The Hunt Public Shaming Needs to end

I don't get the problem here... if people want to play in a way that goes against the norms set by the majority, then why do they care what that majority thinks of them? The OP should just filter out anything that's not FC or LS chat.

I've been losing interest in both hunts and progression due to early pull mentality, the ragefests, and the seeming necessity to do hunts for easier progression of gear. I've missed a few hunts thanks to early pullers even when in the same zone hunting, due to the distance i've had to cover to get there with no other option. It's one thing to miss out when you aren't actively hunting and have to teleport to the zone, but missing out when you're in the same area is kinda unfair. I'm not even pissed, i'm just disappointed in SE's choices.

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Originally Posted by Thayos

I don't get the problem here... if people want to play in a way that goes against the norms set by the majority, then why do they care what that majority thinks of them? The OP should just filter out anything that's not FC or LS chat.

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Game specific mechanic > Mob mentality

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Originally Posted by Kyomagi

Game specific mechanic > Mob mentality

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Haha sure, that's why Ninja did not become a tank in FFXI, right?

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

Waiting a couple extra minutes doesn't cost you hundreds of bucks.

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I think you missed my point. Neither option is "fair". It's unfair to ask the people already at the mob to wait till everyone shows up when "everyone" includes people with slow rigs that were off doing their Ixali dailies and heard about the call late. It's equally unfair to ask players on PS3 and slower computers to upgrade simply in order to hunt.

The problem is every one and their mother think they have a right to hunts. Well they don't its every man for them selves a person can go ahead and pull it and they shouldn't get hated on because of it. I'm starting to thing the hunt system is just an experiment to see how bad people go about it till they finally put a better system in Heavensward.

@Kinseykinz: To port from bottom of the map to top is faster than to run the whole way! lower lanoscea as example... So i can not follow your argumentation about "porting is not needed"... Please, enlighten us with your magical knowing the spawn location, it will help! The time you port it is already down because of known reasons, i will not quote all what was said in here again...

While I agree "Early puller" is not breaking any kind of rule it is a dickish thing to do specially a lot of cause they do it on purpose. A few days ago people were blaming the GW user as the cause of the issue; it got to the point where the creator added a 30 seconds delay to see what happen. At the end, the creator removed the delay since the same early pull still happen as often as before. Therefore GW was used as a scapegoat, the TS people are as guilty as early pull as gw user.

I think it come to the American mentality of " I find it, I keep it and screw everyone else" even if waiting a few second will not cause any harm as long as the hunt pt build is tank/healer and very small amount of dps. I personally have no issue waiting a small bit for other people to benefit to the hunt. But as long as a bad solo player start attack it intentionally, people will start attacking. Just as an early puller can be a dick to the rest of the people, the people will also have the right to shame him by blisting or just refuse to interact with that player. Even if you decide to df stuff, you need ot pf for harder stuff like final coil and making enemy is not the best way to do this.

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Originally Posted by Yukiko

@Kinseykinz: To port from bottom of the map to top is faster than to run the whole way! lower lanoscea as example... So i can not follow your argumentation about "porting is not needed"... Please, enlighten us with your magical knowing the spawn location, it will help! The time you port it is already down because of known reasons, i will not quote all what was said in here again...

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Yes, there are some zones that have more than one 'entrance' or port if you will, and that could logically make sense that you were in fact, actually hunting, and missed it. But you know as well as I do that most people who complain about 'early pulls' were nowhere near the zone, nor were they actively hunting that specific target. Furthermore, you had equal chance of that mob spawning near YOU and others getting there late. Again, it's HUNTING. You're supposed to look for the thing....but others should be looking too (ie competition) and he who finds it should get it. You still didn't find it. Sure, you were at least looking for it, but you didn't find it. And if it weren't for that 'shout', you would have kept looking for it, none the wiser that it had spawned...and most def. out the chance at seals. Ironically, they were NICE in /sh ing the location in the first place, totally not their fault (or anyone else's) you didn't arrive before the pull.

