Can I just say I absolutely love the idea of WHM getting reflect-type abilities.Quote:
Originally Posted by lordparanoia
A bit OP with those potencies though, but a very nice starting point.
-
11-15-2016, 12:44 AMExiled_Tonberry
-
11-15-2016, 01:37 AMShurrikhan
I'd just like to see more done with the three Conjurer elements and perhaps to trade out the four 20%-chance procs for something that more reliable and bankable. I'd still like for them to be the powerhouse healer, but I'd also like to see more in the way of cross-over tools between offense and defense, and maybe even some less direct ways to save lives.
-
11-26-2016, 06:15 AMSemirhage
Restore? WHM already has an identity. It's got the honor of being the most nerfed class in the game. Which is especially silly when WAR and SCH are so overpowered that they're still raid mandatory, but WHM is the one that needed proactive 3.0 nerfs just in case they also became mandatory.
And no, Scholars aren't mandatory because they're "the only off healer". Their emergency healing toolkit is higher potency than WHM's or AST's, on shorter cooldowns, and more flexible. SCH has a version of both of WHM's regen abilities, and both are arguably on-par or stronger. Lily is a permanently divine-sealed (with its own built-in AOE divine seal that stacks with that base potency and can be further Divine Sealed by Rouse) 0 mana always-on version of regen that can split its ticks, doesn't need to be recast, and has a built-in AFK mode if you want to use it. Roused, Illuminated Whispering Dawn is more potent than Medica 2 (Hilariously enough, it is quite similar to pre-nerf Medica 2, which got a slap with the nerf bat because it was too powerful. On a white mage maybe). Lustrate is a more flexible, target-split capable emergency heal on the same "cooldown" as Tetra. Aetherflow and Indomitability, while not dealing damage in cleric stance, restore way more mana and heal more than Assize does, on a shorter timer, with the added bonus of not being an emergency heal that you're forced to put on cooldown if you want to use your mana regeneration. Emergency Tactics straight up gives SCH medica on a relatively short cooldown. Without even touching their shielding or their mitigation abilities, Scholar has a very powerful straight healing toolkit. WHM's main advantage is that they can spam some of those abilities, often in situations where casting it once or twice is sufficient. I don't get this community impression that WHM is "the pure raw healer", because that's only true by a very narrow margin.
Yes, using Aetherflow stacks for these is an opportunity cost. You could use them on Energy drain. That's ignoring the fact that Aetherflow already restores about as much MP as WHM's entire combined MP restoration kit on a shorter cooldown, so it's an opportunity to get even more mana back.
SCH has so many advantages it's insane. AST was overbuffed because they needed to keep up with the steamrolling monster that is SCH. WHM either needs an overhaul that takes them beyond the tired song and dance of "but you have Cure 3!" or Scholar needs a severe beating with the nerf bat. Yoshi stated he wasn't going to do the latter (WHY!?!?, since WHM has ALWAYS been fair game for it. But that's its own rant) I'm going to wait until 4.0 to see if we get the former. I like WHM for its flavor, but good heavens does it need some love.
Tl;dr Scholar is the beast that is the source of this lack of identity. -
11-26-2016, 08:09 AMThunda_Cat_SMASHYoshi knows that if he nerfs Scholar, the community outrage over the lost dps would be so bad it would cause a mass exodus. I do agree Scholar needs nerfs, but I don't see it happening without the obligatory torches and pitchforks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Semirhage
-
11-30-2016, 06:18 PMN8Dawgg
Aspec benefic, aspec helios, collective unconcious, time dilation on tank, celestial opposition on the party, 3k-5k regens for 25+ seconds is pretty amazing no matter how you slice it, those numbers make my heart happy
Asylum has its own tick, so its hard to tell, but I think they come pretty close? But the ability to extend regens is also no joke. -
11-30-2016, 06:44 PMN8Dawgg
Cleric Stance is a Conjurer skill right? How about a WHM trait that reduces MP cost of offensive spells? Or a WHM ability usable in Cleric that reduces MP cost of offensive spells?
-
11-30-2016, 11:03 PMExiled_TonberryHonestly they screwed up here too. They buffed ASTs shields to be, on average, stronger than SCHs shields. So now SCH is more than ever focused on their pet heals and DPS. Nerfing their DPS or pet now is going to throw AST over the edge just like with WHM.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH
I hear that the AST buffs are more like patchwork more than permanent buffs, but I don't see them reducing balance or rolling back heal potency at all. They created ye another minster while WHM remains simply viable. And yet somehow WHM is the one that gets nerfs after nerfs lol, I'll never understand how a Stoneskin would make WHM "mandatory" and a 20% balance doesn't. -
12-01-2016, 01:08 PMVanilleFang
AST is healing more at lower MP costs, and they have the best MP regen ability! What do we do to fix this? We should nerf AST or buff the other healers of course!
Wait.
WHM has Cure III AND Stoneskin II?
*makes Stoneskin II crosscross* -
12-01-2016, 02:27 PMExiled_TonberryWatch. SE is going to give AST Benefic III by 4.0 and Nerf Divine Seal. Just....just watch...Quote:
Originally Posted by VanilleFang
-
12-02-2016, 06:05 AMAmal_WrightI like this line of thinking. Everyone can use cleric stance, but why not make WHM the one that truly integrates it? For example:Quote:
Originally Posted by N8Dawgg
Fluid Aura
150 potency, 5y range
Additional Effect with Cleric-Off: 15y knockback and bind
Additional Effect with Cleric-On: range extended to 20y, no knockback
Maybe make the heavy effect of stone I something different with cleric on? Still thinking. -
12-02-2016, 09:58 AMCynfaelI actually like this kind of thinking as well. I'm sure that the "Healers are Non-Combatants" contingent would throw an absolute fit if Cleric Stance management became even more integral to playing any healing job, but A) I care less about their feelings by the day and B) there is opportunity there beyond direct damage.Quote:
Originally Posted by Amal_Wright
Why not offer special debuffs or (non-crappy) crowd control skills that can only be used while under the effect of Cleric Stance? E.g. Breakga for petrification, anyone? As long as they include at least a few skills that might actually be of use in boss encounters and make sure that WHM has access to some intriguing options, this could be a way to enhance the support role in addition to the obligatory DPS spell upgrades we are sure to get regardless. -
12-02-2016, 09:54 PMVulcwen
I think this goes more into the issues with the DPS meta in general, it's pretty clear that a lot of healers want to be able to be useful without having to all become DPS. The DPS meta is an issue with this game, and while it's currently optimal (and therefore you should dps as healer), and the risk-reward portion of cleric can be rewarding, it's ultimately not what a lot of players want from a healing job. So, introducing other forms of support, like crowd control can make healing more viable, and WHM can become the best CC'er of the healers, in fact, they already are, it's just that encounter design currently gives no use to it by making enemies immune, nor introducing mechanics that require things like sleeps and AoE stuns.
I think a primary issue with CC is that not enough jobs have access to it, SE doesn't want to force players into specific group setups, so they can either make it useless, or give it to more classes as well, I think I'll prefer the 2nd option as it can make content design more interesting in the future.
For sleep mechanics: It could be possible that an enemy has to be kept asleep, which means spending GCDs on refreshing the sleep, it'll be less of a DPS loss to let a healer do this compared to a BLM or other DPS.. you can give other DPS classes sleeps to not force BLM or WHM choices, but if WHM is the only healer with a sleep, it'll be an advantage over other healers. Alternatively, you can vary durations, so that if other healers also get a sleep, a WHM's one is longer in duration meaning less GCDs spent on refreshing it.