone have the same motivations to play a game.
That said, the only persons I am willing to power level are close friends or family members of mine. If some other people want to power level strangers for some more gil/whatever, let them be, it's like hiring private tutoring in real life.
PL does not have to be like this as it is broken. I never seen an MMORPG where you can claim every mob and the high level person just kill steal and get all the experience for you. Let hold their hand throughout the entire game. Why even bother playing anymore? Leveling up should be part of the game.
My only suggestion for extreme haters of power leveling, just regroup together in a special linkshell and enjoy the game together. Your hardcore efforts will be recognized by your peers and ignored by others in any case. Why is there an elevator in a building when there is already stairs? Same for power level.
We are not hater, we are ok with PL if it is done right. The claim system is broken and so is PL in this game. And man, do I not want to group with you for any end game content or raid when you know nothing about your job. -
12-13-2011, 01:18 AMToxicFox
These guys need to come up with a better reason for supporting PL as it is. All I see is the same flawed reasons for supporting PL.
A LS mate got a party in the 30s and the LNC in that party had a level 12 weapon cause he was PL'd. He didn't have a giant red flag and he didn't tell anyone. He was only busted after a while of wondering why everything was so slow. -
12-13-2011, 09:25 PMArcellWhat would that "flawed" reason be? Personally I don't care if it's there or not however I don't want them to revamp the entire claiming/party system just because a couple of people can't handle others using PL. The system as it is is 100% fine. Allowing PL is a minor complaint in the grand scheme of things.Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicFox
The only reason I see you hating it is because you "can't" get into XP parties because of the community, not the system.
Okay so one idiot decided to not upgrade his gear or actually learn his class. He's an idiot and clearly not a good player anyway. Everyone I know, both PL and not, has proper gear and knows how to play their class. There are always exceptions both ways, can't damn the entire community because of that. -
12-14-2011, 12:35 AMsyntaxlies
one solution could be to have it so if someone drops from party the highest lvl takes claim instead of going to party
another could be to lock party members to party while in combat
another could be to put a 30 second passive timer on people when they leave a party.
3 good options there -
12-14-2011, 01:25 AMEruantienwell it used to be players locked to party while in combat, but they removed itQuote:
Originally Posted by syntaxlies
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12-14-2011, 01:30 AMsyntaxliesyea i know, i stated that earlier in the thread. i just added it in this quote so id have 3 options, lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Eruantien
part of me thinks SE is only allowing PL'ing as a preemptive strike to player base drop after p2p. if there are more 50's in game when p2p starts they prob think they'll pay cause they have more to lose. Also it will give the appearance more people are playing if everyone is lvl cap. -
12-14-2011, 02:10 AMToxicFoxI don't need exp parties anymore. My thing hasn't updated yet but I hit the 50 already. I don't plan to level any other jobs till 2.0.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcell
The flawed argument is that its the community that is restricting people from getting parties. People use stuff just cause they can. If you let them PL they will do it. If you don't they won't and they won't complain either. Even if someone doesn't like PL or thinks its OP they will still use it just cause they can. Your right that it is the community but you don't seem to understand how the community works. Dump a bunch of money into a crowd of 100+ people then tell them not to pick it up. All the money would be gone in a flash.
I'm not asking that they remove PL from the game. I'm asking that they change the system so PL can't kill for the party. I do not see why this is hard to do. It can be done without restrictions on players and they're already redoing everything. Its not much more work to make it so PL's can't kill for a party. -
12-18-2011, 10:37 AMmyteluze
Laf. PL'ing in FFXI was actually faster and more fun. This PL'ing in XIV is just a DRAG to grind through. It's not fun at all, and ACTUALLY it's not even that fast. A well formed party of 8 could grind 1-50 in 48 hours, I bet.
PL'ing from 1-36 takes about 4-6 hours depending on how vigilant you are. 36-42 is about 3-4 hours. Then, from 42-50 LEGIT is about 2-3 hours on coffers. So... You do the math. PL'ling really isn't all that broken. The only thing you gain is being able to xp with 2 people at a comparable rate to an 8 man legit party. The playerbase is probably top heavy with end gamers right now, so multiple legit parties from 1-40 probably aren't all that common, and it's not just b/c of PL.
Besides, I don't want to spend a year ranking from 1-50 when it takes months to get an Ifrit win. I think people should be more focused on the broke ass end game fights instead of how people get there. -
12-19-2011, 02:05 AMRunkman
If they add level sync I will have no problem with them taking away PL'ing. As it stand though this is the only way I can play with my friends that have stuck with the game since launch and are already level 50 on almost everything. I would love to just go out with them no matter the level and slay monsters, loot items and have good ol' fashioned Final Fantasy fun.
