Anima Weapons. Putting things into perspective.

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Originally Posted by AdamSandler

I shouldn't be shocked at how many entitled self centered people there are. All the time spent crying to could be that much closer.

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Yeah, people who don't want to run through a boring grind for an obsolete weapon are totally entitled and self centered.

I don't mind the grind for the relic weapon though I think it is a little bit of overkill for the 210 step. My issue is that the crafted components are the largest hurdle as they are crazy expensive on most servers and shelling out 4-8mil is insane. Yes I can level my crafting and gather the mats to remove the cost but to level all the needed jobs, get the gear needed to succeed and gather the mats would take much longer than gathering another 80 from beast tribes and duties. I spend a lot of time playing the game but as a casual player I have 2 level 60 battle classes, 1 crafting at 50 and one gathering at 50. Everything else is under that because I only have so much time to invest. This also means I don't have 4-8mil to spend.

I am going to do it and will invest the time to get there but it is a little insane the length of this one step and months of levelling crafter and gathering classes ahead of me for the final 16 items. (My server prices are crazy)

Anyone else think it is funny to collect Tomestones (a type of token), beast tribe tokens and gordidas tokens just to exchange them for other tokens that you pair up with other items in order to get yet other tokens to finally get the weapon?

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Originally Posted by Janyxea

LOL Sure you were, buddy.

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Napkin Math tells me that with some generous assumptions about new player bonus for tomes, and doing only the most brutally efficient runs you could do it in the time frame he suggested with about 3 hours a day of play dedicated strictly to doing the grind. If this counts on a halfway effort I suppose I depends on how normal one would consider to spend 6 hours a day every day playing FF14, since that would presumably be normal/full effort.

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Originally Posted by HPDelron

Napkin Math tells me that with some generous assumptions about new player bonus for tomes, and doing only the most brutally efficient runs you could do it in the time frame he suggested with about 3 hours a day of play dedicated strictly to doing the grind. If this counts on a halfway effort I suppose I depends on how normal one would consider to spend 6 hours a day every day playing FF14, since that would presumably be normal/full effort.

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Lots of New Player Bonus and roulettes as well as alex when I felt like running it.
Let me amend that. 3 weeks was incorrect. I got it 1/21. So, a month and 5 days.

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Originally Posted by AdamSandler

Lots of New Player Bonus and roulettes as well as alex when I felt like running it.
Let me amend that. 3 weeks was incorrect. I got it 1/21. So, a month and 5 days.

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You said 2-3 weeks. So I was making an assumption of 17 days (~2.5 weeks). Since your current figure is now double the span of your previous we can call this 1.5 hours a day. That's probably still fair to call dedicated play not a halfway effort.

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Originally Posted by AdamSandler

It's not that bad. Halfway trying I was done with the 210 in 2-3 weeks.

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If you do all four beast tribes, an expert roulette, a level 60 roulette, a level 50 roulette, a leveling roulette, a trial roulette, and a main scenario roulette every day, you'd be a little over half way after 21 days.

If you assume an exceptionally generous 5 minutes per beast tribe and trial roulette and 15 minutes per dungeon roulette, that's 100 minutes per day.

After 42 days, or six weeks, at this same pace, you could finish the unidentified item step and have, conveniently, ~8.5k extra esoterics to almost finish the next step also.

But, even using our generous estimates above, that's still a total of 70 hours, or 11.67 hours per week. Attempting to complete it in half the number of weeks would involve significantly more than double the number of hours per week, since you only get the roulette bonuses once per day.

