get RID of the extra buttons to press when engaging please

This should have been placed in Gameplay > Battle Mechanics.

New system takes a little getting used to but after a few hours in a grind party I got the hang of it pretty well. I don't even think about hitting enter anymore, just comes natural.

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Originally Posted by MartaDemireux

This should have been placed in Gameplay > Battle Mechanics.

New system takes a little getting used to but after a few hours in a grind party I got the hang of it pretty well. I don't even think about hitting enter anymore, just comes natural.

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LOL. you cant tell that to people in the NA forums :). We are all way too lazy to click other places. And it still isn't good enough, especially in a party situation where enemies are cluttered up and you're trying to start auto attacking one.

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Originally Posted by Reika

LOL. you cant tell that to people in the NA forums :). We are all way too lazy to click other places. And it still isn't good enough, especially in a party situation where enemies are cluttered up and you're trying to start auto attacking one.

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Well yeah, it could definitely be enhanced as far as targeting is concerned but as it is I have no issues or major complaints. F8 and maybe a tab or shift-tab in a cluster works well for me, or clicking their name. If I had to list one complaint for battle would be that the engaged mob (red named after engaged) should carry the red name over to the target "window" hp/hate meter bar thing.

N54 Nostromo gamepad is good too ^^
been using that and makes things so easy

Gamepad player here. I use (in a macro):

/bm on
/targetnpc
/lockon

Bam. Macro click, then confirm button engages me against the enemy. That's all there is to it for me. Just as many button presses (two) as I had to do when engaging an enemy in FFXI. You whiners need to shush. :P

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Originally Posted by Racht

Gamepad player here. I use (in a macro):

/bm on
/targetnpc
/lockon

Bam. Macro click, then confirm button engages me against the enemy. That's all there is to it for me. Just as many button presses (two) as I had to do when engaging an enemy in FFXI. You whiners need to shush. :P

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Not being sarcastic, but that is a very intelligent idea for macro =). I agree that you've presented a viable option but really when you think about it not everyone knows about your epic fix and it should already be something the average player can do without a macro.

Besides, I value my macro spaces =P. Don't want no stupid engaging macro clogging up my other dern stuff *redneck voice* =/.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnought

MMOs should be played on a mouse and keyboard. i have a gamepad and do not use it.

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Then you're playing the wrong one. Sorry. There are a hundred K/M-centric MMOs out there. This ain't one of them. If you want to play WoW or Lotro, then by all means go play WoW or Lotro. Enjoy.

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Originally Posted by Ventus

Not being sarcastic, but that is a very intelligent idea for macro =). I agree that you've presented a viable option but really when you think about it not everyone knows about your epic fix and it should already be something the average player can do without a macro.

Besides, I value my macro spaces =P. Don't want no stupid engaging macro clogging up my other dern stuff *redneck voice* =/.

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Ya I'll have to try that as a temp fix. Seems both kb + m/controller users are having the same qualms with auto attack. I really do hope they fix things. I think the game should be easy to control with both pieces of hardware and the difficulty of the game should arise from formulating strategies not fumbling with buttons to perform basic actions.

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Originally Posted by Racht

Gamepad player here. I use (in a macro):

/bm on
/targetnpc
/lockon

Bam. Macro click, then confirm button engages me against the enemy. That's all there is to it for me. Just as many button presses (two) as I had to do when engaging an enemy in FFXI. You whiners need to shush. :P

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good luck with that when all the mobs are inside each other

I previously used a gamepad but use a keyboard/mouse now. And neither work in an acceptable manner. It's like a pick your poison situation for me, they both have significant issues. Gamepad is unresponsive (it's not my hardware) and too restricting while the keyboard is too restricting and an absolute mess. Since gamepad users seem to be mostly fine with playing a game with poor controls, I think the best thing they can do for keyboard users right now is add mouse support. I mean really, a mouse is one of the oldest peripherals for a PC and it's utterly useless in this game.

Adding proper mouse support would fix a ton of the keyboard issues. I've posted this before but I'm going to post it again (and again and again) until they consider it. Adding some very simple commands to the mouse will make the keyboard much more user friendly. Hold Left-click to pan camer, hold right-click to turn character, press left-click to target, press right-click to engage and activate auto attack.

And honestly, get rid of Active/Passive Modes, they worthless with auto attack.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Not to sound like an ass, but this is currently a PC only MMO.