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12-22-2011, 10:31 AMRowyne
/signed
I've mostly posted about this in the big PL thread in the General section.
While some (including Yoshi-P) are okay with PLing under certain circumstances, I truly believe the consequences outweigh the benefits:
- As the playerbase becomes prematurely top-heavy, finding others to experience low-mid level content with becomes more difficult. Even moreso if you wish to experience it with a level-appropriate group. This alienates new and low level players who wish to experience the game as it was meant to be played.
- Similarly, the demand for additional low-mid level content becomes less vocalized as many people simply bypass it, leaving new and low level players with less to do.
- Those who wish to level via old-school grinding with a regular party will find it more difficult since many people now insist on bringing along a powerleveler.
- Camps fill up quickly with powerleveling parties in an environment that was never meant to allow for this kind of leveling design.
- Players who skyrocket to level cap by none of their own effort lack the proper knowledge or gear to participate in the endgame content they raced toward. People become less trusting of random players and are not as open to partying with new people that they do not know.
- All of the above points lead to frustration within the community. A community that cannot afford any more discontent right now.
There are still loopholes and exploits that are not being addressed because I truly believe they'd rather let people completely bypass the glaring lack of content by whatever means necessary. Which means they're content to break an aspect of the game to 'fix' it. Now this game is most likely irreparably broken until 2.0.
This issue has gotten so out of control that it's become one of four major reasons I've decided not to sub come January 6th.
While many things have been fixed since launch, core issues (like this) are now actually worse. -
12-28-2011, 03:23 PMKenJammin
PLing brings nothing to the game, and everything it was designed to bring to the game had the opposite effects.
- Its mostly used by higher level players not newer players.
- Its more boring then gildleve's and behests.
- Its so effective that it discourages players from making groups for other content until they have every job at 50.
PLease stop using the "it doesn't effect you then why let it bother you" argument. It doesn't make sense and anyone who uses it obviously has had 5 jobs PLed to 50.
90% of the player base is sheep, and they want to fulfill they're arbitrary virtual goals, and they'll do it even if they're not having fun. Maybe if these kids had engaging video games they wouldn't resort to abandoning they're social responsibilities because they're past time supports they're world view that even when they succeed they still wont be enjoying themselves... -
12-28-2011, 03:40 PMBelial
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12-28-2011, 03:53 PMMaxom
^^^^^
The best thing I've seen in this whole thread. -
01-01-2012, 09:12 PMIsaveron
Is there a reason why you can't keep this nonsensical whining in one topic? It's bad enough you won't let the dead horse rest in peace.
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01-05-2012, 06:39 PMDeadRiser
Lol two more camps in the past two days were taken over by PL parties. It's just an annoyance now. I'm really sick of it.
I still doubt that SE wanted the 50 to join the party, get hate, then be booted out and keep hate. That's not PL. That should technically be called glitching a system. -
01-08-2012, 09:12 AMZerefWhat i read was "stop PL because i can't do it yet" seriously? nobody's asking you to PL, and god knows there are plenty of users here that don't like PL either, find them, join them, play with them, the point of an online game is to find like-minded people to play with, so find like-minded people to play with, nobody is making you or expecting you to get with people you don't want/can't play with, what's next you're going to demand Primals get taken out because even though they're lvl 45 missions people are asking for lvl 50 players to play them and you don't have a 50? it takes what, a week to get to 50? just do it man.Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicFox
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01-08-2012, 09:24 AMknite23
.....you must not be in a ls that is willing to help you level most link shells will get on their lower classes and level with you if your a dedicated member plus Pling isnt that bad on my server so you might want to switch servers if your finding it so difficult on yours. lastly the game needs PL's atm people need to get to 50 play with their friends and help develop the game before 2.0 cause when 2.0/ps3 people hit a nerf will come to Xp but for now everything is where it needs to be we should vote on a dislike button in these forums......
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01-13-2012, 04:13 AMMStowastiqVahlshdeh
I am just adding my vote for no power leveling. I like to enjoy things at a decent pace, learn how to use my character skills and the game controls.
At level 5 I was already getting offers to PL my character as if it was just a natural progression. I politely declined, because to each is own and technically they are trying to help me so I appreciate that gesture. I did think about how strange it was that they assumed I wanted it, immediately confirming to me just how common it is. -
01-16-2012, 02:55 AMAkayoAkayu
The current way to PL is screwy. It has become way too common and it is difficult to form a leveling party without one until level 40.