I'm not sure that something that's a greater time investment than a part-time job would be considered "halfway trying" by most people.

im not doing anima , i despise this huge grinds.... the weapon isnt even worth (and i main BRD) , im getting the Uni. Items , slowly as i do my weekly lore grind and whatnot...im sorry but i dont want to grind anymore....i grinded brayflox in ARR for hours to no end....almost quit the game , so nooo this grinds arent helping. the books almost killed all the fun .... ugh

why any1 would grind this weapons is beyond me,but hey if u like it , more power to you, i tried ....but in the end i told myself , is worth wasting hours here, NOT HAVING ANY FUN AT ALL? grinding alex normal for hours , or old tribe quests .....no thanks , i woud log out , watch some serie , read a book ,play other games , or anything before starting to despise a game i really love , and enjoy playing.

this anima was handle poorly , 1 u need fates , then old dungeons , then grind tomes or dungeons that u already did 10000 times.... dont forget buying overpriced items , or buy mats in the end huge gil sink no matter what...for what? a weapon that isnt going to change anything ...(maybe thats because i play brd and WD on ranged weapons is :rolleyes: )

If the relic chain quest were fun.....or engaging...kinda like job quests , adding some personal battles , mixed with some trial , and dungeon , some tomes , anything but reused old boring content.... :(

Hmm... already got 2 i210 relics and all i did for them was beastribes+PvP, sure it took time but it didnt felt grind at all. Still need Ukonvasara so i keep doing what i have done thusfar.

They nerfed atma and then the books mid way through the old relic idk why people get high and mighty when people want a stage that will be a road block to be easier considering the actual stage offers no benefit but progression.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Where have the devs once said that relic will cost no time?

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I'm actually at a loss for words as to how you interpreted what I said to get that conclusion.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

They nerfed atma and then the books mid way through the old relic idk why people get high and mighty when people want a stage that will be a road block to be easier considering the actual stage offers no benefit but progression.

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They weren't nerfed until much farther down the road. It'll be the same story for this relic as well.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

They weren't nerfed until much farther down the road. It'll be the same story for this relic as well.

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Well maybe cause they were easy just random luck played a huge factor. This is just a pure grind which is ok then a bit of a major investment for many which is the part that is my biggest gripe, i understand making crafters useful but this also needs to work with the supply...

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

They nerfed atma and then the books mid way through the old relic idk why people get high and mighty when people want a stage that will be a road block to be easier considering the actual stage offers no benefit but progression.

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Atma went in with the 2.2 patch and the first adjustment came with 2.4. It was a simple drop rate adjustment.

Novus was introduced in 2.28 and Nexus in 2.38. We've only had Anima since 3.15.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

idk why people get high and mighty when people want a stage that will be a road block to be easier

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I think I speak for a lot of people when I say "why do you deserve an easier time just cause you're late to the party.".

Yeah sure SE has always made catching up easier for players. But the relic weapons are supposed to be the grindiest of them all. It's more of a reward for having devotion to the game and your class. There are plenty alternative weapons than the Anima and I think it should never be nerfed.

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Originally Posted by Jimoori

I think I speak for a lot of people when I say "why do you deserve an easier time just cause you're late to the party.".

Yeah sure SE has always made catching up easier for players. But the relic weapons are supposed to be the grindiest of them all. It's more of a reward for having devotion to the game and your class. There are plenty alternative weapons than the Anima and I think it should never be nerfed.

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Im not "Late" i have my tokens or well the beast tribe tokens to buy half of them, its the Crafted items im up in arms about. Honestly i could easy run Gordias to grind my token.

thats the problem with the community(not all of them) ppl want things to be handed to them without putting work into it..

If you dont like it OP don't do it. I'm on my second relic, no problems. I did a lot of alex for my first one but i'm taking my time on the second one.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

Well maybe cause they were easy just random luck played a huge factor. This is just a pure grind which is ok then a bit of a major investment for many which is the part that is my biggest gripe, i understand making crafters useful but this also needs to work with the supply...

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Tbh, it's not even that bad of a grind, especially over the long term. Given the amount of methods they put in for getting UI items. I knocked two out rather quickly, then ignored it for awhile and have set aside almost what I will need for a third once they nerf the step. (I am assuming they will nerf by half in 3.3) And that is with totally half assing the last one.

That OP was claiming its way to big for him to even finish one yet shows he is far too casual of a player for it, even though you can build the UI passively. The real casuals weapon is the tome one, thats his price point.

The benefit of having the relic one is that you can now be two weeks ahead in lore spending on your gear. Or for me, rather than buy my WHM, I can use my WHM and WAR relics, and spend my lore on my NIN weapon.

