Power-leveling is absolutely BROKEN

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MrLion

Sure...good luck getting insane amounts of EXP on your higher levels...

---

Do Solo-leves on higher Ranks and you will get insane amounts. <_< 15k, 12k and 13k is what i got out of 3 leves and like 40ish Minutes in total.

I think there should be an XP penalty for the lower level members of the party.

As sinfully delicious it is to be on the receiving end, a level 50 should not be able to take a party of late 20s and net 400 to 700 a kill off of a mob significantly lower than the r50.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

Okay, this seriously needs to be fixed immediately.

Now, before you all say, "Oh come on dude, why you gotta crap on something so awesome," honestly think about it. The consequences will be a domino effect that just might force SE to do a server rollback.

Here's an example: I just got 25,000EXP in less than five minutes. From level 24 to 25 with a friend killing and chaining crabs for me in my party.

The above is far far too extreme. Given these possibilities, and even more if she killed something at a higher level, everyone will exploit the crap out of this and no one will have a job below level 40 within a month. Do we really want this? Do we want to make the journey to cap so utterly pointless?

I'm really concerned for the future of this game if this is what SE intended in this patch! This is bad, really bad. Please, SE, let's get an emergency maintenance and fix this before it is too late!

---

You know, one reason why people get so up in arms over Christianity and people who follow it is because of the popular depiction of Christians as people who get ridiculously involved and concerned with things that don't really effect them.

Off-Topic? Not really. That's exactly what you're doing.

Powerleveling is only a pandemic because people seem to think that everyone HAS to do everything the slowest way possible or suddenly it has no value to anyone. Fun fact, 70% of the current FFXIV players have level 50 jobs. The game has been out for over a year, and a good half of the people playing it have been at it for at least that long. People getting to 40+ in a month isn't something that's going to ruin the game. Especially if they are being powerleveled by a friend who's been playing for super long already -- that actually could help them stick to the game (since they have have people to play with and a reason to log on.)

What does it mean for you when people get power leveled? Not a damn thing. You see, there are few tenets of common-sense MMO'ing that will make it so that you need not be concerned with what everyone else is doing:

1. Don't run with randoms. That's what linkshells are for. Build a trustworthy group of friends ingame and play with them. There are people who will be power leveled in your group, but most of them (if your shell is good at all) will still have invested in learning to do their job properly.

2. Don't be a hypocrit. Don't complain about something you're ultimately going to do yourself. You're complaining because you got power leveled by a friend? Why were you doing it, then? The point of a game is experiencing it however you want to, and if you're going to choose to breeze through the early levels to get to quests and epic battles quicker, that's your choice -- but don't complain about it. Some of us enjoy leveling slowly, some don't.

3. Don't sweat the small stuff. In the grand scheme of things, people being power leveled is a non-issue. Its already been declared that jobs will work on a quest-by-quest basis, and for all we know they may not even use EXP to level up. That said, Classes are likely going to just be introductory components to much more focused, much more intense combative elements of the game. People who power level and have no idea what they are doing aren't going to get very far -- people who learn how to play their class/job (regardless of how they level up) ARE. That's the only balance or fix this problem needs, and its already built into the system.

Look, I can understand the idea of not wanting people to get things you worked hard for easily, but grinding is not a gold medal sport. It never has been and it should never be treated like it should be -- its an unfortunate part of MMO's that is necessary but shouldn't be haphazardly imposed on people. Talk to me about people powerleveling through Ifrit and I'll be right there with you. Talk to me about people getting to level 35+ in less than a month, and I'm going to look at you like you're a crazy.

TL;DR? No one cares. Or at least they shouldn't. Let the people power level if they want to, you do the slow way if you want to (I will be.) At the end of the day, quests, missions, bosses, dungeons, and epic rewards will be won by SKILL not by getting to level 50 quickly. So who gives a frightful f*ck.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

I think there should be an XP penalty for the lower level members of the party.

As sinfully delicious it is to be on the receiving end, a level 50 should not be able to take a party of late 20s and net 400 to 700 a kill off of a mob significantly lower than the r50.

---

So, I want to play with my friend who I've duo'd from 10 to 35+ with, but I want to start a new class and they don't (say they've been at the game longer and already have all of the other classes they want at level 30+) You're telling me I shouldn't be able to just run with them to get up to their level quickly so we can do other, more interesting things than grinding.

Give me a real reason for that. See, I'm very open-minded about the subject, I used to be an ant-power level person.

But I realized something about that mentality -- it has no real foundation.

Its built around the pretense that levels are something you earn... They aren't. Running around in circles for hours bashing monsters in rapid succession requires no skill or no how -- it teaches you nothing and gains you no real benefit. Leveling is the unwanted child of Progress, and if Progress had any choice it would leave him at home rather than taking him everywhere.

But yeah, give me a real reason power leveling is bad outside of:

1. It removes your sense of commitment -- that's personal, and if you feel being PL'd will make you not appreciate the game, you don't have to do it.