Still, sportsmanship still applies. You weren't near it...you had to port to get near it, and obviously somehow someway enough people got near it (and pulled it) quicker than you even arrived. Meaning, there were in fact, people either closer to the area, and more importantly, more than enough people got there before you to down it so quickly. Because if only 1-3 blokes were there and pulled it, and you were in the same zone at time it was called out, and ported instantly, and traveled to the location that mob would still be standing and have enough health for you to feasibly get credit. (if those people weren't dead depending on the Mob).

Regardless, you know as well as I do your scenario happens far less than the more common 'chillin in Uldah crafting etc until I see /l 'mob, location'' ...and these people most def. don't automatically deserve full credit 'just because we want it...so be cool guys be cool'. You want full credit, form a party, and go hunting (and if you're wise don't tell people you found the thing).

So again. You were late. You were unlucky. It happens. Move. On. With. Life.

"f*** you, got mine" -- early pullers, who were sort of inevitable after this ridiculous turnout in Hunt participation after the rewards were given a boost.

I like hunts. It's fun doing stuff with a group searching for things out in the world, and the rewards are just icing on the cake. But, it's not fun now. Maybe if they vastly increased the HP pools of hunt marks, things would improve. Right now, most of the people who participate are massively outgeared compared to how these mobs are designed.

For now, save yourself the stress of trying to call out early pullers and just put hunts aside until it calms down, or at least just do it at off-peak hours where you have less of a chance of getting dicked over.

If people were smart, they'd stop hunting for a while so they don't have to be fighting with the people who want everything right now. As before, the hype will die down.

No single soul is asking for waiting 15 minutes. Often it is 10-15 "seconds" differences. Like I said, early puller made a "choice" to be a troll, they will face the consequence, in one way or another.

@Kinseykinz: Try it on my server and i will try on yours... Talking from sportmanship and then telling active hunters who earned it to be "to late"... *sigh*
But still, what does your argumentation have to do anything about the difference in hardware? S rank dies within secunds and just because some SSD players overpower HDD players you saying those who find it dont deserve to get it? What you are telling me is to stop searching for it because I will most likely be on the wrong end of the map when it spawns (the same i could just wait on ätherite and follow the crowd), well isnt that a bit paradox? Your suggestion is to just give up on hunting.

Edit: i will always tell everyone when i have found something, i am not egoistic and i dont care if "I" get ihe seals, but we are talking from a content system that is broken, not from "me"
Edit2: You know as good as i do, that the thing you were talking (ie competition) is not real, it would be true if you can only hunt solo and if you can not communicate with others, but thats not real.

2.3 all over again , shout chat again is filled with ppl raging at each other, WAIT WAIT !$!$! YOU , R!$!$ , !·!$! ect ect ....

didnt u learned nothing SE? /facepalm

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

2.3 all over again , shout chat again is filled with ppl raging at each other, WAIT WAIT !$!$! YOU , R!$!$ , !·!$! ect ect ....

didnt u learned nothing SE? /facepalm

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That's like asking if Ubisoft ever learned from rushing games out filled with bugs.

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Originally Posted by Xellos2099

No single soul is asking for waiting 15 minutes. Often it is 10-15 "seconds" differences. Like I said, early puller made a "choice" to be a troll, they will face the consequence, in one way or another.

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Yeah. wait 10-15 seconds for the guy in /sh, then another one shows up, so you wait 10-15 seconds for him... see where this is going?

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

But how does that even relate to my comment about early pulling being a form of greifing? Yes i know its not really greifing but when you break it down into what its doing to other players, you could class it as greifing.

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Because there is no such thing as early pulling!

Thats why, pulling an unclaimed mob is playiing the game and is in within the game rules, waiting xx amount of time before pulling is a player created thing. Also, no matter how long people wait there will always be some who missed it. The person who finds it has the right to pull however and whenever they want, and if they don't pull it, anyone else has the right to pull it however and whenever they want to also because it is unclaimed.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

Here is how hunts should be. You go to the board like normal and pick up a bounty or mark. You go the location marked by the mark bill ( can be random around area) Right click the mark and activate hunt, this then spawns a mob only for that Person who activated the mark. A bit like leves.