In the end they will nerf the step in 3.3, and people can be set to take a weapon straight to 230 at that point by pre buying everything.

OPs plan to wait for the nerf back fired because he made an assumption of when the nerf would happen and now hes salty about it is all. If they nerfed it now, it's essentially a free 230 weapon, which is the prize for doing the earlier grind. The step to 240 in 3.3 will be a grind to I bet.

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Originally Posted by Jimoori

But the relic weapons are supposed to be the grindiest of them all.

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That is not it's purpose.

It's purpose is to be a weapon that's time and effort to obtain is considered equivalent to the raiding weapons of the same ilevel, without requiring raiding.

The result of that purpose is that obtaining it is often a grind focused endeavor, but it was not created solely to be a weapon that you grind for, as if that act in and of itself is meant to be its flagship attribute.

Relics are basically a glamor item, and they always have been. The current anima weapons are unbelievably grindy because Square-Enix has run out of ideas to keep people playing old content, so they need to keep it relevant in some way. The collectors would have you believe that it's worth all of this effort because at the end you'll end up with something fresh and unique, but in my mind the old Zeta weapons were superior in terms of glamor. No one equips anima weapons for their stats.

Give it a few months and they'll loosen the requirements and add a new higher tier weapon which outshines the relic by a factor of ten. Honestly, they could avoid all of this if they were a bit more open-minded about making the relics special in some way, but they're rather stuffy when it comes to adding special bonuses onto items and I doubt we shall ever see the day when the relics are worth the grind.

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

thats the problem with the community(not all of them) ppl want things to be handed to them without putting work into it..

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I was perfectly fine with the third step when the only other option was to get a 210 savage weapon. It fit its intended purpose then.

That I want to see it better fit its intended purpose now and believe it doesn't hardly means I want something handed to me without putting work in.

Something like making it 12 or 15 tokens each instead of 20, and NQ instead of HQ items. Bam, better fits the time and effort curve of getting to a 210 weapon.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

I was perfectly fine with the third step when the only other option was to get a 210 savage weapon. It fit its intended purpose then.

That I want to see it better fit its intended purpose now and believe it doesn't hardly means I want something handed to me without putting work in.

Something like making it 12 or 15 tokens each instead of 20, and NQ instead of HQ items. Bam, better fits the time and effort curve of getting to a 210 weapon.

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But your 210 tome weapon doesn't become a 230 with almost no effort does it? Welcome to the pay off for having completed it on time. You aren't getting the 210 handed to you, you are getting the 230 handed to you.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

Atma went in with the 2.2 patch and the first adjustment came with 2.4. It was a simple drop rate adjustment.

Novus was introduced in 2.28 and Nexus in 2.38. We've only had Anima since 3.15.

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I was actually just about post this very same information because I was curious when they actually did nerf the Atma drop rate. The tomestone cost was nerfed over time due to the increasing tiers of tomestones.

However, I will admit I was actually hoping for a nerf of some capacity on the Anima weapon cost since the ilvl tier for Stage 3 Anima weapon was basically wrecked the very next patch. If you consider the fact that the Atma portion of Relic weapon was nerfed when the new ilvl tier was introduced, you can sort of see the parallel of hoping for a nerf here too.

If I would take a random shot in the dark, I would imagine the Stage 3 Anima cost nerf to occur on 3.3. I doubt they're going to wait two full patch cycles (3.35) to reduce the Anima Stage 3 cost due to how late they actually launched the content within that ilvl cycle. For me, part of the issue with this "Legendary" weapon cycle compared to AAR is how irrelevant the weapon felt at its launch though the fact that they're making the new Anima i230 does restore some confidence in me that they're putting the "Legendary" weapon curve back on track.

[EDIT]Due to Ashkendor's sig I wanted to try to put "fills you with determination" when I was trying to write "restore some confidence" in my post >>;... Dat Undertale.