2. It will create bad players. Don't run with randoms. There will be slow-level players who suck just as bad.

3. "I don't want to compete with people who leveled up to 50 in a week." Again, personal, and if someone's good enough to compete with you after power leveling to cap as quickly as possible, that's a mark against you, not them.

4. You miss a lot of the game's content. Again, personal.


Frankly, for sake of example, the most fun I had with World of Warcraft was when I started playing via special invitation from a friend and had a +100% boost to EXP. When you can get past the mundane nonsense and start to see more interesting and exciting things, that's when you start to really enjoy MMO's. FFXIV's "freedom" point is in around level 25-30, there's no reason why it should take people months to get there.

Sure limits and rules around who can level with who can easily be imposed -- I just feel they are unnecessary and counter-intuitive to the social focus of the MMO experience. If I convince my girlfriend to play, I want her to be able to run around WITH me and see me take down big baddies and help her get to higher levels so we can do things together. I don't want to have to spontaneously start leveling a class I have no interest in just because there's this misguided belief that people with no friends/allies to help them level faster (or people who, respectfully choose to do things the old fashioned way) should take precedence over the presence of choice.

One of the things I liked in FFXI were skill levels...because if someone was power leveled, then they wouldn't have their skills capped and wouldn't be as effective as those who didn't power level.

If SE want to penilise people for power leveling like this, they will only roll back character's levels that did it, they may even do it like the last exp exploit where they invited people to hand thereselves in to avoid a ban, and just a rollback, and anyone that doesnt hand thierselves in get banned.

Grinding in this game didn't include any remote form of skill. In ffxi you had to actually utilize your abilities (until merit parties anyway). There you learned your job. You don't benefit one bit from grinding here, mentally. All it gives is a headache. So yeah, I don't mind this pl'ing at all.

Seems like Yoshi agrees with me (for now)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

You know, one reason why people get so up in arms over Christianity and people who follow it is because of the popular depiction of Christians as people who get ridiculously involved and concerned with things that don't really effect them.

Off-Topic? Not really. That's exactly what you're doing.

Powerleveling is only a pandemic because people seem to think that everyone HAS to do everything the slowest way possible or suddenly it has no value to anyone. Fun fact, 70% of the current FFXIV players have level 50 jobs. The game has been out for over a year, and a good half of the people playing it have been at it for at least that long. People getting to 40+ in a month isn't something that's going to ruin the game. Especially if they are being powerleveled by a friend who's been playing for super long already -- that actually could help them stick to the game (since they have have people to play with and a reason to log on.)

What does it mean for you when people get power leveled? Not a damn thing. You see, there are few tenets of common-sense MMO'ing that will make it so that you need not be concerned with what everyone else is doing:

1. Don't run with randoms. That's what linkshells are for. Build a trustworthy group of friends ingame and play with them. There are people who will be power leveled in your group, but most of them (if your shell is good at all) will still have invested in learning to do their job properly.

2. Don't be a hypocrit. Don't complain about something you're ultimately going to do yourself. You're complaining because you got power leveled by a friend? Why were you doing it, then? The point of a game is experiencing it however you want to, and if you're going to choose to breeze through the early levels to get to quests and epic battles quicker, that's your choice -- but don't complain about it. Some of us enjoy leveling slowly, some don't.

3. Don't sweat the small stuff. In the grand scheme of things, people being power leveled is a non-issue. Its already been declared that jobs will work on a quest-by-quest basis, and for all we know they may not even use EXP to level up. That said, Classes are likely going to just be introductory components to much more focused, much more intense combative elements of the game. People who power level and have no idea what they are doing aren't going to get very far -- people who learn how to play their class/job (regardless of how they level up) ARE. That's the only balance or fix this problem needs, and its already built into the system.

Look, I can understand the idea of not wanting people to get things you worked hard for easily, but grinding is not a gold medal sport. It never has been and it should never be treated like it should be -- its an unfortunate part of MMO's that is necessary but shouldn't be haphazardly imposed on people. Talk to me about people powerleveling through Ifrit and I'll be right there with you. Talk to me about people getting to level 35+ in less than a month, and I'm going to look at you like you're a crazy.

TL;DR? No one cares. Or at least they shouldn't. Let the people power level if they want to, you do the slow way if you want to (I will be.) At the end of the day, quests, missions, bosses, dungeons, and epic rewards will be won by SKILL not by getting to level 50 quickly. So who gives a frightful f*ck.



So, I want to play with my friend who I've duo'd from 10 to 35+ with, but I want to start a new class and they don't (say they've been at the game longer and already have all of the other classes they want at level 30+) You're telling me I shouldn't be able to just run with them to get up to their level quickly so we can do other, more interesting things than grinding.

Give me a real reason for that. See, I'm very open-minded about the subject, I used to be an ant-power level person.

But I realized something about that mentality -- it has no real foundation.

Its built around the pretense that levels are something you earn... They aren't. Running around in circles for hours bashing monsters in rapid succession requires no skill or no how -- it teaches you nothing and gains you no real benefit. Leveling is the unwanted child of Progress, and if Progress had any choice it would leave him at home rather than taking him everywhere.