B rank = solo
A rank = 4 man
S rank = 8 man

Marks can also detect when the number of players is either to low..ie for 8 Man and does not count chocobos. And gives a message like requires 8 players, this balances out the harder Ranks and stops chocobo abuse.

It would end prepulling and reseting. It would end all this whining and crying about hunts.

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Make it that you pay for the right to hunt them with GC seals, S ranks could be 24 peep and uses FC credits to purchase them.

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Originally Posted by Xellos2099

No single soul is asking for waiting 15 minutes. Often it is 10-15 "seconds" differences. Like I said, early puller made a "choice" to be a troll, they will face the consequence, in one way or another.

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Sure, wait 15 seconds but what about the guy that's 15 seconds after that?

You can't feasibly wait for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Yukiko

@Kinseykinz: Try it on my server and i will try on yours... Talking from sportmanship and then telling active hunters who earned it to be "to late"... *sigh*
But still, what does your argumentation have to do anything about the difference in hardware? S rank dies within secunds and just because some SSD players overpower HDD players you saying those who find it dont deserve to get it? What you are telling me is to stop searching for it because I will most likely be on the wrong end of the map when it spawns (the same i could just wait on ätherite and follow the crowd), well isnt that a bit paradox? Your suggestion is to just give up on hunting.

Edit: i will always tell everyone when i have found something, i am not egoistic and i dont care if "I" get ihe seals, but we are talking from a content system that is broken, not from "me"
Edit2: You know as good as i do, that the thing you were talking (ie competition) is not real, it would be true if you can only hunt solo and if you can not communicate with others, but thats not real.

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Yeah, for the record, I am Legacy. I LIVED on Excalibur until the hunts happened. Because you wanna talk servers where hunts are a crapstorm? Excalibur is your prime example. How bad does Excalibur get you ask. Oh, so bad that as a FC leader, I could be IN MY FC HOUSE CRAFTING and a member of my FC 'early pulls' and I proceed for the next 2 hours in-game to get hate tells about that person, me, our FC, 'you need to control your people' etc. I wasn't even hunting. (over a B rank btw before they became more or less worthless outside your weekly)


Personally, I want the Legacy NM mobs back. Why. Because first come first served. Done. You saw it and could handle it, you pulled it. You didn't handle it, the other group hunting it would laugh at your dead body (not really), and grab it and get their reward. But because THIS version of the game is trying to avoid 'spawn camping' and other nasties that come along with claimed mobs, they allow everyone a shot at it. But allowing everyone a shot at it doesn't mean everyone has a right to have a shot at it. Again, why should someone who wasn't there, and didn't find it automatically deserve full credit?

And no, my suggestion isn't to 'give up' it's to grow a pair and realize that it's supposed to be modestly competitive, not a caring sharing free-for everyone who wants it thing. And that yes, you will be late, and miss things...and that's okay. Move on, get the next one. Also, if people would just start 'killing when enough people show up to logically handle said mob' a lot of your 'slower rig' problems would go away. You'd be able to see it easier, you'd have less people tele'ing into the area slowing your loading times, and you might stand a chance of getting from one end of a zone to another in time to get credit. Why? because if people stopped the 'wait for everyone' expectation, and people just killed them as able/nearby less people would sit in towns waiting for /l 'mob, location' and either 1. Actively hunt more. or as is likely the case once the low hanging fruit is gone, 2. Do something else with their lives. You keep defending the behavior because 'slow rigs' well... that wouldn't matter at all if people weren't leeching off the actions of others, and if the community wasn't accepting this behavior. It's not me who happen-stanced across the mob that's slowing you down....it's the hoarde of people that tele'd in that are. Be mad at them.


Lastly, one thing I knew for sure was happening on Excalibur back when I was still on it was this:

Someone spots mob:
1. They tell their FC/LS
2. They tell the actual Hunt groups LS/TS
3. They wait
4. They announce 1-2 minutes before the established 'pull time' (decided by the official hunt groups typically) in /sh 'mob, location' ....and typically not pull times.

