loved that article i actually do that to get hooked in some stories but i don't do that in all.Quote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
I think this would be the most common reaction for new people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dhex
The big spoiler in the Heavensward opening/trailer was a huge mistake. (spoilers obv)
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04-12-2015, 10:43 AMWaffilicious
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04-12-2015, 10:50 AMKatzyn
I don't understand why there wouldn't be spoilers in an opening movie sequence of a game expansion...I would think that if you're at the point of an opening sequence to a new storyline, you'd have finished the previous storyline...
When I first started this game...I didn't know what in the hell was going on in the opening sequence lol. There was fighting, and some old guy dying, and I had no idea what any of that was depicting until MUCH later...and that didn't bother me in the slightest. If I was new to the game NOW and saw the opening sequence for the expansion today, I'd probably think, "holy crap this game looks like it has an amazing story..."
That's just me, though. -
04-12-2015, 10:56 AMJafnharr
I think the spoiler tag in the CG is mainly for players who currently playing the game and yet to finish MSQ.
But since OP complains about how this would affect potential new players, then let me put this to you. For someone who's new to the universe and have no idea who any of the characters is, this can be viewed as something else than a spoiler. There are plenty of TV series and movies out there that give you an event that happened at the end of the season in the very 1st episode/few mins, then retrace the whole event throughout the season. And quite frankly, I am sure a lot of current players will tell you they see this coming for Nanamo a few patches ago, so spoiler or not, most ppl have already expected this (but still shocked after actually seeing the scene played out).
So as a new player, after seeing that trailer and starts playing 2.0, I would want to find out who kill her and keep me interested all along, especially during any U'dah questline. Or even, given how it is common in storytelling these days, she could have been alive but I was only shown she lying on the floor. So watching that CG could do a lot of things to attract new players. And if I have yet to play FFXIV and am interested in the game but don't want any spoiler, after seeing the spoiler warning, I'll probably stop and look around to see if there's any spoiler free trailer. -
04-12-2015, 11:19 AMLlenCoram*tips fedora*Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
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04-12-2015, 11:24 AMTiggyI like the cut of your jib. :PQuote:
Originally Posted by LlenCoram
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04-12-2015, 11:27 AMAlberel
OP whilst I understand your premise your argument is found somewhat lacking when countless precedents already exist throughout the gaming industry for exactly what you are lamenting.
The Warlords of Draenor cinematic trailer shows Garrosh Hellscream rallying the Iron Horde to lead against Azeroth despite him being an ally until the end of the previous expansion story. This spoils the fact that he betrays the horde for any prospective new players.
The Rise of the Tomb Raider trailer shows Lara dealing with post-traumatic stress disorder as a result of her encountering undead at the end of the previous game. This spoils the big supernatural twist at the end of Tomb Raider.
The Deus Ex: Mankind Divided trailer has several scenes showing the aftermath of the previous game, again spoiling things for newcomers to the franchise.
Chances are any trailer for a sequel (and Heavensward is essentially a sequel to the story of A Realm Reborn) to a story-driven game series will feature some amount of spoilers simply by virtue of the prior events giving the context for the new story. As someone else in this thread already pointed out, the very fact we're even going to Ishgard is technically a spoiler since the entire 2.0 story arc has involved Ishgard as an isolationist state. There's very little at all they could show in a trailer for Heavensward without spoiling something for new players. -
04-12-2015, 11:46 AMmp-please
Surprised people are complaining about this and not on flames of truth, after all t12 is actually hard to clear compared to breezing through MSQ. And tbh sultana death flag was up since 2.2 ish.