But yeah, give me a real reason power leveling is bad outside of:

1. It removes your sense of commitment -- that's personal, and if you feel being PL'd will make you not appreciate the game, you don't have to do it.

2. It will create bad players. Don't run with randoms. There will be slow-level players who suck just as bad.

3. "I don't want to compete with people who leveled up to 50 in a week." Again, personal, and if someone's good enough to compete with you after power leveling to cap as quickly as possible, that's a mark against you, not them.

4. You miss a lot of the game's content. Again, personal.


Frankly, for sake of example, the most fun I had with World of Warcraft was when I started playing via special invitation from a friend and had a +100% boost to EXP. When you can get past the mundane nonsense and start to see more interesting and exciting things, that's when you start to really enjoy MMO's. FFXIV's "freedom" point is in around level 25-30, there's no reason why it should take people months to get there.

Sure limits and rules around who can level with who can easily be imposed -- I just feel they are unnecessary and counter-intuitive to the social focus of the MMO experience. If I convince my girlfriend to play, I want her to be able to run around WITH me and see me take down big baddies and help her get to higher levels so we can do things together. I don't want to have to spontaneously start leveling a class I have no interest in just because there's this misguided belief that people with no friends/allies to help them level faster (or people who, respectfully choose to do things the old fashioned way) should take precedence over the presence of choice.

---

_Insert slow clap .gif here_

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DGMart

Hate to tell you this but grinding on mobs doesn't make you a good or bad player like it did in 11. This game is a easy grindfest and no one cares about that sh*t. Getting high enough to do end game content is what most care about. Why should you care if someone gets PL'd. It doesn't effect you unless they are in your party.

What happens if say your gf/bf wants to get to end game asap without having to go through all the tedious grinding. Why not just PL them especially since the likely hood of them having played your character at some point is high. I guess I don't agree with you the OP.

---

^ This, for real guys.

You really don't learn anything from SP-grinding. Well maybe 320SP x 300 Raptor = 96,000 EXP of boring ! Mobs die in less than 40 seconds. If you have a GLA that actually knows how to tank or a mage that knows how to manage MP when they reach 50, that is a surprise.

For all those people relating this to XI.. SE said they didn't feel Astral Burning was an exploit, so why would this be any different to them? Dood, you could even get temp banned if you messed with an Astral Burn pull that someone else had. But did everyone Astral Burn, nope ! Was it broken as hell, yep !

I have friends that recently came back to XIV (because of this update) and it is exciting that I am able to party with them and help them level up. I came back to XIV probably 3 weeks-ish before the leve-nerf and I feel that was an exploit; this linking mob thing, not-so-much. Purposely failing leves to keep them just because you could get 1200 SP a mob.. yea, come on, lol!

My friend and I actually figured this out by mistake.. He was on his lvl37 PUG trying to get a little extra EXP after his leves up at Treespeak and I was farming Boar hides for a LS mate that needed some extras to synth new gear. We were honestly blown away with how fun the linking system was working and then taught ourselves how to maximize it for higher chains. We had a couple other friends come join us and our Light Party was like umm 37-40s and myself as 50THM...and we had fun farming and grinding EXP. No you read that right! For once grinding and farming was not a masochistic event!

This is exciting for me because now my brother can join XIV with PS3 release and not feel left behind. I can actually really help him level up, not just stand outside passively..Instead I get to actively kill the same mobs that he does! * 'o')b

And the way I see it, there is no scare that gear will become obsolete from lvls 1-49 either because of the new Spiritbond system. It is pretty random which materia you get from each piece of gear. From my experience so far r40+ equipment doesn't always mean you get a IV materia...I honestly see in the future people mass synth'ing gear and then heading into the strongholds all miss-matched and having spiritbond farming hahah

As much work the Devs have done with XIV recently, I think it is safe to say they tested this to the max and it is working as they'd like. Yoshida-san said that he wants people to play with their friends and I really think he has achieved it here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

You know, one reason why people get so up in arms over Christianity and people who follow it is because of the popular depiction of Christians as people who get ridiculously involved and concerned with things that don't really effect them.

Off-Topic? Not really. That's exactly what you're doing.

---

Now let the first thing I say be that your well-thought post is appreciated. It's refreshing to see something more than the usual mundane bullsh** that people post.

Aside from that, I will argue your points. Quoted above because this is something that does affect me. I play MMOs for a sense of accomplishment, that's my fun in the game. And a quick note, I just rerolled on a new server less than a week ago. Now, I cannot speak for everyone, but I would imagine most feel the same. I got level X, woohoo, person B just got 20 levels in the same time it took me to get this one level because I like that sense of accomplishment. Whelp, they just stole it away from me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

Powerleveling is only a pandemic because people seem to think that everyone HAS to do everything the slowest way possible or suddenly it has no value to anyone. Fun fact, 70% of the current FFXIV players have level 50 jobs. The game has been out for over a year, and a good half of the people playing it have been at it for at least that long. People getting to 40+ in a month isn't something that's going to ruin the game. Especially if they are being powerleveled by a friend who's been playing for super long already -- that actually could help them stick to the game (since they have have people to play with and a reason to log on.)