It needs fixed and my solution is to add a limited exp bonus for new, invited players. Yoshida wants new players to be able to level up and play with friends quickly if they want. A powerleveling system that is open to everyone is inevitabley going to be abused.
Suggestion: When my friend registers their account they have the option to put my account down as a referral and this gives them a timed buff (2 weeks?) that allows for enhanced experience. The buff is exclusive to the account, not the character. This could achieve what the intent for PL is but limit it so abuse is not the norm.
I'm guessing it'l be fixed/changed at some point but my hope is that it is soon. I don't like PL but it wouldn't be a huge issue if it didn't effect the ability to find a straight party that doesn't like easy mode. -
01-20-2012, 04:12 PMAlaulaTheGreat
I kinda miss the ole days where PLing was just a healer standing outside of a party while the party inside had to do some work that involved at least auto attacking at an minimum.
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02-02-2012, 04:55 PMStradivari
The current method of PL'ing can't be working as intended.... The lower levels just sit simi-AFK hitting a macro to oust and re-invite their PL'er and nothing else, while the PL'er rapes every mob in site giving them massive amounts of EXP.
When PL parties are around it makes the area worthless to conventional parties that actually want to play the game. -
02-03-2012, 09:44 PMDiyne
There's so many exp camps, I don't see how this hurts 'real' exp parties. The problem there, in my opinion, is that it's been so long, now that we finally do have a search function, most people have already leveled most of the classes they want to play to 50. That, or they're finished. This isn't really plings fault, persay, as just game-age. The level cap will be raised, and then, it won't really be viable to power level people lower than 40-50 anyways. (which are really the levels that matter, imo)
I have pl'd some friends on occassion. Not terribly extensively. We usually go and kill things that are good farm material, or have low amounts of aoe. So it's usually 'Hey, I'm going to go farm wool. Why don't I take my friend along who's been doing leves for two hours and can't get an exp party with me, and help him get some levels while I do this?' Then we wind up with a bunch of people hanging out and bsing in team speak for an hour or two while we farm wool and help so-and-so get some ranks. Oh, and wait around for Uraeus to spawn in between. Or whatever.
The act of power leveling takes up someone's time. If people prefer to have their friends power level them, and level up that way, so what. If the power leveler is willing to do it, then that's their choice. There will be plenty of party content in the future. Yes, this can be taken advantage of by people who want to shovel gil at it, but if you're getting your linkshell members to pl you, they probably friends or they're returning a favor, or what not. I'm certainly not going to go out of my way to go power level some random person I've never spoken to, or someone who sits in town /shout'ing stupid stuff all day.
To be honest, I see very little pling on my server. And when I do, it's usually two friends, or a few linkshell buddies in other LS's, helping each other out because they're sick of doing leves, or they want to hang out and chat while they're doing something semi-productive. I saw giant PL parties back when the system was screwy for like two weeks, but that's long gone now. I think we'll see a few updates to the system to address any 'issues' (if it's not working as intended) with being able to pl other players.
My only real beef is when being power leveled causes skill problems, and a person insists on coming as a specific class and they have no idea what they're doing, because they were power leveled to 45 and haven't even set up their ability bars properly yet. At least understand the mechanics of the class once you hit 50, so that you're not causing others to be bogged down by your ineptitude in the class. -
02-04-2012, 12:18 AMTurtle
I believe a call for helpfunction is in order. There always will be a PL'ing system but it shouldnt be to the extent of people going afk then returning to a job 5 levels higher than when s/he left. FFXI's PL'ing system entailed a mage capable of casting cure(relevent to the level of the group) sitting on the sidelines and helping cure to limit down time. I won't say that I havn't exploited the PL'ing system to help friends out of boredom, but I do realise how over-powered it is.
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02-04-2012, 12:39 AMKiote
You should scrap this and make a FIX PL Petition.
PLing Should Exist. It is a great way to build relationships in game.
The only problem with PLing right now, is that Players can AFK through it. We need more strict Earned XP requirements.
Things like "You must inflict damage or status effects to earn XP" -
02-04-2012, 01:03 AMYoohre_WildRiver
I have been doing party grind on my pug since ls week wjat we do is switch to con 50, use stoneskin, switch back to low rank.. Chargeeeeeeee Rambo mode activated
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02-04-2012, 06:13 AMDiyne
See, i like this. I don't really like the whole 'disband party reinvite' thing. I prefer to make who I'm pling help me out and work for it. Though a lot of my friends are also stubborn and run around attacking the enemies anyways while we're hanging out on team speak.