Why not show them the gameplay, features, overworld to get them interested instead? Story is fine but c'mon, your friends want to play with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
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04-12-2015, 11:47 AMTwivana
One thing that has REALLY erked me bad about all ya'lls posts is calling it a TRAILER its NOT a TRAILER it is the opening MOVIE CINEMATIC FOR HEAVENSWARD! You know when you start up the game and you don't click start right a way and it plays the opening cinematic/movie? THATS WHAT THIS IS!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRDT0sCpnUA
You want the TRAILER?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68CNzwinqlg
I might have broken the links heh -
04-12-2015, 12:10 PMNoxiferMmmyeah. One problem though. The first time you start the game. The very first time. You can't skip the intro video. Trust me. Just installed the game on my new laptop not two days ago. Hit "Start game", the intro starts playing. Right-click doesn't interrupt it, Escape doesn't interrupt it, Enter doesn't interrupt it. I think I tried pretty much all the keys except for alt+F4 or Ctrl+Alt+Del. Why was I so desperate to skip it? Mainly because it slapped me in the face with a reminder that I'd forgotten to switch to Japanese audio. ^^; And because it's long and annoying and I've already seen it several times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildsprite
Common sense actually kinda says that it would o.o If I install any other game + expansions, the latest installed expansion's logo and intro/loading screen is what will take precedence. And if you buy both ARR and Heavensward, why wouldn't you install Heavensward while you're already installing stuff anyway?Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
And I agree with the 'it would be stupid' part ^^; While there is a certain point to the whole argument that a new player wouldn't know what the intro/trailer is about until 10% into the story.... by the time you get to that point, I doubt you'd have forgotten that scene from the intro/trailer, not with the emotional impact that flashback is supposed to have -- even if you don't know her, it's fairly obvious that it's something important that happened, whether that little lady happens to be axe dude's daughter, girlfriend, liege lady or friend.
I also disagree that "this is the same as the 2.0 trailer/intro showing off the end of 1.0". By the time we could play 2.0, 1.0 was gone. You couldn't play through that story even if you wanted to. But for this, 2.0 isn't gone. It's a required part to get to 3.0.
The Ishgardian scenery isn't as much of a spoiler though, since afaik expansions always include new areas added to the game. Meaning it's no big surprise that you'll get to areas you couldn't get to before.
Personally, I don't mind the scenes being there. But that doesn't mean I can't see why someone would mind. -
04-12-2015, 12:48 PMClarkamite
Maybe I needed to read that article further but I'm not sure how that even made sense. How can you study that the way it was studied?
"Data from here suggests this person A liked this book more than this person B and person A had it spoiled for them." I feel like that's reaching a bit too far. What if that story more fit person A's preferences with story? Of course they're going to enjoy it more than person B. I'm not sure, the data feels really circumstantial.
The only way I can see that working is if you could make each test subject read a story, gauge their reaction, erase their memory and then have them read it again only this time with spoilers and see if their reaction is different. -
04-12-2015, 12:57 PMWaffilicious
its a group of people reading the story and that graph is an overall score
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04-12-2015, 01:12 PMKaedrianLiang
Spoilers or not i burst into tears and screamed "noo" when Nanamo took a sip. ;-;
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04-12-2015, 01:17 PMWaffilicious
its like ff7 crisis core, you know its gonna happen but when it happens you still feel it so hard.
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04-12-2015, 01:30 PMAeyisTheres posts about that earlier in the thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by Twivana
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04-12-2015, 01:44 PMdragonflieNot really, in my opinion, any new players that comes in will be like 'Oh there's drama! That looks fun!' then when they play the game, they might forget who those npcs are and not remember the trailer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
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04-12-2015, 01:49 PMOMEGA_HACK
I showed the "trailer" to someone I know, who has never touched this game, they didn't think it as spoilery information in fact the opposite, they got really hyped. They did ask who the lady in the pink dress was and if she was important though; and I just said you would have to play the game to find out. You have to remember that the spoil isn't always in the climax sometimes people are more interested in [/i]how[/i] that climax led up to be so.
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04-12-2015, 02:24 PMIlenyaThis tends to be my reactions to spoilers these days. I'd still rather not have them, but they tend to make me more curious than upset. I want to know how these things happened!Quote:
Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK
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04-12-2015, 03:13 PMVeqluna
It warn you about the spoiler and you accept to watch it and you come here and complain about it?