---

No, you don't have to do it in the slowest way possible. But you also shouldn't be able to breeze through 35 levels in less than a day. I mean, not to sound offensive, but you really see no problem with this? This isn't a single-player game. This isn't a action platformer. It's an MMO, and a game that makes it that effin' easy is a game I will not play.

Thus is why I made this thread in dear hopes that it will not remain this way. Big fan of the Final Fantasy series, especially XI, and the above point really destroys the game for me, and I would think most others who invest their time in this game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

What does it mean for you when people get power leveled? Not a damn thing. You see, there are few tenets of common-sense MMO'ing that will make it so that you need not be concerned with what everyone else is doing:

1. Don't run with randoms. That's what linkshells are for. Build a trustworthy group of friends ingame and play with them. There are people who will be power leveled in your group, but most of them (if your shell is good at all) will still have invested in learning to do their job properly.

---

Half the fun of party play is meeting new people and working with them. Random pickups are fun and I look forward to that coming back. Party with your LS all the time and things stagnate. Variety is important.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

2. Don't be a hypocrit. Don't complain about something you're ultimately going to do yourself. You're complaining because you got power leveled by a friend? Why were you doing it, then? The point of a game is experiencing it however you want to, and if you're going to choose to breeze through the early levels to get to quests and epic battles quicker, that's your choice -- but don't complain about it. Some of us enjoy leveling slowly, some don't.

---

You obviously didn't read my next post. Or was it the third? Doesn't matter. Someone else had already said this, and I already responded. For your benefit, I'll say it again. Don't assume I'm a hypocrite.

An LSmate and I simply tested it because we noticed ridiculous XP gains without even trying. So we put it to the test and tried to see just how ridiculous powerleveling was. Do I plan on doing this regularly? No. Do I plan to be complacent with it? Hell no. I mean, come on, chains when a member in your party is 25-30 levels above the mob? This is silly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

3. Don't sweat the small stuff. In the grand scheme of things, people being power leveled is a non-issue. Its already been declared that jobs will work on a quest-by-quest basis, and for all we know they may not even use EXP to level up. That said, Classes are likely going to just be introductory components to much more focused, much more intense combative elements of the game. People who power level and have no idea what they are doing aren't going to get very far -- people who learn how to play their class/job (regardless of how they level up) ARE. That's the only balance or fix this problem needs, and its already built into the system.

---

This issue being "small" is your opinion, and it seems to be a strong one. However, mine is just as strong. It should, at the very least, take a week to get to 35 if you're playing at least 4-6 hours a day. And that is being generous compared to most MMOs in the past. But in a couple hours, let alone days? How is this a small issue? Is this seriously where MMOs are going to evolve?

If so, I hope a company keeps true to the genre. And I hope that company is SquareEnix. If it's not SE, my money will go elsewhere when the time comes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

Look, I can understand the idea of not wanting people to get things you worked hard for easily, but grinding is not a gold medal sport. It never has been and it should never be treated like it should be -- its an unfortunate part of MMO's that is necessary but shouldn't be haphazardly imposed on people. Talk to me about people powerleveling through Ifrit and I'll be right there with you. Talk to me about people getting to level 35+ in less than a month, and I'm going to look at you like you're a crazy.

---

Trust me, to 90% of the players it is certainly not a "gold medal" sport. To those whom it was, they were generally egotistic and disliked. It's not about the "gold medal," it's about the fun you have along the way and the sense of accomplishment you feel.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

TL;DR? No one cares. Or at least they shouldn't. Let the people power level if they want to, you do the slow way if you want to (I will be.) At the end of the day, quests, missions, bosses, dungeons, and epic rewards will be won by SKILL not by getting to level 50 quickly. So who gives a frightful f*ck.

---

As I have said, I am fairly confident the majority does care. But I could be wrong, and if I am, I have outgrown the genre because if that were the case, the majority would want something for nothing and those are not the kind of people I want to spend time with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

So, I want to play with my friend who I've duo'd from 10 to 35+ with, but I want to start a new class and they don't (say they've been at the game longer and already have all of the other classes they want at level 30+) You're telling me I shouldn't be able to just run with them to get up to their level quickly so we can do other, more interesting things than grinding.

Give me a real reason for that. See, I'm very open-minded about the subject, I used to be an ant-power level person.

---

In this hypothetical situation, if your friend didn't want to level up with you with a level 1 class or simply he didn't have one to switch to, you do it with another person or just solo, whichever you please. No, you should not be able to get to his level within a couple hours. It goes against what MMOs, in essence, are.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

But I realized something about that mentality -- it has no real foundation.

Its built around the pretense that levels are something you earn... They aren't. Running around in circles for hours bashing monsters in rapid succession requires no skill or no how -- it teaches you nothing and gains you no real benefit. Leveling is the unwanted child of Progress, and if Progress had any choice it would leave him at home rather than taking him everywhere.