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I've had controllers for my PC since the mid 90s. If you are truly interested in the game I would suggest you buy one. It makes the game a lot more enjoyable. Should they fix keyboard controls, absolutely. Should they break controller controls, I quit. One of the things that sets FFXIV apart from WoW et al.

In regards to OP yes please. Even with a controller you have to have your action bar open which I personally do not like. This requires you to go into active mode, target and pull up your bar for AA to begin. Should be able to just target and move to active mode. Though I understand why it is this way, so you don't have to exit active mode to switch targets without attacking. Something needs to be re-worked here SE.

Also, this feels like Deja vu from last June/July.

Just. Make. An. Auto. Attack. On/off. action.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Just. Make. An. Auto. Attack. On/off. action.

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Indeed I think that would fix it. Or place one adjacent to the Action bar so it doesn't take up space. Or maybe make the Active/Passive switch AA on press if an enemy is targeted?

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Wow a Dev response,

Thanks for the heads up.

/feels better already

Bayohne, have I told you I love you? Cause I do.

Whatever happened to CTRL+A?

We don't need a dedicated button to initiate auto-attack. Regular attacks work just fine.

A lot of players need to realize that this game is NOT PC-only. Any control layout change has to be made with controller use in mind, and there are only so many buttons available. They're already starting to stretch with the two-key combinations used by targeting mode changes.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

We don't need a dedicated button to initiate auto-attack. Regular attacks work just fine.

A lot of players need to realize that this game is NOT PC-only. Any control layout change has to be made with controller use in mind, and there are only so many buttons available. They're already starting to stretch with the two-key combinations used by targeting mode changes.

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A lot of gamepad users need to remember they are playing on a PC.

Not everyone has money for a gamepad.
PC's default controls are KEYBOARD and MOUSE, and ALL of them have both.
This is NOT a PS3 exclusive game.
This game came out for PC FIRST. (it should have had PC controls 1st, THEN adapted to PS3)
Some people dont LIKE gamepads (hence why I play PC games..)

I can go on if you want, but the simple fact is that this is currently a PC only MMO. So why do I have to buy EXTRA things to make it work? I understand the intent of compatibility for PS3, but you can save that argument for WHEN it gets released for PS3. Until then, it is NOT a PS3 title and the UI SHOULD be PC optimized.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Can you tell us whether or not their current design of keyboard only controls will continue in the future? Will we ever see proper mouse implementation?

Please SE just give us options!!
if the game pad people want to use controller fine. but dont force us to use it.

options options!!! http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sun2SCeSgv...00/RIFT+UI.png

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffeat...3028/lightbox/

Full customization of key mapping, including the action bar, needs to be a priority. Game pad buttons should also be capable of being mapped to whatever we want.

Just make a restore default option in the config if we totally mess things up.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Thank the Gods! Yay, Bayohne! <3

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

A lot of gamepad users need to remember they are playing on a PC.

Not everyone has money for a gamepad.
PC's default controls are KEYBOARD and MOUSE, and ALL of them have both.
This is NOT a PS3 exclusive game.
This game came out for PC FIRST. (it should have had PC controls 1st, THEN adapted to PS3)
Some people dont LIKE gamepads (hence why I play PC games..)

I can go on if you want, but the simple fact is that this is currently a PC only MMO. So why do I have to buy EXTRA things to make it work? I understand the intent of compatibility for PS3, but you can save that argument for WHEN it gets released for PS3. Until then, it is NOT a PS3 title and the UI SHOULD be PC optimized.

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Finally, someone sums up exactly how I feel on this issue.

If a PC-friendly UI is being held back by gamepad controller limitations, then I think it's about time that dual UIs be developed.

I do not like gamepad controllers or the game setups that come with them. Using a kb/mouse allows for single-click actions. Besides, this is a PC game and I will not buy extra hardware to play it, considering I've already sunk hundreds of dollars worth of upgrades into my machine just to be able to run it. This is where I draw the line.

A PC game that cannot be played effectively with a keyboard and mouse is just broken. The funny thing is, Yoshi-P has said he realizes this, that since it's PC-only right now it needs to be optimized for PC. Why do people keep defending broken mechanics by suggesting we should just play with a gamepad when the devs don't even accept that excuse?

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

If a PC-friendly UI is being held back by gamepad controller limitations, then I think it's about time that dual UIs be developed.

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In a previous interview, I vaguelly recall them making some sort of statement that this is the eventual goal. It's just gonna take a while.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

In a previous interview, I vaguelly recall them making some sort of statement that this is the eventual goal. It's just gonna take a while.