I mean if you see the warning and then didn't watch it and come here and complian about it first I might agree with you abit :) -
04-12-2015, 03:35 PMNikitaOh no I might get spoiled ITS A DISASTER!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOQuote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
http://i.imgur.com/wk0DU7P.jpg
Sorry, came into this thread late, but it was definitely my FFXIV general discussion lol for the day. -
04-12-2015, 04:20 PMTheRogueXShow them the other amazing trailers for the game, including the old Heavensward trailer that *didn't* have spoilers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
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04-12-2015, 05:52 PMRumpelstiltzkin
People say we can't have the new jobs without completing the main storyline to 2.55 because we would be spoiled. Then the trailer is a big spoiler in itself (I have not seen it, but I will take your word for it). I'll bet you there will be a lot more people being spoiled by the trailer, which only purpose is to get people to play, but apparently that is fine. Compared to giving people who want a chance to play the job they want early in the storyline, which actually effects the gameplay experience hugely. That however is a big nono. Funny how that works.
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04-12-2015, 07:55 PMRaelettaAmazing. Exactly my thoughts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dhex
Again, I'll join the people stating: It's only going to ruin it for people who play at the moment and have yet to finish. -
04-12-2015, 08:06 PMkyuvenI don't think I've ever seen someone say that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumpelstiltzkin
The real reason is that all 3 job quests start in ishgard. There's no spoilers involved in the 3 jobs, they're just gated content so they don't have to pull an excuse out of their ass as to why there are suddenly machinists, astrologians, and dark knights running around in the three main cities, especially since
We're technically fugitives.
Since there's been literally no reference to any of these professions before now (no, there has not been a reference to the playable Astrologians. The dev team explained that the ones diddling around in Coerthas are different from the ones we'll get, even using different kanji in Japanese), it makes sense that they appear in the closed off Ishgard. -
04-12-2015, 08:22 PMZanheI think they mean something different by that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumpelstiltzkin
Spoiled = A child getting anything they want and not being appreciative of it.
Spoiler = A published piece of information that divulges a surprise, such as a plot twist in a movie. -
04-12-2015, 08:49 PMSpookyGhostJust want to point out, the Dragoon questgiver is in Coerthas and there are Astrologians at the Observatorium, whether they're the same ones as the job or not or not (they literally wear sugarloaf hats and study the stars, it's the same thing just this one has an star globe and can heal things or whatever). Curious Gorge, who teaches the Warrior arts, is from the mountains and swings his axe under a waterfall in Costa Del Sol farrrr away from his homeland. I don't know why the jobs are in Ishgard (if they are), but it's not simply because they're native practices and can't be shoved elsewhere. I guess it could just be that they want you to finish the story and play their new content, but that's just a guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by kyuven
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04-12-2015, 10:16 PMEcks007I suggest you show your non-playing friends the 2.0 official trailer instead of the Heavensward trailer, because that's still going to be what they play through first if they decide to try the game out at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Takfloyd
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39j5v8jlndM -
04-12-2015, 10:27 PMTheonekitten
I wish there had been a disclaimer for the OP so I could have stopped right there....
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04-12-2015, 10:38 PMPeachy
Why are there always players that expect content catered to their exact needs and wants? Any logical thinking adult can stop the video at the spoiler warning if they are that concerned about spoilers. That video was meant to be showed to current players. There are a lot of amazing trailers and videos to get your friends interested, why does it have to be THAT one?