Even on my server now, I'm more apt to know there's a hunt in the area from the sudden influx of /sh inv? or /sh WHM looking for party or /sh hunt party? than by hearing an actual called out location. (Many times, the location is never called out which is fine by me...I'm only 'over-hearing' the intel b/c I'm in the zone doing other things, I don't really deserve to be able to go leech just because 'mob in my zone'). The point, did you ever consider that when you see the /sh in the zone you're in...that the people have already gathered and it's more a 'we found it' than a 'we found it and we're happily waiting for you to arrive' Again though, if everyone would stop expecting to be able to tag it because people wait for them, life would be more pleasant on all servers.

If nothing else, I really wish the 'hunt mentality' would change because the angry /sh spam does NOTHING for the community, or new players impressions of it.

The solution is and always has been SCALING HP!

Hunt mobs should take ~2 minutes to die, no matter how many players are attacking them. It works in WoW and it can work here.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

Sure, wait 15 seconds but what about the guy that's 15 seconds after that?

You can't feasibly wait for everyone.

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Yes you "CAN't" wait for everyone but when i hear fc mate, saying something is up, port over immediately, I arrive to the spot right as it was killed, several time. What people were asking for was reasonable expectation of travel time if you are not in the zone. Right now, basically unless you are in the zone of pop, the chance of making it on time is low. For example, someone called a time, like for example: A mob is discovered at 2:00, a small group of people arrive at 2:20, a pull time of 2:40 is called, there will always be "one" individual who will start attacking right away as if because a time a call, they will attack it right away just to spite the people who wish to wait for others to arrive. If it was not a diskish thing to do I do not know what is. And here people are trying to justify early pull by saying it is the game mechanic and it is mean to be. Maybe, but the consent of the majority of the people hunting do not mind waiting.

I feel like if it's dying that fast then you're the one that's late. Critical mass has been reached and the pull is justified.

There wouldn't be any public shaming if people weren't such jackasses. I can understand the temptation of pulling early when there are multiple hunts up at once but how often is that the case? It's not a bloody race and if people feel the need to be a prick towards the ones that can't make it in time, they deserve to be publicly shamed and hopefully locked out from future hunt groups.

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Because there is no such thing as early pulling!

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There is such a thing as early pulling. But it's a player-made standard that's not against the rules.

If it were just a few people complaining about early pulling, then I'd agree with you that it's not really a thing. However, most people I know in game are upset by all of the early pulling going on.

I'm betting you have no problem with early pulls, and that's totally fine... but much of the playerbase is unified in acknowledging and opposing early pulling, and the only way to be so dismissive about that is to be in complete denial.

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Originally Posted by Xellos2099

they will attack it right away just to spite the people who wish to wait for others to arrive. If it was not a diskish thing to do I do not know what is. And here people are trying to justify early pull by saying it is the game mechanic and it is mean to be. Maybe, but the consent of the majority of the people hunting do not mind waiting.

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What makes you say they're just doing it to be dicks? Unless they publicly announce this (and then you could make a case for griefing), I don't see how you could know it. It's more likely that they're just being selfish or unthinking or maybe they just have some other place to be or are bored of waiting. Don't make the mistake of taking it personally; the fact is, they probably don't give enough of a crap about other people to actively be a dick to them. In any case, who gives a crap about what the majority agree to? If I find a hunt mob, I can do whatever the hell I want with it. I can report it to the linkshell. I can attack it and kite it in circles till someone else finds me and reports it to the linkshell. I can call some friends and kill it myself. If you didn't find it, what gives you the right to get credit for it? People seem to feel that they're entitled to get credit on every single hunt mob that pops.

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Originally Posted by Trixxy

There wouldn't be any public shaming if people weren't such jackasses. I can understand the temptation of pulling early when there are multiple hunts up at once but how often is that the case? It's not a bloody race and if people feel the need to be a prick towards the ones that can't make it in time, they deserve to be publicly shamed and hopefully locked out from future hunt groups.

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Quite honestly, I see far more prickish behavior from the people that didn't make it to a mob in time than I do from the so-called early pullers. I've seen shouts that run the gamut from a simple "fuck you" to "die in a fire" and "kill yourself"; there's worse, and I don't care to repeat them here. But seriously? Over 40 Allied Seals? Does missing out on a hunt really justify the level of harassment that's being thrown around in its wake? People need to get over themselves and understand one fundamental truth about hunts. You (and I mean that as a general you, not directed at the person I'm quoting) can't reasonably expect to make it to every mob. If you don't make it or you just get to tag it for minimum credit, shrug and dust yourself off and go hit the next one up. Better luck next time.