---

That really depends on how you go about grinding. Sure, you could run in circles bashing low-rank enemies, or how we were doing it pre-1.19. But guess what? Things have changed a bit, right?

You can test your skill with friends on higher rank mobs where it takes some strategy to grind with higher rewards. And, once you have figured it out, you can teach it to random pickups when your friends aren't around.

Or yeah, you could run in circles and kill low-rank mobs. If you were to do that, I would understand your point. But it's no longer mandatory.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

But yeah, give me a real reason power leveling is bad outside of:

1. It removes your sense of commitment -- that's personal, and if you feel being PL'd will make you not appreciate the game, you don't have to do it.

---

I already explained the fallacy of this above.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

2. It will create bad players. Don't run with randoms. There will be slow-level players who suck just as bad.

---

Again, touched on this, but I will respond further.

Don't run with randoms? Yes, let's just isolate ourselves from people outside our linkshell. Because everyone outside our linkshell must suck and aren't worth partying with because they're not in our shell. Yes, let's have that tunnel-vision. Great idea.

If someone is powerleveled and doesn't bother to learn his job, he will require a crash-course that could be devastating in a high-difficulty strategy-required endgame event. Sure the player may do just fine, but this isn't always the case. When you learn to use each skill as it comes because you take time in leveling, you know when to use it and its pros/cons in a given situation.

Slow-leveling players sucking, as in your example, probably have failed time and time again and generally shouldn't be playing. Either that or they have a mental disability that most are reasonable enough to understand and work with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

3. "I don't want to compete with people who leveled up to 50 in a week." Again, personal, and if someone's good enough to compete with you after power leveling to cap as quickly as possible, that's a mark against you, not them.

4. You miss a lot of the game's content. Again, personal.

---

3. The issue in question is being able to skip the entire game, not the whole "competition" point you're making. I don't know about anyone else, but once upon a time it was considered a game-breaking issue to be able to do that. What was the point of devs even tossing in content in-between?

Hey, I have an idea. Let's just make a new MMO in which it takes a day to cap and there's no content other than endgame and pvp. Oh wait, that exists. Which game was that again? Oh yeah, go play that if that's the kind of gameplay that gets you going.

4. See above. Content is something important, believe it or not. People tend to complain when there's none of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

Frankly, for sake of example, the most fun I had with World of Warcraft was when I started playing via special invitation from a friend and had a +100% boost to EXP. When you can get past the mundane nonsense and start to see more interesting and exciting things, that's when you start to really enjoy MMO's. FFXIV's "freedom" point is in around level 25-30, there's no reason why it should take people months to get there.

---

100% boost? Okay, that's fine! Well, as long as it wears off after a certain level. XI did something similar, remember those signet rings?

But I can't even put a percentage of extra EXP on this because the receiving end isn't even trying as someone AoE's a group of 20 mobs and the guy gets 1-15 just like that. An exaggeration, I haven't tested if that's possible yet, but do you see where I'm going with this? It's too much.

Powerleveling is part of MMOs, but it should never blatantly break a game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ViolentDjango

Sure limits and rules around who can level with who can easily be imposed -- I just feel they are unnecessary and counter-intuitive to the social focus of the MMO experience. If I convince my girlfriend to play, I want her to be able to run around WITH me and see me take down big baddies and help her get to higher levels so we can do things together. I don't want to have to spontaneously start leveling a class I have no interest in just because there's this misguided belief that people with no friends/allies to help them level faster (or people who, respectfully choose to do things the old fashioned way) should take precedence over the presence of choice.

---

I touched on this above as well. But in addition, you should seriously consider picking up another job when you have the opportunity and time to do so with your girlfriend. The game would get boring if you played the same role every time. Use it as an excuse to experience something new.

The job system has been a hallmark of Final Fantasy since the first title way back on Nintendo.

Anyway, I hope I didn't offend. However as I said, my opinion is just as strong as yours in this matter. Also, I don't harp on Christians, at least not to their faces. To each their own. However, this is a game that's democratic to a degree right now. If it were the same in a real-life situation where Christian decisions were making a huge negative impact on my life, you best bet I would try to change it.

Bad move SE..
Again.. what was the point of having gear from 1-50 if you can level up to 50 in no time?
This is screwing the economy and any sense of purpose for lower end gear, materia on lower end gear, dungeons, and pretty much any content below 50.
May as well remove leveling all together and give everyone max rank to start with.

No sense of progression whatsoever.

Isaac, how exactly does powerleveling affect you in any way?

Like Django said, if people powerleveling gets you THAT antsy, then don't roll with randoms. "But we shouldn't segregate ourselves from other players." No we shouldn't, but if you want a sure fire way to make sure you NEVER deal with people who are apparently ruining your game experience, then stick with a trustworthy group of people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malakhim

Isaac, how exactly does powerleveling affect you in any way?

Like Django said, if people powerleveling gets you THAT antsy, then don't roll with randoms. "But we shouldn't segregate ourselves from other players." No we shouldn't, but if you want a sure fire way to make sure you NEVER deal with people who are apparently ruining your game experience, then stick with a trustworthy group of people.