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04-12-2015, 10:43 PMtjwThose are Astrologists. While they essentially share the same ideal, Astrologians and Astrologists are very different professions; the first is the combat specialist, designed to aid in battle and restore vigor. The second is an occupation, something chosen either of interest or a necessity to earn money for their wife and ten children. After all, you can't say Arcanists and mathematicians/book-keepers in the reception are the same, can you? But they use the same geometric glyphs to work their magicks.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpookyGhost
And before you hassle me about Arcanists and book-keepers being in the same guild, I would like to point out that the JOBS (Summoner and Scholar) are in a totally different zone. In fact, only four Jobs have their quest giver in the same CITY of their Class Guild; BLM, MNK, SCH, PLD. Only PLD is in the same zone as GLA, and that's stretching it considering you need to climb a level in Ul'dah to reach the NPC. SMN is also the oddity that it is not in the region of it's base Class. But keep in mind what I say below...
You also make a good point. Curious Gorge is from the mountains, and comes to US. The three new jobs are different. We are going to Ishgard. Think about Ishgard. Up until 2.55, their secrecy is more secure than a nun's virginity. In no manner of way are they going to let their arts of combat slip out the front doors for the rest of Eorzea to drink on. Dragoon was different because the then-only Azure Dragoon essentially rebelled and escaped outside, causing a need for an outsider to help out. If you're trying to tell me that all three jobs should have someone 'rebel' against their teachings and come out into Eorzea to teach the ways, you have worse story-telling than Stephanie Meyers. -
04-12-2015, 10:57 PMMakado
Its the trailer for the actual expansion not the preview trailer that was released awhile ago. It also says "there are main story spoilers". So I guess if you can't read (how can you play the game then?) Something might be spoiled if your arent using your head and watch it anyways I guess. Otherwise just don't watch it and find the other one. Use some common sense.
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04-12-2015, 10:57 PMshape
Wait there are people who have not finished the main story, lol thats their own fault for being lazy.
As mentioned big massive disclaimer saying it has/contains main story spoilers, you only have yourself to blame for 1 watching it and 2 not doing the main story(lazy)
As someone pointed out the trailer actually does not show any spoilers. The version the OP is going on about is a full movie/trailer, so of course there was going to be spoilers.
You try making a movie trailer of decent length without showing any spoilers, its gonna be one crappy trailer. -
04-12-2015, 10:58 PMLillia
Hi there everyone, I wanted to say that first before I state my opinion here.
I want to say.. that as a current player, I love this opening cinema. It feels like something that was worth waiting to see, I finished the story and I hit a lot of feelers in the end. I was mad about certain events, sad to say goodbye to certain beloved characters even if it may just be for now and excited to see what would unfold after all this is done. This video only enhanced all those feelings for me as a current player, it made me happy and gave me something to look forward to as the game evolves. It also gave me the sense of feeling like this is really happening, a game that I once read was hopelessly ruined years ago is actually making a wonderful comeback and moving forward to it's next expansion.
The above, that excited me. I didn't have the chance to play 1.0 but I was always reading and wondering what if I could get that chance so when I eventually read how the game was a failure, it made me pretty disappointed. :(
That being said, as happy as I am as a current player to be able to experience the game the way I have and watch it do a complete 360 from those many years ago. However I am not beyond seeing the sense of the OP's reasonings either. If I as a new player just happened to buy both ARR and Heavensward bundle and installed both and that might be the opening playing? At first I'd probably be really soaked about it but lets say I started in Ul'dah and met Nanamo earlier than the Gridania and Limsa players. I'd see Nanamo and know she's going to die, while I question why and how it happened because this will be a fact that I know and it is a spoiler in this sense none the less. I'd see Raubahn Aldynn the Flames General without an arm and wonder why that came to be and is he going to be bad? Will he betray us?
This may be a positive thing, it's not an ultimate dealbreaker for me even if I was a new player because I do ultimately love to know that a game has a sense of story to begin with. But I can see how this can easily be a turn off for another player who may see these events through different eyes.
Though I say this, I am also not here to say that I wish for the game avoid using this as the new main trailer or to use it as the main trailer after ARR. This can go many many ways and it can go in the direction of players not even seeing this until 2.55 story is completed. In the end, I am personally fine with either choice and it'll be rather interesting to see what SE will do towards these turns of events.