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I read this, too, but it might have been mentioned long ago enough that it was the previous dev team. I'd like to know if this is still in the plans for the game?

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Finally, someone sums up exactly how I feel on this issue.

If a PC-friendly UI is being held back by gamepad controller limitations, then I think it's about time that dual UIs be developed.

I do not like gamepad controllers or the game setups that come with them. Using a kb/mouse allows for single-click actions. Besides, this is a PC game and I will not buy extra hardware to play it, considering I've already sunk hundreds of dollars worth of upgrades into my machine just to be able to run it. This is where I draw the line.

A PC game that cannot be played effectively with a keyboard and mouse is just broken. The funny thing is, Yoshi-P has said he realizes this, that since it's PC-only right now it needs to be optimized for PC. Why do people keep defending broken mechanics by suggesting we should just play with a gamepad when the devs don't even accept that excuse?

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Comfort zones. Once someone gets used to things being the way they are they will do anything they can to stop it from changing, never mind how important or useful change might be.

In my case I've got enough money for a controller, but I don't HAVE money for a controller. Even if I did, I'm not about to handicap myself just because people are 'OK' with it.

That aside, exactly why is it the Devs are ignoring the Gameplay forum? Whats the point of asking us to keep gameplay related discussion and feedback, and having us use the [dev####] tags to direct your attention to feedback on specific topics if you DO NOT USE THEM. There were two similar topics related to this problem with auto attack days ago in the Gameplay forum and its been even longer since a dev apparently touched the folder.

We've seen two dev replies to that folder and its sub folders in the last two weeks. In comparison the general discussion gets multiple replies in a single day. σ _ σ

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

I read this, too, but it might have been mentioned long ago enough that it was the previous dev team. I'd like to know if this is still in the plans for the game?

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I also vaguely recall that this was a new dev team statement but I could be wrong. Regardless, even if it was the old team, I really don't see the reason why this wouldn't be an important design goal.

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Originally Posted by Phenidate

There were two similar topics related to this problem with auto attack days ago in the Gameplay forum and its been even longer since a dev apparently touched the folder.

We've seen two dev replies to that folder and its sub folders in the last two weeks. In comparison the general discussion gets multiple replies in a single day. σ _ σ

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Yeah, everyone keeps wanting to have that gold crown next to their thread titles. That is the incentive. As long as the CRs keep posting in threads that are created in the wrong forum category, people will still create threads in the wrong forum category. I think that if they reply to a thread with a response or new info, they should use a thread that's posted in the right category, or move the thread to the correct category themselves.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Controller feels a little sloppy too but then again that is partial UI issues atm. Also I really do wish Archer's had an Auto shot and Multishot would be paired with heavy shot instead. I do feel slightly cheated and spoiled from WoW and other games that give their ranged fights a ranged auto attack. Could be done similar to that if they take it into consideration where you have a deadzone for ranged attacks and then you attack with melee if you are in that ranged deadzone but perhaps that is asking too much!?

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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I play this game on keyboard so I'm not even sure what problems people are having, however if you do change things I hope you can at least give us the option to do it one way or the other since I find it smooth as it is now.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

A lot of gamepad users need to remember they are playing on a PC.

Not everyone has money for a gamepad.
PC's default controls are KEYBOARD and MOUSE, and ALL of them have both.
This is NOT a PS3 exclusive game.
This game came out for PC FIRST. (it should have had PC controls 1st, THEN adapted to PS3)
Some people dont LIKE gamepads (hence why I play PC games..)

I can go on if you want, but the simple fact is that this is currently a PC only MMO. So why do I have to buy EXTRA things to make it work? I understand the intent of compatibility for PS3, but you can save that argument for WHEN it gets released for PS3. Until then, it is NOT a PS3 title and the UI SHOULD be PC optimized.

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Strawmanning a bit. I never said anything about you needing to purchase a gamepad. What I was saying is that the developers can't just focus on one control scheme or the other, they need to develop for both. It's an aggravation for players, but it's just something that has to be endured when you're working with multiple platforms.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

Strawmanning a bit. I never said anything about you needing to purchase a gamepad. What I was saying is that the developers can't just focus on one control scheme or the other, they need to develop for both. It's an aggravation for players, but it's just something that has to be endured when you're working with multiple platforms.