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Originally Posted by Ghishlain

If I would take a random shot in the dark, I would imagine the Stage 3 Anima cost nerf to occur on 3.3. I doubt they're going to wait two full patch cycles (3.35) to reduce the Anima Stage 3 cost due to how late they actually launched the content within that ilvl cycle. For me, part of the issue with this "Legendary" weapon cycle compared to AAR is how irrelevant the weapon felt at its launch though the fact that they're making the new Anima i230 does restore some confidence in me that they're putting the "Legendary" weapon curve back on track.

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I wouldn't even assume there's going to be a cost reduction then. The first Atma adjustment just boosted the drop rate. I think it was boosted again later when the first light nerf went in, too. I know it's been boosted several times.

Too lazy to go dig through old patch notes again right now. xD

Yeah I won't lie, I was indeed hoping for a little tone in difficulty on how to get the Anima relic but, since it remained untouched, I imply can't be bothered just yet.

Sure, I can get a 230 weapon if i did that but unless I raided (Which I do not), I don't see a reason to obtain a 230 weapon: 210 is fine for most of the normal content, if not all the content.

Oh I also forgot about sephirot weapons...but nah, not up for the stress. Still a better choice though.

Besides the crafted items are still expensive in my server: last time I checked it was going for 500k EACH. And I need 4 of those for one item! I'm not that rich: my only income is roulettes as a tank!

Ah well, looks like I'll be waiting for other ways to obtain my weapon. I like grinding, but this is pretty long and frustrating. And boring.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

I wouldn't even assume there's going to be a cost reduction then. The first Atma adjustment just boosted the drop rate. I think it was boosted again later when the first light nerf went in, too. I know it's been boosted several times.

Too lazy to go dig through old patch notes again right now. xD

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Indeed, though you can't "boost the drop rate" of the stage 3 anima so the only way they can nerf the acquisition process is making the items "cheaper" (either by reducing the required number of items or reducing the cost to acquire said items).

I guess what I'm trying to say is they made it easier to progress through the stages after a period of time elapsed and I was hoping they would do that for the stage 3 due to the new ilvl tier being introduced.

Boohoo to me for being optimistic though xD I am sitting on around 30 some items of each though so I'll definitely start collecting the item for the new stage (assuming I can without having stage 3 completed) and then pick the weapon that is suitable for the healer that my static wants me to heal with once we get rolling on that.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

I was perfectly fine with the third step when the only other option was to get a 210 savage weapon. It fit its intended purpose then.

That I want to see it better fit its intended purpose now and believe it doesn't hardly means I want something handed to me without putting work in.

Something like making it 12 or 15 tokens each instead of 20, and NQ instead of HQ items. Bam, better fits the time and effort curve of getting to a 210 weapon.

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the problem here is that you looking at the relic by item level,instead of thinking is a long run thats gonna pay off at the end,you know this is the strongest weapon right?

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

the problem here is that you looking at the relic by item level,instead of thinking is a long run thats gonna pay off at the end,you know this is the strongest weapon right?

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OMG do not make me laugh this is the weakest weapon at Ilvl 230, the Lore weapon has far better stats and can be melded so the relic again is immediately eclipsed by the tome option. Which is easier, less grinding and doesn't come with a gil investment.
Sure 3.3 might bring me a Weapon with customiseble stats buy the Lore upgrade will be out by then and again the relic can not be melded which now plays a huge factor in being decent or not.

However since the Monk relic has decent 2nd stats ill go for it, but not being able to meld it with Mat V is a major loss.

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

the problem here is that you looking at the relic by item level,instead of thinking is a long run thats gonna pay off at the end,you know this is the strongest weapon right?

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It's already a "long run". Yet, the weapon is shit tier for quite a lot of jobs.
Is it wrong to ask for the most expensive weapon in the game, both in time and gils, to be good right now instead of being only worth it as a retainer weapon during its build-up process?

"You'll see in 6 months, when we'll prepare 4.0, it'll be slightly better than your other choices!", is not a valid argument for a lot of people.

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Originally Posted by Voltyblast

Yeah I won't lie, I was indeed hoping for a little tone in difficulty on how to get the Anima relic but, since it remained untouched, I imply can't be bothered just yet.