---

So when no one has a job under level 40 except for the new players trickling in (Who then find linkshells and get powerleveled anyway) and I want to party with a level 20, I have to shout for hours or poke my LS for hours waiting to get a party started?

I'm sorry, but for something this blatantly ridiculous, I will not say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." If this doesn't change, I'm going to a MMO that makes sense. But you know what? I probably won't need to because this will probably be fixed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

So when no one has a job under level 40 except for the new players trickling in (Who then find linkshells and get powerleveled anyway) and I want to party with a level 20, I have to shout for hours or poke my LS for hours waiting to get a party started?

I'm sorry, but for something this blatantly ridiculous, I will not say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." If this doesn't change, I'm going to a MMO that makes sense. But you know what? I probably won't need to because this will probably be fixed.

---

...But it's a surefire way to NEVER have to deal with someone who has powerleveled, or has been powerleveled, which are apparently the scourge of all humanity. You also didn't answer the question.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malakhim

...But it's a surefire way to NEVER have to deal with someone who has powerleveled, or has been powerleveled, which are apparently the scourge of all humanity. You also didn't answer the question.

---

Read my entire post from the last page. I already answered that question and will not repeat myself. If you need clarifications, ask.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

Read my entire post from the last page. I already answered that question and will not repeat myself. If you need clarifications, ask.

---

I'm pretty sure you didn't, because none of those reasons you gave effect *your* game experience in any way whatsoever. Just because someone leveled up faster than you doesn't take away the fun or the challenge you had/felt while doing it yourself... Unless you didn't have fun, in which there ain't much I can say other than you might need to look into another game.

You can power level on other MMO's, it makes no difference there, don't understand why everyone has their panties in a twist over it in this game when it makes little to no difference other than the said person might not understand their class properly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malakhim

I'm pretty sure you didn't, because none of those reasons you gave effect *your* game experience in any way whatsoever. Just because someone leveled up faster than you doesn't take away the fun or the challenge you had/felt while doing it yourself... Unless you didn't have fun, in which there ain't much I can say other than you might need to look into another game.

---

The entire post outlines how it affects my gameplay. They are all facets and consequences of it. Read between the lines.

So instead of asking for clarification you challenge my intelligence. Bravo. Line of conversation ended.

All I can say about this is.. get on the train while you can. SE is not dumb at all. let me clear this to you as of right now they are just trying to keep us busy and giving us Candy eye per say .They will fix this eventually and they know It wont matter to much if someone has all the DoW/M at 50 since the new jobs are coming and you will have to start to leveling again at least that is my point of view. Once they release the new jobs they will also fix the crazy amount of exp you can get by PWL .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

So when no one has a job under level 40 except for the new players trickling in (Who then find linkshells and get powerleveled anyway) and I want to party with a level 20, I have to shout for hours or poke my LS for hours waiting to get a party started?

---

"points at leves, company leves, behest, normal soloing..."

In B4 screenshot or it never happenned.

Good luck getting them to change this. I'm sure they had NO IDEA that this would be the result. Honestly, they know what they're doing. It's still a grind to get to 50. This thread is meritless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zoltan

In B4 screenshot or it never happenned.

Good luck getting them to change this. I'm sure they had NO IDEA that this would be the result. Honestly, they know what they're doing. It's still a grind to get to 50. This thread is meritless.

---

When my friend logs in I'll fraps and youtube a video for you from level 1.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

The entire post outlines how it affects my gameplay. They are all facets and consequences of it. Read between the lines.

So instead of asking for clarification you challenge my intelligence. Bravo. Line of conversation ended.

---

Alright I'll bite: What I'm getting from reading between the lines is that while the mobs are the same difficulty, have the same abilities, are in the same places, and every other element in the game is entirely the same, the only difference is is that people are having their own fun in a different way, and you will not stand for that.

Could you offer some clarification, or are you going to bail out again?

Powerleveling is in all MMOs. In WoW, you can get from lvl 1 - 85 within a week. Heirlooms that gives +10% exp each, Guild perks another 10-20%more exp and ofc the Recruit a Friend with 30% exp I think it was.

I spent 2 hours with my friends grinding Ixali camps all around last night and I had a lot of fun tbh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malakhim

Alright I'll bite: What I'm getting from reading between the lines is that while the mobs are the same difficulty, have the same abilities, are in the same places, and every other element in the game is entirely the same, the only difference is is that people are having their own fun in a different way, and you will not stand for that.

Could you offer some clarification, or are you going to bail out again?

---

Man, all I can say is if that's your idea of fun, and in the doubtful scenario that the majority agrees, then this game won't be for me. I said it before, I'll take my money elsewhere when the time comes, if this remains.

Because if it remained as such, there wouldn't be a point to even having levels. It would be an entirely new genre of game. And this new genre wouldn't be one I enjoy. If FFXIV becomes this in the end, I'll find myself a "classic style MMO" because I'm too old for the new generation that doesn't want to work for their progression in a MMO.