Honestly, I'm one of the leeches. I am not actively hunting right now because I'm waiting for things to quiet down a bit. I am, however, a member of a hunt linkshell and I have friends and FC mates that actively hunt. I go out if I see an A rank called that's close to an aetheryte or if there's an S rank up and I'm not doing anything else. Rarely do I get full credit, and I haven't even gotten to the last couple that I've run to. I'm not even mad because I wasn't out actively hunting. Most of the people doing the crying about early pulls are doing the same thing. If you're sitting in North Shroud doing your Ixali dailies, you have absolutely no right to cry when you can't get to Marberry in time.

Ketchup Chips I hereby shame you

Off-peak hunt hours in Cactuar is pretty civil last I checked. We don't usually encounter such behavior all the time. Then again, most of the hunt linkshells are linked with each other and news spreads pretty fast.

I guess it's because we're trying to be organized so that everyone has the chance for the rewards. Sure, we get some people not getting full credit, but usually we would tell them that something is better than nothing.

So yeah, we do this so that the hunts are well organized and almost everyone can get the highest rewards. Plus it makes it easier to locate the marks since we can keep track of the moment they are found/killed.

I guess for the most part, some people complain about early pulls is not because they didn't try to get to the area as fast as other people - moreso they couldn't genuinely make it in time. I know that when multiple areas are open for a spawn, we have people spread out to search. Now that we can't teleport when we gain any sort of aggro, it's kind of difficult to reach the area in time especially if it is in a different zone and this person is in an enemy stronghold.

This is the real pvp right here.

If you think early pulling isn't an issue then you refuse to understand the concept, and stop complaining about others asking for you to be courtesy. And if you are having an issue with early pulls find a better time to do it that isn't as congested, and stop asking for others to be courteous (see this Forum's replies to civil responses).

@Kinseykinz: You repeat yourself without understanding what i was saying...
Waiting on Ätherite for the crowd is in fact giving up hunting, as you said something about "active hunting". Thats your suggestion with "beeing too late, your fault" - so for not beeing late i HAVE TO not move away and SEARCH... "caring sharing free-for everyone who wants it thing", argumenting with using fear is Populism. Can we please try to find solutions and not fight against each other?

1) Timwindow for Regions/Areas to control player population (spread out, with 2 Areas or 3 at same time)
2) Some sort of Claim-System (its hunting after all and first sees, first gets is good)
3) Respawn within timewindow if someone claimed it, the others can continue hunting
4) S-Rank is ment to be beaten from alliances of 24 players -> adjust the claim system
5) Add some SS-Rank World bosses where the server needs to gather (1.xx treants level 99) -> maybe impossible because server traffic
6) To force players spread out, within timewindow you earn the loot from same monster only once!

Edit: I just wonder why you always try to attack me directly? You dont know how i am hunting and what i am trying to tell you is the daily situation "everyone" have, its not personal experiance or personal "beeing to late" it is a fact of a broken system! FC, LS and friends are gathering those informations and i was talking in general. Most of your text you are expecting ME to be late or ME not active hunting or ME not telling "others", beside you come now with telling location orders while not knowing how i do it... All that stuff about "just because in that area", "the people have already gathered" and so on... Are you talking general? It sounds like you are pointing at me and thats bad argumentation, but good Populism.

I see a lot of common responses in this thread. Comments along the lines of "by the time I teleported into the area and reach it it is already dead". Therein lies the problem, you weren't in the area, therefore you weren't actively hunting for it. Why should you get to teleport in and profit off of other peoples work? If you want to make sure you get credit then scout the areas that you know are open and find the damn hunt mark yourself. There are far too many freeloaders who want all of the rewards for none of the effort.

I approve of public shaming. It is usually well deserved and hilarious.

It really isn't that much of a problem on my server though.