Sure, I can get a 230 weapon if i did that but unless I raided (Which I do not), I don't see a reason to obtain a 230 weapon: 210 is fine for most of the normal content, if not all the content.

Oh I also forgot about sephirot weapons...but nah, not up for the stress. Still a better choice though.

Besides the crafted items are still expensive in my server: last time I checked it was going for 500k EACH. And I need 4 of those for one item! I'm not that rich: my only income is roulettes as a tank!

Ah well, looks like I'll be waiting for other ways to obtain my weapon. I like grinding, but this is pretty long and frustrating. And boring.

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I am in the same boat here. 5-6m is a bit much. It shouldn't be an instant reward, but man is it expensive.

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Originally Posted by Whiteroom

But your 210 tome weapon doesn't become a 230 with almost no effort does it? Welcome to the pay off for having completed it on time. You aren't getting the 210 handed to you, you are getting the 230 handed to you.

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Dropping the requirements to 15, or even 12, of each token while leaving the cost of those the same, and changing it to NQ items is still quite a bit of effort and some gil. That hardly results in having 230 handed to you.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

OMG do not make me laugh this is the weakest weapon at Ilvl 230, the Lore weapon has far better stats and can be melded so the relic again is immediately eclipsed by the tome option.

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Firstly, that's going to vary by job. For example, tanks all have parry on the lore weapons, and nobody likes parry.

Secondly, the Anima weapons have both secondary stats capped (rather than one capped and one at ~70% of that). That means you're getting an additional 34 points (with the usual exceptions of Determination and Piety with their slightly different weights) of secondary stats (compared to the 24 points you'd get from two Grade V materia).

Already noted by Ibi

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

the problem here is that you looking at the relic by item level,instead of thinking is a long run thats gonna pay off at the end,you know this is the strongest weapon right?

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I'm judging it based on the intended purpose and design as stated by Yoshi-P, not just item level.

well to bad you guys are not gonna get a nerf on the weapon items,work for it just like all ppl with relic did,an to add up the relic weapon is much better than the stone ones,at least wars are.
an the items are not specialist lock anymore,any master-hand can craft those items,they are just 1*...(thats the best you gonna get)

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

well to bad you guys are not gonna get a nerf on the weapon items,work for it just like all ppl with relic did,an to add up the relic weapon is much better than the stone ones,at least wars are.
an the items are not specialist lock anymore,any master-hand can craft those items,they are just 1*...(thats the best you gonna get)

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I can almost promise you they will nerf it

Idk what you're talking about

meh im not doing a second one till they nerf it

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Originally Posted by Thayos

This is a moot point though, because the point of doing a relic weapon is really now to get an i230 weapon. The way this is designed, you can start from scratch and work toward an i210 weapon... and by the time you get there, you can also have the supplies needed for an essentially free i210 to i230 upgrade.

There's no problem here. You can't sit on the sideline and then complain about not being spoon fed fast enough.

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Also, instead of Spending Lore tomes on a weapon, save up the Lore for your secondary job. I say getting the ilvl 230 anima is a win/win situation if you already got caught up with the ilvl 210.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

To be honest, I'd be pissed off being halfway through my relic if they reduced the cost of the items after I've spent all of my tomes on them. I'm glad it's just as grindy or my previous effort would have been pointless.

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This right here is the messed up mentality people have.

"I did the grind, so should you."

Well I cleared multiple levels of Coil and over half of Gordias Savage. They should revert the nerfs on them, remove unsync as an option for Coil. I did the hard work of learning difficult fights and clearing them to see the story, so should you. But no, you'd cry that it's unfair that you're locked out of glamour, etc.

Double standards.

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Originally Posted by CorbinDallas

This right here is the messed up mentality people have.

"I did the grind, so should you."

Well I cleared multiple levels of Coil and over half of Gordias Savage. They should revert the nerfs on them, remove unsync as an option for Coil. I did the hard work of learning difficult fights and clearing them to see the story, so should you. But no, you'd cry that it's unfair that you're locked out of glamour, etc.

Double standards.

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Right, because one person speaks for all of us.