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Everyone understands that they need to develop for both platforms. What we are scratching our heads about is why in the world did they not have a decent keyboard interface ready to go from the start after 5+ years of development, especially considering that they planned to launch on PC first.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

Everyone understands that they need to develop for both platforms. What we are scratching our heads about is why in the world did they not have a decent keyboard interface ready to go from the start after 5+ years of development, especially considering that they planned to launch on PC first.

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Thank you for saying what I had a hard time saying.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

A lot of gamepad users need to remember they are playing on a PC.

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And a lot of "PC players" need to realize it's a new generation and a lot of people like Gamepad controls for their PC games as well, so it's actually good that a game is built with both in mind.

We already know optimizations will happen.

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And a lot of "PC players" need to realize it's a new generation and a lot of people like Gamepad controls for their PC games as well, so it's actually good that a game is built with both in mind.

We already know optimizations will happen.

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Let me quote this AGAIN since you didn't read it:

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

Everyone understands that they need to develop for both platforms. What we are scratching our heads about is why in the world did they not have a decent keyboard interface ready to go from the start after 5+ years of development, especially considering that they planned to launch on PC first.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

And a lot of "PC players" need to realize it's a new generation and a lot of people like Gamepad controls for their PC games as well, so it's actually good that a game is built with both in mind.

We already know optimizations will happen.

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Not even consoles use gamepads anymore (every console is moving out of gamepads and into motion controls), which "new generation" are you referring to exactly? Even PCs are trying to move in the direction of motion controls (See: Razer Hydra).

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Checked with the development team about whether a dedicated attack button can be added. While we can't promise that a dedicated attack button will show up in the future, a smoother way to initiate auto-attack using keyboard controls is being developed.

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Bayohne
there is clearly some issue where auto attack is not working as it should many are complaining of having to use secondary abilites to start auto attack such as heavy swing/light strike or feather foot etc to actually start auto attacking. Also there is an issue once auto attack starts that the action bar is not highleted(glowing) and we are not able to swtich between action bars using the up and down arrow key on the key board. We have to disengage and totally start over to get this function to work or use the mouse and click the arrow for the action bar to switch. Ive heard complaints of this from both the English and Japanese forums please get a response on this issue.

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Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

Bayohne
there is clearly some issue where auto attack is not working as it should many are complaining of having to use secondary abilites to start auto attack such as heavy swing/light strike or feather foot etc to actually start auto attacking.

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The source of the issue is simply the clunkiness of the UI and how the directional arrows/dpad are used for two very important things: object targeting, and skill selection.

When you are in "object targeting mode" (dpad lets you select object, players, NPC, etc) and are in active mode, you will not auto attack anything.

When you are in "skill selection mode" (dpad lets you select your skills and abilities) and are in active mode, you will auto attack whatever you are targeting.

It's very, very awkward.


One solution would be to have the directional arrows only select skills, and the tab, shift+tab only cycles through targets.


For keyboard, you could make it so that dpad only selects skills, and the analog stick push only cycles through targets.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

The source of the issue is simply the clunkiness of the UI and how the directional arrows/dpad are used for two very important things: object targeting, and skill selection.

When you are in "object targeting mode" (dpad lets you select object, players, NPC, etc) and are in active mode, you will not auto attack anything.

When you are in "skill selection mode" (dpad lets you select your skills and abilities) and are in active mode, you will auto attack whatever you are targeting.

It's very, very awkward.


One solution would be to have the directional arrows only select skills, and the tab, shift+tab only cycles through targets.


For keyboard, you could make it so that dpad only selects skills, and the analog stick push only cycles through targets.

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I USE A KEYBOARD THIS IS A PC GAME(lol caps lock) what do u mean DPad i found this game to play worse w/ a dpad long ago. The UI is overly complex when it doesnt need to be period. we dont need 4-8 different targeting modes for a keyboard; the FF11 way worked wonders and was never an issue and this should have the same UI for targeting but it doesnt...........

One issue I've noticed when I was soloing a battle leve yesterday is

After killing the first leve mob, I pressed TAB to target the second one in the same mob group. It happened that a mob from another leve mob group stood in the middle, as I tabbed through it it was targeted first ad hence the AUTO ATTACK started, which wasn't intended. Then I had two groups of mobs attacking me at the same time >_>' which I couldn't handle, so I ran away. Even if I could, I wouldn't kill them at the same time as the other group would yield no SP.

Sometimes there is a need to press ENTER to initiate auto attack, sometimes there isn't. Maybe only the first mob we need to press ENTER?