Edit: As for the first opening for ARR, I don't view it as much of a spoiler because it did not really show anyone that we meet die, etc. But rather it filled holes of what happened so we understood the story we're walking into. There's also the fact that most the story concerning Bahamut and the final events of that cinema is locked in BcoB content so him being shown in the trailer isn't that big of a deal either. (Not that the last aspect bothers me too much anyways as I raid casually.) :P -
04-12-2015, 11:01 PMAdamFyi
I mean, if you really want to show this to your friends without needing to spoil the story, there is literally a spoiler-free version on the same channel.
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04-13-2015, 12:51 AMLeowilde
From a marketing point of view, they already have a spoiler free version of the trailer as well, so I don't really see the problem.
EDIT:
Sorry, I only read the first page of the thread when I answered. XDQuote:
Originally Posted by AdamFyi
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04-13-2015, 12:59 AMTiggyQuote:
Originally Posted by Lillia
That's precisely what the new opening does for people walking into 3.0 the first time. It deliberately sets the stage where we are clearly on the run. It's not like new players know exactly why. The derplander wasn't even in the scene where Nanamo drinks the poison in the CG so they don't even really know that it was us that poisoned her specifically and is left quite vague in that video alone. People here like to split hairs and act like they aren't that similar when they really are. Both show the events at the end of the previous version. New players who don't know the previous story are in both instances in the dark about what is going on. Even the context and setting are extremely vague to those with no knowledge of the setting and story line. Both videos achieve the exact same thing. You having played 1.0 already or not doesn't change the reality that some players did see the 1.0 story and in that situation YOU were the new player seeing "spoilers." Just because you are now the veteran who is "in the know" you can't suddenly get all picky about which situation was more "ok." It's hypocritical. It's blatantly hypocritical.
In addition it doesn't matter if I could go back and play the 1.0 story line or not. The 2.0 story line covered many of the larger details, including the events surrounding Bahamut. To a new player they didn't know what happened yet or why when they watched the opening and those details came later on when they played through the plot. For a new player to 3.0 it would be the exact same. The details would be covered in the story line later. -
04-13-2015, 06:32 AMLilliaI didn't really come on here to fight with one side or the other. Honestly I could careless about your pointless one way argument, not to be rude but that's me blatantly saying it. You're obviously still fighting a battle you originally had with OP who by now probably stopped reading as you are, correct me if I am wrong; seemingly sitting here roadblocking any other opinion that isn't in agreement with your own.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiggy
I don't think ill of you as a fellow poster seeing as I don't know you and you're obviously strongly opinionated. So I'll just cut to the chase... I stated my opinion and I don't really care to fight about it. I'm not going to debate it, I'm not going to say I'm right or wrong, it's how I feel and that's about it. If you disagree then fine but don't try to debate with me cause it really won't go anywhere. ^^;
Edit: Oh and to say least something related to the topic, Like I said at the end of my reply... I don't care how SE does it either way and the cinema makes me excited. :) -
04-13-2015, 07:23 AMKiyashi
Meh. You had a full week and some change to finish the story. They told you ahead of time that there would be spoilers in the intro when it would be released. I was telling my FC this ahead of time because of of some players being lazy and letting things go.
They also put a disclaimer at the start. You watched it without finishing the story that's all on you. It's that simple. -
04-13-2015, 07:26 AMLaerune
SE warned us before the trailer was released, they shared this news weeks before the Live Letter was aired, they even put it in the video. If someone is too stupid, doesnt have enough patience to read the little setence or does not care, then this is their problem and not SE,
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04-13-2015, 08:02 AMMamisero
How many fedoras do you own, OP?
And has your mom given you any Good Boy Points recently?
I think she might need to take them away. -
04-13-2015, 11:33 AMdice137
I'm pretty sure the game won't force you to watch it. They can probably just skip it if they don't want anything to be ruined for them.