I don't understand. If you feel that early pulling is nothing wrong, then the public shaming is not a shaming and people won't care about it.
If you feel that people care about it, then you may revise your understanding about what is "right" and "wrong".

I think those who do such shouts should be reported for harassment, anyone can /shout a random persons name followed by saying they were an early puller. That person they named would be often harassed because of the original shout regardless of whether they were even at the hunt to begin with. The ones shouting the names should face a suspension from the game for 24 hours for harassment.

If SE respond and say they wont do anything about such people and that it is up to the players to handle it then every single person who I see do that to another regardless of whether I was in the hunt or not and regardless of whether they were the ones who pulled, I might do the same to them, their name will be shouted as an early puller in all regions I teleport to so they get harassed like they harassed others with their original shout.

My advice first and foremost however is report them for harassment and SE should ideally punish them with suspension. If SE refuses to do that then a taste of their own medicine might make them change their ways but that's more a last resort and based on SE saying it is not something they will deal with in any regard.

It's a good thing this thread will change the world. Lol.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

I think those who do such shouts should be reported for harassment, anyone can /shout a random persons name followed by saying they were an early puller. That person they named would be often harassed because of the original shout regardless of whether they were even at the hunt to begin with. The ones shouting the names should face a suspension from the game for 24 hours for harassment.

If SE respond and say they wont do anything about such people and that it is up to the players to handle it then every single person who I see do that to another regardless of whether I was in the hunt or not and regardless of whether they were the ones who pulled, I might do the same to them, their name will be shouted as an early puller in all regions I teleport to so they get harassed like they harassed others with their original shout.

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Good example:
Camp Bronze Lake, someone jumps down to get to the quest location and gets aggroed from A-Rank Monster, then /shout are comming to blist him...
There are some other locations where the hunt Monster can be very close to villages...

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Originally Posted by BristolRuss

I see a lot of common responses in this thread. Comments along the lines of "by the time I teleported into the area and reach it it is already dead". Therein lies the problem, you weren't in the area, therefore you weren't actively hunting for it. Why should you get to teleport in and profit off of other peo

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It isn't like this is much different for most of those who pull right when they get there. They were told by a ls or an FC where it was and just got there faster. The one pulling should be the one who found it, but that never happens. I see many times where someone finds a mark then 4-5 parties show up and instantly kill before the person who found it can even get in a party to get full credit. The people who show up and pull right when they are ready are plain selfish, yet so are those complaining about being late. Neither did anything different, one was just luckier.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

I think those who do such shouts should be reported for harassment, anyone can /shout a random persons name followed by saying they were an early puller. That person they named would be often harassed because of the original shout regardless of whether they were even at the hunt to begin with. The ones shouting the names should face a suspension from the game for 24 hours for harassment.

If SE respond and say they wont do anything about such people and that it is up to the players to handle it then every single person who I see do that to another regardless of whether I was in the hunt or not and regardless of whether they were the ones who pulled, I might do the same to them, their name will be shouted as an early puller in all regions I teleport to so they get harassed like they harassed others with their original shout.

My advice first and foremost however is report them for harassment and SE should ideally punish them with suspension. If SE refuses to do that then a taste of their own medicine might make them change their ways but that's more a last resort and based on SE saying it is not something they will deal with in any regard.

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Even better. In 2.3 I was an an FC whose leader would pull whenever he got to the hunt mob. The mob mentality of some of the players on my server decided to remove me from the 3 hunt linkshells I was in at the time, just for being in the same FC. Joke's on them, I started doing hunts with some friends from another FC and would pull as soon as our group was there, since it wouldn't get any worse for me anyway.

I see public shamming a bunch on Hyperion. Though most of the time they have this 10 minute wait before they actually pull and then when one person does too early it's like a bomb set off. I thought NM Hunts were supposed to be correlated to what people wanted it to be from FFXI. If I remember it was always OH SHIT LEAPING LIZZY/ EMPEROR FLY POPPED. /DIA DIA DIA. NINJA THAT SHIT. First come, first serve.

So why are people complaining? If you weren't in the zone when it first popped it means you weren't actively hunting - meaning if you missed it then - isn't that your fault?