I don't want to play an action-style game where time spend on leveling doesn't matter and gear/player skill determines all. Sure, that's fine for endgame, but endgame comes at the- Oh, wait for it- END. Do I need to define "end?" Endgame, as in, the options available to you after reaching the END of what you were progressing for.

But no, these concepts must be becoming too antiquated for the new generation to accept. I'm too old school. Maybe this will not be the MMO for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jericho

But, judging by the usual responses I get from saying this kind of thing, I'm sure I'm the only one that feels this way.

---

You are not.

I for one has a friend that just started i cant wait to plvl him so i can enjoy content with somone i know. Plus alot of my LS have been trying desperatly to catch up to me (even tho im only lvl 38) and the rest of my ls so we can enjoy content together, there are so many different classes to level so i dont think its a big deal. You should rejoice that you are able to level faster.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gasher

You are not.

---

All I can say is that I hope that it is either fixed very soon, or, just a temporary measure.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

Man, all I can say is if that's your idea of fun, and in the doubtful scenario that the majority agrees, then this game won't be for me. I said it before, I'll take my money elsewhere when the time comes, if this remains.

Because if it remained as such, there wouldn't be a point to even having levels. It would be an entirely new genre of game. And this new genre wouldn't be one I enjoy. If FFXIV becomes this in the end, I'll find myself a "classic style MMO" because I'm too old for the new generation that doesn't want to work for their progression in a MMO.

I don't want to play an action-style game where time spend on leveling doesn't matter and gear/player skill determines all. Sure, that's fine for endgame, but endgame comes at the- Oh, wait for it- END. Do I need to define "end?" Endgame, as in, the options available to you after reaching the END of what you were progressing for.

But no, these concepts must be becoming too antiquated for the new generation to accept. I'm too old school. Maybe this will not be the MMO for me.

---

umadbrah? z

You want to WORK to have FUN.

Just keep reading that sentence over and over again.

Rage more please

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Issac

That's a good point, but I wouldn't call it a "crutch." It's more of a glaring design flaw that will wreck the balance in the game.

---

Taking this a little too seriously? If you have friends and been playing for a while, you have an advantage. But to anyone coming in new. I am sure they are not going to have access to a power leveler right away. Also, isn't leveling just the learning curve for the true experience? Don't need to grind all day to learn your class.

You know almost every MMO most people can max a class in a week if they are on everyday? Same concept with FFXIV. I could get a WoW toon up to 35 in one night if I wanted to, and that isn't saying I have skill, anyone with time and experience can pull that off.

You basically want the FFXI experience, but don't forget, this is FFXIV.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chain

Rage more please

---

lolinorite?

Doh, lost a majority of my reply from clicking on Reply instead of Post Quick Reply.

tldr: If SE wants to keep levels in the game, then the power-leveling mechanism should be reassessed and balanced (in this case, party level gap and its benefits). Like Punishing Barbs or a cheap AoE Cure before, we benefit, but I still think it needs balancing and will offer the suggestion as I have before on other topics.

long version:
@Violent_Django. I'm surprised to see so much posted from a small snippet. But I feel an unusual craving to respond with a post of similar length. Normally I would leave out real world examples, because that brings an entire new playing field into this discussion that can easily be dismissed under "but this is a game". And I can't convince what's real to me to be real to you. But read on if you were interested in what I had to say.

Here's my thoughts on it. You and your friend were leveling. There's content you want to see at the high levels. But you regret a choice you made earlier, the class choice, regret enough that you want to experience the unseen content with a different class. You're starting over, not him, because you've already seen the content, not interested in going through the same/similar grind over again. You want the same stretch of game to go by faster. It's personal that you don't want to do it again or that you started over. It makes sense (to me) and I agree that it could go faster.

But I don't expect friend to wait for me to catch up anymore or to hold him from experiencing the content himself, because it was my choice to start over. And I don't expect him to power-level me so that we're up to speed again. His choice to help me out every time I change my mind and likewise.

Real world example against: You start your major, you've invested four years, you decide that's not how you wanted to go out into the world. You change your major. Some things may transfer over credit wise to make some of that journey less painful (in FFXIV sense, cross class abilities, equipment you may be able to reuse). Anything that doesn't transfer, you start over on.

Real world example for: You start your career, you work your way from retail consultant to a managerial position of industry X. You shift flag ships to industry Y, but remain a managerial position with similar or improved benefits. You don't start over in some areas and you learn what you need to learn on the job, not from your education.

And that leads me to supporting your point on being able to adapt to a high level class after being power leveled. The grind is like college. What you do in an in-game party is like real world on-the-job training. And on-the-job training (to me) is more important than the college education that may not be as relevant to your future income. It's like a college class for Business Management, learning from a professor who has studied the topic (and could be a retired CEO who felt the need to teach) versus being the new hire apprenticed to the high rollers actually developing and managing a successful business.

You might learn things in college that you otherwise would never learn. But is that grind helping you apply it in the real world you ask? Some of us figure it out. Others don't. I support your point on that as it relates to in-game.

Trying to get back to topic with my example: But back to the power-leveling concern at hand. Did I benefit from it? Yes, yes I did. A party of level 27~30 taking on level 29~33 enemies in groups was very good. And while exploring, we wanted to see what was on the other side of a group of level 38 enemies. What did we do? Whooped out a level 50, cleared the enemies, and before discovering the other side, learned the XP was delicious. Too delicious. Do I want to see what the level 50s are seeing content-wise and wear that sexy shiny new Cobalt Cuirass? Heck yes. Do I think this promotes balanced gameplay, groups, and community? No. I don't.

Real world, hypothetical until a case can be pinpointed: If people develop a cure for a specific-type of cancer, the general hope might be that it gets used on the everyday person. And the secret hope (or it could be me) that the tyrant (orders the death of children, profits from the suffering of others, etc) that gets this cancer, is not going to benefit from the cure. I don't personally like the idea he gets to benefit from the cancer cure, live longer, get a chance he'll keep being a tyrant. But it's the way the world works, I don't* like it, but it's there. And if I or someone I care about gets that cancer (and aren't planning suicide), you bet I'm gonna try to take advantage of it.

Back to game: I think even the power leveling is broken and could be alleviated with an XP penalty when level differences are strong. When the r45+ is in the group, nerf the XP gains the r25~30s are getting.

It's like Punishing Barbs, thought it was suspiciously good at launch. Reflected the full amount of damage you received, even if you mitigate the damage with Aegis Boon, etc. No SP for it back then, but you killed what was attacking you, chance to get whatever it dropped or the pleasure of seeing it die. My thoughts on it? Cap the damage that it could return, make it trigger based on the damage you actually take, etc. It needed be balanced.

Or casting Cure on a group, suffering no potency loss on multiple targets, for the same MP cost as a single target cure. I think that's broken and could be fixed. I may like an inexpensive, party Cure. And I definitely could take the beating, but I could out heal it and with Stygian Spikes to keep MP up while party members smack the creature. I don't think that's balanced.

I've lost my train of thought in between work here and forgot where I was going with this. Hitting post so I don't lose this and will edit or post a response as desired.

edit: don't like the tyrant living, he should be defeated and looted

Are you people arguing that this shouldn't be fixed completely crazy?

There isn't even 10% of the end game content they'd need to satisfy advancement as rapid as this. Even if you argue leveling should be easy or nonexistent and the game should focus on content for high levels, that content needs to exist before people get there and right now it doesn't. How can anyone be in favor of this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Travesty

Are you people arguing that this shouldn't be fixed completely crazy?

There isn't even 10% of the end game content they'd need to satisfy advancement as rapid as this. Even if you argue leveling should be easy or nonexistent and the game should focus on content for high levels, that content needs to exist before people get there and right now it doesn't. How can anyone be in favor of this?

---

Ifrit seems to be a gear check fight, with materia being new and new armor recipes it should take some time to enhance yourself to actually complete this content. You also have to wait untill your group enhances themeselves with new gear and materia as well. And even if we can lvl multiple classes quickly (i have a feeling it will still take some time even with plvling) there is still the process of enhancing each class with gear and materia. So overall the grind is still there. There is also the process of learning and waiting for everyone else to learn content. Leveling shouldent be the biggest growing process, preparing for end game and completing end game should. Besides we are getting more primals soon

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mindx3

Ifrit seems to be a gear check fight, with materia being new and new armor recipes it should take some time to enhance yourself to actually complete this content. You also have to wait untill your group enhances themeselves with new gear and materia as well. And even if we can lvl multiple classes quickly (i have a feeling it will still take some time even with plvling) there is still the process of enhancing each class with gear and materia. So overall the grind is still there. There is also the process of learning and waiting for everyone else to learn content. Leveling shouldent be the biggest growing process, preparing for end game and completing end game should. Besides we are getting more primals soon

---

Someone earlier posted they went from 35-44 in 2 hours. By exp, that's 30% of the total grind. I don't care what the learning curve is, there is nowhere near enough content for level 50 players to support that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Travesty

Someone earlier posted they went from 35-44 in 2 hours. By exp, that's 30% of the total grind. I don't care what the learning curve is, there is nowhere near enough content for level 50 players to support that.

---

Really? Thats awesome hopefully i can get plvld to 45 (im 38)And kill off the last 5 lvls so i can fight hard mode ifrit with my ls, if that can happen by the end of the week then im super excited. I still have all my other classes to level, gear up and add materia to. Thats a ton of content right there. Theres also the quests i need to complete and crafting/ gathering to do. I really dont think i can acomplish all that by the time new primals come out, as i do have a life >.>

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MrLion

Sure...good luck getting insane amounts of EXP on your higher levels...

---

I went from 44-48 LNC in a few hours yday. Woulda got 50 if not other ppl hitting 50 and disbanding pt.

Has anyone noticed that a topic called "its almost impossible to level a new character" and one thats called "Power leveling is broken" coexist in the most popular topics at the same time?

whenever a good thing happens theres someone that has to take it down ><, massochist